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New vamp is basically NB nerf
Dr_Ganknstein
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I don't know many night blades that don't become vampires for the dark stalker passive. Even if you had infinite cloak you are screwed without mobility. Now if anyone goes vamp for this reason they get an automatic +5% cost to abilities at stage one. Oh, you are using NMA? Thats another 5% for a total of +10% ability cost. So you either live with the additional costs or don't use those sets. I feel like they did this to nerf certain play styles indirectly.
14
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Sinolai✭✭✭✭✭Havent read what they do to Vamps but I am happy to hear dark stalker passive leaving. I hate to keep NBs vamps only becouse I need that passive. With that gone I can finally get rid of the rash. Hope they remove invigorating drain at the same time so my tanks are not pushed to get the rash anymore either.Edited by Sinolai on April 3, 2020 12:08PM2
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Dr_Ganknstein✭✭✭✭✭
✭Havent read what they do to Vamps but I am happy to hear dark stalker passive leaving. I hate to keep NBs vamps only becouse I need that passive. With that gone I can finally get rid of the rash. Hope they remove invigorating drain at the same time so my tanks are not pushed to get the rash anymore either.
Dark stalker isn't leaving. I'm complaining about the increased cost of using non-vampire abilities.0 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*Edited by Tommy_The_Gun on April 3, 2020 1:04PM19 -
Lord_Eomer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Do we now have a possibility of Build based on vampire skills only?Edited by Lord_Eomer on April 3, 2020 8:15PM0 -
azjuwelz✭✭✭✭Some of us still want to play our favorite class. Some love would be appreciated.'Xbox-NA
Guildmaster of Nightmothers Deadly Deals
PVE/PVP Stamblade: Ylandra Silverthorn
PVE Magwarden healer: Raw'zl Dah Zel
PVE DK Tank: Greta Feuerwerk
PVP StamDK: Helga Feuerwerk
PVP Necro Healer: Dratha Helbain
PVE Magcro: Dorian Fey
PVE Magblade: Arivssa Thaoral
PVE Magsorc: Eldara Birchwood2 -
Dr_Ganknstein✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lord_Eomer wrote: »Do we now have a possibility of Build based on vampire skills only?
It seems they are pigeonholing in the direction of if you are a vampire you will use only vampire abilities. That's fine but give us some better passives in ledgerdeman and thieves guild as well as dark brotherhood.2 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't know many night blades that don't become vampires for the dark stalker passive. Even if you had infinite cloak you are screwed without mobility. Now if anyone goes vamp for this reason they get an automatic +5% cost to abilities at stage one. Oh, you are using NMA? Thats another 5% for a total of +10% ability cost. So you either live with the additional costs or don't use those sets. I feel like they did this to nerf certain play styles indirectly.
These changes are going to nerf a lot of play styles. There is no doubt about that.
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Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Lord_Eomer wrote: »Do we now have a possibility of Build based on vampire skills only?
I think there’s a really good possibility it’ll mesh well with NB. Someone screen captured some tooltips and they look good.
It’s hard to say how well things will work looking at tooltips though. Have to play test things to figure it out, but it should mesh well with all mag classes. I don’t know about stamblade though.Edited by Iskiab on April 4, 2020 12:50AMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten1 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*
I don’t think there is a single Sorc who wanted Bound Armaments implemented the way it was. It’s a reskin of Grim Focus.
Sorcerer identity is mixing in a powerful attack inbetween spammables at a random pace. You might get 4 Crystal Frag procs in a rotation, or 0 Crystal Frag procs. And it’s your job to use them effectively. There’s also a 4sec curse to maintain inbetween spammables to mix things up (ZOS nerfed this....)
Nightblade identity is timing your powerful attack, knowing when you’ll get it since it’s based on Light and Heavy attacks, and using it inbetween your spammable. Plus you get minor berserk for free (ZOS removed it...)
This sort of thing made the classes feel unique. It could’ve been as easy as making Bound Armaments a stamina copy of Crystal Frags. It would’ve at least been Sorcerer-like. Instead, the Stam Sorc rotation now feels more like a Nightblade than a Sorc.Edited by Vaoh on April 4, 2020 3:57AM2 -
nublife01✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*
bro there have already been a few final nails theyre just dancing on our grave at this point. if no changes are made to the class it will be blatantly obvious that ZOS doesn't listen to their community. i didn't make a forum account until this past year for this reason and have been following the issue intently. everyone agrees on this matter and has agreed since the nerf to 7th legion that the class no longer has any viable builds and is simply broken. if there are no buffs it will be blatantly obvious that the ivory tower is too high to fix the class.7 -
nublife01✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*
I don’t think there is a single Sorc who wanted Bound Armaments implemented the way it was. It’s a reskin of Grim Focus.
Sorcerer identity is mixing in a powerful attack inbetween spammables at a random pace. You might get 4 Crystal Frag procs in a rotation, or 0 Crystal Frag procs. And it’s your job to use them effectively. There’s also a 4sec curse to maintain inbetween spammables to mix things up (ZOS nerfed this....)
Nightblade identity is timing your powerful attack, knowing when you’ll get it since it’s based on Light and Heavy attacks, and using it inbetween your spammable. Plus you get minor berserk for free (ZOS removed it...)
This sort of thing made the classes feel unique. It could’ve been as easy as making Bound Armaments a stamina copy of Crystal Frags. It would’ve at least been Sorcerer-like. Instead, the Stam Sorc rotation now feels more like a Nightblade than a Sorc.
sorc is in a much better place than nightblade. youre about as powerful as a stamdk right now though the class takes 10 times the skill to play because it is supposed to be defensive while maintaining high pressure. though the bound armament ability is broken and unfitting i agree. i think a stamina copy of crystal frags would make the class insanely op. the best rework to bound armaments i can think of is an ability that snares and buffs their aoe pressure instead of giving burst damage. it wont break the class and will fit best with how the class is played at the highest skill level.Edited by nublife01 on April 4, 2020 7:48AM1 -
Inklings✭✭✭✭✭
Dark stalker no longer requires stage 4. Just being a vamp gets you that passive now according to the descriptions in the class passives shown in the greymoor info/videos we got. The skill ability increase is only stage 4. So this is NOT affecting any NB that just became a vamp for that passive.1 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*
I don’t think there is a single Sorc who wanted Bound Armaments implemented the way it was. It’s a reskin of Grim Focus.
Sorcerer identity is mixing in a powerful attack inbetween spammables at a random pace. You might get 4 Crystal Frag procs in a rotation, or 0 Crystal Frag procs. And it’s your job to use them effectively. There’s also a 4sec curse to maintain inbetween spammables to mix things up (ZOS nerfed this....)
Nightblade identity is timing your powerful attack, knowing when you’ll get it since it’s based on Light and Heavy attacks, and using it inbetween your spammable. Plus you get minor berserk for free (ZOS removed it...)
This sort of thing made the classes feel unique. It could’ve been as easy as making Bound Armaments a stamina copy of Crystal Frags. It would’ve at least been Sorcerer-like. Instead, the Stam Sorc rotation now feels more like a Nightblade than a Sorc.
sorc is in a much better place than nightblade. youre about as powerful as a stamdk right now though the class takes 10 times the skill to play because it is supposed to be defensive while maintaining high pressure. though the bound armament ability is broken and unfitting i agree. i think a stamina copy of crystal frags would make the class insanely op. the best rework to bound armaments i can think of is an ability that snares and buffs their aoe pressure instead of giving burst damage. it wont break the class and will fit best with how the class is played at the highest skill level.
Oh I wasn’t referring to how good the class was. I’m well aware how devasted the NB class is. Every class received nerfs across the board to standardize them.
NB maybe has had its class identity ripped apart the most though.2 -
OWLTHEMAD✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*
See, without major changes and improvements, youll be able to 'nightblade' better on every class other than a nightblade. As things stand with the current changes there will be literally no reason to play one. Run and gun ganking on a zappy sorc with properly delayed burst? How about similar stategies on a templar or warden.
How about aoe bombing with leap on a dk? How about necro tools paired with invis, what will that look like?
Nightblade has been paying hard for the priviledge of cloak with baked in limitations for years,Bar space and damage nerfs, zero delayed burst, stun removals.
Now everyone will have it, but nightblades are the only ones with these limitations.
It doesnt matter if nightblades can synergise better with it if every other class' tools are better able to capitalise on it.
The only decent way to play a nightblade when this thing drops is going to be dropping vampirism and using prismatic enchants.
This is all just really bad if you are a nightblade main.
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juhislihis19✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
I remember the time StamBlades were the top dogs of PVP. That was when Wrobel was still around.
I remember the nerf threads. If I recall right, most of the complaints were about Cloak. Mine was as well. Sacrificing your potions just to pull them out of their Cloak, seems too excessive. Spamming AoE's several times and you "might" succeed. Expedition + Cloak and the NB was already out of reach. Fight restarts.
So complains were about Cloak, majority of it. StamBlades deserved to be nerfed, and they could've started and finished with just Cloak. So what ZOS did? They literally changed EVERY other ability in their toolkit, except CLOAK. That pissed me off.
And look at the state of NB now, a huge mess. But the Cloak is still there, lol.3 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭juhislihis19 wrote: »Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
I remember the time StamBlades were the top dogs of PVP. That was when Wrobel was still around.
I remember the nerf threads. If I recall right, most of the complaints were about Cloak. Mine was as well. Sacrificing your potions just to pull them out of their Cloak, seems too excessive. Spamming AoE's several times and you "might" succeed. Expedition + Cloak and the NB was already out of reach. Fight restarts.
So complains were about Cloak, majority of it. StamBlades deserved to be nerfed, and they could've started and finished with just Cloak. So what ZOS did? They literally changed EVERY other ability in their toolkit, except CLOAK. That pissed me off.
And look at the state of NB now, a huge mess. But the Cloak is still there, lol.
Don't worry. They are giving access to on-demand, cheap invisibility to every class with new vampire overhaul. So you people could complain more over every class, BUT not NB...
Edited by Tommy_The_Gun on April 6, 2020 9:59AM1 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »juhislihis19 wrote: »Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
I remember the time StamBlades were the top dogs of PVP. That was when Wrobel was still around.
I remember the nerf threads. If I recall right, most of the complaints were about Cloak. Mine was as well. Sacrificing your potions just to pull them out of their Cloak, seems too excessive. Spamming AoE's several times and you "might" succeed. Expedition + Cloak and the NB was already out of reach. Fight restarts.
So complains were about Cloak, majority of it. StamBlades deserved to be nerfed, and they could've started and finished with just Cloak. So what ZOS did? They literally changed EVERY other ability in their toolkit, except CLOAK. That pissed me off.
And look at the state of NB now, a huge mess. But the Cloak is still there, lol.
Don't worry. They are giving access to on-demand, cheap invisibility to every class with new vampire overhaul. So you people could complain more over every class, BUT not NB...
I don't know if I consider invis with a @6 second delay, on-demand. If the NB cloak skill took 6 seconds to work, no one would use it. I think peeps are getting worked up over something no one will care about after release.
Some of other skills, the stun for example, fill class gaps, but will it be worth the ability cost increase just to get a stun that work better than flame clench?
It is going to make DPS go way up, everyone has strong self heals. Again, if the ability cost increase is not too onerous.
The biggest change is vampire going from a 10% sustain boost today to negative sustain.0 -
Casul✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ok is it just me or does it seem like vampire NB will be the best form of vampire because they can now utilize both resource pools to go invisible. Compared to say a magplar which can only utilize stamina.PvP needs more love.3 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Lord_Eomer wrote: »Do we now have a possibility of Build based on vampire skills only?
Yes, that seems to be the goal. Players that are on a vampire b/c they actually want to play a vampire and not just for a sneak passive or 10% regen bonus.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC1 -
Dr_Ganknstein✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lord_Eomer wrote: »Do we now have a possibility of Build based on vampire skills only?
Yes, that seems to be the goal. Players that are on a vampire b/c they actually want to play a vampire and not just for a sneak passive or 10% regen bonus.
Don't forget weakness to fire, lower health regeneration, take more damage from fighters guild abilities.0 -
Ectheliontnacil✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Havent read what they do to Vamps but I am happy to hear dark stalker passive leaving. I hate to keep NBs vamps only becouse I need that passive. With that gone I can finally get rid of the rash. Hope they remove invigorating drain at the same time so my tanks are not pushed to get the rash anymore either.
We'll you could use Night's Silence now, if vampire really bothers you that much. Or just use a skin. -_-
Removing dark stalker just results in the loss of a 5pc bonus or a severe movement speed penalty, which sucks either way.
So yeah, heavy and unwarranted nerf to steath gameplay (stealing, assassinations etc.) .0 -
Dark Stalker isn't being removed. it's going to be a Stage 2 Vampire after the rework.1
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Dr_Ganknstein✭✭✭✭✭
✭JondarKorric wrote: »Dark Stalker isn't being removed. it's going to be a Stage 2 Vampire after the rework.
Yeah, I'm not sure where "those people" got that from. From what I've seen dark stalker passive works at all stages. Was watching DOTz video on it and the passive had no stage attached. My gripe is with the +5% increase to non vampire abilities at stage one. I'd be fine with being stage one but now if you are going to run a set like NMA and be a vampire you are looking at +10% ability cost. And in this day and age where almost everyone likes to be tanky and heal like a truck, NMA is very useful.Edited by Dr_Ganknstein on April 8, 2020 11:04AM0 -
nublife01✭✭✭✭juhislihis19 wrote: »Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
I remember the time StamBlades were the top dogs of PVP. That was when Wrobel was still around.
I remember the nerf threads. If I recall right, most of the complaints were about Cloak. Mine was as well. Sacrificing your potions just to pull them out of their Cloak, seems too excessive. Spamming AoE's several times and you "might" succeed. Expedition + Cloak and the NB was already out of reach. Fight restarts.
So complains were about Cloak, majority of it. StamBlades deserved to be nerfed, and they could've started and finished with just Cloak. So what ZOS did? They literally changed EVERY other ability in their toolkit, except CLOAK. That pissed me off.
And look at the state of NB now, a huge mess. But the Cloak is still there, lol.
dude the nerfs to cloak were detect pots and now the fact that literally every class has a main ability to get a nb out of cloak. if that isnt enough for you there are very apparent l2p issues. the last viable stamblade build also utilized dark cloak partially for this reason. cloak is not overpowered in the slightest and does not at all define the nightblade class unless we are nerfed to the extend that we utterly depend upon it. every class has an ability like cloak, yet ours actually isnt outlawed in pvp guild duels like streak is for example. cloak is not op to anyone who understands how to play the game.
like based on your logic, fossilize on a magdk's bar is also op because sometimes you need a immovable bot to not be cc'd in the middle of your burst on them. i like the immovable pots with crit on them so when they spam their safety button in the middle of my burst heh. [snip] is a sorcs streak too op because despite its nerfs they can literally streak away and reset the fight? engine guardian proc/streak, streak streak. Fight restarts? I'm pretty sure there isn't a potion to counter streak though. Hmmm not really an ability either to stop it. cloak is not op. every class has an ability/mechanic that they play around that makes their class strong. this does not mean that ability needs to be nerfed or the class needs to be gutted. [snip]
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Lunar on April 8, 2020 3:53PM0 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Stamblade don't need dark stalker to work, top Stamblade usually play without it.
So this not a Stamblade nerf.
And because vampire will have huge drawback, it's not "giving" NB mechanics to others. It's far from it.
However could synergise well with some Magblade builds.2 -
Dr_Ganknstein✭✭✭✭✭
✭Stamblade don't need dark stalker to work, top Stamblade usually play without it.
So this not a Stamblade nerf.
And because vampire will have huge drawback, it's not "giving" NB mechanics to others. It's far from it.
However could synergise well with some Magblade builds.
It is a nerf because if you are playing without it and utilize stealth your mobility will suffer. Mobility is probably more important then damage imo. But if you are talking about the NBs that refuse to use cloak because its beneath them then they are playing Dayblades not Nightblades imo. Its no longer an assassin.3 -
nublife01✭✭✭✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*
See, without major changes and improvements, youll be able to 'nightblade' better on every class other than a nightblade. As things stand with the current changes there will be literally no reason to play one. Run and gun ganking on a zappy sorc with properly delayed burst? How about similar stategies on a templar or warden.
How about aoe bombing with leap on a dk? How about necro tools paired with invis, what will that look like?
Nightblade has been paying hard for the priviledge of cloak with baked in limitations for years,Bar space and damage nerfs, zero delayed burst, stun removals.
Now everyone will have it, but nightblades are the only ones with these limitations.
It doesnt matter if nightblades can synergise better with it if every other class' tools are better able to capitalise on it.
The only decent way to play a nightblade when this thing drops is going to be dropping vampirism and using prismatic enchants.
This is all just really bad if you are a nightblade main.
no this is bad for everyone. have you every dueled another nightblade main as a nightblade main? do you know how cancer/aids of a 1v1 that is. literally plebs sprint for 3 seconds and they get cloak. don't even have to hotbar it. like if i even touch this game after these changes im just going to make a vamp magsorc with engine guardian and become a facerolling cat on keyboard immortal god. just going to streak/invis on people like im rick james. **** your couch.Edited by nublife01 on April 8, 2020 12:06PM1 -
Dr_Ganknstein✭✭✭✭✭
✭Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »Not just any nerf. It is the final nail to the coffin for NB class (no pun intended, because you know, Vampires).
Since literally every patch done by new combat team, NB has seen only nerfs. Not a single buff. Even the last min-patch when they sneaked Incap silence replacing it with stun, their comment was basically, that it was causing some issues they could not fix, so they added stun back. Not because no one was using incap or because NB is underperforming.
Last year NB "lost" 3 of its major class identity features:
- Fear was casually added to fighters guild skill and right now this skill (Turn Evil) is basically night & day vs NB fear (Mass Hysteria). Skill is available for every class to use.
- Grim Focus was basically "copied" into sorc toolkit (Bound Armaments) so now Sorcs also have access to NB-unique mechanics of charging an attack by gathering stacks. The minor difference is animation and 4 projectile instead of one.
- Ambush also suffered similar fate. Flying Blade (Dual Wield skill) received identical "teleport" style gap-closer. All classes can use it.
On the horizon we have yet another "thing" that will be commonly available for all classes - easy to access on demand cheap invisibility (Unnatural Movement vampire passive). Add to that another vampire passive (Strike from the Shadows) and pretty much every other class is equally good or better than what NB class specialize in, while still having their own unique class features.
NB is already the "underdog" class, underperforming in pretty much all type of content. This new incoming changes will make them simply put - obsolete. Class is doomed without a rework. It has no identity left and nothing what other class can alredy offer in a better form (in other word, NB brings nothing to the table).*insert Craft Blade meme here*
See, without major changes and improvements, youll be able to 'nightblade' better on every class other than a nightblade. As things stand with the current changes there will be literally no reason to play one. Run and gun ganking on a zappy sorc with properly delayed burst? How about similar stategies on a templar or warden.
How about aoe bombing with leap on a dk? How about necro tools paired with invis, what will that look like?
Nightblade has been paying hard for the priviledge of cloak with baked in limitations for years,Bar space and damage nerfs, zero delayed burst, stun removals.
Now everyone will have it, but nightblades are the only ones with these limitations.
It doesnt matter if nightblades can synergise better with it if every other class' tools are better able to capitalise on it.
The only decent way to play a nightblade when this thing drops is going to be dropping vampirism and using prismatic enchants.
This is all just really bad if you are a nightblade main.
no this is bad for everyone. have you every dueled another nightblade main as a nightblade main? do you know how cancer/aids of a 1v1 that is. literally plebs sprint for 3 seconds and they get cloak. don't even have to hotbar it. like if i even touch this game after these changes im just going to make a vamp magsorc with engine guardian and become a facerolling cat on keyboard immortal god.
Im going to cancel pvping and open a shop selling nothing but detect potions and ingredients. I will tell war stories to who happen to stop by and tell them about the days when we didn't need all these detect pots. I'll be wearing my Cyrodiil Veteran hat and maybe get a boat so i can go up river and catch cobras for the Mae Sa snake farm.1 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Stamblade don't need dark stalker to work, top Stamblade usually play without it.
So this not a Stamblade nerf.
And because vampire will have huge drawback, it's not "giving" NB mechanics to others. It's far from it.
However could synergise well with some Magblade builds.
It is a nerf because if you are playing without it and utilize stealth your mobility will suffer. Mobility is probably more important then damage imo. But if you are talking about the NBs that refuse to use cloak because its beneath them then they are playing Dayblades not Nightblades imo. Its no longer an assassin.
You have cloak for being mobile at normal speed while being invisible, this what people use.
You play a snipe gank build that kills noobs running with their horses, according to your own video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPyYkuG0Z1I&t=1s
If you want that passive, be a vamp stage one. Since you snipe from far away, it will not affect your gameplay (5% cost increase neither).
You are complaining on something without it being tested yet and for no good reason.3 -
nublife01✭✭✭✭going to start a forum post making a poll on which is worse everyone getting cloak or the upcoming bashweave meta. lol this game is about to be a meme.0
