ESO PvP: Healing is Extremely Underwhelming

Dracane · June 2020

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

KurtAngle2 · June 2020

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

You're not using the strongest heal in noCP (which is Matriarch) pvp atm and you want to seriously have me consider your opinion in noCP as Magsorc somewhat relevant (especially a Magsorc that uses Dark Deal as her only heal lolz)?

Just move on guys

Dracane · June 2020

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

You're not using the strongest heal in noCP (which is Matriarch) pvp atm and you want to seriously have me consider your opinion in noCP as Magsorc somewhat relevant (especially a Magsorc that uses Dark Deal as her only heal lolz)?

Just move on guys

Just saying that I do not profit from the things you use as your point.

cheemers · June 2020

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

You're not using the strongest heal in noCP (which is Matriarch) pvp atm and you want to seriously have me consider your opinion in noCP as Magsorc somewhat relevant (especially a Magsorc that uses Dark Deal as her only heal lolz)?

Just move on guys

Just saying that I do not profit from the things you use as your point.

The fact that you intentionally limit yourself should not be relevant to a discussion on class or game balance.

Chilly-McFreeze · June 2020

cheemers wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

You're not using the strongest heal in noCP (which is Matriarch) pvp atm and you want to seriously have me consider your opinion in noCP as Magsorc somewhat relevant (especially a Magsorc that uses Dark Deal as her only heal lolz)?

Just move on guys

Just saying that I do not profit from the things you use as your point.

The fact that you intentionally limit yourself should not be relevant to a discussion on class or game balance.

The fact that someone mains (!) a certain class should not be relevant to a discussion at all.

cheemers · June 2020

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

cheemers wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

You're not using the strongest heal in noCP (which is Matriarch) pvp atm and you want to seriously have me consider your opinion in noCP as Magsorc somewhat relevant (especially a Magsorc that uses Dark Deal as her only heal lolz)?

Just move on guys

Just saying that I do not profit from the things you use as your point.

The fact that you intentionally limit yourself should not be relevant to a discussion on class or game balance.

The fact that someone mains (!) a certain class should not be relevant to a discussion at all.

I'm not sure what you mean by this? A bad player maining mag sorc only will still be a bad magsorc, even if they don't play any other characters.

Balance decisions should be made about the things that have the _potential_ to over perform, and shouldn't be muddied by players who intentionally play off-meta. I enjoy playing off-meta but I acknowledge that my hybrid pelinals sorc should not be relevant if we're discussing meta pet magsorc balance, as an example.

Dracane · June 2020

cheemers wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

cheemers wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

You're not using the strongest heal in noCP (which is Matriarch) pvp atm and you want to seriously have me consider your opinion in noCP as Magsorc somewhat relevant (especially a Magsorc that uses Dark Deal as her only heal lolz)?

Just move on guys

Just saying that I do not profit from the things you use as your point.

The fact that you intentionally limit yourself should not be relevant to a discussion on class or game balance.

The fact that someone mains (!) a certain class should not be relevant to a discussion at all.

I'm not sure what you mean by this? A bad player maining mag sorc only will still be a bad magsorc, even if they don't play any other characters.

Balance decisions should be made about the things that have the _potential_ to over perform, and shouldn't be muddied by players who intentionally play off-meta. I enjoy playing off-meta but I acknowledge that my hybrid pelinals sorc should not be relevant if we're discussing meta pet magsorc balance, as an example.

You miss the point however. I hate the matriarch heal too, I hate shield stacking too and I hate ball of lightning.
I do not use them for several drawbacks they bring me, but also because I find them obnoxious and annoying.

These things should be changed. But without that, Magsorc is at best mediocre and thus not worth this special highlight you both broadcasted here. My point being, I struggle a lot since I do not use that overpowered heal and that overpowered shieldstack. Hence I have a reason to complain just like the rest, for sorcerer is not any better off without these things.

red_emu · June 2020

It just shows that ZOS does not listen to the player base.

For months we were screaming: cross over heal stacking is overturned and what have they done? Nerf everyone and in the process made ball groups even more efficient.

When a ball group approaches, it literally looks like a spiderweb with so many radiating regens going off.

The other day, a ball group stood on ram at a keep. With no siege shield, they were peppered with fire and shock lancers, meatbags and aoes and guess what? Their health was jumping from 10% to 100% every second.

Meanwhile, if you're not in a group, the only PvP you can play is 1v1 as you won't outheal damage from more than 2 players!

ZOS solution to overturned healing only widened the gap between the ball groups/kiters/tower trolls and the rest of us, plebs.

I don't blame the ball groups. If a game is giving them a way to stay immortal and shred enemies in seconds, that is exactly what they are going to do.

IMHO, either healing received from other players needs to be cut with Battle Spirit or make it so you can not stack the same heal on a player?

Whatever the solution is, ZOS is most likely going to nerf healing even further, making solo or non-coordinated gameplay impossible.

(I wonder if that's their way to fix the performance in Cyrodiil? Make it impossible for less experienced or not organised players to survive until they quit. I guess it's easier for a server to calculate 5-6 ball groups on the entire map, rather than individual players)

Firstmep · June 2020

Dracane wrote: »

cheemers wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

cheemers wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

KurtAngle2 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I do not agree. I prefer having people die in pvp rather than no one dying. That is the entire point of pvping.
So no, Harrowstorm was one of the least healthy thus far. Greymoor introduced cancer and imbalance on its own, the healing change is none of them. Furthermore, I do not feel like healing is that much weaker. Most still heal as crazy as before.

Easy said as a MAGSORC main.
What an unworthy statement

You suppose I must not heal? My pitiful dark deal heal got even weaker, yes. The times where hardened ward is good and worthy have long passed after several direct and indirect nerfs. I struggle more than ever to stay alive this patch, at least it is somewhat likewise for my enemies, so I am fine. Until they discovered well fitted stacking and are stronger than ever before.

I am suffering since a very long time. You suffer since 2 weeks.

You're the least affected class by the healing nerfs, go play something else and notice by yourself how gimped you are in the survivability department when you don't have the:

- Best Shields
- Best Mobility
- Best Heal

I already notice that since:

-I do only use 1 shield and it's a shadow of what it once was
-I play in no cp only and trust me, stamina sorcerer vastly outperform magsorc in that regard
-I do not use pets, thus my only heal is dark deal

You're not using the strongest heal in noCP (which is Matriarch) pvp atm and you want to seriously have me consider your opinion in noCP as Magsorc somewhat relevant (especially a Magsorc that uses Dark Deal as her only heal lolz)?

Just move on guys

Just saying that I do not profit from the things you use as your point.

The fact that you intentionally limit yourself should not be relevant to a discussion on class or game balance.

The fact that someone mains (!) a certain class should not be relevant to a discussion at all.

I'm not sure what you mean by this? A bad player maining mag sorc only will still be a bad magsorc, even if they don't play any other characters.

Balance decisions should be made about the things that have the _potential_ to over perform, and shouldn't be muddied by players who intentionally play off-meta. I enjoy playing off-meta but I acknowledge that my hybrid pelinals sorc should not be relevant if we're discussing meta pet magsorc balance, as an example.

You miss the point however. I hate the matriarch heal too, I hate shield stacking too and I hate ball of lightning.
I do not use them for several drawbacks they bring me, but also because I find them obnoxious and annoying.

These things should be changed. But without that, Magsorc is at best mediocre and thus not worth this special highlight you both broadcasted here. My point being, I struggle a lot since I do not use that overpowered heal and that overpowered shieldstack. Hence I have a reason to complain just like the rest, for sorcerer is not any better off without these things.

I'd think my Templar was weak too if I played it without cleanse.
Anyway just Beacuse you don't use all the (broken) tools available to your class, that doesn't mean it's mediocre or weak.

max_only · June 2020

Kadoin wrote: »

Xzysts wrote: »

Kadoin wrote: »

They were told, but didn't listen.

Meanwhile, the tank meta is stronger than ever, they introduced 1-piece set items that further empowered the tank meta, and with heals taking a nosedive % damage reduction, damage avoidance, and damage resistance (shields), all went up in value and classes with native access to that rule Cyrodiil because the sets that granted those things all got nerfed.

It's surprising how anyone could read the patch notes and conclude the changes were bad, even without testing, and yet with testing and input the changes still went through. It's crazy.

Wait, no. It's ZOS.

Like I said. I pretty much play every class and seem to be running the same setups as everyone else and even went out of my way to try and survive. For me, it was just not possible. I have played PvP for a long time. This is by far worse than the DoT meta imo.

You gotta use that double-ravage health poison man. That's the secret sauce. Since most people can only get a 1-2k HoT tick, then you have to use that poison to make sure their ticks don't matter.

Next you have to wear Sellistrix. Now that Sellistrix is guaranteed to proc every 5 or 6 seconds with AoE damage and AoE stun, it is the BiS proc set in the entire game for any content where you can stun without consequences (don't use it in boss fights where tank has to interrupt, but for cleaning trash and vMA its the greatest). Sellistrix forces a player to stop attacking, waste stam sprinting out or blocking, and does damage. I

In other words Sellistrix offers both attack and defense in one 2 piece for zero cost since it can proc on any attack or skill unlike infernal guardian, and the proc is guaranteed. Too bad my input on the set in PTS was apparently read and ignored, but that's great for anyone looking to win or 1vX with a set that is literally a carry set.

Third, you have to make sure you have speed and a bow to slow them down. There are many ways to make a "haha I win build," but what I recommend is a stamplar or hybrid templar with defense + speed + ritual of retribution (so no one can get close without proccing Sellistrix ) + bow.

Works quite well this patch to the point gear doesn't even really matter. I'm serious. You gonna see many do that this patch eventually because it's broken op, and of course I have been recommending it everywhere since before the patch dropped just to ruin PvP.

I’ve been using Sellistrix on stamdk and stamSorc for over a year (I love the earthquake animation, fits well with dk theme), is it finally my time to shine?