Just over one week on console and I think I have found only 2 new plans, despite opening every container I could find. I play for several hours every day, too.

Are the harrowstorms supposed to be a source for furnishing plans through the satchels that drop? Like Elsweyr? If so, then that is a huge disappointment.

The satchels themselves rarely drop for me (have done the harrowstorm daily every day since launch). Then the chances of not getting a base game plan or provisioning recipe push the odds down to near zero for zone furnishing plans.

I am hearing from others who are having the same experience.

Do the dwarven delve in Blackreach if you want plans. I have gotten like 5 of them so far. 3 greens, 1 blue, and 1 purple.

The blue is actually hilarious story. I was doing a guild event where we do a normal trial and we were doing NSO. And I was like "Make sure you loot the backpacks and urns too guys. You might get something nice." And then right as I said that, I got a Ham furnishing design. And I was like "Yes! A blue plan I actually need" "And they were like "What'd you get?". "HAM!"

So then we all start joking about Ham. The next guild event we're going WB hunting and I get another Ham recipe and some white meat froma heavy sack. "This game just loves giving you Ham."

Finally, we're in Western Skyrim and getting all the skyshards. And I get a Solitude Breakfast: Eggs and Ham recipe.

I go out and get a ham to bake irl the next day because that had to be the universe's way of telling me to eat some Ham lol.

katanagirl1 wrote: »

The place is very crowded right now, so you’re competing against a lot of other players and a lot of containers are already empty.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that containers are not shared. I'm pretty sure the number of 'empty' Urns/Wardrobes/Trunks/Backpacks/Nightstands/Dressers is assigned individually when you zone into the instance. I've been farming Urns for years and I think they are unaffected by others.

Treasure Chests, Thieves Troves, and Safeboxes are of course shared.

I have opened an urn in a location and not taken it, then abruptly changed my mind, and with no other visible players in the are, the urn suddenly was empty before I could pick it up again.

I don’t believe the ”personal instance” theory anymore.

I have a video on my YouTube channel that shows this at Dreloth Tomb.

ApostateHobo wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I have opened an urn in a location and not taken it, then abruptly changed my mind, and with no other visible players in the are, the urn suddenly was empty before I could pick it up again.

I don’t believe the ”personal instance” theory anymore.

I have a video on my YouTube channel that shows this at Dreloth Tomb.

Nah containers just kind of empty themselves a little while after you search them. No idea why, but it's been that way as long as I've played the game.

Yeah. I'm also pretty sure that this is normal and was always like this, especially if you open several containers in the same area. It's probably to reduce server load, rather than keeping personal loot data for every player from hundreds of checked containers.

There might also be a timer on them that determines when the container will reset to an Empty state from the moment of opening it (regardless of whether or not you open any new ones in the instance), but it is definitely affected by opening other containers.

When I was powerleveling Legerdemain at the Daggerfall ships, you could literally see this happening live. Look inside Crates or Dressers without looting the item, then keep moving on to some other containers and as you look inside your (around 5th) new containers, the old ones across the room will magically pop their lid/drawers and change into their 'Empty' container state. I liked to pretend that a friendly thieving poltergeist was accompanying me on my heists, and they were happily taking the stuff I left behind, lol.

My experience with dropping vampiric or solitude furnishing plans:
1. From Stealing - I did not have any luck from that - 0 plans /solitude or vampiric/ for 1-2 hours stealing around town and villages
2. HS - farming 3 hours, got 8 sachels and from them 1 green and 2 blue new plans. I guess this is gonna be like farming dragons in Elswayer but way way harder.
3. Farming Labyrinthian Public Dungeon /it has not many urns/- the first time i went there doing quest line I got 1 green and 1 blue new plans. 2n, 3rd, 4th time .... nothing. I guess first-timer luck always counts.
4. Farming Nchuthnkarst Public Dungeon - the heaven of urns. Every time i go there i usually get 1 dwelmer motifs and a cheap purple old plan. Also found 3 blue dwarven plans, 1 green solitude, 1 blue vampiric. Out of 5-6 runs no luck with purple dwarven or new plan.
Drop rate for me is normal - as it always been everywhere. No pain no gain.
I am looking this from the bright side, since Greymoor the purple dwarven plans listings on traders are increasing everyday. More listings make price go down. It will be easer to farm gold and buy from trader than farm and drop the plans on my own.

bluebird wrote: »

ApostateHobo wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I have opened an urn in a location and not taken it, then abruptly changed my mind, and with no other visible players in the are, the urn suddenly was empty before I could pick it up again.

I don’t believe the ”personal instance” theory anymore.

I have a video on my YouTube channel that shows this at Dreloth Tomb.

Nah containers just kind of empty themselves a little while after you search them. No idea why, but it's been that way as long as I've played the game.

Yeah. I'm also pretty sure that this is normal and was always like this, especially if you open several containers in the same area. It's probably to reduce server load, rather than keeping personal loot data for every player from hundreds of checked containers.

There might also be a timer on them that determines when the container will reset to an Empty state from the moment of opening it (regardless of whether or not you open any new ones in the instance), but it is definitely affected by opening other containers.

When I was powerleveling Legerdemain at the Daggerfall ships, you could literally see this happening live. Look inside Crates or Dressers without looting the item, then keep moving on to some other containers and as you look inside your (around 5th) new containers, the old ones across the room will magically pop their lid/drawers and change into their 'Empty' container state. I liked to pretend that a friendly thieving poltergeist was accompanying me on my heists, and they were happily taking the stuff I left behind, lol.

A simpler explanation is that other players that are not in your instance are farming them.

bluebird wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

ApostateHobo wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I have opened an urn in a location and not taken it, then abruptly changed my mind, and with no other visible players in the are, the urn suddenly was empty before I could pick it up again.

I don’t believe the ”personal instance” theory anymore.

I have a video on my YouTube channel that shows this at Dreloth Tomb.

Nah containers just kind of empty themselves a little while after you search them. No idea why, but it's been that way as long as I've played the game.

Yeah. I'm also pretty sure that this is normal and was always like this, especially if you open several containers in the same area. It's probably to reduce server load, rather than keeping personal loot data for every player from hundreds of checked containers.

There might also be a timer on them that determines when the container will reset to an Empty state from the moment of opening it (regardless of whether or not you open any new ones in the instance), but it is definitely affected by opening other containers.

When I was powerleveling Legerdemain at the Daggerfall ships, you could literally see this happening live. Look inside Crates or Dressers without looting the item, then keep moving on to some other containers and as you look inside your (around 5th) new containers, the old ones across the room will magically pop their lid/drawers and change into their 'Empty' container state. I liked to pretend that a friendly thieving poltergeist was accompanying me on my heists, and they were happily taking the stuff I left behind, lol.

A simpler explanation is that other players that are not in your instance are farming them.

Other instances can't interact with yours. So simpler? Maybe. But wrong. Try it, really, if you don't believe me

Take 2 friends with you, or even just one into an instance with you. Have them take a look and point out which containers are marked 'Empty' for them from the start. They will be different. You can have a person see all Empty containers while others are looting them afterwards. Then have all 3 of you look inside a same on-empty container and tell each other what's inside. The contents of the container will be different for each of you.

You might each see different things, but I bet as soon as one of you takes what’s in there, the others will see the container as empty. They may be instanced, but they could also be shared. Like nodes, a player with rank 1 in ore will see iron but my character with rank 10 sees rubedite. When someone else farms a node, it vanishes for me.

I don’t really have any people left on my friends list that play at the same time as I do try it out.

I do see other players in my instance interact with containers and I see them as empty afterward as well.

I did multiple runs through farming areas and only found one purple solitude plan and one purple vampire one. I haven't even found all greens yet.

bluebird wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

ApostateHobo wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I have opened an urn in a location and not taken it, then abruptly changed my mind, and with no other visible players in the are, the urn suddenly was empty before I could pick it up again.

I don’t believe the ”personal instance” theory anymore.

I have a video on my YouTube channel that shows this at Dreloth Tomb.

Nah containers just kind of empty themselves a little while after you search them. No idea why, but it's been that way as long as I've played the game.

Yeah. I'm also pretty sure that this is normal and was always like this, especially if you open several containers in the same area. It's probably to reduce server load, rather than keeping personal loot data for every player from hundreds of checked containers.

There might also be a timer on them that determines when the container will reset to an Empty state from the moment of opening it (regardless of whether or not you open any new ones in the instance), but it is definitely affected by opening other containers.

When I was powerleveling Legerdemain at the Daggerfall ships, you could literally see this happening live. Look inside Crates or Dressers without looting the item, then keep moving on to some other containers and as you look inside your (around 5th) new containers, the old ones across the room will magically pop their lid/drawers and change into their 'Empty' container state. I liked to pretend that a friendly thieving poltergeist was accompanying me on my heists, and they were happily taking the stuff I left behind, lol.

A simpler explanation is that other players that are not in your instance are farming them.

Other instances can't interact with yours. So simpler? Maybe. But wrong. Try it, really, if you don't believe me

Take 2 friends with you, or even just one into an instance with you. Have them take a look and point out which containers are marked 'Empty' for them from the start. They will be different. You can have a person see all Empty containers while others are looting them afterwards. Then have all 3 of you look inside a same on-empty container and tell each other what's inside. The contents of the container will be different for each of you.

You might each see different things, but I bet as soon as one of you takes what’s in there, the others will see the container as empty. They may be instanced, but they could also be shared. Like nodes, a player with rank 1 in ore will see iron but my character with rank 10 sees rubedite. When someone else farms a node, it vanishes for me.

I don’t really have any people left on my friends list that play at the same time as I do try it out.
I do see other players in my instance interact with containers and I see them as empty afterward as well.

You don't have to bet. I'm telling you. It's a fact. There's no point in guess-work when everything is well-documented, not sure how else to tell you. Containers like Urns, Dressers, Backpacks, Wardrobes, etc. are not shared. They are permanent fixtures in the world that are always there, and their Empty/non-Empty status and their loot are allocated randomly for each player on an individual basis.

Crafting nodes, Treasure Chests, Thieves Troves, Safeboxes and Heavy Sacks in the world are shared, they can be looted by any player, they are competitive. Unlike containers, they aren't permanent fixtures in the world but spawn randomly and may not always be there. They are a completely different type of loot system.

Which server do you play on? Cause you really should have taken all our word for it when we're telling you how it works, but I volunteer to make a char on your server and try it out if you still don't believe it.

Where is this info documented?

I have trouble believing things found on forums when my observations indicate otherwise.

katanagirl1 wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

ApostateHobo wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I have opened an urn in a location and not taken it, then abruptly changed my mind, and with no other visible players in the are, the urn suddenly was empty before I could pick it up again.

I don’t believe the ”personal instance” theory anymore.

I have a video on my YouTube channel that shows this at Dreloth Tomb.

Nah containers just kind of empty themselves a little while after you search them. No idea why, but it's been that way as long as I've played the game.

Yeah. I'm also pretty sure that this is normal and was always like this, especially if you open several containers in the same area. It's probably to reduce server load, rather than keeping personal loot data for every player from hundreds of checked containers.

There might also be a timer on them that determines when the container will reset to an Empty state from the moment of opening it (regardless of whether or not you open any new ones in the instance), but it is definitely affected by opening other containers.

When I was powerleveling Legerdemain at the Daggerfall ships, you could literally see this happening live. Look inside Crates or Dressers without looting the item, then keep moving on to some other containers and as you look inside your (around 5th) new containers, the old ones across the room will magically pop their lid/drawers and change into their 'Empty' container state. I liked to pretend that a friendly thieving poltergeist was accompanying me on my heists, and they were happily taking the stuff I left behind, lol.

A simpler explanation is that other players that are not in your instance are farming them.

Other instances can't interact with yours. So simpler? Maybe. But wrong. Try it, really, if you don't believe me

Take 2 friends with you, or even just one into an instance with you. Have them take a look and point out which containers are marked 'Empty' for them from the start. They will be different. You can have a person see all Empty containers while others are looting them afterwards. Then have all 3 of you look inside a same on-empty container and tell each other what's inside. The contents of the container will be different for each of you.

You might each see different things, but I bet as soon as one of you takes what’s in there, the others will see the container as empty. They may be instanced, but they could also be shared. Like nodes, a player with rank 1 in ore will see iron but my character with rank 10 sees rubedite. When someone else farms a node, it vanishes for me.

I don’t really have any people left on my friends list that play at the same time as I do try it out.
I do see other players in my instance interact with containers and I see them as empty afterward as well.

You don't have to bet. I'm telling you. It's a fact. There's no point in guess-work when everything is well-documented, not sure how else to tell you. Containers like Urns, Dressers, Backpacks, Wardrobes, etc. are not shared. They are permanent fixtures in the world that are always there, and their Empty/non-Empty status and their loot are allocated randomly for each player on an individual basis.

Crafting nodes, Treasure Chests, Thieves Troves, Safeboxes and Heavy Sacks in the world are shared, they can be looted by any player, they are competitive. Unlike containers, they aren't permanent fixtures in the world but spawn randomly and may not always be there. They are a completely different type of loot system.

Which server do you play on? Cause you really should have taken all our word for it when we're telling you how it works, but I volunteer to make a char on your server and try it out if you still don't believe it.

Where is this info documented?

I have trouble believing things found on forums when my observations indicate otherwise.

Observation: You left loot in an Urn, but when you changed your mind and went back to it, it was empty.
Jumping to a conclusion: Another player must have taken it!
--> What actually happened: The game empties all containers if you leave more than 5 in progress.

It's always been this way. I don't know why you hang on to your own speculation, instead of believing what several people confirm. Why would we lie to you? Lol. What you observed has a very simple explanation, what we told you.

But here, I made this video for you. Hope it clears it up.
https://youtu.be/v_cJXF577jg

katanagirl1 wrote: »

That could be the correct explanation, but it seems like there are some assumptions being made. How did you come up with the magic number of five containers?

Bluebird got to the "magic" number of 5 by counting.

There is no assumption, there is a video showing what happens.

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Can you explain how I could possible log on, fast travel straight to a nameless particular farming location with urns, and every single one of them be empty for me?

I have had that happen, usually later I think the day when there would be more players online.

Go to the dwemer public dungeon in Blackreach and TRY to loot every container you find. If you do loot every urn on the way, by the time you get to the Haj Mota room I can guarantee that all the urns will be empty for you.
That's because the game limits how many containers you can loot in a certain period of time. It's also the reason why so many players "park" toons outside of profitable areas.

You can try the same experiment in Old Orsinium too - a PD in Wrothgar, but that dungeon is less linear. No matter where you start or how you do it, you'll only be able to loot so many containers.

The same principle apply if you port out of a delve/dungeon where you looted and go straight to another. Go to Vvardenfell, loot all containers in a tomb and then try doing the same on another tomb. All containers on the second tomb will be empty. IIRC the dwemer public dungeon there is affected too.

TL;DR:
1. You can only loot so many containers at any given time,
2. Once you loot from one area (delve, dungeon, tomb, church, what-have-you), all the other containers will appear empty for that toon for a certain period of time (no, I haven't timed it). As far as I can remember changing zones will not get containers to be full again.

On top of that there are also places where the containers are always empty, and some that once you do the quest(s) there will no longer have containers with loot.

Lootable containers are instanced. No one can take the loot from you. Not all containers in a certain area will have loot inside. Which containers have loot and which ones are empty is random.

If you're logging in after being off for a few hours and the first place you go to loot (where you know there is lootable containers) is all empty, contact support because there might be something wrong.

Well I can see you have done a lot of work here. I would be more inclined to watch these last videos if you didn’t seem to be taking my questioning so personally.

I would hope that you would appreciate that I have taken years of farming furnishing plans for at least one hour per day and, based on my observations, formed my own theory. Also, that I would not just throw all that out just because someone told me differently.

I’ll come back later and watch these when I feel like the hostility has cooled off. Thanks for your time.

The drop rate on both is somewhere between "Godawful" and "Atrocious."

@bluebird , with all due respect to everyone involved, I decided to post not because I wanted to correct or change @katanagirl1 's mind. By the time I jumped into this thread it was very clear to me that no matter what we did or write wouldn't have made a difference to them.

I posted because it might help other players.