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How would you address the skill gap?
VoidCommander
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How would you address the skill gap? 165 votes
Swap the roles of light and heavy attacks
5%
9 votes
Increase heavy attack damage only
16%
28 votes
Lower light attack damage only
8%
14 votes
Make no changes
53%
88 votes
Add option for automatic light attack weaving
15%
26 votes
1
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ZeroXFF✭✭✭✭✭
✭Add option for automatic light attack weavingOf these options, adding auto-attacks is the best one, but ideally I would want light attacks to be treated as skills. No need for automation then, because it's no longer unnecessary complication of controls, and every key press results in a meaningful action. This is really all it would take to shrink the gap by 20k.1 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭None of those. I’d address the skill gap by taking us back to pre-Morrowind where it was larger.
Back when ESO had a large PvP population because people had to learn the game (it is fun to improve overtime) instead of becoming unkillable healbots/tanks who also can apply pressure. Back when ESO had a large Endgame PvE population because the gameplay was far more engaging and classes felt unique.
I miss how ESO used to play and have lost the majority of my friends lost and guild members because of how ZOS has “addressed the skill gap” over the years.25 -
relentless_turnip✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Make no changesPlease don't tell me anyone want automatic light attacks...
That is insane!!!
We can already build with proc sets and horde free damage....
You can already roll a templar and win at dps just by pressing one button.
What next auto pathing?! maybe character will automatically block and dodge!?
Do we just want to watch our characters complete content for us?!
Anyone who wants these sorts of changes I would like to introduce to a device called a television!!
Its a bit like a game except you don't control the protagonist, you just watch them.
Where is the satisfaction!?
When we request these changes, please let us consider the path we are on and what it leads to.
Seriously if people like the combat system in WOW go and play WOW.
It is a fantastic game, for me personally I always hated the combat system and fell in love with ESO's combat.11 -
Zer0_CooL✭✭✭✭✭
✭Why would you need to do anything about it?
I recently decided to focus more on pve since pvp... well you know. Anyway, with dungeon gear i got 23k dps on a 6 mil dummy. I think its probably the lowest you can get unless you're playing with your feet.
So thats the bottom where i start from. I improve my rotation, then i improve my gear and eventually i can play vet trials and the more dificult dungeons.
I don't need to hit 90k dps, but why shouldn't i have to improve my skill? Isn't that the point of a game? (well not all games of corse)
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Schattenfluegel✭✭✭✭Make no changesSlightly Nerf on LA Dmg, and a slightly buff on HA - thats all. Practising your rotation should be rewarded for all.
LA Weaving should be shown in the tutorial of this game.Edited by Schattenfluegel on March 24, 2020 8:26AMLove my Stamsorc7 -
VoidCommander✭✭✭✭✭Increase heavy attack damage onlyrelentless_turnip wrote: »Please don't tell me anyone want automatic light attacks...
That is insane!!!
We can already build with proc sets and horde free damage....
You can already roll a templar and win at dps just by pressing one button.
What next auto pathing?! maybe character will automatically block and dodge!?
Do we just want to watch our characters complete content for us?!
Anyone who wants these sorts of changes I would like to introduce to a device called a television!!
Its a bit like a game except you don't control the protagonist, you just watch them.
Where is the satisfaction!?
When we request these changes, please let us consider the path we are on and what it leads to.
Seriously if people like the combat system in WOW go and play WOW.
It is a fantastic game, for me personally I always hated the combat system and fell in love with ESO's combat.
If auto light attacks were implemented, I doubt it would have a snowball effect of automation in combat. The ZOS team is looking for solutions to the problem of the wide skill gap, and this solution is a direct, simple, and effective way to close that gap by up to 20%.2 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You educate, enlighten people and show them what tools that can be used in order to achieve a better performance. More or less what a lot content creators already do. Demolishing the ceiling isn't the way to adress the gap.14 -
VoidCommander✭✭✭✭✭Increase heavy attack damage onlyYou educate, enlighten people and show them what tools that can be used in order to achieve a better performance. More or less what a lot content creators already do. Demolishing the ceiling isn't the way to adress the gap.
A very valid point. One problem with that is, is that many dps players don’t realize how much they need to learn. It took me years of playing ESO before I ever looked up a guide on how to do good dps, because I had finally realized that I had only been pulling 15k dps.
Having an “end of dungeon” screen that shows damage done by individual members of the group could prove useful for prompting players to seek out content creator’s help.
Failing this, would applying an auto-light weave option actually hurt the community in some way? You could make it a skill that lasts 20 seconds so that new players can use it as a crutch, and the dedicated players do it manually for an extra ability slot.
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Schattenfluegel✭✭✭✭Make no changesVoidCommander wrote: »Having an “end of dungeon” screen that shows damage done by individual members of the group could prove useful for prompting players to seek out content creator’s help.
I am heavy against this. You can meet twice in this game, and when your groupnumber DPS is worse, you gonna kick them out of the group. There are players, doing this - its unfair against newer players too.VoidCommander wrote: »Failing this, would applying an auto-light weave option actually hurt the community in some way? You could make it a skill that lasts 20 seconds so that new players can use it as a crutch, and the dedicated players do it manually for an extra ability slot.
It will destroy the whole combat system and the pvp system...this game wasnt meant to be an AA Weave game. Even not in content too. Its about timing and practise.Edited by Schattenfluegel on March 24, 2020 8:34AMLove my Stamsorc0 -
Roach1990✭✭Add option for automatic light attack weavingYou cannot help bad players. The gap will be still same...2
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RaptorRodeoGod✭✭✭✭✭Lower light attack damage onlyI'd also spike the damage of regular skills to compensate, because doing anything else doesn't make sense. Skills should be more impactful than light attacking.Add a Scribing skill that works like Arcanist beam.
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Veteran players have been alienated and disengaged from Overland since One Tamriel, due to the lack of difficulty, and pushed into dungeons and trials; the minority of content in the Elder Scrolls Online. We can't take the repetition anymore, fix Overland engagement for Vet players. I don't even care if it's not combat related anymore, just make Overland engaging again.
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Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 10 years. 6 paid expansions. 25 DLCs. 41 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. Make a self debuff mythic. Literally anything at this point.2 -
Lilly_Elessa✭✭✭Add option for automatic light attack weaving"Auto" light attacking is an interesting idea, that would at least legitimately help people who perform lower; Not just low skill/new, but also high ping, arthritis, the very lazy, the out of practice, the cheaper mice/keyboards that can't take the spammy-clicky abuse, etc.
I also would have gone for removing animation cancelling, which I understand would not be popular with many other old players, but it is an option with real merit that at least used to be a hot topic.2 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭There are all the tools available in game already for this, you can't change people's mentality though.1 -
Olupajmibanan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Increase heavy attack damage onlySchattenfluegel wrote: »VoidCommander wrote: »Having an “end of dungeon” screen that shows damage done by individual members of the group could prove useful for prompting players to seek out content creator’s help.
I am heavy against this. You can meet twice in this game, and when your groupnumber DPS is worse, you gonna kick them out of the group. There are players, doing this - its unfair against newer players too.
You can already kinda do this. Just take a screenshot of player IDs within your group. This way you bypass the "anonymous" logging feature and can reliably track everyone's dps.Edited by Olupajmibanan on March 24, 2020 9:22AM0 -
Robby94✭✭✭Make no changesOTHER:
There is no need, we have normal mode and veteran mode, cp campaigns and no cp campaigns. mixing the players into the same group is what causes all the frustration from both sides.
if all gear dropped from normal then there wouldn't be the need for low skilled players joining a vet dungeon to get helms, trial gear etc. they would have less stress or anxiety from the possibility of annoying their group mates,
For Vet content just keep all the titles and achievements, they won't feel bothered by the low skilled. they'll be less frustrated and therefore both sides will have more fun.
while it does separate the community from playing with each other, friends can still group up and help one another. Most times people who you group with from your guild or friends list have patience and will help you get better.
Edit: on a side note if the LA/HA attack changes help with server performance and the desync of skills and bar swap, then so be it. If it needs to be done to make the game better then we will adjust to it within weeks and be chasing the new meta, thats the nature of MMO's (unfortunately).
Edited by Robby94 on March 24, 2020 9:32AM0 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I would definitely not try to dumb down the core game play mechanics. Instead, I think I would focus on maybe making content more accessible by overhauling the base game & DLC dungeons - by adding more difficulty options:
Current: Normal, Veteran, Hard Mode
What I would do:
Beginner - this will be mostly for DLC dungeons and will be on pair with current normal base game dungeons. White or green gear drops.
Normal - This will stay the same for DLC dungeons, but for base game will be "in the middle" - between Normal & Veteran.
Veteran - No changes
Hard Mode - No Changes.
In short - I would add a "Beginner" mode (or whatever to call it) to DLC dungeons that will be on pair with current base game dungeons and it will drop white or green quality gear.
For Base game dungeons, I would re-name "Normal" to "Beginner" and add new "Normal" mode that is slightly harder (so it will be between current normal & veteran.
If indeed devs see a serious issue in player skill gap and they want new players / less skilled players not to feel excluded from end-game content then imho this is better way (lesser evil) than re-inventing core game mechanics.1 -
Schattenfluegel✭✭✭✭Make no changesOlupajmibanan wrote: »Schattenfluegel wrote: »VoidCommander wrote: »Having an “end of dungeon” screen that shows damage done by individual members of the group could prove useful for prompting players to seek out content creator’s help.
I am heavy against this. You can meet twice in this game, and when your groupnumber DPS is worse, you gonna kick them out of the group. There are players, doing this - its unfair against newer players too.
You can already kinda do this. Just take a screenshot of player IDs within your group. This way you bypass the "anonymous" logging feature and can reliably track everyone's dps.
Yeah but no one will to this in Vetdungeons. Instead you've get kicked with low cp on starting.Love my Stamsorc0 -
Katinas✭✭✭✭Make no changesLack of skill or refusal to improve on that is a player's problem, not game's.
If you think it would be cool to win an Olympic medal and think it's unfair that athletes can run a marathon in around two hours, you don't complain and expect the International Olympic Committee to lower the standards so you could run for your pleasure.
If you are bad at game, realize it is your problem and improve yourself. Thousands of players have improved themselves, so can you.5 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Make no changesCan we stop calling spamming your left mouse button a skill gap?
You do not have to learn anything about light attack weaving. It is literally just spamming your left mouse button.
Everyone, even hindered people can do this. There is no skill gap in this game when it comes to offense. The only skill gap is that you need to memorize and keep up your damage over time abilities and your buffs. The game features a good in game bufftracker.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos4 -
JumpmanLane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I think there's this big push at closing the skill gap at ZOS because no one at Zenimax can out parse @ZOS_Gilliam lol.
Man, he click a keyboard lol!0 -
Runefang✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Make no changesI'd buff skills and provide better base game functionality for players to be given feedback on their rotation and performance. Combat metrics and action duration reminder in particular would help people know when dots/buffs run out and help them know if their dps was bad or not.1 -
Kalante✭✭✭✭✭
✭Make no changesFix server performance and dsyncs.
Three years ago this game did not ran flawlessly but at least my skills and attacks server registered them. Zos wants to take the cheapest route while maximazing profit by catering to casuals with these changes that dumb down eso's complex combat in hopes to kill two birds with one stone.
We all know that they dont want to do an overhaul of this game so they keep adding these band aid patches and combat changes.Edited by Kalante on March 24, 2020 11:09AM1 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Add option for automatic light attack weavingPut light and heavy attacks on the same GCD as skills.Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten3 -
Muzzick✭✭✭✭Make no changesGames have skill gaps, don't see why that's even an issue. Maybe make an easy or questing mode for some of the "tougher" normal content like DLC dungeons.1
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LadyNalcarya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Increase heavy attack damage onlyI think that light attack builds should still have the highest dps, simply because they require more skill. However, it would be nice if heavy attack builds would be a viable alternative for people who can't or don't want to play a la build for whatever reason.
The main problem is that the game doesn't really teach people how to play (rotations and stuff), and those who picked ESO with no prior mmo experience are just confused and overwhelmed. The existing build advisor is a good idea, but it's really outdated, for example, it offers newbie magsorcs to use a clannfear, which is now a stamina-based pet. Imo it should include more up-to date info and tips on how to use rotations (for example, when you unlock aoe dot for the first time, it would tell you how to properly use these) and that you have to use active skills, not just auto attacks. A lot of people in this game just have no idea how it works and treat it as Skyrim 2, and this is a big problem considering that the ESO combat system is drastically different.Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Voice of Reason
PC/EU1 -
Ezhh✭✭✭✭✭
✭Make no changesTutorials that explained weaving would make the world of difference...
I have taught so many players the basics after meeting them on random dungeon runs (I offer first, don't try and force feed them help) and the result is pretty much always a noticeable increase in damage output. I know many other players do the same.
But the game should have this built in. That would actually make a difference for any worse performing player who actually cares to improve. As for those who don't care to improve, with very few exceptions, that's their own choice, and then a skill gap is okay.7
