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Warden stun, Quality of life improvement
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BrokenGameMechanics✭✭✭✭Polar Wind Arctic Blast isn't supposed to be used as a main stun for the Warden, it's a defensive maneuver that heals you up while providing some crowd control with stuns and Chilled procs.
Besides, Magdens (and Magcros) get access to a lovely stun next update with the Vampirism update. So besides a little fine tuning to Arctic Blast, there's no need to change it.
It shouldn't heal at all, wardens already have a skilline dedicated to healing. The ice skilline is there for tanking and crown control. Remove the healing from artic wind/blast completely and make it a decent stun for warden.
But that is the whole point of the original OP posting. Arctic Blast for all intents and purposes isn't any kind of stun, main or otherwise. Stuns, CC, Gap Closers and Executioners are all super critical and the Warden has none of those.
Even from a "defensive stun" perspective the associated cc (chilled) and stun are both in name only in not for real. The range is substantially smaller than all melee combat skill ranges. No one gets that close to attack, they don't have to. And even if they were momentarily that super close, it will never be for 3 seconds. You will NEVER see a Arctic Blast stun in "normal" PVP combat. Very very rare if ever.2 -
OlumoGarbag✭✭✭✭✭
✭I really dont want rely on vamp for a stun. Its not even sure how exactly the skills will be fine tuned. Some might even change. Shock clench stun made non-vamp magden viable for a while. After that Broken op vampdrain made it a solid class again. Now its in semi good spot again due to good sets and offensive options, but it still lacks ccs, stuns, gapclosers and executes.
Alot of magicka warden skills are still a joke. I havent seen any good magden use birds, bear or shards. Which were all nerfed. And dont get me started on natures grasp, one of the most heavily nerfed skills in eso history.class representative for the working class, non-cp, bwb and Trolling0 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭BrokenGameMechanics wrote: »Polar Wind Arctic Blast isn't supposed to be used as a main stun for the Warden, it's a defensive maneuver that heals you up while providing some crowd control with stuns and Chilled procs.
Besides, Magdens (and Magcros) get access to a lovely stun next update with the Vampirism update. So besides a little fine tuning to Arctic Blast, there's no need to change it.
It shouldn't heal at all, wardens already have a skilline dedicated to healing. The ice skilline is there for tanking and crown control. Remove the healing from artic wind/blast completely and make it a decent stun for warden.
But that is the whole point of the original OP posting. Arctic Blast for all intents and purposes isn't any kind of stun, main or otherwise. Stuns, CC, Gap Closers and Executioners are all super critical and the Warden has none of those.
Even from a "defensive stun" perspective the associated cc (chilled) and stun are both in name only in not for real. The range is substantially smaller than all melee combat skill ranges. No one gets that close to attack, they don't have to. And even if they were momentarily that super close, it will never be for 3 seconds. You will NEVER see a Arctic Blast stun in "normal" PVP combat. Very very rare if ever.
Artic blast stuns on cooldown every single BG where a magden decides to slot it, because BGs tend to be more of the "brawler" type of PvP. But idk what you refer to as normal PvP content.
My overall point is that the heal of both artic blast and polar wind is significantly overperforming and needs to go completely. It adds fuel to the current tank meta in PvP where people just stack 50k+ HP and gets carried by artic wind/polar wind with the sole purpose not to die. Zos needs to discourage this type of playstyle (by adding a soft-/hardcap on HP and remove all HP scaling defensive heals) because it creates a very unhealthy PvP environment.
So I agree with OP, give magden a good stun at the expense of getting rid of the heal completely from both artic with and polar wind. It's a win-win
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BrokenGameMechanics✭✭✭✭You don't need a reliable stun when you can be nearly unkillable and 3 shot people, you paid to win enough don't you think?
And stamden does have a reliable stun without 2h, it's called "dawn breaker" and all you have to do after is mash steel nado.
DB is not a reliable stun. It is an Ulti.
Given that If we are counting non ult ccs then NB has 2 stuns 1 root, DK has 3 stuns 1 root 1 pull, Templar has 1 stun and eclipse, Sorc has 3 stuns 1 pull and negate, and warden has no stun ...[1]
I don't think your position advocating for the removal of ND, DK and Templar stuns is viable as they all meet your criterion. I think the better option is to restore the Warden stun.
[1] A cut and paste for last years "Warden needs a stun" convo. May be out of date.1 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭tbh, they need to remove the arctic blast heal and completely change how the stun works. it being a defensive stun with a heal is just plain awful it needs to be a damage stun skill. not a healing jack of all trades master of none skill.Edited by ESO_Nightingale on April 6, 2020 8:02AMPvE Frost Warden Main and teacher. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@Frostingale
Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/eso_nightingale2 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Again this all classes need to have similar tool kits - no they don't - the whole purpose of having different classes is to have different toolkits - if you guys want it all the same, why have classes then at all, I really hate pvp balance, it ruins the fun. Warden is a good class, just adapt to it's toolkit and make the best of it - you don't need to be like any other class as well - be unique, be a true warden.
And how would some QoL Changes for Artic Blast make Warden like "all the same"?
It isn't asked for a rework of the arctic blast mechanics!
I don't like the way classes are "balanced" just due to pvp requirements - this is a role playing game and and different classes should have very distinct abilities, not all the same just with different animations, colors and particles. PvP balance ruins RP.
The same crap with racial passives - what ZOS has done to racial identities is just horrid and has not much to do with established lore. And all that is just happening because of pvp whiners who want all the same at every class - that is not a good direction for the game.Edited by Lysette on April 6, 2020 8:43AM0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »tbh, they need to remove the arctic blast heal and completely change how the stun works. it being a defensive stun with a heal is just plain awful it needs to be a damage stun skill. not a healing jack of all trades master of none skill.
But that is exactly how the class is designed - jack of all trades master of none - you can form it in any direction you like in the end, it has a toolkit for everything with decent but not necessarily best effects.0 -
OlumoGarbag✭✭✭✭✭
✭How would adding one second duration to the skill ruin class diversity or RPing for Warden?
Warden is a strong group class, but you can't play with friends in bgs anymore and cyro is unplayable as soon as everyone of your guild/friends/partners are online.class representative for the working class, non-cp, bwb and Trolling0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »tbh, they need to remove the arctic blast heal and completely change how the stun works. it being a defensive stun with a heal is just plain awful it needs to be a damage stun skill. not a healing jack of all trades master of none skill.
But that is exactly how the class is designed - jack of all trades master of none - you can form it in any direction you like in the end, it has a toolkit for everything with decent but not necessarily best effects.
i don't think you see my point.PvE Frost Warden Main and teacher. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@Frostingale
Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/eso_nightingale1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »ESO_Nightingale wrote: »tbh, they need to remove the arctic blast heal and completely change how the stun works. it being a defensive stun with a heal is just plain awful it needs to be a damage stun skill. not a healing jack of all trades master of none skill.
But that is exactly how the class is designed - jack of all trades master of none - you can form it in any direction you like in the end, it has a toolkit for everything with decent but not necessarily best effects.
i don't think you see my point.
I don't think so, you want a stun+damage - but a stun+heal is useful as well - either of those is ok to me. And as far as scaling goes - I think something should scale from max health as well.Edited by Lysette on April 6, 2020 9:24AM1 -
OlumoGarbag✭✭✭✭✭
✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »ESO_Nightingale wrote: »tbh, they need to remove the arctic blast heal and completely change how the stun works. it being a defensive stun with a heal is just plain awful it needs to be a damage stun skill. not a healing jack of all trades master of none skill.
But that is exactly how the class is designed - jack of all trades master of none - you can form it in any direction you like in the end, it has a toolkit for everything with decent but not necessarily best effects.
i don't think you see my point.
I don't think so, you want a stun+damage - but a stun+heal is useful as well - either of those is ok to me. And as far as scaling goes - I think something should scale from max health as well.
I think the best option would be to have Polar wind (the heal morph) to deal dmg and heal, since pve tanks need it.
Arctic Blast (offensive morph) should get lower healing or healing removed, but an increase in dmg as well as a reliable stun.
That way people can decide whether they want to sacrifice survivalbilty for a reliable cc or keep the heal. Having a reliable cc is as good of an defensive as having a good heal or even better when you dont have any other sources of crowd control.class representative for the working class, non-cp, bwb and Trolling1 -
Artorias24✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think that every class should have a basic toolkit to work with. A damage spammable and a CC. And atm we are really far away from this.
Warden has birds as a spammable wich are ok. Mit Bad but also not really good.
Wardens CC is just trash and you need an instant CC like other classes offer. Why not change the CC morph of arctic blast into an melee instant freeze? And the other moph stays with the heal...1 -
VaxtinTheWolf✭✭✭✭✭If so many want a faster Sun effect, let it tick every 0.5 seconds so it'll stun after 1.5 seconds if within range. Possibly reduce damage or duration, one or the other.|| AD - Rah'Jiin Lv50 Khajiit Nightblade (Damage) || EP - Generic Argonian Lv50 Argonian Nightblade (Tank) || DC - Zinkotsu Lv50 Breton Nightblade (Healer) ||
|| DC - Ja'Kiro Feral-Heart Lv50 Khajiit Dragonknight (Damage) || EP - VaxtinTheWolf Lv50 Redguard Templar (Tank) || AD - Velik Iranis Lv50 Dark Elf Sorcerer (Tank ) ||
|| EP - Einvarg The Frozen Lv50 Nord Warden (Tank/Healer) || EP - Keem-Ja Lv4 Argonian Necromancer (Healer/Tank) ||PC - North American Server (Champion 1300+)1 -
Taktak✭✭✭magicka warden feels bad in curent stat without realiable stun .....i always try to depend on my team to make cc in BGs because everyone can run away from magden combo or stop it with cc like streak.
Arctic Blast is good for heal not stun
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Mr_Walker✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No. No more CC in this game. Jesus. CC immunity is busted, break free is busted, immovables are busted, and the bright idea is to... add another stun?
Just hell no.0