Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
Great Job, ZOS, now we're back to PvP Tank Meta /facepalm
-
Koensol✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
This guy knows. Hist sap is one of the most underrated 'tank' sets. Pair it with a mitigation set and bogdan, slot meditate and use lingering health + vitality pots, get a decent health pool and its GG.can someone throw me one of these op tank builds? as far as i saw no heal or tanking ability was buffed. Only some damage nerfed. Don't cry because tanks are stronger, they are not they are just the same, your damage got lowered just a bit and suddenly the excuse for this are the same tanks.
again, tell me at least one of these op builds that survive 2+ players in BGs
Class agnostic:
"Healer"
Bogdan 2-piece
Trinimac or Hist
1 Damage or sustain set
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate between shields and block
Ice staff/Resto
"Tank"
Also Bogdan
Also trinimac or hist
1 Damage or sustain set, or defensive set* (depends on if you can get major and minor protection from skills)
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate shields
Ice Staff / Resto or SnB Resto
I am not joking about this by the way.1 -
BaiterOfZergs✭✭✭✭✭High mmr has always been filled with slow matches regardless of how people are built , won’t change much.Zerg of House Smallscale, First of his name, wielder of Volendrung, battleground hero, Cyrodiil butcher, the swifft footed, OG of the Templars and first pvpers, defender of scrolls and baiter of zergs.1 -
WiseSky✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I had a feeling something was gonna change as I read on the forums as I bought the game 3 months ago... that is why I created each vocation with a stamina build and a magicka build, now I can hop from build to build
0 -
FENGRUSH✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Lol! Streamers like frengrush always complain on healers healing. While he is a tank/DPS SORC with a few zergs to boot his kills...
So, hence the NERF to heal.
That's pretty sad if that's true. Glad I don't watch streamers.
Not sure what 'frengrush always complain on healers healing' means. Also not a tank... unless alchemist spriggin balorghs and brp weapon with passive damage boosts and triple weapon damage medium armor is considered a 'tank'.
The reason a spec like that can still live decently with 0 sustain is because of cp. Something that poster probably missed in his assessment.
Fixing blocking as you suggested isnt a crazy idea applying it to battle spirit. Game needs to move all pvp to noncp or redesign it to solve a lot of issues. Tanks aren't a bad thing in pvp of they're supporting. If they're not, they're useless. Maybe in flag captures they are good but that's hardly pvp at all. Those BG modes are flawed in design.
Tldr; dont listen to idiot rando posters. Blockers have been destroyed in noncp and through other means, bleed buffs vs blockers etc. Things that dont touch pve are the only solutions I really put together. Not nerfing or impacting pve. But using battle spirit for global pvp changes only is not a bad idea, just should be last resort for simplicity sake (coding for less chance of bugs). Believe it or not, they cant make battle spirit changes easily for some reason.3 -
Ysbriel✭✭✭✭✭
Why complain about a player you can’t kill and he cannot kill you either? isn’t it easier to just move along? like seriously every time i hear people complain about tanks that won’t die on PvP i just LoL about it. perhaps if people would get their Zerg auto pilot turned off and think for a moment. Invincible Tanks wouldn’t be a problem. And this is me as a Tank that has Laughed so much till coughing when the zergs just keep hitting and hitting and going full WB parse with ulti dump just for me instead moving along with the siege. I can count with just one hand 🖐 the few moments when people have realized, maybe i should just move along instead of trying to kill this here obviously walking by himself out in the. open with a sword and shield individual because it ain’t leading anywhere. Sometimes it’s not about L2P it’s about thinking right.2 -
DLM✭✭✭✭✭I have a better suggestion: can we finally scrap PvP out of this game?
Are we now going to destroy tanks in PvE because of you PvP whiners?4 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭It is simple, if people in BGs are dying fast than it is l2p issue. Good players will help, heal and protect eachother, stacking buffs and heals. I would prefer to play deathmatch with 150 highest score for 15 mins than game finishing in 7 mins because of scrubs in the match.1 -
Spartabunny08✭✭✭✭Tanks ain't nothing like what they used to be. You ever heard of a two hand ultimate...? How about fear and now it's in fighters guild so everyone can use fear. Ok how about a DK with petrify another unblockable ability. I mean wow, they already nerfed tanks back when woeler thought he was a tank and doubled the block cost. Back then 1 person could tank zergs... I miss my tank that was actually fun LMAO5
-
VioletVience✭✭✭ZOS has been attempting to introduce effective counters to the heal/tank meta for years. Proc sets, oblivion damage, easy access to Defile, DOTs....they've tried their darnedest to figure this out, but every solution they've introduced has been extremely unpopular with players.
I'm not at all optimistic about whatever it is they attempt to do next.
And they kill all this counters for years, lul. There is no more access to major defile for everyone, thousand times nerfed dots, completly useless proc sets vs tank builds, great work.0 -
Nyladreas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
You're still not understanding that High MMR BG comps are all "tanks", you can't really not attack a "tank" in these games. You can only disable and overwhelm it, while keepin his friends at check. It's apparent you haven't played a high ranked game yet. These teams are made of successful and experienced 1vX players in most cases. Hence why I said you have no idea what you're talking about when you used the word "zergling".universal_wrath wrote: »xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »
I would much rather have everyone squishy and actually dying all the time than this, trust me. I don't understand why so many people in this game get frustrated or extremely mad with being killed, it's PvP, you kill you die.Careful for what you wish for, you just might get it.
Reap what you sow.
Or in this case, you don't die, you don't kill, you just wait every BG out till the end of the time limit.
from what you just said its simply l2p issue...
Nope, you just never healer/tank bots in BGs and that is way you say it is l2p issue. Everytime I play healer with my friend, where are unkillable even with coordinated ulti drop. If we have 1 or 2 decent DD players, it is mostly win for us. I can litterlay set in aoes and out in the open surrounderd by 4+ players and heal my way throu with my friend back and forth out in the open, no need for LOS control or blocking. Of course that was pre scalebreaker because single target dots were much weaker. After scalebreaker was released, we were melted down by dots, 2-3 players with 1-2 dots each were more than enough to take us down. Now dots have been nerfed. None if us is even relying on pirate skeleton, hero steaddast, or shakl breaker sets. We use off meta set. We almost never do any dmg, just pure healing/support bots.
Thank you for sharing your experience, this is exactly what I'm talking about. Some people just have no clue or probably haven't even gotten high enough MMR to properly understand what's up.oh the zergling tears i love it
You seem to not understand what the words you used actually mean.
Its you who doesnt understand a thing if you waste your time attacking tanks
I, in fact, run the same setup to be on par. That doesn't mean I actually ENJOY it, and since it's an automatic handicap to run something else - it makes me want to complain about it. Because it REALLY isn't fun.
What this person said.universal_wrath wrote: »xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »Careful for what you wish for, you just might get it.
Reap what you sow.
I would much rather have everyone squishy and actually dying all the time than this, trust me. I don't understand why so many people in this game get frustrated or extremely mad with being killed, it's PvP, you kill you die.
Or in this case, you don't die, you don't kill, you just wait every BG out till the end of the time limit.
from what you just said its simply l2p issue...
Nope, you just never healer/tank bots in BGs and that is way you say it is l2p issue. Everytime I play healer with my friend, where are unkillable even with coordinated ulti drop. If we have 1 or 2 decent DD players, it is mostly win for us. I can litterlay set in aoes and out in the open surrounderd by 4+ players and heal my way throu with my friend back and forth out in the open, no need for LOS control or blocking. Of course that was pre scalebreaker because single target dots were much weaker. After scalebreaker was released, we were melted down by dots, 2-3 players with 1-2 dots each were more than enough to take us down. Now dots have been nerfed. None if us is even relying on pirate skeleton, hero steaddast, or shakl breaker sets. We use off meta set. We almost never do any dmg, just pure healing/support bots.
Thank you for sharing your experience, this is exactly what I'm talking about. Some people just have no clue or probably haven't even gotten high enough MMR to properly understand what's up.oh the zergling tears i love it
You seem to not understand what the words you used actually mean.
Its you who doesnt understand a thing if you waste your time attacking tanks
No, the issue is they don't appear as tanks, they do normal damage, but tank like tanks.Edited by Nyladreas on October 23, 2019 11:09AM0 -
Vildebill✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yeah high MMR BGs are so boring. Time almost always runs out because no one is dying or killing anything. On a typical deathmatch i have like 5 kills, died 3 times, and did over 1 million damage. Healmatch? Tankmatch? The biggest question though is how people find it fun.
EU PC0 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't play BGs because of being forced to premade groups. But in Cyrodiil and IC... Well I don't think its that hard to kill someone, yes there are people who are hard to kill or even unkillable (and causing no threat), but most (like 80-90% of my encounters) end with someones death. Why BGs are so different from Cyrodiil?I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.0 -
Sergykid✭✭✭✭✭
✭
This guy knows. Hist sap is one of the most underrated 'tank' sets. Pair it with a mitigation set and bogdan, slot meditate and use lingering health + vitality pots, get a decent health pool and its GG.can someone throw me one of these op tank builds? as far as i saw no heal or tanking ability was buffed. Only some damage nerfed. Don't cry because tanks are stronger, they are not they are just the same, your damage got lowered just a bit and suddenly the excuse for this are the same tanks.
again, tell me at least one of these op builds that survive 2+ players in BGs
Class agnostic:
"Healer"
Bogdan 2-piece
Trinimac or Hist
1 Damage or sustain set
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate between shields and block
Ice staff/Resto
"Tank"
Also Bogdan
Also trinimac or hist
1 Damage or sustain set, or defensive set* (depends on if you can get major and minor protection from skills)
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate shields
Ice Staff / Resto or SnB Resto
I am not joking about this by the way.
that's applicable to mag tanks. And even so, you can't survive 2+ in a BG with that setup. I have a stam tank that is using most forms of defense: major and minor protection, minor maim on enemy, capped resistances, heavy armor, abilities and buffs for sustain and mitigation. Still, surviving two decent players or more is not possible. 1v1 can be tanked with less than that. So you can either go half tank to fight 1v1, or go full tank and still 1v1 cuz 1v2 is not possible. Against potatoes u can 1v3 with the half tank setup.-PC EU- / battlegrounds on my youtube0 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Careful for what you wish for, you just might get it.
Reap what you sow.
I would much rather have everyone squishy and actually dying all the time than this, trust me. I don't understand why so many people in this game get frustrated or extremely mad with being killed, it's PvP, you kill you die.
Or in this case, you don't die, you don't kill, you just wait every BG out till the end of the time limit.
I haven't bg'ed lately cause I've been busy with other stuff. But I'll believe this when I see it. Because people always exaggerate defensive builds on this forum. If someone doesn't die in seconds it's OMG they're INVINCIBLE! NERF THE TANK META!
I've seen this over and over and over again.
In any case: I'd rather have a long fight (or even a stalemate) then some stupid instant death one way or the other fight any day of the week. PvP should be about having fun - and getting slaughtered almost instantly just isn't fun. So it's not about people having a problem with "dying" really. It's about people having a problem with not having any fun.
The damage on this game's PvP has been way out of control for years. It needed to be substantially reduced. The same could be said of PvE for that matter. So I say bring on the nerfs to damage. They have been a long time coming.Edited by Jeremy on October 23, 2019 10:35PM1 -
Goregrinder✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭can someone throw me one of these op tank builds? as far as i saw no heal or tanking ability was buffed. Only some damage nerfed. Don't cry because tanks are stronger, they are not they are just the same, your damage got lowered just a bit and suddenly the excuse for this are the same tanks.
again, tell me at least one of these op builds that survive 2+ players in BGs
Class agnostic:
"Healer"
Bogdan 2-piece
Trinimac or Hist
1 Damage or sustain set
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate between shields and block
Ice staff/Resto
"Tank"
Also Bogdan
Also trinimac or hist
1 Damage or sustain set, or defensive set* (depends on if you can get major and minor protection from skills)
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate shields
Ice Staff / Resto or SnB Resto
I am not joking about this by the way.
I'm going to buy these sets and try these tonight bro.0 -
Canned_Apples✭✭✭✭✭
✭Some of their complaints are exaggerated and premades were impossible to kill before this patch, and before the patch before that one, and the one before that one, and the one before that one. Point is, you can’t use premades as an example.
If you’re looking to be “unkillable,” then play a sorc- Stam or mag.0 -
Nyladreas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Now don't get me wrong... The DOT meta sucked hard, but at least people kept dying. What we have now though? Holy ***....
High MMR BGs are just full of players running 40k-50k+ health blocking and watching each other until their ults charge then atttempt
to kill each other.
Can we please have an increase of block costs and decrease of block mitigation on battlespirit, with one hand and shield equipped? Hell, why don't you add a forced defense cap too This is actually ridiculous and boring as hell
No y hurt pve tanking when during dot meta players were killable this is why dots should not have been nerfed in my guild discord I called this out pts week 1. Dot nerf and return of unkillable players. Seriously dots may have been hard hitting with no strong counter but players died yet that was a problem every1 wants to be unkillable and deal insane damage.
Don't worry, I got you, my friend. Read it again - I said battle spirit. PvE would be completely safe from those nerfs.
@BattleAxe
Problem is ZoS has yet to use battle spirit to separate pve and pvp so chances are block changes will be effecting both sides
Sadly that's true, ZoS already has a perfect "tool" in front of them, and not only that, we know for a fact that they can make abilities behave differently based on whether they interact with a player or an NPC, yet they still choose to go the other way.Edited by Nyladreas on October 24, 2019 8:42AM1 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭Now don't get me wrong... The DOT meta sucked hard, but at least people kept dying. What we have now though? Holy ***....
High MMR BGs are just full of players running 40k-50k+ health blocking and watching each other until their ults charge then atttempt to kill each other.
Can we please have an increase of block costs and decrease of block mitigation on battlespirit, with one hand and shield equipped? Hell, why don't you add a forced defense cap too This is actually ridiculous and boring as hell
No y hurt pve tanking when during dot meta players were killable this is why dots should not have been nerfed in my guild discord I called this out pts week 1. Dot nerf and return of unkillable players. Seriously dots may have been hard hitting with no strong counter but players died yet that was a problem every1 wants to be unkillable and deal insane damage.
Don't worry, I got you, my friend. Read it again - I said battle spirit. PvE would be completely safe from those nerfs.
@BattleAxe
Problem is ZoS has yet to use battle spirit to separate pve and pvp so chances are block changes will be effecting both sides
Sadly that's true, ZoS already has a perfect "tool" in front of them, and not only that, we know for a fact that they can make abilities behave differently based on whether they interact with a player or an NPC, yet they still choose to go the other way.
I do have a forum thread poll with well over half wanting separation of pve and pvp changes0 -
Koensol✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
@Sergykid Oh yes you cank tank 1v2 easily with the right build and if you know how to play it. I am not going to share that build any more than I already did, because when I first did that some updates ago, a true nb healer epidemic broke out on PC EU. On my tankblade healer I have tanked 2 people consistently in high MMR and even 3 at some times and sustained it. 4 is not doable unless they are scrubs, but sometimes you hold out long enough for your team to come to the rescue, but you need everything up: ult, potion, resources, everything.
This guy knows. Hist sap is one of the most underrated 'tank' sets. Pair it with a mitigation set and bogdan, slot meditate and use lingering health + vitality pots, get a decent health pool and its GG.can someone throw me one of these op tank builds? as far as i saw no heal or tanking ability was buffed. Only some damage nerfed. Don't cry because tanks are stronger, they are not they are just the same, your damage got lowered just a bit and suddenly the excuse for this are the same tanks.
again, tell me at least one of these op builds that survive 2+ players in BGs
Class agnostic:
"Healer"
Bogdan 2-piece
Trinimac or Hist
1 Damage or sustain set
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate between shields and block
Ice staff/Resto
"Tank"
Also Bogdan
Also trinimac or hist
1 Damage or sustain set, or defensive set* (depends on if you can get major and minor protection from skills)
As much damage reduction as possible
Layer HoTs
Rotate shields
Ice Staff / Resto or SnB Resto
I am not joking about this by the way.
that's applicable to mag tanks. And even so, you can't survive 2+ in a BG with that setup. I have a stam tank that is using most forms of defense: major and minor protection, minor maim on enemy, capped resistances, heavy armor, abilities and buffs for sustain and mitigation. Still, surviving two decent players or more is not possible. 1v1 can be tanked with less than that. So you can either go half tank to fight 1v1, or go full tank and still 1v1 cuz 1v2 is not possible. Against potatoes u can 1v3 with the half tank setup.
The trick is to stack not just mitigation, but also hots and most importantly: healing multipliers. Mitigation means jack *** without hots as it means you will just die a bit slower. Stacking different sources of mitigation together (resist, dmg reduction, heals, movement) works best. Just slotting tanksets and hoping you will survive ends badly for you.
My build has been heavily nerfed in all aspects though, mind you. So it is not capable of the same it used to be. And that is a good thing, because I had matches with up to 3 million heals without dying, high MMR. I have been on the other side as well, and it isn't fun fighting in a BG where no one dies.0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Nerfing with battle spirit again, nukes people who use block just for a big attack or 2 more than those built to do it.
What we need is more choices. More major defile options, abilities that will drop block without CC as that's overloaded as is doing both but not able to do with the target having CC immunity.
Just need counters. I mean, you could do a counter like that rather than making javelin ignore armored. Maybe Poo Fist could have something like that added, keep whatever.0 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭Nerfing with battle spirit again, nukes people who use block just for a big attack or 2 more than those built to do it.
What we need is more choices. More major defile options, abilities that will drop block without CC as that's overloaded as is doing both but not able to do with the target having CC immunity.
Just need counters. I mean, you could do a counter like that rather than making javelin ignore armored. Maybe Poo Fist could have something like that added, keep whatever.
The tank meta counter was dot meta ppl died a lot more even in heavy only real issue too few classes had counter aka purge against dots. If purge cleansed more effects or had a more manageable cost dots would have not been so over the top1 -
dtsharples✭✭✭✭✭It all went to Oblivion when they removed Defile from practically everything.
That was the dumbest move they ever made imo.
1 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Nerfing with battle spirit again, nukes people who use block just for a big attack or 2 more than those built to do it.
What we need is more choices. More major defile options, abilities that will drop block without CC as that's overloaded as is doing both but not able to do with the target having CC immunity.
Just need counters. I mean, you could do a counter like that rather than making javelin ignore armored. Maybe Poo Fist could have something like that added, keep whatever.
The tank meta counter was dot meta ppl died a lot more even in heavy only real issue too few classes had counter aka purge against dots. If purge cleansed more effects or had a more manageable cost dots would have not been so over the top
That was too much of a blanket coverage as it hit everyone, and a lot of classes bar space is already limited.
I'd rather them ad a mechanic like maybe blocking CCs prevent the CC like they do now, but it breaks block for 2 or 3 seconds. Or maybe heavy attacks do it.0 -
IlCanis_LupuslI✭✭✭✭✭Well thank God I'm working on a setup which has a 60% AOE reduced healing received and health regen in anticipation of this (Xbox so still waiting for the patch)
Xbox-EU-AD
Khajiit Night blade Healer(BiS for cuteness)-Flawless Conquerer Grand Overlord
Khajiit Stamsorc Werewolf, Flawless Conquerer (1st attempt ww form during the entire dungeon) main
Khajiit(Master Race) Templar Healer, Flawless Conquerer
Khajiit Stam dk, Flawless conquerer, 2nd attempt
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCQhCmVHwZioVyTEDberxGtA?view_as=public
Werewolf Veteran player, Since Wrathstone-DLC "Raid-Wolf", 50k dps with fracture, Pvp Healer.1
