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Separate PvE and PvP
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AWinterWolf✭✭✭✭I agree they should be split, whether it be skills do less damage, or act differently in pvp compared to pve, or a completely different skill set, it would (in my opinion) appease both sides.@AWinterWolf, PC EU.
Main character: Healer, CP 1300+,
Completed:
vSS (Ice & Fire HM)
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All Dungeon Trifectas.
Favourite quote:
History is a story written by the victors, who often paint themselves the best of lights.1 -
Aurie✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lazarus_Rising wrote: »Don't sell your assumptions as proof. There is no proof that he does not run dungeons just because he has a team doing it. Additional he is the lead and not a tester. I assume he is doing the math and stuff and the team is testing it and gives him feedback. (The Engineer has the Idea - The Designer makes the CAD-Drawing).
Gilliam is also completelly right, these changes are not for the casuals and its good that they don't care for them that much.
If he's doing the math he needs to go back to school, as it doesn't add up.
As for that last sentence, your attitude is as bad as theirs.
@Rain_Greyraven , I too have a lot of respect for Yoshi P. It's good to know he is still in chrage over at FFXIV, I might have to go back and have another look at it!
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Edited by Aurie on September 19, 2019 12:34AM2 -
Alienoutlaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭or just simply have an option at login to either play on a pvp server or a pve server both sides would then be separated "physically" and Dev's would be free to change things on one without impacting on the other, would improve performance as players wont be loading in from PvE and vice versa.2 -
Dusk_Coven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭SydneyGrey wrote: »They've decided it's "too hard" to balance PvP and PvE separately, so instead they've decided that PvP always takes precedence
If this is true, then unfortunately they took the impossible route.
Because PvE is balanced against targets the devs have 100% control over -- is the encounter too weak? Too strong? To complicated? They can tweak that.
PvP is balanced against what is for all intents and purposes an infinite number of permutations -- not just any one build, but also when those builds come together in a team or a zerg, and the various environments they are used.
I think what they are counting on is for PvE to just muddle through with enough dps and heals. In that last twitch stream there was a mention that they "did parses" and could finish trials. By that did they mean they did parses on dummies to look at the numbers and calculated a boss kill time that had an acceptable margin before soft enrage? Or did they actually put together a team.
If the latter, what sort of team?
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Alienoutlaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Dusk_Coven wrote: »SydneyGrey wrote: »They've decided it's "too hard" to balance PvP and PvE separately, so instead they've decided that PvP always takes precedence
If this is true, then unfortunately they took the impossible route.
Because PvE is balanced against targets the devs have 100% control over -- is the encounter too weak? Too strong? To complicated? They can tweak that.
PvP is balanced against what is for all intents and purposes an infinite number of permutations -- not just any one build, but also when those builds come together in a team or a zerg, and the various environments they are used.
I think what they are counting on is for PvE to just muddle through with enough dps and heals. In that last twitch stream there was a mention that they "did parses" and could finish trials. By that did they mean they did parses on dummies to look at the numbers and calculated a boss kill time that had an acceptable margin before soft enrage? Or did they actually put together a team.
If the latter, what sort of team?
we have seen them play trials live before.........they suck at best lol so i doubt "they" did anything
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Commancho✭✭✭✭✭So many ridiculous ideas here. Although open world pvp server would be fun.Edited by Commancho on September 19, 2019 8:13AM1
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Runkorko✭✭✭✭✭
✭Alienoutlaw wrote: »
why we need to sugges new ideas when old one work perfekt?
IF ZoS need to adjust smth this is Battle Spirit.
We dont need separate pve/pvp skills.Edited by Runkorko on September 19, 2019 8:42AM1 -
Lazarus_Rising✭✭✭✭✭“Gilliam is also completelly right, these changes are not for the casuals and its good that they don't care for them that much.” @Lazarus_Rising
And this, Ladies and Gentlemen, is why we have such an awful combat team.
Yeah it must be my comment that causes an "awful" combat team.
So you think they should take 10k dps people into account when it is about balacing damage and sets? It would rather say they should take the people into account who doing 25-40 dps which is the core. I assume you don't understand the meaning of what a casual is.also known as Overlich.0 -
Casterial✭✭✭✭✭
✭SydneyGrey wrote: »They've decided it's "too hard" to balance PvP and PvE separately, so instead they've decided that PvP always takes precedence, and they'll just destroy the game for PvEers over and over with their frequent bipolar changes.
This is false, pvpers don't ask for these nerfs. In fact, aside from this nerf all I kept reading was PVE is too easy, adjust it. So they did and it screwed PVP royally.Daggerfall Covenant:Casterial Stamplar || Casterial DK || Availed NB || Castyrial Sorc || Spooky Casterial Necro
Member since: August 2013
Kill Counter Developer
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The Last Chillrend Empress
Animation Cancelling2 -
Casterial✭✭✭✭✭
✭They also already have the power. Battle spirit. This buff can apply per class per main stat and apply buffs or nerfs that adjust said class.
If Templar w/ 30k stamina Apply Stamplar Battle Spirit.Daggerfall Covenant:Casterial Stamplar || Casterial DK || Availed NB || Castyrial Sorc || Spooky Casterial Necro
Member since: August 2013
Kill Counter Developer
For the Daggerfall Covenant
The Last Chillrend Empress
Animation Cancelling1 -
davapoole✭✭✭erowaffles
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As long as gear and skills are the same in pve and pvp zenimax will always go back and forth with nerfs and buffs and the game will never be balanced.
The only way to actually balance the game out is to separate them and have a skill tree for pvp and one for pve.
Multiple mmos already do this because its only logical to do so.
To be honest I don't even know why I am even typing this since zenimax doesn't care and will continue to buff and nerf *** every 3 months till the game dies.
i totally agree with this about splitting pvp and pve. i have said it for years but zos ignore it. they only listen to pvp comments as lead combat designer is lead pvp designer who only plays pvp. therefore about 20% of the game players control what happens to everyone as all the changes are done for pvp reasons always. they complain the most so thats all that counts if you play pve only shut up as zos dont want to know what you think. everybody is complaining dots are op. i have never heard people complain in pve that they do too much damage so at least use the battle spirit to balance pvp and just leave pve alone. there is no justification for these changes again as always so seperate the two games pve and pvp most other mmo`s can do it and if zos did it the game would become a lot more stable and could build your characters as you want not having to change every patch because of pvp rebalancing every update
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Trinity_Is_My_Name✭✭✭✭✭
✭SydneyGrey wrote: »They've decided it's "too hard" to balance PvP and PvE separately, so instead they've decided that PvP always takes precedence, and they'll just destroy the game for PvEers over and over with their frequent bipolar changes.
100% accurate.
Every nerf this nerf that thread is PVP related. Every balance change is for PVP.
Seems a bit strange to me. PVP players make up an extremely low population of the total player base yet here we are with PVP players making ZOS dance like a puppet on strings.0 -
Stebarnz✭✭✭✭✭
✭They only balance around pvp as that's the hard part, pve balance is easy as mobs have predictable behaviours!
pvp is the only true test!
the game wasn't designed to have split pvp and pve so they will never do it!0 -
Red_Feather✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I guess you guys missed the stream talking about how streamers who are endgame pve experts were whining and bitching about how shallow pve endgame had become because everyone should use the same damage over time skills.1 -
Lazarus_Rising✭✭✭✭✭Trinity_Is_My_Name wrote: »SydneyGrey wrote: »They've decided it's "too hard" to balance PvP and PvE separately, so instead they've decided that PvP always takes precedence, and they'll just destroy the game for PvEers over and over with their frequent bipolar changes.
100% accurate.
Every nerf this nerf that thread is PVP related. Every balance change is for PVP.
Seems a bit strange to me. PVP players make up an extremely low population of the total player base yet here we are with PVP players making ZOS dance like a puppet on strings.
You are using Wall of Elements or Siphon in PVP? There are countless other examples to proof this is PVE relatedEdited by Lazarus_Rising on September 19, 2019 11:28PMalso known as Overlich.0 -
Wolfpaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Zerowaffles wrote: »As long as gear and skills are the same in pve and pvp zenimax will always go back and forth with nerfs and buffs and the game will never be balanced.
The only way to actually balance the game out is to separate them and have a skill tree for pvp and one for pve.
Multiple mmos already do this because its only logical to do so.
To be honest I don't even know why I am even typing this since zenimax doesn't care and will continue to buff and nerf *** every 3 months till the game dies.
Maybe a distant CP update will do this? Kinda makes sense to balance/nerf skills now, get it worked out pre cp update. Champ point allocation will balance dmg, support, pen, res, etc...
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