Official Discussion Thread for "Update 23 Brings Improvements to Guilds, Crafters & The Undaunted"

Community Manager

This is the official discussion thread for the Update 23 Brings Improvements to Guilds, Crafters & The Undaunted blog article.

Check out some of the big quality-of-life improvements and changes coming soon with Update 23!
Jessica Folsom
Lead Community Manager - ZeniMax Online Studios
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  • devildog13_93
    Will RNG for the refinement be the same? Or if I refine 1000 mats do I get 1 gold mat? Or will it be less or more?
  • Gariele
    Sigh. After all the feedback and talk from actual GMs it looks like it has fallen on deaf ears. So many better solutions. Killing ghost guilds, adding more trader kiosk, Now we watch as trade wars break out from the domino effects.
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  • Jayne_Doe
    Will RNG for the refinement be the same? Or if I refine 1000 mats do I get 1 gold mat? Or will it be less or more?

    Someone did some testing on PTS and found that the drop rates were similar to their data for live.
  • wenchmore420b14_ESO
    Undaunted keys as currency, good QOL change.
    Multi Crafting, Thank you! Huge QoL....

    Has ANYONE at ZoS read ANY of the feedback about this? This is NOT a good QoL change!
    There are other ways to deal with ghost guilds and such without the multibidding.
    And 10 is just too many...imo...
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  • Dont_do_drugs
    What on earth made zos going on with the bad QoL argumentation about multi bids, despite all critic feedback without even acknowledging anything of what had been written and addressing it in any ways, in firm of a comment, and who at ur headquarters chose to write that article then as if it never happened. Is it the "oh group finder isn't working?" game? Wait, there was a problem?

    Get Stuff like this (but not this stuff)


    "I have too admit. People leading trade guilds in this game are quite stupid. Not stupid like fools, but stupid like leaders.
    They can only bla-bla and waste gold on feeding their ego. I am disappointed."

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  • Pyr0xyrecuprotite
    Re the changes to Undaunted Keys allowing you to buy shoulders from an Undaunted merchant instead of being used to open a Chest, does that mean the Treasure Hunter passive benefit is lost when using undaunted keys now?
  • Durnik
    I'm not seeing a note on date. August, September?
  • DragonRacer
    Durnik wrote: »
    I'm not seeing a note on date. August, September?

    There was an announcement at QuakeCon last weekend (though, yes, it can be hard to find that info and is strange they didn't put it in the blog). August 12th for PC and August 27th for consoles.
    PS5 NA. GM of The PTK's - a free trading guild (CP 500+). Also a werewolf, bites are free when they're available. PSN = DragonRacer13
  • Feric51
    I completely 100% wholeheartedly DISAGREE that mutli-bidding will alleviate the issue of guilds not having guild traders after flip. There's still a limited number of guild traders and more guilds bidding on traders than possible trader locations means that even if guilds were given the opportunity to bid on 100 trader locations, some guilds would lose and not have a trader for the week because only 218 guilds can win a trader bid on a given week.

    All multi-bidding means is that bigger guilds that have money saved up will be able to bid on decent backup locations, kicking out mid-tier guilds, who will have bid on backup locations in lower-tier locations, and the poor newer guilds trying to start out that can't afford a bunch of backup bids will be completely out of luck.

    I think a lot of people are misunderstanding the whole multi bid process. So here's a breakdown to make it make more sense, and for simplicity we're going to assume this is in a vacuum of sorts.

    SUPER TRADER bids on 10 stalls for 10 million gold each. Wayrest, Rawl'ka, Mournhold, Rimmen, etc etc. They win their preferred spot in Wayrest. The rest of the bids are simply returned. Net cost to the guild = 10 mil after trader reset.

    Medium Trader bids 5 million on Wayrest, Rawl'ka, Mournhold, Rimmen, etc. They get outbid for Wayrest, but now SUPER TRADER's bid is off the books at Rawl'ka so they win Rawl'ka with 5 million and get all their other bids (including Wayrest) returned. Net total cost = 5 mil.

    N00b guild bids 100k at Wayrest, Rawl'ka, Mournhold, Rimmen, etc. They get outbid at Wayrest and Rawl'ka, but win Mournhold with 100k and have all their other bids returned.

    Now, that was a gross exaggeration because at any time you might have 20+ guilds bidding on the prime spots so you're never going to get Mournhold for 100k. But the whole concept of ghost guilds bidding high on prime spots and then flipping the guild for a profit are gone. There's no point to bid on a trader for 5-10mil if you don't actually have stuff to list unless you're simply doing it out of spite to punish one of the trading conglomerates since you'll be unable to sell that spot now which will quickly deplete your spite stash of cash.

    Meanwhile, big guilds won't have to create a bunch of "emergency" guilds to snatch up Riften, Daggerfall, etc in case their capital city stall gets sniped, they'll simply place one of their 10 bids there. So if they win their capital city bid, you won't have a ghost guild taking up a mid-tier stall anymore and it will fall to one of the mid-tier guilds (hopefully).

    Anyway, I see it as a boon for mid-tier traders because they can bid on several mid-tier spots, and still put in some backup bids at Outlaw's Refuges, etc. to hopefully guarantee a spot instead of laying all the eggs in their preferred basket and being SoL if a ghost guild takes them out.

    Edit: Main point of all this is just because a big guild bids high on a mid-tier stall doesn't mean the smaller guilds have to beat that bid. They just have to hope that the big guild gets its preferred spots so their mid-tier bid vanishes.
    Edited by Feric51 on July 31, 2019 8:52PM
    Xbox NA

    Darkness Falls: The Crusade survivor (you young kids will never know the struggle of text-based games)

  • Feric51
    Feric51 wrote: »
    Edit: Main point of all this is just because a big guild bids high on a mid-tier stall doesn't mean the smaller guilds have to beat that bid. They just have to hope that the big guild gets its preferred spots so their mid-tier bid vanishes.

    Exactly. It really sucks to be the low man on the totem pole.

    There's no reason for everyone to not throw a backup bid at small, out of the way traders now, whether that's a big guild placing an "oh sh*t" bid or a mid-tier guild hedging their bet, or another low tier guild bidding on other traders in their tier just in case.

    The lowest tier trading guilds have no real recourse than to raise more money for their bid and cross their fingers that everyone else wins their other trader bids before it trickles down to theirs.

    This is exactly why I think it will help alleviate some of the mid-tier ghost guilds we've seen historically. Many of the big traders would create ghost guilds to bid on their backup spots in case their one, and only, main stall bid got sniped. If they won their main bid, their backup bids became ghost guilds they could then auction off.

    With being able to have up to ten separate bids from one guild. If they win their preferred spot, this is potentially nine ghost guilds that are now gone that would have been there under the current live version. Yes, the lowest of the low guilds are still going to find their spots highly competitive, probably even costlier than before since mid-tier guilds (currently) don't generally go to the extreme of creating ghost guilds to bid on the way out of the way traders. Now they can toss up emergency bids on the lackluster spots with no consequences if they win their preferred spot.

    So, ultimately, this is a big win for mid-tier guilds/stalls and probably a bigger burden on the new/low guilds.
    Xbox NA

    Darkness Falls: The Crusade survivor (you young kids will never know the struggle of text-based games)

  • BenevolentBowd
    Finally, they also offer the monthly monster shoulder style page for 50 keys (and this page has a chance to drop from regular mystery coffers, as well).
    - Announcement
    The monthly monster shoulder style pages will be available directly from the merchant for 50 keys each, in addition to continuing to be a rare drop from the mystery coffers, at the same rates as previously seen with the Undaunted chests.

    Undocumented Patch Notes? ... the pledge vendors are selling previously offered Monster Style pages (shoulder). Not all of them but first 4...
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  • princessl0llie
    Soul Shriven
    There's a few I'm already pissed about..not sure how much longer I can play eso if they gonna keep messing it up and NEVER listen to the the end it's all bout greed n wanting money
  • Grimm13
    Multi-Bidding is not a Improvement for Guilds. It's killing off small to medium size Guilds, as predicted.

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