[POLL] Is login/logout to reset items in boxes/bookcases ... a cheat/exploit?

TheCookisMonstar · April 2014

In my opinion exploits have ruined many things in this game, but the annoying thing is that people can abuse the login/logout to reset book cases... do it 100 times and you probably have reset maybe 500-1000 attempts at skillups... Even more annoying is the spam of people selling Motif and recipe claiming rarity... which would be true if people did not exploit. Scamming to me is worse than gold spammers.

Question 1- Is abusing login/logout resets a cheat/exploit?
1= yes
0= no

Question 2- Should this loot table be server side to take away the exploit?
1= yes
0= no

TheCookisMonstar · April 2014

saved

Sarenia · April 2014

I feel that it is an exploit.

They need a more elegant throttle than login to manage containers.

MysticAura · April 2014

I feel that pointing this type of thing out on the forums, is just asking for more people to say 'oh neat I'm going to do that now!' please don't advertise possible exploits or cheats on the forums (no matter how minor)

TheCookisMonstar · April 2014

MysticAura wrote: »

I feel that pointing this type of thing out on the forums, is just asking for more people to say 'oh neat I'm going to do that now!' please don't advertise possible exploits or cheats on the forums (no matter how minor)

awareness bringes fixes

not being aware and ignoring game breaking exploits brings free to play

in the words of a dev I know.... its better to get their attention through votes than cries...

dolmen · April 2014

Else where, in response to this I said:

If a player wants to spend their time on these "exploits", fine by me. I would find it very boring. But some will do most anything to get more "gold", items or skill levels.

Doing so will not affect anyone's play, or the game "economy". There is no game "economy". Prices are set at the vendors and do not fluctuate. There is no influence of supply and demand, thus no economy.

The only "economy" that exists in game is the trading between players. Prices there are influenced by supply and demand. ZOS will not concern themselves with this. How these "exploits" ruin that economy isn't an issue. If you don't like the price, don't buy. If can't get your price, sell something else. This economy is a true Open Market. I do hope a trade channel will be opened on day to segregate the "exchange" off to another channel, just to clear up the current spam.

I believe it's up to the players who don't like these "exploits" to control their "Item envy" and "Level envy". The fact some players are doing these does not in anyway affect your play or enjoyment unless you chose for it to.

And let's be honest here. Who hasn't while moving items through the bank from character to character not hit the various containers/book cases in the bank while doing so? I have. Who hasn't on the way to else where stopped off at the Mages Guild and hit the book cases? I have.

Remember also, all containers are instanced to the player, so you are not losing the chance for anything to anyone.

TheCookisMonstar · April 2014

dolmen wrote: »

Else where, in response to this I said:

If a player wants to spend their time on these "exploits", fine by me. I would find it very boring. But some will do most anything to get more "gold", items or skill levels.

Doing so will not affect anyone's play, or the game "economy". There is no game "economy". Prices are set at the vendors and do not fluctuate. There is no influence of supply and demand, thus no economy.

The only "economy" that exists in game is the trading between players. Prices there are influenced by supply and demand. ZOS will not concern themselves with this. How these "exploits" ruin that economy isn't an issue. If you don't like the price, don't buy. If can't get your price, sell something else. This economy is a true Open Market. I do hope a trade channel will be opened on day to segregate the "exchange" off to another channel, just to clear up the current spam.

I believe it's up to the players who don't like these "exploits" to control their "Item envy" and "Level envy". The fact some players are doing these does not in anyway affect your play or enjoyment unless you chose for it to.

And let's be honest here. Who hasn't while moving items through the bank from character to character not hit the various containers/book cases in the bank while doing so? I have. Who hasn't on the way to else where stopped off at the Mages Guild and hit the book cases? I have.

Remember also, all containers are instanced to the player, so you are not losing the chance for anything to anyone.

So... you condone cheating and if they can and want to you have no problem with it?

What about later when it effects you in pvp and they are exploit cheating there?

Applemoth · April 2014

It can't be considered a cheat, because it's allowed by the "rules" of the game.

To argue that it's an exploit, you need to show that the devs clearly didn't intend it. The 'duplicated items' exploit that came to light recently is obviously an exploit because nobody could sensibly argue that the devs intended it. I don't think that's so clear in this case.

Of course, if the devs announce that they consider it an exploit and are going to take steps to prevent it, then it's an exploit. Until then I think its fine (if a bit cheesy).

Caran · April 2014

I fail to see the problem. What "valuable" loot do those containers have? Racial motif books at best ... in a couple of weeks (even without these "exploits") everybody will have the normal ones.

Melian · April 2014

Logging in and out to loot containers doesn't interfere with anyone else's enjoyment of the game and doesn't use them in a way the devs didn't intend. If they only wanted them looted once, they would have made them that way.

MercyKilling · April 2014

Actually, I have a greater concern in this:
I've made one character per faction, and I play them in roughly equal amounts. My first is a Dunmer, and I played the intro island and then alted. Played my Bosmer through the intro island then alted. Played my Redguard through the intro island then went back to the Dunmer. One week I took to get through Bal Foyen and Stonefalls..and in that entire week I found NOT ONE SINGLE MOTIF BOOK despite looking everywhere. When I moved to the next zone, the Bosmer was next up.

Took me four hours of play until I was able to enter the bank area and immediately loot three motif books in a row. After that...nada. Nothing, zip zilch squat.
Flash forward another week and I'm playing my Redguard through the second starter island and I'm running through Glenumbra. Took a couple of days, but I managed to loot two more motif books, and just last night to get a VERY RARE motif book. Imperial style, YAY!

My concern is this: For the Pact, I have yet to find a motif book despite a whole week of play as compared to four hours for the Alliance and two days for the Covenant. I'm thinking loot tables are skewed and might need some attention.

Either that, or I have some REALLY godawful luck on loot rolls for my Dunmer character.

dolmen · April 2014

@TheCookisMonstar, I don't advocate cheating. Nor do I consider these "exploits" such since they do not in anyway deprive me of something. Who is getting cheated here? That is the question. Those who make use of these "exploits" in my opinion only are cheating themselves of the full game experience. But that is an opinion and not really relevant.

So. How are these "exploits" cheating? Someone goes to all that trouble to have more virtual "stuff" and this negatively affects me how? Someone goes to all that trouble to gain skill levels, for which they still need the skill points to use and this affects me how?

Not sure where you were going with the PVP advantage so I let that ride.

Audigy · April 2014

I don't think spreading exploits in the official forum is the answer. Most people didn't know about this exploit but now that you made it public ...

There is a support form ingame, use it.

Zakua · April 2014

Dolmen makes some very good points.
I'm going to say no and no.
I login and out a bit between my toons and I always check / recheck for loot befor

Gaudrath · April 2014

This is not an exploit, nor is it cheating. The game is designed this way, and it was an intended design. Good or bad, players cannot be blamed for playing the game as it was intended to be played.

Alexies · April 2014

no

Korah_Eaglecry · April 2014

TheCookisMonstar wrote: »

MysticAura wrote: »

I feel that pointing this type of thing out on the forums, is just asking for more people to say 'oh neat I'm going to do that now!' please don't advertise possible exploits or cheats on the forums (no matter how minor)

awareness bringes fixes

not being aware and ignoring game breaking exploits brings free to play

in the words of a dev I know.... its better to get their attention through votes than cries...

Awareness for whom? A simple Bug Report to the Devs in game would of sufficed. Instead you brought it to the forums to announce it. This might be microcosm of the community. But people are going to share this with others and its going to spread even more then it already has.

There was no need for a poll. Bug Report would of done just fine.

I think the real issue is that you wanted to create a debate on this because you dont like the way others are going about getting these items and you seek to cause an uproar about it so the Devs HAVE to do something about it. Rather giving the Devs a chance to make a call about it without a mob of forum-goers crying foul.

MaxBat · April 2014

@TheCookisMonstar: No and No.

Really? Here on the forums? Not getting enough attention at home?

Harbingers · April 2014

No and No.

This is a flaw in the system if deemed anything of such. This is what happens when the majority cries about shared loot boxes. You face your own consequence.

caelumpanache · April 2014

MercyKilling wrote: »

Either that, or I have some REALLY godawful luck on loot rolls for my Dunmer character.

6 motifs across a week, two days and four hours, isn't really bad luck. It is funny though.

To the OP, I would vote no and no. If you think it is an exploit or cheating then you should report it as such through the proper channels.

Melian · April 2014

MercyKilling wrote: »

Actually, I have a greater concern in this:
I've made one character per faction, and I play them in roughly equal amounts. My first is a Dunmer, and I played the intro island and then alted. Played my Bosmer through the intro island then alted. Played my Redguard through the intro island then went back to the Dunmer. One week I took to get through Bal Foyen and Stonefalls..and in that entire week I found NOT ONE SINGLE MOTIF BOOK despite looking everywhere. When I moved to the next zone, the Bosmer was next up.

Took me four hours of play until I was able to enter the bank area and immediately loot three motif books in a row. After that...nada. Nothing, zip zilch squat.
Flash forward another week and I'm playing my Redguard through the second starter island and I'm running through Glenumbra. Took a couple of days, but I managed to loot two more motif books, and just last night to get a VERY RARE motif book. Imperial style, YAY!

My concern is this: For the Pact, I have yet to find a motif book despite a whole week of play as compared to four hours for the Alliance and two days for the Covenant. I'm thinking loot tables are skewed and might need some attention.

Either that, or I have some REALLY godawful luck on loot rolls for my Dunmer character.

For what it's worth, I have one character in each faction too and I've found the most motif books on my Dunmer (I think she found three, the Breton found two and the Bosmer found one).

TheCookisMonstar · April 2014

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

TheCookisMonstar wrote: »

MysticAura wrote: »

I feel that pointing this type of thing out on the forums, is just asking for more people to say 'oh neat I'm going to do that now!' please don't advertise possible exploits or cheats on the forums (no matter how minor)

awareness bringes fixes

not being aware and ignoring game breaking exploits brings free to play

in the words of a dev I know.... its better to get their attention through votes than cries...

Awareness for whom? A simple Bug Report to the Devs in game would of sufficed. Instead you brought it to the forums to announce it. This might be microcosm of the community. But people are going to share this with others and its going to spread even more then it already has.

There was no need for a poll. Bug Report would of done just fine.

I think the real issue is that you wanted to create a debate on this because you dont like the way others are going about getting these items and you seek to cause an uproar about it so the Devs HAVE to do something about it. Rather giving the Devs a chance to make a call about it without a mob of forum-goers crying foul.

Awareness brings both questions, answers, comments, and concerns.

If you are unhappy about this being made public then please feel free to state your opinion on pro/con of it.

Bottom line is that it has already been widespread since beta and word of mouth has people running around like crazy exploiting this in mages guilds or banks. It does cause problems with other people because it gives unfair advantages and is a method of gold farm botting.

Anything that is outside the proper means of obtaining wealth, experience, or fame will always be of concern to real gamers... only elitists would cheat and exploit their way up while not enjoying the real gift that has been granted to them... the time, story, and community. The obligation one has to maintain a community or save it from itself involves reporting problems...without doin so, things get out of control and ruined.

Nox_Aeterna · April 2014

Nah , i dont really think so.

If you have the patience to do it , then you may get whatever you get.

I personally like this , they farm it , their farm lower the prices , i can buy one of each for a better price :P (granted i already got like 5 dif ones , so i only need to buy 5 now).

TheCookisMonstar · April 2014

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

Nah , i dont really think so.

If you have the patience to do it , then you may get whatever you get.

I personally like this , they farm it , their farm lower the prices , i can buy one of each for a better price :P (granted i already got like 5 dif ones , so i only need to buy 5 now).

So if you have the patience or ability to cheat then do it?

I don't think I could ever agree with you on that line. That can extend to if you can kill someone than do it because then that's one less person to compete for in jobs, mating, life, etc. Maybe in a zombie apoc but ... lieing, cheating, and stealing is not a tolerable issue.