Donny_Vito wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

Donny_Vito wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

gatekeeper13 wrote: »

How do you spot a bot when farming, for example? Really interested to learn how.

usually more than one character all running as if glued together or standing at a spawn sight (bears/wolfs) constantly heavy attacking, usually sorc's with pets, they have totally random names and are always low level
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNtSJoST07o

I think he was asking more of a rhetorical question. But your answer has a lot of assumptions in it, nothing concrete. Aside from some anti-bot software that tracks keystrokes, patterns, etc... you are basically just assuming someone is a bot because they are standing still at one node. I'm done this while I've been coding at home, and just farm a node when I'd look up at my game and see it's there (was also on my Sorc )

i've seen this type of bot for myself when you have 6 toons running and changing direction like a flock of birds its kid of a big give away lol but i understand what your saying

Trust me, I've seen them too. I know in my mind they are a bunch of bots, but I think ZoS is more worried about accidentally banning a real player than banning a bot.

true, there are genuine ppl that farm set paths and even run specific gear for speed ect ect that to the uninitiated would look like a bot

Donny_Vito wrote: »

Trust me, I've seen them too. I know in my mind they are a bunch of bots, but I think ZoS is more worried about accidentally banning a real player than banning a bot.

This may be part of it, but I don't think ZOS loses a lot of sleep over accidental bans. These things just happen. They deal with it. It might take weeks, but, from what I can tell, ZOS is in no hurry. If the player leaves before the ban is lifted, they don't have to do anything at all! If they are still around, they get unbanned. Win for everyone.

I don't think that, philosophically, ZOS cares about bots. They do not approve, or disapprove.

I think that they care about them if a lot of people report them. At that point, they will task someone with investigating the report. It might take a bit of time before that happens, depending on support load. I think they look for indications of businesses that are profiting off of the game, and that is when the ban hammer comes down. If they do not see this, then I think it is basically a judgement call.

I do not think that ZOS is really all that interested in players who are using automation software for personal use. It has been a long time since I have even heard rumors of a normal everyday player getting banned for using a cheat program. Epic Games, they are not.

Now, while I make it sound like they are not doing anything at all, that is not what I am saying. I am sure that they are banning bots all the time.

For the EU players, I have frequently considered how much better life would be over there if there were not BOTS on the server taking up server resources that could be in use by YOU to play the game.

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

Donny_Vito wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

Donny_Vito wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

gatekeeper13 wrote: »

How do you spot a bot when farming, for example? Really interested to learn how.

usually more than one character all running as if glued together or standing at a spawn sight (bears/wolfs) constantly heavy attacking, usually sorc's with pets, they have totally random names and are always low level
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNtSJoST07o

I think he was asking more of a rhetorical question. But your answer has a lot of assumptions in it, nothing concrete. Aside from some anti-bot software that tracks keystrokes, patterns, etc... you are basically just assuming someone is a bot because they are standing still at one node. I'm done this while I've been coding at home, and just farm a node when I'd look up at my game and see it's there (was also on my Sorc )

i've seen this type of bot for myself when you have 6 toons running and changing direction like a flock of birds its kid of a big give away lol but i understand what your saying

Trust me, I've seen them too. I know in my mind they are a bunch of bots, but I think ZoS is more worried about accidentally banning a real player than banning a bot.

true, there are genuine ppl that farm set paths and even run specific gear for speed ect ect that to the uninitiated would look like a bot

Yes there are, so you have to seek some evidence.

Do they make a course correction when you are at a node first and before you harvest it or do they continue to the vacant node you harvested. Some have a pause in there and others are very quick in detecting that the node is not there.

Drop a bag of suspicious meat right before the node, harvest the node and see if they run up and take the meat. A player will not harvest it, bots will as it's detected the same as a node. This can be any memento that can be set down and interact-able by others. The suspicious meat is just fun to watch.

If a player is doing these things then they are behaving like a bot and I don't feel bad sending in a report as ZOS will still check them out and make their decision (if any). But those just a couple well known quick ways to sort them. Big thing learn how a player reacts, it is not always precise and exact.

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Donny_Vito wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

gatekeeper13 wrote: »

How do you spot a bot when farming, for example? Really interested to learn how.

usually more than one character all running as if glued together or standing at a spawn sight (bears/wolfs) constantly heavy attacking, usually sorc's with pets, they have totally random names and are always low level
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNtSJoST07o

I think he was asking more of a rhetorical question. But your answer has a lot of assumptions in it, nothing concrete. Aside from some anti-bot software that tracks keystrokes, patterns, etc... you are basically just assuming someone is a bot because they are standing still at one node. I'm done this while I've been coding at home, and just farm a node when I'd look up at my game and see it's there (was also on my Sorc )

I've also done the "stand by a node and wait for it to spawn" thing, especially when I need a specific mat (e.g., Raw Ironweed) to complete a daily writ. Sometimes I run around and hit the spots where I know that particular type of mat spawns, but if I'm doing something else (like surfing the web on my iPad) then I might just stand by a known node spot and wait for it.

Seen characters like this. Waited until they harvest the node, then dropped a bag of suspicious meat. A true player still stands there, but if they are a bot or macro user they take it. Don't get mad if you act like a bot and sometimes get reported like a bot.

Also wandered up if they are just standing at a spawned node. Wave or jump up, see if I get a reaction. After a short time I might harvest the node as I can not tell are they DC'd, a broken bot/macro or just away for a nature call. Then I move off. There are some bots that do this during their runs to refresh the spawn, just have to observe and make that call per basis.

Grimm13 wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Donny_Vito wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

gatekeeper13 wrote: »

How do you spot a bot when farming, for example? Really interested to learn how.

usually more than one character all running as if glued together or standing at a spawn sight (bears/wolfs) constantly heavy attacking, usually sorc's with pets, they have totally random names and are always low level
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNtSJoST07o

I think he was asking more of a rhetorical question. But your answer has a lot of assumptions in it, nothing concrete. Aside from some anti-bot software that tracks keystrokes, patterns, etc... you are basically just assuming someone is a bot because they are standing still at one node. I'm done this while I've been coding at home, and just farm a node when I'd look up at my game and see it's there (was also on my Sorc )

I've also done the "stand by a node and wait for it to spawn" thing, especially when I need a specific mat (e.g., Raw Ironweed) to complete a daily writ. Sometimes I run around and hit the spots where I know that particular type of mat spawns, but if I'm doing something else (like surfing the web on my iPad) then I might just stand by a known node spot and wait for it.

Seen characters like this. Waited until they harvest the node, then dropped a bag of suspicious meat. A true player still stands there, but if they are a bot or macro user they take it. Don't get mad if you act like a bot and sometimes get reported like a bot.

Also wandered up if they are just standing at a spawned node. Wave or jump up, see if I get a reaction. After a short time I might harvest the node as I can not tell are they DC'd, a broken bot/macro or just away for a nature call. Then I move off. There are some bots that do this during their runs to refresh the spawn, just have to observe and make that call per basis.

I didn't know what you meant by suspicious meat, but I guess it's a memento earned from that delve in Stonefalls or Deshaan? I didn't realize you could drop those things in the environment, like an anniversary cake or whatever.

I've occasionally thought about posting stuff in zone chat while I farm, to let people know I'm not a bot, but I can see where that would get really old fast for other players. I was trying to farm Ironweed in Bal Foyen this morning, but someone ran up and harvested one node just before I could. I felt like posting a humorous reaction in zone chat, but decided not to.

Once another player whispered to me while I was farming, and we had a brief conversation about farming. I don't know if he was testing me to see if I was a bot, but he seemed to be at least somewhat grateful that I was just running around at normal (sub-sprint) speed, as opposed to all of the other farmers who were running full speed or even riding on mounts.

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

I've mentioned this before on similar threads the Solution to the "bots" is a very simple one in theory (not sure how easy to implement)
1) have the nodes on a random spawn script so they are never in the same place twice at any given time (even if it by a meter either way) this will serve to disrupt the scripted bots path and force a human to interact.
2) have a multi key press system to actually farm the node (similar but not as complex as the lock pick) and have this on a random interval timer again forcing HUMAN interaction.
if done correctly the random location tied with random key press system would ensure a bot could not be programmed to farm set routes and automatically collect nodes.
just an idea

Your first suggestion is great, and would likely go a long way to combatting bots.

Your second suggestion would really kill my gathering game. I just play and stop every chance I get to gather. Making a mini-game out of gathering would make an otherwise minimal gathering task more tedious.

Just to give you an idea of the impact of bots:) 500k Gold use to be worth around $48.50, today 500k Gold is worth about $6.42:)
*About a year or a little more of time between the two amounts.

@SeaGtGruff Some bots don't have sprint in their script while most players use sprint, so that is often one of the first things to notice and may have been why he was checking you.

@gatekeeper13 Mostly repetition of a specific action at specific intervals. For instance, you might find a bot sitting on a node that jumps once exactly every 5 seconds. These are usually very basic bots that are literally just spamming E multiple times with a jump added in every once ina while on repeat. You can often do things like drop mystery meat, attempt to trade with them, etc and see they automatically always click on it. You can also try interacting with them by waving, sending pms, etc and they ignore them even while actively doing something in game. The slightly more advanced scripts I usually see at the Alikk'yr Dolmens. They sit there casting AOE skills every so often while also casting a heal and doing a dodge to the left or right every once ina while. You'll usually find them in the stable at that one city dolemen in Alik'yr. They're almost always there. The most advanced bots will be a LOT harder to detect. These are usually your professional gold farmers whose entire living in based on this and put time and effort into making tools. If you've ever seen these kind of bot programs running on WoW you'll know they can out heal/dps your average player in dungeons. They read the actual program memory in your RAM or interact via add-ons and send input to the game based on actual things happening in the game. These are REALLY hard to detect though, if they are working right. This is usually where anti-cheat tools come into play as they are designed to detect things listening to memory or what not, but all it takes is finding out what they are detecting and making a new method to get around it. It's basically a never ending cat and mouse game.

As for the multiple characters people are seeing, sometimes those are bots, and sometimes they are players multiboxing. Both are not allowed though by the EULA though.

Indoril_Nerevar wrote: »

No, they do not.

But I do.

Then continue to report them as you see them. Like I said above, I don't think ZOS cares one way or another unless they are breaking the law or acting as a business. That suggests that ZOS is only taking action because their players are bringing it to their attention. If their players do not care enough and stop reporting in numbers that warrant action, they probably are fine with that.

On Xbox I see them a lot in Bal Foyen--usually naked, level 3 or 4, pet sorc, with a name like xmfwtd. It's kinda funny when you've just farmed the mat they're headed for because they'll still run up, and then start checking their map. They seem mostly targeted on ore deposits because I see them ignore alchemy ingredients, even lucrative ones.

I enjoy sprinting around to grab all the ore and then watch them standing around with nothing to do.

I think their (lack of) actions made it pretty clear that they couldn't care less.