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Master destro staff is too OP
MentalxHammer
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With how much ZOS talks about "power budget" and creating standards across the item sets I just have no clue why they think it's balanced to offer a buff of over 700 spell damage from a 2-piece. This is OBVIOUSLY overtuned, [Snip].
[Edited for bashing]
Edited by ZOS_Volpe on April 22, 2020 1:48AM [Edited for bashing]
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Veinblood1965✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Agreed it should be reduced, it is definitely way OP. OMG I can't believe I just typed that I must be tired. ARE YOU MAD??0 -
Olupajmibanan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Tried multiple ways of using the Master Inferno:
1) Flame Clench as spammable.
2) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Reach every 15 seconds.
3) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Clench every 4 seconds to maintain the buff.
None of these contested my usual setup. Not even close. Where is the overtuned part? If anyone knows of a way to make it work and outshine all other setups, please, I am open to new ideas.Edited by Olupajmibanan on April 21, 2020 7:41PM1 -
iCaliban✭✭✭✭✭
✭This is a lot of crying about nothing. Stamina dominates pvp with ridiculously high WD combined with capped resists.
The prior nerf to vdsa staff is a big part of why this gap exists and the buff is a good one0 -
Drdeath20✭✭✭✭✭
✭Olupajmibanan wrote: »Tried multiple ways of using the Master Inferno:
1) Flame Clench as spammable.
2) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Reach every 15 seconds.
3) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Clench every 4 seconds to maintain the buff.
None of these contested my usual setup. Not even close.
The insinuation is for burst in pvp. Get a stun with clench and 700 spell damage for 4 seconds with almost no conditionality.1 -
MentalxHammer✭✭✭✭✭
✭Olupajmibanan wrote: »Tried multiple ways of using the Master Inferno:
1) Flame Clench as spammable.
2) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Reach every 15 seconds.
3) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Clench every 4 seconds to maintain the buff.
None of these contested my usual setup. Not even close. Where is the overtuned part? If anyone knows of a way to make it work and outshine all other setups, please, I am open to new ideas.
or you could just use flame clench when you want to stun your opponent.. then reap the massive damage buff while they are stunned... seems okay to me0 -
MentalxHammer✭✭✭✭✭
✭This is a lot of crying about nothing. Stamina dominates pvp with ridiculously high WD combined with capped resists.
The prior nerf to vdsa staff is a big part of why this gap exists and the buff is a good one
I agree that a buff to vdsa staff is needed, but dude this is obviously op... the master bow is one of the strongest arena weapons and that only offers 300 WD (330 next patch) and doesnt benefit your healing. The vdsa staff buffs your SD by double that.... and it applies to your healing. Like dude if you cant see how this is op than you dont deserve to call people out for "crying".......1 -
Drdeath20✭✭✭✭✭
✭MentalxHammer wrote: »Olupajmibanan wrote: »Tried multiple ways of using the Master Inferno:
1) Flame Clench as spammable.
2) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Reach every 15 seconds.
3) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Clench every 4 seconds to maintain the buff.
None of these contested my usual setup. Not even close. Where is the overtuned part? If anyone knows of a way to make it work and outshine all other setups, please, I am open to new ideas.
or you could just use flame clench when you want to stun your opponent.. then reap the massive damage buff while they are stunned... seems okay to me
Magsorcs are foaming at the mouth but not sure most other mag classes are super pleased1 -
WrathOfInnos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MentalxHammer wrote: »Olupajmibanan wrote: »Tried multiple ways of using the Master Inferno:
1) Flame Clench as spammable.
2) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Reach every 15 seconds.
3) Molten Whips as spammable with Flame Clench every 4 seconds to maintain the buff.
None of these contested my usual setup. Not even close. Where is the overtuned part? If anyone knows of a way to make it work and outshine all other setups, please, I am open to new ideas.
or you could just use flame clench when you want to stun your opponent.. then reap the massive damage buff while they are stunned... seems okay to me
Master Flame Clench in PVP has some potential. Using the other morph, any other element, or trying this in PVE are all weak options.0 -
iCaliban✭✭✭✭✭
✭MentalxHammer wrote: »This is a lot of crying about nothing. Stamina dominates pvp with ridiculously high WD combined with capped resists.
The prior nerf to vdsa staff is a big part of why this gap exists and the buff is a good one
I agree that a buff to vdsa staff is needed, but dude this is obviously op... the master bow is one of the strongest arena weapons and that only offers 300 WD (330 next patch) and doesnt benefit your healing. The vdsa staff buffs your SD by double that.... and it applies to your healing. Like dude if you cant see how this is op than you dont deserve to call people out for "crying".......
Do you even know how much tooltips go up by when you add 700 spell damage? Have you actually looked at them and seen just how meh the actual boost is?
Even with 100% uptime of this staff, dizzy will still hit harder. This genuinely isnt that big a deal. And heals are being cut by 20%
Using this staff comes with a lot of opportunity cost. Either you drop a 5pc front bar or a monster set. Back barring it isnt practicalEdited by iCaliban on April 21, 2020 7:56PM1 -
psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭MentalxHammer wrote: »This is a lot of crying about nothing. Stamina dominates pvp with ridiculously high WD combined with capped resists.
The prior nerf to vdsa staff is a big part of why this gap exists and the buff is a good one
I agree that a buff to vdsa staff is needed, but dude this is obviously op... the master bow is one of the strongest arena weapons and that only offers 300 WD (330 next patch) and doesnt benefit your healing. The vdsa staff buffs your SD by double that.... and it applies to your healing. Like dude if you cant see how this is op than you dont deserve to call people out for "crying".......
Do you even know how much tooltips go up by when you add 700 spell damage? Have you actually looked at them and seen just how meh the actual boost is?
Even with 100% uptime of this staff, dizzy will still hit harder. This genuinely isnt that big a deal. And heals are being cut by 20%
Using this staff comes with a lot of opportunity cost. Either you drop a 5pc front bar or a monster set. Back barring it isnt practical
That's 700 raw damage though before your major sorcery buff, and minor if you're a templar.
Dizzy has a cast time and is melee, they're really not comparable.
There are plenty of decent sets you can use the 5pc from the back bar. It's not like you'd be giving up a ton doing that cause the staff is giving you 700+ damage anyway.
It's way overtuned, after reading the patch notes that was the one that really stood out. The other being Carve being able to up to 24 people, but they did leave a note saying they intended to monitor that.0 -
Alucu✭✭✭After actually trying it on pts on duels and dummy, it has more or less the same damage potential as perfected asylum so I'd say balanced (PVP build)Edited by Alucu on April 21, 2020 8:42PM0 -
iCaliban✭✭✭✭✭
✭psychotic13 wrote: »MentalxHammer wrote: »This is a lot of crying about nothing. Stamina dominates pvp with ridiculously high WD combined with capped resists.
The prior nerf to vdsa staff is a big part of why this gap exists and the buff is a good one
I agree that a buff to vdsa staff is needed, but dude this is obviously op... the master bow is one of the strongest arena weapons and that only offers 300 WD (330 next patch) and doesnt benefit your healing. The vdsa staff buffs your SD by double that.... and it applies to your healing. Like dude if you cant see how this is op than you dont deserve to call people out for "crying".......
Do you even know how much tooltips go up by when you add 700 spell damage? Have you actually looked at them and seen just how meh the actual boost is?
Even with 100% uptime of this staff, dizzy will still hit harder. This genuinely isnt that big a deal. And heals are being cut by 20%
Using this staff comes with a lot of opportunity cost. Either you drop a 5pc front bar or a monster set. Back barring it isnt practical
That's 700 raw damage though before your major sorcery buff, and minor if you're a templar.
Dizzy has a cast time and is melee, they're really not comparable.
There are plenty of decent sets you can use the 5pc from the back bar. It's not like you'd be giving up a ton doing that cause the staff is giving you 700+ damage anyway.
It's way overtuned, after reading the patch notes that was the one that really stood out. The other being Carve being able to up to 24 people, but they did leave a note saying they intended to monitor that.
There are no good magicka back bar damage sets. Sustain? Sure. Not damage.
This means to use master staff you give up a 5pc (400 spell damage) or a monster set. This seems like a fair tradeoff. The uptime on this staff will not be great and the skill itself is trash1 -
FirmamentOfStars✭✭✭✭✭psychotic13 wrote: »MentalxHammer wrote: »This is a lot of crying about nothing. Stamina dominates pvp with ridiculously high WD combined with capped resists.
The prior nerf to vdsa staff is a big part of why this gap exists and the buff is a good one
I agree that a buff to vdsa staff is needed, but dude this is obviously op... the master bow is one of the strongest arena weapons and that only offers 300 WD (330 next patch) and doesnt benefit your healing. The vdsa staff buffs your SD by double that.... and it applies to your healing. Like dude if you cant see how this is op than you dont deserve to call people out for "crying".......
Do you even know how much tooltips go up by when you add 700 spell damage? Have you actually looked at them and seen just how meh the actual boost is?
Even with 100% uptime of this staff, dizzy will still hit harder. This genuinely isnt that big a deal. And heals are being cut by 20%
Using this staff comes with a lot of opportunity cost. Either you drop a 5pc front bar or a monster set. Back barring it isnt practical
That's 700 raw damage though before your major sorcery buff, and minor if you're a templar.
Dizzy has a cast time and is melee, they're really not comparable.
There are plenty of decent sets you can use the 5pc from the back bar. It's not like you'd be giving up a ton doing that cause the staff is giving you 700+ damage anyway.
It's way overtuned, after reading the patch notes that was the one that really stood out. The other being Carve being able to up to 24 people, but they did leave a note saying they intended to monitor that.
There are no good magicka back bar damage sets. Sustain? Sure. Not damage.
This means to use master staff you give up a 5pc (400 spell damage) or a monster set. This seems like a fair tradeoff. The uptime on this staff will not be great and the skill itself is trash
There are plenty of options to backbar actually. You can use a damage proc set like icy conjuror, another buff from spell strategist or a set buffing all damage source like draugrkin.0 -
OWLTHEMAD✭✭✭✭I could see this being an indirect buff to magblade direct damage rotations. Fire off once after placing dots, fire your spammables, fire clench, bow proc. Would have to see it in practice. Though, it does feel like a straight up buff to magblade gank rotations. Im on console so cant test for myself and will have to wait till live to form an opinion.0
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MentalxHammer✭✭✭✭✭
✭psychotic13 wrote: »MentalxHammer wrote: »This is a lot of crying about nothing. Stamina dominates pvp with ridiculously high WD combined with capped resists.
The prior nerf to vdsa staff is a big part of why this gap exists and the buff is a good one
I agree that a buff to vdsa staff is needed, but dude this is obviously op... the master bow is one of the strongest arena weapons and that only offers 300 WD (330 next patch) and doesnt benefit your healing. The vdsa staff buffs your SD by double that.... and it applies to your healing. Like dude if you cant see how this is op than you dont deserve to call people out for "crying".......
Do you even know how much tooltips go up by when you add 700 spell damage? Have you actually looked at them and seen just how meh the actual boost is?
Even with 100% uptime of this staff, dizzy will still hit harder. This genuinely isnt that big a deal. And heals are being cut by 20%
Using this staff comes with a lot of opportunity cost. Either you drop a 5pc front bar or a monster set. Back barring it isnt practical
That's 700 raw damage though before your major sorcery buff, and minor if you're a templar.
Dizzy has a cast time and is melee, they're really not comparable.
There are plenty of decent sets you can use the 5pc from the back bar. It's not like you'd be giving up a ton doing that cause the staff is giving you 700+ damage anyway.
It's way overtuned, after reading the patch notes that was the one that really stood out. The other being Carve being able to up to 24 people, but they did leave a note saying they intended to monitor that.
There are no good magicka back bar damage sets. Sustain? Sure. Not damage.
This means to use master staff you give up a 5pc (400 spell damage) or a monster set. This seems like a fair tradeoff. The uptime on this staff will not be great and the skill itself is trash
Clever alchemist, draugrkins grip both great back bar dmg sets.0 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It’s unfortunate.
Destructive Clench with a Master Shock Staff was a unique, powerful AoE spammable. It was also the only Shock Mage spammable. That’s deleted now.
Destructive Reach with a Master Ice Staff was a unique, adequate spammable. It was also the only Ice Mage spammable. That’s deleted now.
And what did we gain through these nerfs? Weird, random changes by slapping on a big Spell Damage buff and removing the direct damage. Smh3 -
FirmamentOfStars✭✭✭✭✭All because we can not have nice unique things, instead we get standardisized stuff and general buffs and debuffs.3
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WrathOfInnos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@Vaoh is completely right.
On live I'll run a master lightning staff with clench for trash fights or cleave heavy bosses and swap it out for perfected asylum with crushing shock for single target.
Both of these setups are now trash.
Yep, the Master Lightning Clench setups was never quite the best, but it was a lot of fun. With the addition of a 1pc Spell Damage or Spell Crit it could’ve actually been a competitive option, but instead it had to be completely redesigned in a way that both the PVP and PVE community seem to dislike.
As another interesting note, the Master Lightning would not have ever been used for AoE and trash if the Blackrose Lightning wasn’t designed so poorly. The perfected bonus of Spell Pen was a good choice for this unique weapon (not like the Maelstrom staff). However, putting a long duration DoT on an AoE weapon that is typically used against enemies that won’t survive more than 5s was questionable. But the larger issue with the BRP staff is that is that using your spammable Elemental Ring refreshes the DoT before it ever ticks. So the staff literally does nothing if you cast your spammable more than once.
The BRP staff should really be much more similar to how the Master 2h works, instant damage on an AoE ability, that scales up based on how many enemies it hits. Even if it didn’t scale up, instant additional damage would have been so much better (which is exactly why the Master Lightning was superior to the BRP Lightning, despite its smaller radius and aiming limitations).Edited by WrathOfInnos on April 21, 2020 10:36PM2 -
SirWafflecakes✭✭✭So as a mag sorc who really misses flame reach, I can say that I am looking forward to this change. Ancient Grace, Crafty, chudan, master flame and potato resto is like having a permanent bsw pre nerf active on demand. No compromise in power at all. With that in mind... this probably is to strong and will get nerfed. The only draw back is using a dodgeable and blockable stun as opposed to streak. It seems worth it to me to gain inner light on my bar and bol instead of streak for kiting. Sorc burst will feel better, kiting will be easier, stun will still damage, and curse, frag, and endless will all hit harder all because of this 1 staff.1 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Tbh if the distance of Flame Clench was 22m like Magnum Shot and Javelin I would use it as a stun on both my magsorc, magblade and probably magcro too (despite sometimes causing Blastbones to miss) to line up burst. Might still do if they don't nerf it. It can be quite easily paired with one of Lich, Warlock , Clever Alchemist on backbar.
Or..or.. simply paired with Willpower and vMA Resto which makes for an insanely stat dense combo.That's total 900 spell damage which (since it's a proc) applies to both front and backbar buffing your heals too if you keep it up. And remember they removed the cooldown on the vMA resto, so if you have Radiating on 3 teammates + yourself then with only 25% crit chance 1/4 heals will crit every sec, giving 500 mag per sec. That's 1k mag regen equivalent just from that weapon, higher even if you're healing 10-12 people. And you still have a monster set and another 5-piece set to play with.
These numbers are pretty insane and in my eyes not remotely balanced... but then again not many things seems balanced in this patch.EU | PC | AD0
