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grave robber synergy way over powered
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fred4✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
As an aside: The guy I encountered was actually really fast and that's coming from someone (me) who is built for maximum speed on my magblade (3x gold Swift, Steed, Windrunning, RAT, Concealed).Moonsorrow wrote: »So as said, Magicka necro has 1 (one) time every 20 seconds to try this combo.. with any other class in 20 seconds i do WAY more damage and be more flexible, and with Infused or Swift trait on jewelry for better utility than what Harmony brings to solo player.0 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭If you get caught inside a grave robber synergy the first thing you should ask yourself is:
"Why did I fail so horrible at positioning myself so I got caught in a potential high damage burst?"
The only way those synergies will hit you for 17-18k (assuming you aren´t running a full-blown glass canon with sub 20k resistance) is if you get hit by colossus ultimate prior to the synergy (30% more damage taken). There will be 2 groups of people using this synergy:
1. Organized small-and medium scale group
2. Organized large-scale groups.
Both of these groups are after fighting forces of greater numbers than themselves (generally speaking), and god forbid that there´s a tool to deal with zergs. There´s already enough advantage of being in greater numbers as a zerg, so there should definitely come some trade offs while doing so (aka you´re more vulnerable to AoE burst such as grave-robber and proximity detonation etc....)
Pro-tip to avoid getting deleted by this: Use your brain and stop chasing the groups that will most likely use it against you, or be confident enough with your own group so that you know how to counter it. The skill and harmony trait is balanced as it is.
this.
i hate this synergy and OH GOD HOW I WISH DK BANNER has the ability to trigger our own synergy..... *hhnnggggghhhhh*
BUT
after figuring out the issue and how Harmony trait plays into this, I learn to...
*ehm*
wait for it..
....
wait for it...........
drumroll please.........
*avoid the red circles*
Problem freakin solved.
Like, seriously. Forget Cyrodiil, even in BG, there's very few spots you can get cornered into a space you can't get out of. (the tiny room in the bridge tower comes to mind lol)
Seriously. Just... don't stay in the red circle.
Threat. Gone.
Very true, but staying out of the red circle is not always possible.
I’ll give you an example, I think Dracarys uses clever alchemist and all pot at the same time. They fight for a bit with big burst then run away covering their tracks with the fear circles. It’s a good strategy, and the counter seems to be to stay on them so you can hit them without their clever alchemist buff and hit their sustain.
In this situation - no, staying out of the red isn’t the solution. If you let them break away they will come back and roll you.
In this case though I still don’t think the self synergy is too much. What’s too much is the fear circles and break free being buggy in lag. It’s actually the fear circle with the ability that makes the combo OP... and a buggy break free in general. In a no lag environment the colossus plus synergy would be easy to counter.Edited by Iskiab on January 3, 2020 8:27PMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten4 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bullseyebudx wrote: »
it takes a second or so to trigger the synergy.
my roll button is mapped to a button on my mouse. break free is also on another button. it's literally 2 clicks for me (a stamDK) to get away.
that being said.....If you get caught inside a grave robber synergy the first thing you should ask yourself is:
"Why did I fail so horrible at positioning myself so I got caught in a potential high damage burst?"
The only way those synergies will hit you for 17-18k (assuming you aren´t running a full-blown glass canon with sub 20k resistance) is if you get hit by colossus ultimate prior to the synergy (30% more damage taken). There will be 2 groups of people using this synergy:
1. Organized small-and medium scale group
2. Organized large-scale groups.
Both of these groups are after fighting forces of greater numbers than themselves (generally speaking), and god forbid that there´s a tool to deal with zergs. There´s already enough advantage of being in greater numbers as a zerg, so there should definitely come some trade offs while doing so (aka you´re more vulnerable to AoE burst such as grave-robber and proximity detonation etc....)
Pro-tip to avoid getting deleted by this: Use your brain and stop chasing the groups that will most likely use it against you, or be confident enough with your own group so that you know how to counter it. The skill and harmony trait is balanced as it is.
this.
i hate this synergy and OH GOD HOW I WISH DK BANNER has the ability to trigger our own synergy..... *hhnnggggghhhhh*
BUT
after figuring out the issue and how Harmony trait plays into this, I learn to...
*ehm*
wait for it..
....
wait for it...........
drumroll please.........
*avoid the red circles*
Problem freakin solved.
Like, seriously. Forget Cyrodiil, even in BG, there's very few spots you can get cornered into a space you can't get out of. (the tiny room in the bridge tower comes to mind lol)
Seriously. Just... don't stay in the red circle.
Threat. Gone.
Very true, but staying out of the red circle is not always possible.
I’ll give you an example, I think Dracarys uses clever alchemist and all pot at the same time. They fight for a bit with big burst then run away covering their tracks with the fear circles. It’s a good strategy, and the counter seems to be to stay on them so you can hit them without their clever alchemist buff and hit their sustain.
In this situation - no, staying out of the red isn’t the solution. If you let them break away they will come back and roll you.
In this case though I still don’t think the self synergy is too much. What’s too much is the fear circles and break free being buggy in lag. It’s actually the fear circle with the ability that makes the combo OP... and a buggy break free in general. In a no lag environment the colossus plus synergy would be easy to counter.
buggy break free is definitely, without a doubt, the reason of more than 50% of my deaths in CP Cyrodiil.
i'm 200% sure of this.August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber2 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bullseyebudx wrote: »
i mean, dude, CC-ing someone than unleashing your combo isn't an issue with necro... that's Cyrodiil 101
August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber3 -
Bullseyebudx✭✭✭Bullseyebudx wrote: »
i mean, dude, CC-ing someone than unleashing your combo isn't an issue with necro... that's Cyrodiil 101
I get that, the only difference here is it's pretty much a forced death at instant speed with a CC, like it's a lot of damage.
Even if you see and avoid the initial circles the Vicious Death triggers off those that didn't could kill you outright.0 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Bullseyebudx wrote: »
it takes a second or so to trigger the synergy.
my roll button is mapped to a button on my mouse. break free is also on another button. it's literally 2 clicks for me (a stamDK) to get away.
that being said.....If you get caught inside a grave robber synergy the first thing you should ask yourself is:
"Why did I fail so horrible at positioning myself so I got caught in a potential high damage burst?"
The only way those synergies will hit you for 17-18k (assuming you aren´t running a full-blown glass canon with sub 20k resistance) is if you get hit by colossus ultimate prior to the synergy (30% more damage taken). There will be 2 groups of people using this synergy:
1. Organized small-and medium scale group
2. Organized large-scale groups.
Both of these groups are after fighting forces of greater numbers than themselves (generally speaking), and god forbid that there´s a tool to deal with zergs. There´s already enough advantage of being in greater numbers as a zerg, so there should definitely come some trade offs while doing so (aka you´re more vulnerable to AoE burst such as grave-robber and proximity detonation etc....)
Pro-tip to avoid getting deleted by this: Use your brain and stop chasing the groups that will most likely use it against you, or be confident enough with your own group so that you know how to counter it. The skill and harmony trait is balanced as it is.
this.
i hate this synergy and OH GOD HOW I WISH DK BANNER has the ability to trigger our own synergy..... *hhnnggggghhhhh*
BUT
after figuring out the issue and how Harmony trait plays into this, I learn to...
*ehm*
wait for it..
....
wait for it...........
drumroll please.........
*avoid the red circles*
Problem freakin solved.
Like, seriously. Forget Cyrodiil, even in BG, there's very few spots you can get cornered into a space you can't get out of. (the tiny room in the bridge tower comes to mind lol)
Seriously. Just... don't stay in the red circle.
Threat. Gone.
Very true, but staying out of the red circle is not always possible.
I’ll give you an example, I think Dracarys uses clever alchemist and all pot at the same time. They fight for a bit with big burst then run away covering their tracks with the fear circles. It’s a good strategy, and the counter seems to be to stay on them so you can hit them without their clever alchemist buff and hit their sustain.
In this situation - no, staying out of the red isn’t the solution. If you let them break away they will come back and roll you.
In this case though I still don’t think the self synergy is too much. What’s too much is the fear circles and break free being buggy in lag. It’s actually the fear circle with the ability that makes the combo OP... and a buggy break free in general. In a no lag environment the colossus plus synergy would be easy to counter.
buggy break free is definitely, without a doubt, the reason of more than 50% of my deaths in CP Cyrodiil.
i'm 200% sure of this.
Agreed. Lag is OP. Cyrodiil strategy would be completely different without lag. Damage would be through the roof. People would find something else to *** about, and I don’t think it’d be Necro synergy & ult combos. If it was you’d see more of it in BGs.Edited by Iskiab on January 3, 2020 9:09PMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten0 -
Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bullseyebudx wrote: »Bullseyebudx wrote: »
i mean, dude, CC-ing someone than unleashing your combo isn't an issue with necro... that's Cyrodiil 101
I get that, the only difference here is it's pretty much a forced death at instant speed with a CC, like it's a lot of damage.
Even if you see and avoid the initial circles the Vicious Death triggers off those that didn't could kill you outright.
To get that big 15-20k hit from Grave Robber necromancer has to hit you with Major Vulnerability first. Meaning that they have to cast the Colossus first (which is your "I really don't want to be here" que, btw), then they still need to cast the stun, the boneyard and the synergy itself. That combo is far from "instant".
And here is an easy way to counter Vicious Death. Don't stack in blobs. And don't stand next to that 20k HP PvE hero, it's a bad idea, just don't.
4 -
KillsAllElves✭✭✭✭✭KillsAllElves wrote: »Good, im glad it hits hard. Too many players stacking resistances afraid to die.
People cry about tank meta>gets killed by "OP" ability> ask for nerf of said "OP" ability doing too much damage>asks for healing buffs. 🤨. Re-ocurring cycle.
Instead of nerfing how about Buff all damage abilities by 25%-30%. We will see less of these tank meta threads. You know im sayin?
Only problem is it’s the tanks who’re complaining they can’t kill anyone. Go figure. Two overly tanky specs meet and stalemate.
It's the pariah and S&B back bar types who aren't happy because their strategy isn't working.
When people talk about the tank meta in cyrodiil theyre refering to players stacking resistances, healing and can do damage not all out tanks. Those are only good for building ultimate on.0 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭KillsAllElves wrote: »KillsAllElves wrote: »Good, im glad it hits hard. Too many players stacking resistances afraid to die.
People cry about tank meta>gets killed by "OP" ability> ask for nerf of said "OP" ability doing too much damage>asks for healing buffs. 🤨. Re-ocurring cycle.
Instead of nerfing how about Buff all damage abilities by 25%-30%. We will see less of these tank meta threads. You know im sayin?
Only problem is it’s the tanks who’re complaining they can’t kill anyone. Go figure. Two overly tanky specs meet and stalemate.
It's the pariah and S&B back bar types who aren't happy because their strategy isn't working.
When people talk about the tank meta in cyrodiil theyre refering to players stacking resistances, healing and can do damage not all out tanks. Those are only good for building ultimate on.
I know, but some people are always a little slow to find the meta when the game changes, myself included, and I find it happens most on classes you’ve played the longest and get stuck in your ways.
With healing up I’m having a lot more success specing more for damage than tankiness this patch. If someone’s stam and using pariah with S&B you’re going to have a hard time killing people in the same spec as you - enter tank meta thread (unless you’re a Stamwarden because shalks gives them more burst).
I went defensive monster only and the rest damage this patch, with back bar potatoes, and I’m feeling like I’m ripping through people. Healing being up means you can invest less in resistances because your healing is stronger, making you do more damage.Edited by Iskiab on January 3, 2020 10:43PMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten0 -
Bullseyebudx✭✭✭Bullseyebudx wrote: »Bullseyebudx wrote: »
i mean, dude, CC-ing someone than unleashing your combo isn't an issue with necro... that's Cyrodiil 101
I get that, the only difference here is it's pretty much a forced death at instant speed with a CC, like it's a lot of damage.
Even if you see and avoid the initial circles the Vicious Death triggers off those that didn't could kill you outright.
To get that big 15-20k hit from Grave Robber necromancer has to hit you with Major Vulnerability first. Meaning that they have to cast the Colossus first (which is your "I really don't want to be here" que, btw), then they still need to cast the stun, the boneyard and the synergy itself. That combo is far from "instant".
And here is an easy way to counter Vicious Death. Don't stack in blobs. And don't stand next to that 20k HP PvE hero, it's a bad idea, just don't.
Right but you're describing 1 person doing it, regardless I think it's telegraphed most of the time, but the combo would go -graveyard, DOT tick, Colossus, fat DOT tick, then Synergy for the kill.
The GIANT glowing yellow ball in the floor is usually the dead give away that *** is about to get real, but that being said the damage is A LOT.
Nova takes a bit to generate back, but Graveyard is 20 seconds so when you start to get multiple templars and or necros you can get some cheesy death recaps.
My issue is purely the sheer amount of damage that can be dealt at instant speed; which inherently leads to issues around performance.
Honestly... I don't even think you need the Colossus I think it's pretty much just the Nova, Graveyard combo. Obviously at that point why not run the Colossus but I don't think it's even needed tbh not 100% sure on that but.
I'm not saying go after 1 ability or effect specifically, but maybe marginally adjusting them all might fix this issue, or at least make it a little more reasonable to defend against.0 -
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭@Iskiab we don't use alchemist.
I agree that grave robber over performs in comparison to other synergies though.
@Solar_Breeze
NA ~ Izanerys: Dracarys (Videos | Dracast)
EU ~ Izanagi: Banana Squad (AOE Rats/ Zerg Squad / Roleplay Circle)0 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭Moonsorrow wrote: »
There is a cooldown on synergies? Or just this one? Or just in solo play?Moonsorrow wrote: »
Yes and no. This is Cyrodiil we're talking about. Reality: I see the Colossus. I roll out of it. Grave Robber hits me for 18K as I've already rolled out of the ulti. Never saw any visuals for that at all. Also this was a single guy. Yeah, two of us were chasing him down, so fair play I guess.So no, it is not "spammable" like some forum misinformation specialists like to say. And.. in reality, you know it is a part of combo, a combo that has ultimate big part of it and it is also ground targeted ultimate that once used is easily avoided
What a BS argument. That's group play, like you say. Whoever heard of a synergy activated by a single player themselves? Is that a bug or intentional?What comes to group play, Synergies been for a while already in heavy use since things like Gravity Crush (Templar ulti Synergy) does even more damage than the necro synergy. Other Synergies in group use are the DK Shifting Standard synergy and Talons Synergy.
That's not me. I'm not the OP and I don't demand anything. It's just a single player activating a synergy by themselves rubs me the wrong way. But fine, now that I know about it: Whatever.Sadly, at the moment it is pretty much the only thing magicka necro got going for itself, and without it.. well, would be one more big sad loss to the people who not understand game mechanics or are not bothered to "git gud" but rather demand anything that even remotely works be nerfed.
I normally say, yes, you should dabble in every class to understand PvP, but I'm not paying for Elsweyr until ZOS fix the lag in Cyro.I wish you do try playing Magicka Necro though, try it at high mmr bgs and Cyro & IC
The Self Synergy option on Graveyard is Avid Boneyard morph, yes it is intended. And yes first skill ever to get Self Synergy and yes you got 20 seconds cooldown.
Synergy Cooldowns are a thing, you cannot activate the same Synergy more than once in 20 seconds. Basic ESO mechanics.
All synergies have 20 seconds cooldown, meaning you cannot activate the same synergy. But you can activate different synergy. Rule breaker is Shards/Orbs that share cooldown, to prevent us players from enjoying too much of resources at pve lol.
So as said, Magicka necro has 1 (one) time every 20 seconds to try this combo.. with any other class in 20 seconds i do WAY more damage and be more flexible, and with Infused or Swift trait on jewelry for better utility than what Harmony brings to solo player.
Trying to explain it is hard, only trying it yourself will tell you. It is a gimmick play, that sometimes is rewarding but most times fails unless people follow into the rabbit hole and all stars align for the big boom. Harmony gives benefit once every 20 seconds, other times.. you are like a spider, waiting for them to be in the webs..
Yes, i have golden Vicious Death jewelry with Harmony. Juicy..
Still, i can kill, gank, bomb and farm way more efficiently with my Magblade bomber on exact same gear on group and on solo too, obviously different jewelry trait in use then on solo bomber.
Thats all sweet until you come across a team of 8 tanks - 2 healers and 1 or 2 necro harmony bomber, this makes them all unkillable and when you get frustrated that is the moment they bomb. All nice and well your statements about solo play but that is an ego chamber put this in the hands off a ball group and its to easy for them to win. They all say stay out of the red, but in Cyro chaos you don't see the red, the necro ult has almost no visual maybe the last smash making it a perfect storm of having a very strong feeling it has no counter. It comes on top of to tanky, to much heals and then with collosus, harmony boneyard, gravity crush and vicious death to much damage. I have been instant killed this with major protection, minor protection, major evasion and 30K plus resist with active healing. That is just to much.
well, so nothing special at all
you will never kill a good team especially if they are more than you and more harmonized together
for today you will barely scrach tank even as glass cannon while this tank will be still able to hurt you
so it is clear team which have more tanks supporting together alongise with healers and maybe some dps will always beat you if you have less tanks in team
welcome to still ongoing tank meta caused early by proc-cheese-nightblades and everytime there will be anything added against tank meta, people will still cry about it and when it got nerfed well will go back to cry about tank meta how hard it is to kill anyone
so no please all rethink what are you writing and maybe try o finally end tank meta and start normal gameplay where you dont need hours of fighting, stacking combo to be able to kill someone, try bring back when pvp for real was dynamic here instead of slow and braindead0 -
jcm2606✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Say we nerf Grave Robber, what next? Someone will just complain about the next strongest thing, until eventually we're hitting with jelly noodles, and even then people will want to water the jelly down even further.
Stop asking for nerfs. Ask for buffs. Every class should have strong skills/combos like this. That's what makes a strong class, strong tools.
Crying for nerfs nonstop is what has led to classes feeling like a recolour of the same skills, because you people cannot accept that strong *** should exist in the game.Edited by jcm2606 on January 9, 2020 4:20AM5 -
Decimus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Actually I'd argue grave robber synergy isn't strong enough - you can drop this on a ball group after invis pot onslaught and it's typically still not enough to deal with that group of players
What this means is that Harmony+Graveyard is only left viable in a group setting, where you have other synergies to combo with it (Nova in particular deals a lot of damage, with a base tooltip about 50% bigger than Graveyard).
I would like to see the self synergy strong enough to act as a counter to the groups currently utilizing it.0 -
TRVP✭✭I can’t stress this enough, harmony and grave robber should not be changed! Nothing wrong with it, you can see it coming from a mile away😅. I see woppabeam moaning and this boy runs round in a 24 man chasing small scale players heavy attacking with 100 points into siphoner. Also his Zerg leader has been trying to use it and it’s interesting to say the least.
Wouldn’t surprise me if they nerf it to stop these babies crying but then again, they do only change fun things In the game:)0 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭If you get caught inside a grave robber synergy the first thing you should ask yourself is:
"Why did I fail so horrible at positioning myself so I got caught in a potential high damage burst?"
The only way those synergies will hit you for 17-18k (assuming you aren´t running a full-blown glass canon with sub 20k resistance) is if you get hit by colossus ultimate prior to the synergy (30% more damage taken). There will be 2 groups of people using this synergy:
1. Organized small-and medium scale group
2. Organized large-scale groups.
Both of these groups are after fighting forces of greater numbers than themselves (generally speaking), and god forbid that there´s a tool to deal with zergs. There´s already enough advantage of being in greater numbers as a zerg, so there should definitely come some trade offs while doing so (aka you´re more vulnerable to AoE burst such as grave-robber and proximity detonation etc....)
Pro-tip to avoid getting deleted by this: Use your brain and stop chasing the groups that will most likely use it against you, or be confident enough with your own group so that you know how to counter it. The skill and harmony trait is balanced as it is.
Casters can activate their own grave synrgies whick mean you don't need group play to wipe a team. As for how to combo the skill/synrgy is 100% of players i seen in BGs usr vamp drain to stun. They animation cancel the wgole combo, use ulti, use grave rubber, vamp drain, and synrgy. Some of the skip the ulti part and start excuting after using synrgy. In 25k+ resist in BG, grave rubber synrgy deals between 11-13k with harmony jewlery, no armor debuff applied at all. Your pro tips sound good, doesn't work. Seen both ball teams and solo players who you need a whole team to kill in higher MMR BGs get deleted by this combo eveytime they encounter people who use it. Needless to say I run 16k resist and get get by around 15k that is about 70% of my HP. I play glass canon, but no skill in the game hit me more than 10k max crit, some stealth onslaught reach 14k but that is ok, because it is an ultimate that ignore resistance.0 -
SJD_Phoenix✭✭✭This post was made to *** about the grave robber/harmony combo but no ones mad about nova/harmony?
Ok lol0 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭SJD_Phoenix wrote: »This post was made to *** about the grave robber/harmony combo but no ones mad about nova/harmony?
Ok lol
It’s mostly used by organized groups against other organized groups.
Yea, with the crazy numbers people mention getting hit for in this thread in their squishy specs by Necros, it’s safe to say a nova will one shot them.Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten1
