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Hey ZOS, I think there's still a couple of NB skills you forgot to give to all the other classes.
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TX12001rwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »RaunHunter wrote: »Yeah, not a fan of this at all. But someone did mention that the new Vampire skill line is undoubtedly going to have it when there was a call for more accessible invisibility. I thought it would be an active, if at all. It's a passive, lol. Literally no reason to pick NB any more except for nostalgia.
Sprinting for x seconds vs a button press that removes dots and last longer.
Yup, NBs are dead now that every class has access to mediocre, breakable invis that costs more than cloak. Whatever will they do???
You should take a look at the Cowards Set, grants 30% speed and 30% damage reduction while sprinting, now imagine how invisibility will stack, the moment they are losing a battle they can flee before getting killed.1 -
Sanguinor2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Why isnt there any complain about dk chains for everyone from fighters guild?
DKs have better Things to complain About, like cloak, ball of Lightning and shimmering Shield being better projectile counters than wings.Politeness is respecting others.
Courage is doing what is fair.
Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
Honor is keeping ones word.4 -
luen79rwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wow now that you mention it, its true!!! Lol even the spammable is quite similar to veiled strike. OMG... What's next? reworking psijic order to give everyone a better version of Streak? LOLPC/DC/NAserver
V16 sorc - V16 temp - V16 dk - V1 nb - V1 temp - V1 dk3 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Sanguinor2 wrote: »
Agreed. Total BS they stripped that from DKs and left it on wardens.Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten2 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭RaunHunter wrote: »Rave the Histborn wrote: »Sprinting for x seconds vs a button press that removes dots and last longer.
Yup, NBs are dead now that every class has access to mediocre, breakable invis that costs more than cloak. Whatever will they do???
How is "virtually as long as you can sprint" shorter than 3 seconds? Also, Vampires also have a skill that removes dots. It reads 'Mist Form'. Costs more? It doesn't cost anything, except the stamina cost for sprinting, which everyone else has to pay as well. Breakable invis? Cloak is breakable as well; in fact, it breaks on sprinting, when in combat, and is still bug-ridden. So... Virtually everything you said is invalid.
How is being invisible "virtually as long as you can sprint" better than 3 seconds of instant, constant, invisibility? You do realize that if you need to do anything you lose the invis, you lose far more resources than you would using cloak (that also don't regen while sprinting), and it doesn't remove dots or have any of the utility that cloak does right? You do realize you can already get most of this (just not the length) from invis pots right?
It costs more stamina because you have to sprint for a prolonged period and you get no stamina regen like I already mentioned and you'd have to pull off a full sprint without getting hit for X seconds to activate it in combat so cloak already has a HUGE advantage with a button press. The small cost of cloak is easily gained back just from average mag regen so I'm not sure where you're getting your costs from. Mist form does remove dots but it also prevents healing and magicka regen, cloak doesn't so that's another HUGE advantage that cloak has in its pocket. Mist form also doesn't make you invisible when you get DoT removal like cloak does so you can't reposition and set yourself back up for an optimal attack.
There isn't a video game that doesn't have bugs, and this is ESO so "bug-ridden" isn't' a valid complaint. Once this gets release it'll be buggy as well. Cloak also has a timer, so yes while it can be broken (like all invisibiility in this game) it has distinct advantage over having to maintain sprint the entire time. So....everything I said is valid .
P.S. Saying "virtually" everything is invalid is stupid. It's either invalid or it isn't, it's not technically, kinda, well in the right light, if you look at it this way, maybe under certain circumstances it's valid.0 -
Vercingetorix✭✭✭✭✭
✭Overly dramatic. Invisibility was never going to remain exclusive to NB. If not Vampirism, the eventual Illusion Staff skill line would’ve contained it. Keep in mind as you needlessly panic that NB invisibility has the following benefits:
- Cloak grants a guaranteed critical strike
- Cloak has no restrictions regarding use other than cost
- Cloak’s cost preserves stamina since it costs magicka.
- Cloak synergizes with Shadow passives
Also, remember that sprinting for 8 seconds (without being CC’d) is the actual vampire requirement and sprinting must be maintained. Sprinting prevents abilities from being casted and magicka builds will inherently have less stamina to work with. Applying CC to a vampire prior to them trying to run away will require them to break free first, giving then even less stamina to work with. You will be fine. The sky is not falling.Edited by Vercingetorix on March 30, 2020 6:20PM“Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”2 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
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No, that would be Mages Guild:luen79rwb17_ESO wrote: »Wow now that you mention it, its true!!! Lol even the spammable is quite similar to veiled strike. OMG... What's next? reworking psijic order to give everyone a better version of Streak? LOL
Transfer: Teleport over a short distance and deal AOE dmg at target location (has cast time).
- Teleportation (1st morph): Removes cast time and increases dmg, but it is single target dmg (copy paste NB Teleport Strike).
- Blink (2st morph) Removes cast time, does not require target, stuns all enemies between you and target location (copy paste Sorc Streak).
I probably made those too weak, as obviously weapon / guild / world skills should be superior to class skills.
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ketsparrowhawk✭✭✭✭✭I'm a little nervous about the sprint/cloak. NB's are balanced around having stealth. What happens when everyone has access to cloak, yet their class is not balanced for ganking? Could get wild.3 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭ketsparrowhawk wrote: »I'm a little nervous about the sprint/cloak. NB's are balanced around having stealth. What happens when everyone has access to cloak, yet their class is not balanced for ganking? Could get wild.
No one is getting access to cloak. Invisibility doesn't equal cloak0 -
SosRuvaak✭✭✭✭✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »ketsparrowhawk wrote: »I'm a little nervous about the sprint/cloak. NB's are balanced around having stealth. What happens when everyone has access to cloak, yet their class is not balanced for ganking? Could get wild.
No one is getting access to cloak. Invisibility doesn't equal cloak
they get a bonus when they come out of stealth how is that not nightblade cloak
For the Pact!
~Sump Scales~
Lusty Argonian Nightblade
~Baron Humbert von Gikkingen~
Smokes-His-Greens
~Ruvaak~2 -
Langeston✭✭✭✭✭
✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »ketsparrowhawk wrote: »I'm a little nervous about the sprint/cloak. NB's are balanced around having stealth. What happens when everyone has access to cloak, yet their class is not balanced for ganking? Could get wild.
No one is getting access to cloak. Invisibility doesn't equal cloak
they get a bonus when they come out of stealth how is that not nightblade cloak
And the bonus is more than just the initial strike. Strike From Shadows is literally just a buffed version of Master Assassin, available to all classes.4 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
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And it will happen... it will, but people refuse to listen to reason. New nightmarish gank builds are incoming. The forums will explode with nerf threads - but at that point it will be too late.ketsparrowhawk wrote: »I'm a little nervous about the sprint/cloak. NB's are balanced around having stealth. What happens when everyone has access to cloak, yet their class is not balanced for ganking? Could get wild.
There is a reason why each class has its own unique toolkit.
What bothers me is it will also be a way others could use as a defence. You can boost your speed quite easy in eso and sprinting close to speed cap is not that difficult.
Granted, NB can use cloak as a defensive skill, but NB are quite squishy. Now imagine this on more tanky class like DK or Warden or Templar or (and that sounds broken af) - on a Necro with Bone Goliath ulti.
Imagine invisible tanky zerg going through open door / wall inside keep and BOOM 24 tanks inside out of nowhere lol.9 -
Sanguinor2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ketsparrowhawk wrote: »I'm a little nervous about the sprint/cloak. NB's are balanced around having stealth. What happens when everyone has access to cloak, yet their class is not balanced for ganking? Could get wild.
If Vamps are only stealthed as Long as they sprint then ganking shouldnt be much of a Problem since the second you stop sprinting to cast something you are out of Stealth, that aside I still wish they´d Change that passive to something else that doesnt give full Stealth.Politeness is respecting others.
Courage is doing what is fair.
Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
Honor is keeping ones word.0 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »ketsparrowhawk wrote: »I'm a little nervous about the sprint/cloak. NB's are balanced around having stealth. What happens when everyone has access to cloak, yet their class is not balanced for ganking? Could get wild.
No one is getting access to cloak. Invisibility doesn't equal cloak
they get a bonus when they come out of stealth how is that not nightblade cloak
Because nightblade cloak gives you bonuses with use and from going into and going out of stealth.
Cloak costs mag and you can use it at the press of a button. Vampires need to sprint for 8 seconds to trigger to get a spell damage boost. As a mDK that is roughly 1/4 of my stamina that I need to use sprinting (so I can't use spells) in order to trigger invis and get a small spell damage boost. That's also on top of the stam rec I lose while sprinting. I can't see most people doing that.
They aren't even the same thing2 -
This is going to stack with the night blade passive... Nbs should be stoked they’re gonna hit super hard coming out of cloak0
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Vicinia✭✭✭✭This is gonna have huge implications for PvP. Potatoes are gonna get "eviscerated" by those who can use this skill line efficiently
Vamp paired with Warden, Necro or Templar is gonna be disgusting. I can see the cries for nerfs already
Gotta feel bad for the nightblades on this one though
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RaunHunter✭✭✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »How is being invisible "virtually as long as you can sprint" better than 3 seconds of instant, constant, invisibility? You do realize that if you need to do anything you lose the invis, you lose far more resources than you would using cloak (that also don't regen while sprinting), and it doesn't remove dots or have any of the utility that cloak does right? You do realize you can already get most of this (just not the length) from invis pots right?
It costs more stamina because you have to sprint for a prolonged period and you get no stamina regen like I already mentioned and you'd have to pull off a full sprint without getting hit for X seconds to activate it in combat so cloak already has a HUGE advantage with a button press. The small cost of cloak is easily gained back just from average mag regen so I'm not sure where you're getting your costs from. Mist form does remove dots but it also prevents healing and magicka regen, cloak doesn't so that's another HUGE advantage that cloak has in its pocket. Mist form also doesn't make you invisible when you get DoT removal like cloak does so you can't reposition and set yourself back up for an optimal attack.
There isn't a video game that doesn't have bugs, and this is ESO so "bug-ridden" isn't' a valid complaint. Once this gets release it'll be buggy as well. Cloak also has a timer, so yes while it can be broken (like all invisibiility in this game) it has distinct advantage over having to maintain sprint the entire time. So....everything I said is valid .
P.S. Saying "virtually" everything is invalid is stupid. It's either invalid or it isn't, it's not technically, kinda, well in the right light, if you look at it this way, maybe under certain circumstances it's valid.
You are again speaking of resources. Where does it say it will consume more resources for Vampires to sprint compared to others? It doesn't. Meaning, everyone pays the same cost for sprint; only Vampires get invisibility for free with it.
Also, do NBs remain invisible throughout even if they cast spells or do attacks? No. They get out of invis as well. In fact, they get out of invis if they start sprinting. The only thing they get is instant invisibility, which can be replaced with invis pots. Nothing can be replaced by the "sprint to go invis" mechanic. So, any class can get invis pots+vampire and be better at stealth than NB.
Mist form is now a toggle. They can just activate it to purge the dots and then deactivate, which means the cost is significantly lower than the cost for cloak.
P.S. It is exactly as you said. It is "virtually" invalid because if you ignore some of the facts, then you can make the argument sound 'valid'. So, it is not stupid to point that out. It is stupid to ignore/contort facts.Lesson #1: Red means dead.5 -
Uryel✭✭✭✭✭
✭like the NB abilities, but arguably much stronger. yay!
Of course stronger. "Nerf Nightblade" is basically ZOS' Carthago delenda est
I don't know what annoys me the most about that. Could be any of these, or a combo :
- The pretense, often used to justify nerfs, that "each class must bring something unique to the table", meaning either "nightblades will lose a skill and others will keep their version" or "Nightblades will keep one part of the ability as a morph, and the other part as the other morph, while other classes will keep similar ability untouched".
- The loss of class meaning / fantasy that occurs over time. The top assassination skill is now a defense skill, FFS. because obviously, when you prepare to strike from the shadow, your top priority is to make sure your subsequent strikes will boost your defense. But just a tiny little bit, wouldn't want to be too good at that either.
- The fact PvP whiners keep complaining about assassins assassinating. Apparently, no one cares about mages doing magic, tanks being tanky, but a knife in the back ? An unforseen arrow ? Now that's a no go, sir !
- And my personal pet peeve, the Bosmers being turned to guards, because obviously there couldn't be 2 stealthy races even though lore tsaid there was for 25 years, and obviously cats are much better at hiding, what with their enhanced senses such as earing or smell. Which in turn means my Bosmer Nightblade thief, who had been to Cyrodiil ONLY for fishing and skyshard hunting, was completely broken 4 years after being born.
Freacking spreadsheet approach to game balancing...4 -
TX12001rwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Just imagine, entire zergs completely invisible, suddenly appearing right next to you and killing you before you even realize it before vanishing as fast as they appeared.
Sounds scary doesn't it because that is exactly what is going to happen.4 -
SosRuvaak✭✭✭✭✭TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Just imagine, entire zergs completely invisible, suddenly appearing right next to you and killing you before you even realize it before vanishing as fast as they appeared.
Sounds scary doesn't it because that is exactly what is going to happen.
lag will tell you theyre near.
kinda like fighting with DCFor the Pact!
~Sump Scales~
Lusty Argonian Nightblade
~Baron Humbert von Gikkingen~
Smokes-His-Greens
~Ruvaak~1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I thought Cloak was so easily countered, shouldn't this be completely insignificant? (o_ô)
And the vamp invis bonus damage is probably extremely useful on a NB with invis on demand.1 -
RaunHunter✭✭✭
Cloak is countered when you know someone is cloaked around you; i.e., a NB who cloaks after engaging in combat. It is however, not easy to counter when someone starts sprinting from out of FOV, and doesn't appear until they are right next to you. Like mentioned above, you'll have zergs of invisible vamps coming in, killing you before you can even register how many there are, and going away invis-sprinting.I thought Cloak was so easily countered, shouldn't this be completely insignificant? (o_ô)
And the vamp invis bonus damage is probably extremely useful on a NB with invis on demand.Lesson #1: Red means dead.0 -
SosRuvaak✭✭✭✭✭RaunHunter wrote: »
Cloak is countered when you know someone is cloaked around you; i.e., a NB who cloaks after engaging in combat. It is however, not easy to counter when someone starts sprinting from out of FOV, and doesn't appear until they are right next to you. Like mentioned above, you'll have zergs of invisible vamps coming in, killing you before you can even register how many there are, and going away invis-sprinting.I thought Cloak was so easily countered, shouldn't this be completely insignificant? (o_ô)
And the vamp invis bonus damage is probably extremely useful on a NB with invis on demand.
>implying the servers will preform for it
kekFor the Pact!
~Sump Scales~
Lusty Argonian Nightblade
~Baron Humbert von Gikkingen~
Smokes-His-Greens
~Ruvaak~0 -
Langeston✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Um, it is easily countered — that's beside the point. The problem I have is that for over a year now they've been not just nerfing NBs, but also giving their unique skills and abilities to every class in the game via weapon & world skill lines — and often, those skills are a better version of the original NB skill. They've weakened & watered down the class to an insane degree.I thought Cloak was so easily countered, shouldn't this be completely insignificant? (o_ô)
And the vamp invis bonus damage is probably extremely useful on a NB with invis on demand.
They try to talk a good game re: "class identity," and then they turn around and destroy what's left of what made NBs unique. How would you like it if Streak, Frags, and Wrath were available to every class, and in some cases the generic abilities were even stronger than the original Sorc abilities?9 -
Czekoludek✭✭✭✭✭
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Old info mate, sustain was also nerfed. You can feel that especially in PvP where as magblade you need to stack 200-300 regen more then other mag classes3 -
Curious_Death✭✭✭✭✭TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Imagine how OP that would be with the cowards set, 30% speed boost when sprinting + Invisibility.
get set that in invis regen all stats 600-700/sec + nma with speed jawelleries = *- G.G -*
edit:
wait a sec - maybe NB will now use cloak for escape from combat then run around in invis ! NB can be even more OPEdited by Curious_Death on March 30, 2020 10:10PM0
This discussion has been closed.