EU Players READ This
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Anotherone773✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭We shall sue the company over 0.45 Euros and demand compensation! Zenimax's legal team doesnt know EU law! However, I do as i have studied it extensively from my armchair!0 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭This is not hardware issue, this is their failed implementation/Patching of the new system that won't let you log for 30 seconds after you crash. Poor QA, poor Businesss requirementsEdited by RouDeR on October 26, 2019 1:14PM0 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Don't think anyone has stated that a company TOS's supercede any form of LAW, they work in conjunction with the LAW and as such ALL company/establishments outline a TOS in order that if disputes are raised the LAW/Courts/Arbitration services have a quick job to do ... why do you think we're subjected to these everywhere you go/work so that entities cover themselves from the like.
The term of service is a legally binding document which you as a party of this agreement have recognised by creating an account and using said services.
You cannot then 'not recognise' the outlaying terms in the agreement without consequence on both fronts.
Most of the TOS, EULA and all this stuff we sign all the time is done purely as an intimidation process.
They are only binding AS LONG AS they're not contradicting the law, but completing it.
Say you buy a tech thing and the TOS says "opening the case of the item by yourself voids the warranty" is generally valid and legally binding. (provided the law doesn't say otherwise). But if the TOS says "you agree to never get a refund even if the item doesn't work as it's meant to work", that is not legally binding in any way and people who do not get intimidated by TOS and make the effort to act usually get refunded ASAP - by merely threatening to sue.
I'm not sure ZOS in currently in the objective situation to not provide the service as it's meant to work. Reasonably small downtimes are part of regular service and would probably not be considered a major failure calling for reimbursement. The real threat is more a matter of image and reputation. But ESO's server performance has been known and largely commented everywhere for YEARS and that hasn't prevented crowds of players from staying and joining the game.
Therefore showing patience is the only thing we can really do.
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Yoku✭✭✭Dread_Viking wrote: »i want to ask all EU players to go to support and ask for Compensation for all the Down Time We are experiencing since this ihs not just a technical issue but a case of them trying to save money on the EU server hardware and service. i believe this is unacceptable behavior from a AAA Developer. i pay for my ESO+ i am a paying costumer and i demand to be treated like one
@ZOS_GinaBruno
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom
@ZOS_KaiSchober0 -
Cążki✭✭✭✭update 24
1. lfg tool *** up as before
2. pings same as before
3. cant login in problem still as before
4. balance changes as allways but not istead of new mechanics
5. fps rate same as before
SCAM COMPANYAltmer skooma dealer.
PC-EU2 -
Salvas_Aren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Dread_Viking wrote: »Schattenfluegel wrote: »You've signed all the ToS guys, it wont work.
if TOS is in Conflict with Local law then it doesn't matter
Sorry to say, you're wrong again.These Terms of Service contain a binding individual arbitration and class action waiver provision in Section 15 (Dispute Resolution, Arbitration and Class Action Waiver) that affects Your rights under these Terms of Service with respect to any Disputes (as defined below in Section 15) between You and ZeniMax, and requires You and ZeniMax to resolve Disputes in binding, individual arbitration, and not in court
This clause in the ToS is not legal in all countries.
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Nyladreas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭StabbityDoom wrote: »Just because they don't HAVE to give you compensation doesn't mean they won't. It doesn't hurt to ask, since in the past they have extended contests since EU had downtime.
Excatly it doesn't hurt to ask, demanding it on the other hand won't work,
Throwing out random Laws / Abritration rulings without fully knowing how the system works seems a little desperate.
YOU (the user) have agreed to the TOS, it's purely down to ZOS whether they are feeling charitable enough to compensate the community. They don't have to ofc but one would hope they would.
NOT in EU ffs... Why isn't anyone understanding that companies' TOS has no power over customers here in EU if it doesn't fully comply with our laws. LOL.
It's sad as hell to see Americans live in a world where they can't do anything just because of some company's twisted terms of service.
In an extreme example....You could basically do anything over there, no doubt even things that conflict with human rights as a company and never face consequences if the service you provided was more desired than the risk provided with it. As long as people agree its 100% okay! Jesus christ...Edited by Nyladreas on October 26, 2019 1:22PM2 -
mcagatayg✭✭✭✭I want some kind of compensation aswell I just subscribed with ESO+ to be able to play new DLC, and now we get this? Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday we had serious problems. Now today, I can't enjoy like this. 5-6 days of downtime or simply not being able to play... ESO+ is 15€ per month. Thats 0.5€ for a day... I lost around 3€ so far and god knows how much more i will lose... This is just sad. It's the weekend aswell... I just feel like i got scammed, not gonna lie. I don't even know why i keep playing or trying to play this game. I should get addicted to something cheaper...0 -
Salvas_Aren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Don't think anyone has stated that a company TOS's supercede any form of LAW, they work in conjunction with the LAW and as such ALL company/establishments outline a TOS in order that if disputes are raised the LAW/Courts/Arbitration services have a quick job to do ... why do you think we're subjected to these everywhere you go/work so that entities cover themselves from the like.
The term of service is a legally binding document which you as a party of this agreement have recognised by creating an account and using said services.
You cannot then 'not recognise' the outlaying terms in the agreement without consequence on both fronts.
Most of the TOS, EULA and all this stuff we sign all the time is done purely as an intimidation process.
They are only binding AS LONG AS they're not contradicting the law, but completing it.
Say you buy a tech thing and the TOS says "opening the case of the item by yourself voids the warranty" is generally valid and legally binding. (provided the law doesn't say otherwise). But if the TOS says "you agree to never get a refund even if the item doesn't work as it's meant to work", that is not legally binding in any way and people who do not get intimidated by TOS and make the effort to act usually get refunded ASAP - by merely threatening to sue.
I'm not sure ZOS in currently in the objective situation to not provide the service as it's meant to work. Reasonably small downtimes are part of regular service and would probably not be considered a major failure calling for reimbursement. The real threat is more a matter of image and reputation. But ESO's server performance has been known and largely commented everywhere for YEARS and that hasn't prevented crowds of players from staying and joining the game.
Therefore showing patience is the only thing we can really do.
True. Ive read through a few so far and mostly they are like "maybe it works."
Fun begins when the clauses interfere with themselves. Ive seen that in a couple of MS EULAs.0 -
Lady_Linux✭✭✭✭✭redgreensunset wrote: »Dread_Viking wrote: »
This right here. EU law does not in general recognize a ToS as a valid, legal agreement because most of them are too vaguely worded to be considered legally binding here. So technically we could drag them to court and probably win.
So do it.I simply must protest. There are no Penguin avatars for me to use in the forums.
BTW, I use arch too0 -
Lady_Linux✭✭✭✭✭Don't think anyone has stated that a company TOS's supercede any form of LAW, they work in conjunction with the LAW and as such ALL company/establishments outline a TOS in order that if disputes are raised the LAW/Courts/Arbitration services have a quick job to do ... why do you think we're subjected to these everywhere you go/work so that entities cover themselves from the like.
The term of service is a legally binding document which you as a party of this agreement have recognised by creating an account and using said services.
You cannot then 'not recognise' the outlaying terms in the agreement without consequence on both fronts.
Hence why the above outlined quotes, reserve them from being held accountable for any disruption in service, only if your locale sits outside the arbitration sanctions outlined in the TOS will you have a leg to stand on.
You are not legally bound to any agreement that violates the laws of the land. Doesn't matter what the agreement says, if it violates the law it's illegal.
I simply must protest. There are no Penguin avatars for me to use in the forums.
BTW, I use arch too1 -
Eva13✭✭✭Cirantille wrote: »
Every sensible company would compensate after such terrible service they provided.
Zeni's not a sensible company
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Anotherone773✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭StabbityDoom wrote: »Just because they don't HAVE to give you compensation doesn't mean they won't. It doesn't hurt to ask, since in the past they have extended contests since EU had downtime.
Excatly it doesn't hurt to ask, demanding it on the other hand won't work,
Throwing out random Laws / Abritration rulings without fully knowing how the system works seems a little desperate.
YOU (the user) have agreed to the TOS, it's purely down to ZOS whether they are feeling charitable enough to compensate the community. They don't have to ofc but one would hope they would.
NOT in EU ffs... Why isn't anyone understanding that companies' TOS has no power over customers here in EU if it doesn't fully comply with our laws. LOL.
It's sad as hell to see Americans live in a world where they can't do anything just because of some company's twisted terms of service.
In an extreme example....You could basically do anything over there, no doubt even things that conflict with human rights as a company and never face consequences if the service you provided was more desired than the risk provided with it. As long as people agree its 100% okay! Jesus christ...
Thats not true at all about doing whatever you want in the US. Also for some reason the armchair warriors seem to think that Zenimax doesnt have an EU legal team. They do in fact have a legal department, whose sole job is to deal with the legal side of running a business in every country in which they operate in.
I know you really want to be right on this but your not. It is not reasonable to expect 100% uptime on any service. As i said before its not even half an euro. If its that big of a deal cancel your subscription.
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Ysbriel✭✭✭✭✭They wont even throw in free stuff as compensation for their maintenance times for ESO+ subscribers, like even free to play mobile games do that and this supposed to be a big AAA company. I mean i would be surprised if the idea of the EU players having such a rough time rings a compensation bell.0 -
jircris11✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dread_Viking wrote: »i want to ask all EU players to go to support and ask for Compensation for all the Down Time We are experiencing since this ihs not just a technical issue but a case of them trying to save money on the EU server hardware and service. i believe this is unacceptable behavior from a AAA Developer. i pay for my ESO+ i am a paying costumer and i demand to be treated like one
As CRAPPY as it is, they are secure by ToS. You know the wall of txt most dont read.IGN: Ki'rah
Khajiit/Vampire
DC/AD faction/NA server.
RPer0 -
p_tsakirisb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dread_Viking wrote: »
Hahaha. When you select the country you are in, it displays EULA based on the laws of that country.
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Salvas_Aren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Dread_Viking wrote: »
Hahaha. When you select the country you are in, it displays EULA based on the laws of that country.
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probabkyravi✭✭✭Its an obvious hardware issue, Bethesda have taken it too far. Its time for some compensation.
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NeillMcAttack✭✭✭✭✭
✭Won’t happen. It’s in the terms and conditions that you agree to that they won’t compensate for things like this.
End user licence agreements are not law.PC EU - NoCP PvP, is real PvPTiidehunter Nord StamDK EP PvP MainLegion Commander Tresdin Stamplar DC PvE MainSephirith Altmer MagPlar EP Gondar the Bounty Hunter Khajiit StamBlade DCThe Dirge Redguard StamNecro EP Disruptor Stormcrafter Nord StamSorc ADLone Druid Bosmer Stam Warden EP Necro-Phos Argonian MagBlade AD@ McAttack in gamePlayed since beta, and then on console at release, until the game became unplayable on console.0 -
Salvas_Aren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NeillMcAttack wrote: »
They are basically crap, two parts "according to law" and three parts "lets give it a try".0 -
Tubben✭✭✭Schattenfluegel wrote: »You've signed all the ToS guys, it wont work.
Its not THAT easy. Having something inside the ToS, doesent mean it's legal. I have no clue how it is in this case, i am no lawyer. But in germany, as you know, having unexpected parts in a ToS make the whole ToS void - i think atleast. An clearly unexpected part would be something like "If the server comes down due,Lady_Linux wrote: »redgreensunset wrote: »Dread_Viking wrote: »
This right here. EU law does not in general recognize a ToS as a valid, legal agreement because most of them are too vaguely worded to be considered legally binding here. So technically we could drag them to court and probably win.
So do it.
You still need to have the money to do this. I dont.0 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You all are just so funny.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0 -
xenowarrior92eb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭before coming here to rage, perhaps "customers" should read what they agreed and signed when they bought the game and subscribed...like TOS and EULA.1 -
maboleth✭✭✭✭✭
✭This is the last time I'm clickbaiting to the threads like these.
NO, I will not ask for any compensation and other BS. Every time the guys have to fix something with the servers, army of pitiful men start swarming the forums demanding compensation of all kinds.
Do something else with your life, for Earth's sake.1 -
Salvas_Aren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »before coming here to rage, perhaps "customers" should read what they agreed and signed when they bought the game and subscribed...like TOS and EULA.
ToS and EULAs are basically toilet paper in the EU.
Unbelieveable, huh?
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daim✭✭✭✭✭Is this official page ? https://www.facebook.com/ElderScrollsOnlineEurope/
I'm usually quite relaxed but this is getting ridiculous. I just subbed last sunday and there's been .. three (?) downtimes and now one in PRIME TIME at SATURDAY!
I'll certainly remember NOT to sub after this!""I am that which grips the heart in fright, hearkens night and silences the light." It was written on my sword, long…long ago." ―Ajunta Pall
PC|EU0 -
Salvas_Aren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Seems like an appropriate first impression.
Farm some monster heads in the DLC dungeons and drop your +. 0
