Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
Will shields remain useless?
-
D3N7157✭✭✭✭sorceres have been playing this way for ages and still are with great sucess, are you aware of sizes healing ward can reach when you are at 10% hp? if you expect shields to do all the work without any HOT or burst heal ability its not going to work,
shield, streak, conversion is as strong as ever in my opinion, you can stack 2 shields that will be 24k easily and then healing ward another 15k on top i have no idea why are you complaining, and you can have 20k resistances with zero effort on top of that. i just fail to see the issue here nobody if forbidding you to use snb and hold block in such situation either you know, best while streaking away.....
Healing ward.... In its most irrelevant state without use of trial staves. And I highly doubt it gives up to 15k sizes...
You seriously think shields and Streak is as strong as ever? I agree that dark convert is at its peak but streak used to go through block and didn't have a cool down 4 years ago... Shields were vastly superior in any prior patch, remember no battles spirit...
So you think sorcs complaining right now need to use 3 shields with snb, use of hots and burst heals to stay at 'pinnacle' state. This is adding up to 5 additional things I am not doing now that I cannot sacrifice if I want to compete at my current level 🙄
Smh my head...
streak is super cheap now and goes through block. check your facts3 -
D3N7157✭✭✭✭for me it seems you dont play as well as you think you do, i cant help you rapid regen is available to any classEdited by D3N7157 on February 8, 2020 3:24PM4
-
Mickey✭✭✭What are you about, streak = best it's been... LMFAO there is still the increase per streak with the cone targeting but you want me to check my facts, no increase cool down per streak is weaker than the fatigue apparently..
I'm not going out my way to get overhaul my build to use multiple heals and shields, that's a sign of a weak sorc.Edited by Mickey on February 8, 2020 3:48PM1 -
Mickey✭✭✭Http://prntscr.com/qzex1t
Please check your facts about honor the dead... Btw the above heal is from PURIFY0 -
iCaliban✭✭✭✭✭
✭I have not slotted a single shield, and all my mag chars use light armor, since shields started gaining effectiveness with resistance. I don't miss them because blocking and rolling are superior in every single way.
This concerns mostly sorcerers, don't start saying a no shield sorcerer would work because, for example, a Mag DK can compete without using shields.
It is objective that shields as a main defense is too expensive and give little in size return when used even with a high magicka pool.
I have been playing a no shield sorc for 2 patches. With more than moderate success0 -
Mickey✭✭✭I have not slotted a single shield, and all my mag chars use light armor, since shields started gaining effectiveness with resistance. I don't miss them because blocking and rolling are superior in every single way.
This concerns mostly sorcerers, don't start saying a no shield sorcerer would work because, for example, a Mag DK can compete without using shields.
It is objective that shields as a main defense is too expensive and give little in size return when used even with a high magicka pool.
I have been playing a no shield sorc for 2 patches. With more than moderate success
That play style would still be inferior to a shield build.
Just because it is possible to play without shield doesn't mean shields should remain [snip].
[Edited for profanity]Edited by ZOS_Volpe on February 9, 2020 9:40PM3 -
Gilvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭in that case we will need the return of oblivion damage and shield breaker set.0 -
iCaliban✭✭✭✭✭
✭I have not slotted a single shield, and all my mag chars use light armor, since shields started gaining effectiveness with resistance. I don't miss them because blocking and rolling are superior in every single way.
This concerns mostly sorcerers, don't start saying a no shield sorcerer would work because, for example, a Mag DK can compete without using shields.
It is objective that shields as a main defense is too expensive and give little in size return when used even with a high magicka pool.
I have been playing a no shield sorc for 2 patches. With more than moderate success
That play style would still be inferior to a shield build.
Just because it is possible to play without shield doesn't mean shields should remain [snip].
[Edited for profanity]
In point of fact, it's not inferior at all. Farmed quite a few shield spammers.
Which is my point. Shields are so bad that even on the "shield class" they arent even the best optionEdited by ZOS_Volpe on February 9, 2020 9:41PM1 -
Mickey✭✭✭I have not slotted a single shield, and all my mag chars use light armor, since shields started gaining effectiveness with resistance. I don't miss them because blocking and rolling are superior in every single way.
This concerns mostly sorcerers, don't start saying a no shield sorcerer would work because, for example, a Mag DK can compete without using shields.
It is objective that shields as a main defense is too expensive and give little in size return when used even with a high magicka pool.
I have been playing a no shield sorc for 2 patches. With more than moderate success
That play style would still be inferior to a shield build.
Just because it is possible to play without shield doesn't mean shields should remain ass.
In point of fact, it's not inferior at all. Farmed quite a few shield spammers.
Which is my point. Shields are so bad that even on the "shield class" they arent even the best option
I'm not swayed by that, since I've seen about 2 non shield sorcs in my life time do anything impressive.
But as you agree shields need a buff I'm all for that.1 -
hakan✭✭✭✭✭lol yeah sure go on to the other posts and say l2p it fine then come here complain about shields.
compared to vigor, you get instant health. they are fine.2 -
KillsAllElves✭✭✭✭✭lol yeah sure go on to the other posts and say l2p it fine then come here complain about shields.
compared to vigor, you get instant health. they are fine.
Perfect reason to buff all damage abilities to counter balance the high healing and high resistance stacking meta were currently in.
Stam players in pvp are running tri-pots, 2 troll king and vigor to proc troll king. That is meta!
I would love to see a huge shield buff. However bad players will always be bad unless they make the commitment trying to better them selves.2 -
TheFM✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭lol yeah sure go on to the other posts and say l2p it fine then come here complain about shields.
compared to vigor, you get instant health. they are fine.
Shields don't even compare to vigor atm. Vigor is cheap, heals for a ton, and negates far more damage than a 7 k shield that is negated in a single hit.5 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭Nope, shields are good as they should be they offer strenght comparable to burst heal ability my sorc has a 12k hardened ward i can get nowhere near that heal on my magplar for example unless it crits when it doesnt its actually half that,
to me it seems u have L2P and keep your shields up when its not time to go offensve issue
smh my head
It's pretty ez to delete a sorc through a 12k hardened ward.3 -
Mickey✭✭✭PhoenixGrey wrote: »Nope, shields are good as they should be they offer strenght comparable to burst heal ability my sorc has a 12k hardened ward i can get nowhere near that heal on my magplar for example unless it crits when it doesnt its actually half that,
to me it seems u have L2P and keep your shields up when its not time to go offensve issue
smh my head
It's pretty ez to delete a sorc through a 12k hardened ward.
Http://prntscr.com/qzex1t
A 21k honor the dead on an weak build is half as good as a 12k shield!!! Clearly1 -
TheFM✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What are you about, streak = best it's been... LMFAO there is still the increase per streak with the cone targeting but you want me to check my facts, no increase cool down per streak is weaker than the fatigue apparently..
I'm not going out my way to get overhaul my build to use multiple heals and shields, that's a sign of a weak sorc.
Yeah, a sure fire sign of a weakend class is that you have to go to outside sources aside your class and weapon skills to be viable. And rapid regen is incredibly unreliable. It would be one thing if it always hit you and one other person, but it does not. Healing ward is absurdly bad atm, if you couple it with the BRP resto staff AND rapid regen its -okay- but then you lose out on your 4 and 5 piece bonus , and you have to sacrifice certain abilities that you need to be functional. A heavy armor mag sorc IS possible, I tried, but your shields are awful, you always run out of magicka, and breaking free is the worst.1 -
PapaWeeb✭✭✭✭KillsAllElves wrote: »When playing mag sorc >>>DONT GO INTO MELEE RANGE<<<... I dont know why this is so hard for players to understand. Its easy to control the fight while playing mag sorc. If youre in range of toppling charge - go play another class. This is a zergling mentality.
Absolutely not lmao, many decent MagSorcs use streak as a stun, you wanna streak from 30 metres away?PC EU0 -
Rikumaru✭✭✭✭✭
✭What are you about, streak = best it's been... LMFAO there is still the increase per streak with the cone targeting but you want me to check my facts, no increase cool down per streak is weaker than the fatigue apparently..
I'm not going out my way to get overhaul my build to use multiple heals and shields, that's a sign of a weak sorc.
Yeah, a sure fire sign of a weakend class is that you have to go to outside sources aside your class and weapon skills to be viable. And rapid regen is incredibly unreliable. It would be one thing if it always hit you and one other person, but it does not. Healing ward is absurdly bad atm, if you couple it with the BRP resto staff AND rapid regen its -okay- but then you lose out on your 4 and 5 piece bonus , and you have to sacrifice certain abilities that you need to be functional. A heavy armor mag sorc IS possible, I tried, but your shields are awful, you always run out of magicka, and breaking free is the worst.
Don't zerg if you want rapid regen to hit yourself, you implied it yourself in a previous post that you play solo right? So there surely shouldn't be any problem with the reliability of rapid regen. If you are running with a zerg, you can always use the radiating regen morph instead. Alongside rapid regen, basically every magicka class in the game has a / multiple good heals.
Also talking of going to outside sources for skills, you realise stamina has to do this for every spammable other than biting jabs and maybe surprise attack right? Also for rally too (a heal and buff).Overload rework. Power Overload now does physical damage and grants you the power of a tornado: You throw a brick at the target with a light attack, and you hammer your head into that brick with every heavy attack. We have decreased its Ultimate cost, but increased the chance that you get stuck in the animation.2 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭What are you about, streak = best it's been... LMFAO there is still the increase per streak with the cone targeting but you want me to check my facts, no increase cool down per streak is weaker than the fatigue apparently..
I'm not going out my way to get overhaul my build to use multiple heals and shields, that's a sign of a weak sorc.
Yeah, a sure fire sign of a weakend class is that you have to go to outside sources aside your class and weapon skills to be viable. And rapid regen is incredibly unreliable. It would be one thing if it always hit you and one other person, but it does not. Healing ward is absurdly bad atm, if you couple it with the BRP resto staff AND rapid regen its -okay- but then you lose out on your 4 and 5 piece bonus , and you have to sacrifice certain abilities that you need to be functional. A heavy armor mag sorc IS possible, I tried, but your shields are awful, you always run out of magicka, and breaking free is the worst.
Also keep in mind that light armor is not suitable for relying on healing. Light armor grants no spell damage or magicka and has low resistances + no secondary mitigation benefits.
Medium armor has alot of weapon damage (buffs healing) more base resistance and secondary benefits in the form of dodge cost mitigation. So medium armor can well rely on heals.
Heavy armor obviously has great defense and directly buffs healing taken.
Light armor does not synergize well with heals. I have seen wardens and templars in light armor relying on healing rather than shields being easily evaporated where as heavy armor templars are immortal. Light armor needs shields, which is why it is so easy to delete. Shields are way too expensive for what they offer.
I fail to understand why the spell warding passive still gives spell resistance and not damage shield strenght. O.o That would synergize well with light armor. That is what it is all about! And why does light armor have the same amount of regeneration and cost reduction as medium armor? It should have more since it offers significantly less resistance than medium. Why are these armor types so equally numbered when one is more fragile than the other? The math is flawed in my opinion.Edited by Dracane on February 9, 2020 4:40PMAuri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos2 -
Drdeath20✭✭✭✭✭
✭Shields need a pvp buff but they are fine for pve.
Increasing the duration is more of a pve buff, where as in pvp the shields usually break after 1 or 2 hits. Leaving shields at 6 seconds means pve players have enough time to shield up and block those big pve 1 shots but its also short enough that it requires some timing.
I believe the best course of action is to subtley decrease the cost of a shield by a margain of ~10%. It still only covers 1 or 2 hits but it becomes equally as appealing as healing. The problem is that you still need to have heals, and a purge with a shield where as if you only use a heal and a purge you have a free prescious ability spot.
Slightly reducing the cost would barely effect pve bcz typically wipes dont happen from damage dealers not having enough magicka to activate a shield.
Now if shields were reasonably cheaper than healing it would make them more enticing to slot 1, in pvp, bcz in some scenarios they are more cost efficient than healing back up.Edited by Drdeath20 on February 9, 2020 7:52PM0 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Shields need a pvp buff but they are fine for pve.
Increasing the duration is more of a pve buff, where as in pvp the shields usually break after 1 or 2 hits. Leaving shields at 6 seconds means pve players have enough time to shield up and block those big pve 1 shots but its also short enough that it requires some timing.
I believe the best course of action is to subtley decrease the cost of a shield by a margain of ~10%. It still only covers 1 or 2 hits but it becomes equally as appealing as healing. The problem is that you still need to have heals, and a purge with a shield where as if you only use a heal and a purge you have a free prescious ability spot.
Slightly reducing the cost would barely effect pve bcz typically wipes dont happen from damage dealers not having enough magicka to activate a shield.
Now if shields were reasonably cheaper than healing it would make them more enticing to slot 1, in pvp, bcz in some scenarios they are more cost efficient than healing back up.
A bit more generosity if I may. 10%? You can as well insult and attack me instead.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Funny how the balance is in a much worse state after their skill pruning than it was before. Far less classes and specs are viable, I'm so glad that I've quitted this game before Dragonhold. This is the first PTS since years in which I didn't even bother to log in. Instead of buffing some of the blatantly overnerfed skills (shields are among them, especially hardened, dampen and healing ward) they nerf Iceheart (LOL) and release a broken op stamina set for tanks.I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.0 -
Drdeath20✭✭✭✭✭
✭Shields need a pvp buff but they are fine for pve.
Increasing the duration is more of a pve buff, where as in pvp the shields usually break after 1 or 2 hits. Leaving shields at 6 seconds means pve players have enough time to shield up and block those big pve 1 shots but its also short enough that it requires some timing.
I believe the best course of action is to subtley decrease the cost of a shield by a margain of ~10%. It still only covers 1 or 2 hits but it becomes equally as appealing as healing. The problem is that you still need to have heals, and a purge with a shield where as if you only use a heal and a purge you have a free prescious ability spot.
Slightly reducing the cost would barely effect pve bcz typically wipes dont happen from damage dealers not having enough magicka to activate a shield.
Now if shields were reasonably cheaper than healing it would make them more enticing to slot 1, in pvp, bcz in some scenarios they are more cost efficient than healing back up.
A bit more generosity if I may. 10%? You can as well insult and attack me instead.
Sure0 -
ZOS_VolpeadminGreetings all,
After removing a few posts, we must remind everyone that all post should be kept within the guidelines of the rules that we have in place. Having different opinions and debating is completely acceptable. However when doing so, keep it civil and constructive. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.
Thank you for your understanding,
The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios
Forum Rules | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Home Page | Help Site0 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Funny how the balance is in a much worse state after their skill pruning than it was before. Far less classes and specs are viable, I'm so glad that I've quitted this game before Dragonhold. This is the first PTS since years in which I didn't even bother to log in. Instead of buffing some of the blatantly overnerfed skills (shields are among them, especially hardened, dampen and healing ward) they nerf Iceheart (LOL) and release a broken op stamina set for tanks.
Same here. I did not log in for 5 months or so according to my associate. Due to them I decided to log in today and do some dungeons. Yet my class or rather playstyle/s feel/s dead outside of being a subordinate support bot.Edited by Dracane on February 9, 2020 10:36PMAuri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
KillsAllElves✭✭✭✭✭KillsAllElves wrote: »When playing mag sorc >>>DONT GO INTO MELEE RANGE<<<... I dont know why this is so hard for players to understand. Its easy to control the fight while playing mag sorc. If youre in range of toppling charge - go play another class. This is a zergling mentality.
Absolutely not lmao, many decent MagSorcs use streak as a stun, you wanna streak from 30 metres away?
Absolutely yes and decent mag sorcs streak away all the time, no way getting around that fact and i do it alot myself.0 -
MaxJrFTW✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭In no cp my shields seem to be of little to no use. I may as well be playing without them because if someone catches up to me i'm dead shields or not. Cp is a different story, but i rarely go to crutch point land."I don't know you, and I don't care to know you."
―Ulrich Leland, 3E 4330 -
IAVITNI✭✭✭✭✭First off this isn't a sorcerer thread. Though admittedly that class is affected the most and I am technically a mag sorc main, the topic of this thread are shields in general. I will update the op to clarify this, but to everyone reading, please keep this in mind.
Shield builds should be a viable/competitive option for all magicka classes. This does not mean they have to be BiS, but they should be comparable up to a small margin, which on live they are not.Nope, shields are good as they should be they offer strenght comparable to burst heal ability my sorc has a 12k hardened ward i can get nowhere near that heal on my magplar for example unless it crits when it doesnt its actually half that,
to me it seems u have L2P and keep your shields up when its not time to go offensve issue
smh my headfor me it seems you dont play as well as you think you do, i cant help you rapid regen is available to any class
I think you're missing the point and this is what everyone else who is stating it is a L2P issue is missing as well.
Perhaps comparing Shields to Vigor was the biggest error. Instead let's compare Shields to the Magicka Vigor--Rapid Regeneration.
For 5 out of 6 classes, Rapid Regeneration is the better option by a large margin. It is cheaper and provides greater returns for survivability in general.
Building to use shields is incredibly restrictive in terms of sets that can be used. And even then, a shield build will be comparatively weaker to a Rapid Regen build using the same sets. Rapid Regen builds can also be more versatile as they are not locked into using one (1) if not two (2) of necropotence/alfiq/BTB. in fact, the best option is currently BTB+ one of the other 2 aforementioned sets. This is nothing close to play your way.
That said, and again I will update the OP, a big buff is not needed. Realistically, decreasing the costs of shields would be enough to make them competitive with RR builds. Though IMO shield builds are now inherently flawed after the resistance changes. The concept of shields was to be strong when they were up but essentially pure glass when they were down, but instead they normalized shields with burst heals but did not provide any of the benefits of healing to shields while keeping all the drawbacks.
And for reference, I have adapted. I run RR on all magicka classes and the only shield I run is Hardened on a magsorc and I play almost exclusively solo. RR is just better than Dampen. Period. This shouldn't be the case. It should be build/situation dependant.
As an aside, magicka builds should not have universal access to strong HoTs. Magicka builds were designed around proactive defence that clearly distinguished them from their stamina counter-parts. Providing magicka builds with strong reactive defensive tools when they were originally designed with strong proactive tools is asking for imbalance moving forward.
0
