Werewolf in PvP

Qbiken · November 2019

Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

But then again @IlCanis_LupuslI ,the main reason people wanted ww nerfed was because it was one of the few things that was a threat against the "pvp elite" and 3-4 man premades (where I see people who wanted ww nerfed quite often in such contexts) im battlegrounds. Werewolf was annoying to adapt to because it had never been encountered before, hence why the so called "elite" hated it.

Now we've a meta where people get carried by blackrose weapons and barely dies. Imagine if there was a tool that could've dealt with such things......ohh ye........

People hated old WW because it had zero resource management, low skill ceiling, and the most popular and powerful builds were built around pure tankiness while spamming light attacks forever.

New direction for werewolf is the right direction, 25% more powerful abilities with 25% increased cost, balanced. WW “mains” don’t want balance, they want an I-win button.

You do realise that the 25% stuff is pure *** right, and is nowhere the truth? Werewolf is nowhere near 25% more powerful compared to anything.

And saying ww required 0 resource management is big L M A O. And werewolf should definitely be more powerful than other setups, but in more specific contexts.

I don't want a "i WiN bUtToN", but I want to feel competitive and not seeing all my single target pressure being outhealed by a single vigor tick when speccing fully into damage (speaking of i win button).

But anti ww players will remain salty I guess.....

Jimmy_The_Fixer · November 2019

Qbiken wrote: »

Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

But then again @IlCanis_LupuslI ,the main reason people wanted ww nerfed was because it was one of the few things that was a threat against the "pvp elite" and 3-4 man premades (where I see people who wanted ww nerfed quite often in such contexts) im battlegrounds. Werewolf was annoying to adapt to because it had never been encountered before, hence why the so called "elite" hated it.

Now we've a meta where people get carried by blackrose weapons and barely dies. Imagine if there was a tool that could've dealt with such things......ohh ye........

People hated old WW because it had zero resource management, low skill ceiling, and the most popular and powerful builds were built around pure tankiness while spamming light attacks forever.

New direction for werewolf is the right direction, 25% more powerful abilities with 25% increased cost, balanced. WW “mains” don’t want balance, they want an I-win button.

You do realise that the 25% stuff is pure *** right, and is nowhere the truth? Werewolf is nowhere near 25% more powerful compared to anything.

And saying ww required 0 resource management is big L M A O. And werewolf should definitely be more powerful than other setups, but in more specific contexts.

I don't want a "i WiN bUtToN", but I want to feel competitive and not seeing all my single target pressure being outhealed by a single vigor tick when speccing fully into damage (speaking of i win button).

But anti ww players will remain salty I guess.....

Not anti-werewolf, just pro-balance.
WW abilities have 25% more power than non-wolf counterparts, that’s just a fact, and asking for even more bonus damage is just asking for an unfair advantage. Current WW does have resource management and I was referring to the old light attack builds that abused the first tick of berserker bleed with light attack spam to deal high damage at literal 0 stamina cost.

If you’re concerned about the total damage output of werewolf then maybe the transform passives or the secondary effects of WW abilities could be adjusted, but just making wolf simply deal even more damage when their already scaled 25% higher is just greedy.

Honestly, if they need any buffs it’s in the defensive department, having a single burst heal that’s scaled off health and costs a spellcaster resource is more limiting than anything else.

Qbiken · November 2019

Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Jimmy_The_Fixer wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

But then again @IlCanis_LupuslI ,the main reason people wanted ww nerfed was because it was one of the few things that was a threat against the "pvp elite" and 3-4 man premades (where I see people who wanted ww nerfed quite often in such contexts) im battlegrounds. Werewolf was annoying to adapt to because it had never been encountered before, hence why the so called "elite" hated it.

Now we've a meta where people get carried by blackrose weapons and barely dies. Imagine if there was a tool that could've dealt with such things......ohh ye........

People hated old WW because it had zero resource management, low skill ceiling, and the most popular and powerful builds were built around pure tankiness while spamming light attacks forever.

New direction for werewolf is the right direction, 25% more powerful abilities with 25% increased cost, balanced. WW “mains” don’t want balance, they want an I-win button.

You do realise that the 25% stuff is pure *** right, and is nowhere the truth? Werewolf is nowhere near 25% more powerful compared to anything.

And saying ww required 0 resource management is big L M A O. And werewolf should definitely be more powerful than other setups, but in more specific contexts.

I don't want a "i WiN bUtToN", but I want to feel competitive and not seeing all my single target pressure being outhealed by a single vigor tick when speccing fully into damage (speaking of i win button).

But anti ww players will remain salty I guess.....

Not anti-werewolf, just pro-balance.
WW abilities have 25% more power than non-wolf counterparts, that’s just a fact, and asking for even more bonus damage is just asking for an unfair advantage. Current WW does have resource management and I was referring to the old light attack builds that abused the first tick of berserker bleed with light attack spam to deal high damage at literal 0 stamina cost.

If you’re concerned about the total damage output of werewolf then maybe the transform passives or the secondary effects of WW abilities could be adjusted, but just making wolf simply deal even more damage when their already scaled 25% higher is just greedy.

Honestly, if they need any buffs it’s in the defensive department, having a single burst heal that’s scaled off health and costs a spellcaster resource is more limiting than anything else.

While I agree that the heal is way to costly, I disagree about werewolf needing a buff in the defensive department. The change to the heal in Wolfhunter is one of things that caused the uproar against werewolfs in the first place. I´d rather see werewolf having over the top damage, but requiring support from outside sources to stay alive (from a healer/guardbot for example).

And people forget that with bleed damage no longer ignoring resistance, werewolf single target pressure became incredibly weak. Buffing the bleed by 25% (just so they could reduce it by 40-50% a few patches later) didn´t really help them either.

And Howl of Agony is like a weaker version of dizzying swing in terms of damage (and I can´t remember the last time I managed to hit someone while being feared to get the extra bonus damage).

Personally the 2 things I want for werewolf is:
* Their old damage back (but with weaker self-healing as a trade-off)
* Group utility (currently werewolfs are quite useless in groups)

IlCanis_LupuslI · November 2019

Qbiken wrote: »

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Koensol wrote: »

IlCanis_LupuslI wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Werwolfs were broken for too long back when torugs was meta. Good to see them in a more balanced place these days.

Ye, lets balance something due to a confirmed bug (enchants procing from single target dots, which was usable on non werewolf setups before it got fixed)....sounds like a great way to balance the game.

Even without that bug it was borderline broken. In a decent team nothing was as scary as a WW. The ease at which they put out damage, even with just light attack spamming, was just stupid. Werewolf has always been strong, I never got the complaints about them being weak. Bleeds in combination with unmitigatable damage from torugs and *** monsterhelmets like zaan only inflated this. They deserved to be toned down.

Lmao. I've fought werewolves with torugsand zaan,(when it was broke) I was on a 2h/resto Medium stamsorc and he was trying to kill me for 20min(unsuccessful)
If you died to that I'm lost for words.

Stopped reading at this point. One word: LMAO.

Ye I'm with koensol on this one. While I'm/was a werewolf enthusiast, there's no logical reason to defend the bugged ww bleed + torug combo in Murkmire. There wasn't a single specc in the game that could survive that (aside from cloaking away i guess), and it was just broken.

Zaan doesn't really have anything to do with werewolf, and they're better of using other monsters sets imo, but that's another topic.

Oh it was doable challenging no doubt but quite doable. The trick was outplaying your higher mobility(medium armor stamsorc duh) vs that cancer setup. And if I did it on a crappy test build anyone can do it.
To quote the art of war= “If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”
I knew exactly what they were running their combos and how their build worked.
Yes it's quite easily if you know how to exploit the werewolf weaknesses. Strong yes broken nah I've seen worse. And no just like back in the proc set meta I refused to used it.