Vykosa Nerf Update

Nefas · January 2020

Update (PTS WEEK 3, https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/511000/pts-patch-notes-v5-3-2#latest):

This set now reduces the target’s Weapon and Spell Damage by up to 20% for 5 seconds with a 15 second cooldown, rather than reducing it by up to 268 for 8 seconds with a 12 second cooldown.

While certainly still a nerf compared to Major Maim, it is noticeably better than the abysmal ~260 WD/SD reduction the previous PTS iteration had. The below CMX courtesy of AnotherMyth from Worst In Slot Discord server shows the PTS Vykosa on Olms:

I personally haven't done any tests yet on PTS but the set looks like it can still be effective in the niche scenarios it's being used for on Live.

The swap to make it more passive with a lesser effect didn’t yield the results we had hoped for, so we’re putting it back into a category where it’s strong for a short period of time, but we’ve increased that duration a bit to help it be more usable in situations where you haven’t perfectly memorized the time frames for each attack.

A valid point I suppose since it did punish tanks including myself for mistiming the proc by not providing Major Maim for a specific attack at the time for the group. Although I would also argue that was also an attractive feature of the set, the fact that it kept you on your toes/you needed to know the fight (most tanks become very familiar with timings of boss fights anyway).

Additionally, we opted for a percentage reduction over a flat decrease to prevent situations where groups could stack this with other damage reduction sources, such as Mending or Weakening enchants, and significantly reduce the threat an enemy could pose.

A fair change to not let these stack, at least in my opinion, with this most recent change to the set as you don't want to make certain boss mechanics/attacks completely irrelevant though I'm sure others will have different thoughts.

Original Post:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mjV3rsPM-U

1) Keep the Major Maim but adjust the timeframe for the proc (3 seconds to 2?) or adjust the duration to be longer and keep the same Major Maim duration if the devs think for whatever reason it's overperforming.

2) If no Major Maim, simply increase the value of the weapon/spell damage it reduces. Very very underwhelming atm with 268 weapon/spell damage reduction. One hander enchants are literally the same thing.

As it is on PTS, Vykosa is now completely useless and it feels like they missed the point of the set and took a step backwards with Vykosa compared to the other item-set updates they've carried out.

John_Falstaff · January 2020

It's no use. As @satanio pointed out earlier, they didn't nerf it because it was too strong. They nerfed it because they need to sell new DLC, and what's a good way to make new, shiny, useful sets when you're out of ideas for useful effects? Of course it's to ruin old useful sets and transfer their effects to new DLC ones for which people will be paying money.

It's disgusting. I thought necro cash-grab would be their most blatant one, but now they've hit a new low. I wish they at least commented on it, but time goes, and we're still waiting for the oft-promised better communication. So far, the only communication there is ends with 'thank you for understanding'.

frozzzen101 · January 2020

Honestly, no tank would ever use 5 piece on such garbage that they are trying to sell in new dlc. It is strong, but it's too limited in terms of timing it properly and it adds no group benefit. And if you really are struggling with staying alive, Leeching plate is much better option overall. So no, even their marketing strategy is faulty because Vykosa's major maim is only useful because it comes from monster mask source, arguably one of most flexible aspects of tank gear and it's never mandatory. It is just nice option to have around.*

It is too obvious cashgrab and really shouldn't be treated like anything else like balancing oversight or it being too strong or anything than that. It feels like marketing department is making combat changes rather than combat team, which might explain lots of things recently.

*Was nice option to have around

AgaTheGreat · January 2020

The only place I used Vykosa is MT in vss hm (last boss). There's no way any tank is going to use the new garbage set just to get access to major maim. What about other sets you have to run? There's just not enough space.

We'll have to make do.

Olupajmibanan · January 2020

AgaTheGreat wrote: »

The only place I used Vykosa is MT in vss hm (last boss). There's no way any tank is going to use the new garbage set just to get access to major maim. What about other sets you have to run? There's just not enough space.

We'll have to make do.

My thoughts exactly. Outside of HM Nahviintas it was used for vAS before each Storm the Heavens. However thats an entirely avoidable mechanic and Vykosa was only useful for progression groups learning the encounter. It created some more room for mistakes, but I definitely won't use full 5pc for this purpose. Guess, new progression groups will just have to learn trough pain

karekiz · January 2020

ZoS: Ohh *** they are using a monster set to counter abilities on less than 5 total encounters in game. Nerf it and resell it.
Dev: What do we do with Vykosa.
ZoS: - Points to the Great Monster Set Trashpin. There. There it shall lay.

They should just revamp it back. Its hardly "OP" levels and the best trial it works on is already aging. The new set needs to be remade into something entirely new. I wouldn't actually mind if they made the "new" Vykosa set into the 5 set bonus (Something like an AoE Mending for 10 seconds refreshed on taunt). Best of both.

SirMewser · January 2020

John_Falstaff wrote: »

It's no use. As @satanio pointed out earlier, they didn't nerf it because it was too strong. They nerfed it because they need to sell new DLC, and what's a good way to make new, shiny, useful sets when you're out of ideas for useful effects? Of course it's to ruin old useful sets and transfer their effects to new DLC ones for which people will be paying money.

It's disgusting. I thought necro cash-grab would be their most blatant one, but now they've hit a new low. I wish they at least commented on it, but time goes, and we're still waiting for the oft-promised better communication. So far, the only communication there is ends with 'thank you for understanding'.

Then what if we can say, that some of us won't get the new DLC in fear that the new shiny sets will be nerfed in the next (Q2+) DLC?
If it's truly a cycle.
I haven't bothered buying the last 2 DLCs because of this reason.
I know I'm not alone.

Perhaps others are indifferent that this is happening so they buy it anyways.
I wouldn't be surprised.

satanio · January 2020

I’m sad.

IonicKai · January 2020

It's been said before and should be said again. No good tank will give up one of their 5 pc sets to run the set from the new dlc. It costs more to the group then to just have the tank use something else or do something else like roll dodge or be guarded. Monster sets are where tanks get some utility and this change to vykosa destroys the utility it was being used for.

Tsar_Gekkou · February 2020

I finally get around to burning keys to get the right weight shoulder for this and it gets gutted. Kinda hurts.

satanio · February 2020

So, 20% WD reduction is good right? If bosses have ~4000 WD... is the problem solved?

LeeNordTank · February 2020

I agree with Nefas !!!

Nefas · February 2020

Edited OP.

satanio wrote: »

So, 20% WD reduction is good right? If bosses have ~4000 WD... is the problem solved?

I don't think there was a "problem" in the first place but if the problem you're referring to is the first PTS iteration of Vykosa, I'd say more or less it's better than whatever it was.

actosh · February 2020

did just a real quick test with my tankblade.

Used Olms on Vet as Dummy and the Heavy attack he does.

Usual Tankbuild, around 27k res. Minor prot up.

live: 7-8k less dmg taken.
pts: 5-6k less dmg taken.

Havent tested other mechanics/attacks yet, but on a first look i like it.

satanio · February 2020

Nefas wrote: »

Edited OP.

satanio wrote: »

So, 20% WD reduction is good right? If bosses have ~4000 WD... is the problem solved?

I don't think there was a "problem" in the first place but if the problem you're referring to is the first PTS iteration of Vykosa, I'd say more or less it's better than whatever it was.

Even you yourself have proposed solutions, and why do people propose solutions - to solve problems!
Afterall, I am happy about this change and I'm happy to see those numbers @actosh.

actosh · February 2020

satanio wrote: »

Nefas wrote: »

Edited OP.

satanio wrote: »

So, 20% WD reduction is good right? If bosses have ~4000 WD... is the problem solved?

I don't think there was a "problem" in the first place but if the problem you're referring to is the first PTS iteration of Vykosa, I'd say more or less it's better than whatever it was.

Even you yourself have proposed solutions, and why do people propose solutions - to solve problems!
Afterall, I am happy about this change and I'm happy to see those numbers @actosh.

Yeah me 2. Still need to test some other stuff, but its looking okay for a 2piece monsterset. Mostly for vAS(IR).
Weaker then they Maim, but the increased duration is an ok alternative for it. Thanks to everybody who suggested solutions to ZOS to keep the set in it´s niche use it has

mav1234 · February 2020

The changes ZOS made here make sense and seem to keep the niche usage of this set - maybe even expanding it! Good on them.

Asardes · February 2020

How much Weapon Damage do bosses and mobs actually have?

actosh · February 2020

Asardes wrote: »

How much Weapon Damage do bosses and mobs actually have?

Noone knows that for certain but, i found out something funny about vykosa.

Switched gear a lot, sometimes fought even without gear (except for vykosa).

The result on this quick test was, it reduces (when active with the 5 sec window) each incoming dmg by around 20-21% (think rounding errors within eso itself).

Doenst matter if normal mob, overland boss, trial boss, your equiped stuff, active buffs ( had activated everything on nb u can get) and it was always 20% reduction on the attack. Seems to work like Relentless Focus on a Blade, that it is calculated at the last spot. Like the mitigationformula =dmg u would take - vykosa = real dmg u take. On phone right now, so sry for not explaining it in 20 pages ^^.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Gilliam is this how the set is supposed to work right now? That would mean each enemy has the same wep/spell dmg and each attack has its own value.

Asardes · February 2020

Well if the value is constant for all NPC enemies - which I find unlikely - then the set will be less effective on bosses than other mobs, which presumably have less weapon damage. Same problem with Healing Mage set which reduces this mysterious "weapon damage" stat. IMO rather than have such obscure calculations both sets should receive an unique % reduction to damage which is easier to calculate.

actosh · February 2020

Thing is Vykosa reduced incoming dmg by around 20% on a bear and on olms.
The NB Skill Power Extraction, that reduces wep/spell dmg by 200 did almost nothing in terms of dmg reduction. So i think that each category of mobs does have different wep/spell dmg values.

Need to take way more time for testing, was just a quick look. Only thing u can say for certain is that vykose reduces inc dmg by 20% after your mitigation got calculated against the hit.

Asardes · February 2020

actosh wrote: »

Thing is Vykosa reduced incoming dmg by around 20% on a bear and on olms.
The NB Skill Power Extraction, that reduces wep/spell dmg by 200 did almost nothing in terms of dmg reduction. So i think that each category of mobs does have different wep/spell dmg values.

Need to take way more time for testing, was just a quick look. Only thing u can say for certain is that vykose reduces inc dmg by 20% after your mitigation got calculated against the hit.

If it's 20% the nerf is not that bad, considering Major Maim is 30%. Actually now you can stack Vykosa with Major Maim from something like Solar Prison.

Vykosa Nerf *Update*

Vykosa Nerf Update