Off balance change

Madhatten512 · January 2020

Before I get into the change to off balance on the pts first I want to say that ZOS needs to learn the difference between effective and overperforming... When d swing was changed everyone went insane they hated it the skill was ruined blah, blah, blah. Though I didn't initially like the change I did see that the people that toon the time to perfect and master combos that used the off-balance cc could gain an advantage. So that's what I did I practice it.. I dueled constantly on the pts to get used to change, and when it went live I did the same. It added a layer of skill to the combos you could do with a 2h, and it was effective.. That doesn't mean its broken and needs changing.

I don't understand Zenimaxs need to kill playstyles. Have you even considered what this off-balance change does to flame lash mag dks a playstyle that's been around since the game wsa released. Every stam weapon line has taken heavy nerfs in 5 or 6 straight patches, and now 2h is really the only viable damage option in pvp because of onslaught. Now after your made the sweeping change to d swing last patch, and we have all adjusted to that change (in my case I actually like where d swing is in the current patch)you pull the rug out and change it again.. My only reasoning behind you doing this is because it was killing bad players to easy like the original d swing.. The off-balance cc has plenty of counter you can avoid the d swing that placed you off balance or you can block or avoid the heavy attack that will cc you... That is more counters than a lot of ccs in this game.. You really need to explain to us what kind of game this is turning into. Yo me every patch your doing things to slow combat. to dumb it down, and make it as beginner(or bad player) friendly as possible...

MentalxHammer · January 2020

Agreed. Honestly this change is completely ludicrous considering they think major protection and harmony are just fine...

Madhatten512 · January 2020

MentalxHammer wrote: »

Agreed. Honestly this change is completely ludicrous considering they think major protection and harmony are just fine...

and don't forget bombard.... How that lovely skill remains untouched is beyond me..

blur · January 2020

Madhatten512 wrote: »

Before I get into the change to off balance on the pts first I want to say that ZOS needs to learn the difference between effective and overperforming... When d swing was changed everyone went insane they hated it the skill was ruined blah, blah, blah. Though I didn't initially like the change I did see that the people that toon the time to perfect and master combos that used the off-balance cc could gain an advantage. So that's what I did I practice it.. I dueled constantly on the pts to get used to change, and when it went live I did the same. It added a layer of skill to the combos you could do with a 2h, and it was effective.. That doesn't mean its broken and needs changing.

I don't understand Zenimaxs need to kill playstyles. Have you even considered what this off-balance change does to flame lash mag dks a playstyle that's been around since the game wsa released. Every stam weapon line has taken heavy nerfs in 5 or 6 straight patches, and now 2h is really the only viable damage option in pvp because of onslaught. Now after your made the sweeping change to d swing last patch, and we have all adjusted to that change (in my case I actually like where d swing is in the current patch)you pull the rug out and change it again.. My only reasoning behind you doing this is because it was killing bad players to easy like the original d swing.. The off-balance cc has plenty of counter you can avoid the d swing that placed you off balance or you can block or avoid the heavy attack that will cc you... That is more counters than a lot of ccs in this game.. You really need to explain to us what kind of game this is turning into. Yo me every patch your doing things to slow combat. to dumb it down, and make it as beginner(or bad player) friendly as possible...

You also should mention the fact that Armor of Truth got directly nerfed by this as did the CP passive.
Moreover people will be immune to Dizzy for 15s after the OB is consumed/drops off. This will include OB being applied from other players you don't necessarily know about. In other words, you find some dude you want to kill, you try to CC with DS and he is immune because someone else already popped his off balance cherry. You are a Stam Sorc and only have Dizzy as your source of CC, gg. Also they can chain their immovability potion to the 15s OB cooldown which gives them 23s of immunity.

evoniee · January 2020

oh great, now maybe people will try out dual wield or snb at pvp.

the problem is being able to stun without slotting actual stun skill or stun in a spammable without any rules and you can do it consistently is pretty broken.

with a cp passive skill, you can stun ppl consistently without slotting any actual stun skill.

at pts, dizzy still have a cc after a second hit (or hit when enemy off balance), you dont even need a medium / heavy attack to stun.

what dev trying to change is, off balance debuff are pretty broken "in general" not only on dizzy swing.

also with cp skill, it increase damage to off balance target.

tldr:
- off balance up time is too high, it need some adjustment. you can still stun with off balance and it is not consumed on the stun, but it has a cooldown now, which is an ok idea.
- also not only that, uppercut and two handed are the only effective melee offensive weapon, i believe dev try to refresh the game a little bit.

usmguy1234 · January 2020

evoniee wrote: »

oh great, now maybe people will try out dual wield or snb at pvp.

the problem is being able to stun without slotting actual stun skill or stun in a spammable without any rules and you can do it consistently is pretty broken.

with a cp passive skill, you can stun ppl consistently without slotting any actual stun skill.

at pts, dizzy still have a cc after a second hit (or hit when enemy off balance), you dont even need a medium / heavy attack to stun.

what dev trying to change is, off balance debuff are pretty broken "in general" not only on dizzy swing.

also with cp skill, it increase damage to off balance target.

tldr:
- off balance up time is too high, it need some adjustment. you can still stun with off balance and it is not consumed on the stun, but it has a cooldown now, which is an ok idea.
- also not only that, uppercut and two handed are the only effective melee offensive weapon, i believe dev try to refresh the game a little bit.

Refresh the game? By taking away counterplay options? One's that took a decent amount of effort to pull off- laughably more effort than pushing a button to trigger synergies that hit harder than ultimates?

If less is more zos is killing this game...I mean killing it (this game).

jcm2606 · January 2020

evoniee wrote: »

oh great, now maybe people will try out dual wield or snb at pvp.

the problem is being able to stun without slotting actual stun skill or stun in a spammable without any rules and you can do it consistently is pretty broken.

with a cp passive skill, you can stun ppl consistently without slotting any actual stun skill.

at pts, dizzy still have a cc after a second hit (or hit when enemy off balance), you dont even need a medium / heavy attack to stun.

what dev trying to change is, off balance debuff are pretty broken "in general" not only on dizzy swing.

also with cp skill, it increase damage to off balance target.

tldr:
- off balance up time is too high, it need some adjustment. you can still stun with off balance and it is not consumed on the stun, but it has a cooldown now, which is an ok idea.
- also not only that, uppercut and two handed are the only effective melee offensive weapon, i believe dev try to refresh the game a little bit.

This was never an issue before the Dizzy stun was removed, putting a spotlight on off balance as a mechanic. If it was never an issue before, can we really consider this an issue now, or is this simply a matter of bad players QQ'ing about the fact that they're dying in PvP?

Syrusthevirus187 · January 2020

Bad players will always die in pvp

Madhatten512 · January 2020

evoniee wrote: »

oh great, now maybe people will try out dual wield or snb at pvp.

the problem is being able to stun without slotting actual stun skill or stun in a spammable without any rules and you can do it consistently is pretty broken.

with a cp passive skill, you can stun ppl consistently without slotting any actual stun skill.

at pts, dizzy still have a cc after a second hit (or hit when enemy off balance), you dont even need a medium / heavy attack to stun.

what dev trying to change is, off balance debuff are pretty broken "in general" not only on dizzy swing.

also with cp skill, it increase damage to off balance target.

tldr:
- off balance up time is too high, it need some adjustment. you can still stun with off balance and it is not consumed on the stun, but it has a cooldown now, which is an ok idea.
- also not only that, uppercut and two handed are the only effective melee offensive weapon, i believe dev try to refresh the game a little bit.

Its a two step process for a cc that has counters how in gods name is that broken??? If you have a problem with blocking or dodging a heavy attack after you have been set OB is a learn to play issue.

Also, I'd love to use duel wield, or SnB(which was my preferred playstyle) but they have been nerfed into uselessness.. On the pts last night me and friend tested master duel wields rending slash on a build that had over80k consistant weapon damage it was ticking for a max of 968..They have removed options for stamina damage dealers.. Necro bash ult gets SnB bash weaving gutted instead of nerf the ult..

I'd love to go into theory crafting with options other than 2h burst builds, but as of right now there isn't any. I'm just asking them not to again nerf another mechanic that is effective, but it has counters and isn't overperforming in anyway..

Siohwenoeht · January 2020

Madhatten512 wrote: »

evoniee wrote: »

oh great, now maybe people will try out dual wield or snb at pvp.

the problem is being able to stun without slotting actual stun skill or stun in a spammable without any rules and you can do it consistently is pretty broken.

with a cp passive skill, you can stun ppl consistently without slotting any actual stun skill.

at pts, dizzy still have a cc after a second hit (or hit when enemy off balance), you dont even need a medium / heavy attack to stun.

what dev trying to change is, off balance debuff are pretty broken "in general" not only on dizzy swing.

also with cp skill, it increase damage to off balance target.

tldr:
- off balance up time is too high, it need some adjustment. you can still stun with off balance and it is not consumed on the stun, but it has a cooldown now, which is an ok idea.
- also not only that, uppercut and two handed are the only effective melee offensive weapon, i believe dev try to refresh the game a little bit.

Its a two step process for a cc that has counters how in gods name is that broken??? If you have a problem with blocking or dodging a heavy attack after you have been set OB is a learn to play issue.

Also, I'd love to use duel wield, or SnB(which was my preferred playstyle) but they have been nerfed into uselessness.. On the pts last night me and friend tested master duel wields rending slash on a build that had over80k consistant weapon damage it was ticking for a max of 968..They have removed options for stamina damage dealers.. Necro bash ult gets SnB bash weaving gutted instead of nerf the ult..

I'd love to go into theory crafting with options other than 2h burst builds, but as of right now there isn't any. I'm just asking them not to again nerf another mechanic that is effective, but it has counters and isn't overperforming in anyway..

I agree. I've shelved my stamsorc for PVP because of the nerfs to dualwield and snb. I really don't like the two handers on that build because it all feels slow and clunky, and I feel bad about using a bow because I built a brawler, not an archer.

FlowOne · January 2020

evoniee wrote: »

oh great, now maybe people will try out dual wield or snb at pvp.

the problem is being able to stun without slotting actual stun skill or stun in a spammable without any rules and you can do it consistently is pretty broken.

with a cp passive skill, you can stun ppl consistently without slotting any actual stun skill.

at pts, dizzy still have a cc after a second hit (or hit when enemy off balance), you dont even need a medium / heavy attack to stun.

what dev trying to change is, off balance debuff are pretty broken "in general" not only on dizzy swing.

also with cp skill, it increase damage to off balance target.

tldr:
- off balance up time is too high, it need some adjustment. you can still stun with off balance and it is not consumed on the stun, but it has a cooldown now, which is an ok idea.
- also not only that, uppercut and two handed are the only effective melee offensive weapon, i believe dev try to refresh the game a little bit.

Wait what? Try DW and SNB? Both of this skill lines was nerfed and ***. I wanna see how u gonna kill some one with this trash. Dizzy never was a problem in old patches, it was high reward skill with insane dmg, stun and 1s cast. All what zos must to do buff DW and SNB like it was before and return dizzy how it was. Then people gonna play with other spammables again and dizzy gonna be ok. And rly do u think people like to play with it? No but this is only one playable skill. Issues in lack of skills, cuz 90% of them r super trash.