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Cast times on Ultimates
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burglar✭✭✭✭TriangularChicken wrote: »
Synchronizing their attacks to their animations? Glorious Dawnbraker? Are you guys Role Players or Game Developers?Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
This isnt your twitchy shooter with a TTK. You wanna talk about being a better player? Learn to overcome and succeed with the new cast times.
Why would a role player care about cast times? You dont have to cancel the animation if you dont want it. If you wanted you could see that glorious dawnbreaker slam down on the floor last patch. Just because you want to roleplay as Merida's champion and want roleplay and immerse yourself while vanquishing evil with that glorious dawnbreaker everyone else has to do the same?
Visit one of the many tavern in the game and roleplay in there while the rest of us can have fun with the fast paced combat eso is known for (and also one of the big selling points) instead?
Huh? You're not a DPS outside of the game, are you? No, you are ... whatever your ego tells you. Sure, roleplaying in the way you're referring to it is a part of it, but it's rare. Beyond that, though, even when you join a dungeon and join as a DPS, or a tank, or whatever, you are taking a character you've spent time building to be strong in a specific role that you are trying to fulfill, therefore my friend, even when you're animation cancelling, you're roleplaying!
I agree with ArchMikem, you will adapt, get used to it. Besides, shouldn't people be allowed to see which abilities are about to be used on them? Considering this game was made to inform you of incoming actions via their animation? A certain portion of the animation should always play at least a little bit. There will be some adjustment, but knowing the timing will require skill itself. Besides, this really won't affect the game as much as it will potentially improve it for people with lower latency. We might even get lucky with changes like this and have more people come into PvP!
Edited by burglar on August 12, 2019 6:13PMBosmer Melee Magicka Nightblade7 -
Jagdkommando✭✭✭✭Tested the cast times. They're not horrible but all they do is make an already laggy/unreliable timed game feel even more clunky. It's just like the channeled time on dark deal. Weird timing now and honestly just a garbage "fix". Roll cancelling an incap or dawnbreaker just doesn't feel smooth anymore, you have to wait a certain amount of time...it's just clunky and is not the fast paced gameplay we associate with ESO. This change should be rolled back.
And thus it is horrible...Edited by Jagdkommando on August 12, 2019 7:01PM4 -
zDan✭✭✭✭Horrible change. Are they trying to remove the skill gap entirely?zDan - Xbox EU/NA
I specialize in solo PvP on every class in the game,
be sure to check out my YouTube for several 1vX and build videos!
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXkrJ3K68GHLn2-HgHjITsA4 -
cyclonus11✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭All Dawnbreaker uses should look and feel exactly like the Molag Bal execute from the main quest. /s1 -
magictucktuck✭✭✭✭✭I just finished both new dungeons and completely forgot until i tried to swap cancel an ulti and once i was aware it wasnt a big deal i just have to think a little... before long it will be muscle memory also. I don't agree with adding them but damn people make a big deal over something so small5 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭magictucktuck wrote: »I just finished both new dungeons and completely forgot until i tried to swap cancel an ulti and once i was aware it wasnt a big deal i just have to think a little... before long it will be muscle memory also. I don't agree with adding them but damn people make a big deal over something so small
Basically my thinking.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA One Star General - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!4 -
The_Lex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
This isnt your twitchy shooter with a TTK. You wanna talk about being a better player? Learn to overcome and succeed with the new cast times.
Let me be clear, I'm not saying that you are an idiot. But I do think this was an idiotic troll attempt.
When people dont like the response they just claim the person is Trolling. I may not be old yet but god do i feel old on the internet these days.
I really could care less about how old the internet makes you feel, but if truly does make you feel old, perhaps you should do yourself a favor (and us) and spend less time on the internet.
Either way, you are, arguably, the most outspoken shill for everything ZOS does. No skin off my nose...you do you. But, take a serious look at what you wrote earlier and tell me that it wasn't a troll response, especially how you worded it.
Zero credibility.
Edited by The_Lex on August 12, 2019 8:16PM5 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It may have been done to fix a bug that occurred with 2H sword where you could charge a heavy and instantly swap + blast skills off with no CD on them after using all of those ults that mysteriously gained a cast time (nearly every other ult did not allow you to bug out the system like that).
Apparently ZOS was and is more awake this time around, they even patched HP% heals working off of mag crit all the time (the smart people that knew about this would stack points into elfborn just for vengence and a super heal even on a stam char and double dip it).
That's not all...I'm impressed, maybe I should submit more bug reports from now on after all...2 -
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The point of it was so you couldn't animation cancel it. That way people at least have some small clue they are about to get smacked with it. Of course with the lag, good luck getting it to work now
It actually has absolutely nothing to do with "animation canceling". DB and Incap have always been instant cast abilities meaning so long as a target is in range for incap to be used or a target is within the conal range of DB, the abilities will resolve server side immediately. These abilities missing or being dodged is a result of anticipation ie if the target was already under the effect of dodge rolling.
Bar swapping or blocking right away, depite popular misguided opinions, did nothing for how the skills are resolved server side since that occurs instantly upon ability press. Visually, client side however, the animations for these abilities never lined up for when they resolve and when the actual animation of the attack making contact is shown. The full animations for these abilities were designed in a way to, at the very least, encompass the window for which the GCD refreshes since you cant activate another skill in this time anyways, in large part so that animations can be animated more naturally instead of trying to squeeze the entire wind up, contact and recovery animation into a tiny millisecond time frame.
This is a nerf for sure as now you have that tiny window to react (lag issues aside ofc) to the ultimates, and doubly so, if your reaction is on point good players can now potentially "fake cast" them to bait roll dodges or whatnot. This actually puts a higher skill cap on the interaction between 2 players.Edited by exeeter702 on August 12, 2019 9:15PM1 -
Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭exeeter702 wrote: »The point of it was so you couldn't animation cancel it. That way people at least have some small clue they are about to get smacked with it. Of course with the lag, good luck getting it to work now
It actually has absolutely nothing to do with "animation canceling". DB and Incap have always been instant cast abilities meaning so long as a target is in range for incap to be used or a target is within the conal range of DB, the abilities will resolve server side immediately. These abilities missing or being dodged is a result of anticipation ie if the target was already under the effect of dodge rolling.
Bar swapping or blocking right away, depite popular misguided opinions, did nothing for how the skills are resolved server side since that occurs instantly upon ability press. Visually, client side however, the animations for these abilities never lined up for when they resolve and when the actual animation of the attack making contact is shown.
This is a nerf for sure as now you have that tiny window to react (lag issues aside ofc) to the ultimates, and doubly so, if your reaction is on point good players can now potentially "fake cast" them to bait roll dodges or whatnot. This actually puts a higher skill cap on the interaction between 2 players.
Future nerf thread:
“Dear Zos... I recently had a 1v1 with a more skilled opponent that eventually killed me. He kept Feinting his ultimate and I would react and dodge roll away. I COULDNT TELL WHEN HE WOULD ACTUALLY USE IT! Please ban this player because they used strategy to eventually get the ultimate to land. I think he was using a macro to feint the dawny even! Please nerf, my stamina bar depends on it”Edited by Insco851 on August 12, 2019 9:16PM5 -
Nicalas✭✭✭This is terrible. Got my first taste of these on live and they are so slow that I get stuck in loops where I keep cancelling the ultimate. It completely breaks the flow of the game.3
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exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭exeeter702 wrote: »The point of it was so you couldn't animation cancel it. That way people at least have some small clue they are about to get smacked with it. Of course with the lag, good luck getting it to work now
It actually has absolutely nothing to do with "animation canceling". DB and Incap have always been instant cast abilities meaning so long as a target is in range for incap to be used or a target is within the conal range of DB, the abilities will resolve server side immediately. These abilities missing or being dodged is a result of anticipation ie if the target was already under the effect of dodge rolling.
Bar swapping or blocking right away, depite popular misguided opinions, did nothing for how the skills are resolved server side since that occurs instantly upon ability press. Visually, client side however, the animations for these abilities never lined up for when they resolve and when the actual animation of the attack making contact is shown.
This is a nerf for sure as now you have that tiny window to react (lag issues aside ofc) to the ultimates, and doubly so, if your reaction is on point good players can now potentially "fake cast" them to bait roll dodges or whatnot. This actually puts a higher skill cap on the interaction between 2 players.
Future nerf thread:
“Dear Zos... I recently had a 1v1 with a more skilled opponent that eventually killed me. He kept Feinting his ultimate and I would react and dodge roll away. I COULDNT TELL WHEN HE WOULD ACTUALLY USE IT! Please ban this player because they used strategy to eventually get the ultimate to land. I think he was using a macro to feint the dawny even! Please nerf, my stamina bar depends on it”
Its sad that this is an entirely likely post to exists on these forums.0 -
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is terrible. Got my first taste of these on live and they are so slow that I get stuck in loops where I keep cancelling the ultimate. It completely breaks the flow of the game.
Its very telling how fiercely ZOS has tried to avoid implementing numerous UI features into ESO throughout its lifespan in what is ostensibly an effort to avoid showing ESOs true colors in terms of just how similar it is to other MMOs under the hood as if they were scared it would drive away potential players...
Buff / debuff timers on screen
floating combat text
in game hot bar display for the GCD
Nameplates
Percentage health / resource bar display
Visible ultimate point number display
Text chat (for console)
Its like they wanted to mask as much as possible to make sure the game looks like skyrim and not like an mmo right out of the box.
Which brings me to the relevant point here. Cast bars. If ZOS wants to adhere to various (and completely reasonable for mmos) combat governing mechanics then they need to own it and give all the interface tools necessary. A cast bar, as unsightly as some might feel it is, needs to be available in game beyond addons. This demonstrates alot of information and helps visualize various vast times so players understand skills and how to play around them.
Instead they have tried desperately to obfuscate the actual functioning elements of combat and have slowly been giving in over the years.
They want to have their cake.....
"Hey come play our game! Its just like the tes games you love, did you play skyrim? Well you will love this!"
And want to eat it too.
"Hey do you like mmos?, come try our game out, its complex with alot of mechanical depth for hard core players who enjoy end game pve and pvp!"
Edited by exeeter702 on August 12, 2019 10:24PM2 -
The_Lex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭exeeter702 wrote: »
They want to have their cake.....
"Hey come play our game! Its just like the tes games you love, did you play skyrim? Well you will love this!"
And want to eat it too.
"Hey do you like mmos?, come try our game out, its complex with alot of mechanical depth for hard core players who enjoy end game pve and pvp!"
Agreed. Neither is entirely true, and it's arguably becoming less true all the time.1 -
Kel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CAST TIMES DO NOT BELONG IN FAST, TWITCH BASED COMBAT
That this was given the go ahead to go live goes against the combat design we've all fallen in love with since day 1.
Ridiculous8 -
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭CAST TIMES DO NOT BELONG IN FAST, TWITCH BASED COMBAT
That this was given the go ahead to go live goes against the combat design we've all fallen in love with since day 1.
Ridiculous
Cast times and channels have existed in eso since day one.Edited by exeeter702 on August 12, 2019 11:30PM0 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
This isnt your twitchy shooter with a TTK. You wanna talk about being a better player? Learn to overcome and succeed with the new cast times.
Let me be clear, I'm not saying that you are an idiot. But I do think this was an idiotic troll attempt.
When people dont like the response they just claim the person is Trolling. I may not be old yet but god do i feel old on the internet these days.
I really could care less about how old the internet makes you feel, but if truly does make you feel old, perhaps you should do yourself a favor (and us) and spend less time on the internet.
Either way, you are, arguably, the most outspoken shill for everything ZOS does. No skin off my nose...you do you. But, take a serious look at what you wrote earlier and tell me that it wasn't a troll response, especially how you worded it.
Zero credibility.
I like how you're trying to put me in my place.
Call me a shill if you want. My word for it is supporter. Wtf would i ever come here and tell off the people working to give me a game world that helped me through my Cancer treatment four years ago and still to this day brings me joy? If it ever came to the point where a development decision was a step too far even for me, i'd unsub and just stop playing, and delete my forum bookmark. Until then, i wont contribute to the bystander effect whenever i see a thread crapping on the devs.
Why are you even still here?CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA One Star General - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0 -
The_Lex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
This isnt your twitchy shooter with a TTK. You wanna talk about being a better player? Learn to overcome and succeed with the new cast times.
Let me be clear, I'm not saying that you are an idiot. But I do think this was an idiotic troll attempt.
When people dont like the response they just claim the person is Trolling. I may not be old yet but god do i feel old on the internet these days.
I really could care less about how old the internet makes you feel, but if truly does make you feel old, perhaps you should do yourself a favor (and us) and spend less time on the internet.
Either way, you are, arguably, the most outspoken shill for everything ZOS does. No skin off my nose...you do you. But, take a serious look at what you wrote earlier and tell me that it wasn't a troll response, especially how you worded it.
Zero credibility.
I like how you're trying to put me in my place.
Call me a shill if you want. My word for it is supporter. Wtf would i ever come here and tell off the people working to give me a game world that helped me through my Cancer treatment four years ago and still to this day brings me joy? If it ever came to the point where a development decision was a step too far even for me, i'd unsub and just stop playing, and delete my forum bookmark. Until then, i wont contribute to the bystander effect whenever i see a thread crapping on the devs.
Why are you even still here?
Yep. I figured you wouldn't respond to the original point. White Knights say whatever they want while always claiming the high road.
Why are you even in this post?4 -
Gaggin✭✭✭✭This is crazy talk, zos finally gave us everything people've been asking for... more cast times, less aoe ground dots, more soul trap, more snares, less class abilities on bar, you know... less fun...5
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Mettaricana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭If they goona make ukts folow their anination then fix animation cancelling while your at it make a *glorious* skill function without the knee jerk twitching tgat accompanies animation canceling and while your at it slow the game content down to compensate slowing down the combat. Not point ults taking 10% longer and the content still moving full sail..1 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
This isnt your twitchy shooter with a TTK. You wanna talk about being a better player? Learn to overcome and succeed with the new cast times.
Let me be clear, I'm not saying that you are an idiot. But I do think this was an idiotic troll attempt.
When people dont like the response they just claim the person is Trolling. I may not be old yet but god do i feel old on the internet these days.
I really could care less about how old the internet makes you feel, but if truly does make you feel old, perhaps you should do yourself a favor (and us) and spend less time on the internet.
Either way, you are, arguably, the most outspoken shill for everything ZOS does. No skin off my nose...you do you. But, take a serious look at what you wrote earlier and tell me that it wasn't a troll response, especially how you worded it.
Zero credibility.
I like how you're trying to put me in my place.
Call me a shill if you want. My word for it is supporter. Wtf would i ever come here and tell off the people working to give me a game world that helped me through my Cancer treatment four years ago and still to this day brings me joy? If it ever came to the point where a development decision was a step too far even for me, i'd unsub and just stop playing, and delete my forum bookmark. Until then, i wont contribute to the bystander effect whenever i see a thread crapping on the devs.
Why are you even still here?
Yep. I figured you wouldn't respond to the original point. White Knights say whatever they want while always claiming the high road.
Why are you even in this post?
What original point? That you believed i was Trolling? How is me telling the OP to deal with the changes remotely close to Trolling.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA One Star General - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!1 -
Lord_Eomer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TriangularChicken wrote: »..are simply horrible. Why do you want to slow down combat ZOS? Most people are playing ESO for the awesome fluid (disregard lag for a second) PvE and PvP fights. If I wanted to play slow round based games I'd have moved to Tera or Rome: Total War.
"Adjusted the animations and cast times for many Ultimates that are meant to have high impact to better synchronize their attacks to their animations. These abilities cannot be interrupted, and canceling them or being stopped while casting them will not consume your Ultimate."
"This ability and its morphs now all have a minor cast time to match their animation of slamming down the glorious Dawnbreaker."
Synchronizing their attacks to their animations? Glorious Dawnbraker? Are you guys Role Players or Game Developers?
Have u used even an ultimate or just reading patch notes and start complaining?0 -
The_Lex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
This isnt your twitchy shooter with a TTK. You wanna talk about being a better player? Learn to overcome and succeed with the new cast times.
Let me be clear, I'm not saying that you are an idiot. But I do think this was an idiotic troll attempt.
When people dont like the response they just claim the person is Trolling. I may not be old yet but god do i feel old on the internet these days.
I really could care less about how old the internet makes you feel, but if truly does make you feel old, perhaps you should do yourself a favor (and us) and spend less time on the internet.
Either way, you are, arguably, the most outspoken shill for everything ZOS does. No skin off my nose...you do you. But, take a serious look at what you wrote earlier and tell me that it wasn't a troll response, especially how you worded it.
Zero credibility.
I like how you're trying to put me in my place.
Call me a shill if you want. My word for it is supporter. Wtf would i ever come here and tell off the people working to give me a game world that helped me through my Cancer treatment four years ago and still to this day brings me joy? If it ever came to the point where a development decision was a step too far even for me, i'd unsub and just stop playing, and delete my forum bookmark. Until then, i wont contribute to the bystander effect whenever i see a thread crapping on the devs.
Why are you even still here?
Yep. I figured you wouldn't respond to the original point. White Knights say whatever they want while always claiming the high road.
Why are you even in this post?
What original point? That you believed i was Trolling? How is me telling the OP to deal with the changes remotely close to Trolling.
If that's all you said, then that would be fine.
Keep claiming the high road.0 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
This isnt your twitchy shooter with a TTK. You wanna talk about being a better player? Learn to overcome and succeed with the new cast times.
Let me be clear, I'm not saying that you are an idiot. But I do think this was an idiotic troll attempt.
When people dont like the response they just claim the person is Trolling. I may not be old yet but god do i feel old on the internet these days.
I really could care less about how old the internet makes you feel, but if truly does make you feel old, perhaps you should do yourself a favor (and us) and spend less time on the internet.
Either way, you are, arguably, the most outspoken shill for everything ZOS does. No skin off my nose...you do you. But, take a serious look at what you wrote earlier and tell me that it wasn't a troll response, especially how you worded it.
Zero credibility.
I like how you're trying to put me in my place.
Call me a shill if you want. My word for it is supporter. Wtf would i ever come here and tell off the people working to give me a game world that helped me through my Cancer treatment four years ago and still to this day brings me joy? If it ever came to the point where a development decision was a step too far even for me, i'd unsub and just stop playing, and delete my forum bookmark. Until then, i wont contribute to the bystander effect whenever i see a thread crapping on the devs.
Why are you even still here?
Yep. I figured you wouldn't respond to the original point. White Knights say whatever they want while always claiming the high road.
Why are you even in this post?
What original point? That you believed i was Trolling? How is me telling the OP to deal with the changes remotely close to Trolling.
If that's all you said, then that would be fine.
Keep claiming the high road.
I'm not the one being belligerent, so yeah, I'm going to. Good chat.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA One Star General - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!1 -
ZarkingFrued✭✭✭✭✭
✭TriangularChicken wrote: »..are simply horrible. Why do you want to slow down combat ZOS? Most people are playing ESO for the awesome fluid (disregard lag for a second) PvE and PvP fights. If I wanted to play slow round based games I'd have moved to Tera or Rome: Total War.
"Adjusted the animations and cast times for many Ultimates that are meant to have high impact to better synchronize their attacks to their animations. These abilities cannot be interrupted, and canceling them or being stopped while casting them will not consume your Ultimate."
"This ability and its morphs now all have a minor cast time to match their animation of slamming down the glorious Dawnbreaker."
Synchronizing their attacks to their animations? Glorious Dawnbraker? Are you guys Role Players or Game Developers?
They're definitely role players bruh, and if the animation needed synchronized then they should have changed the animation on it.3 -
ZarkingFrued✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ulti cast times feel clunky, and like I'm playing point and click games like Runescape. Gg ZOS you've finally made it to Runescape level now.Edited by ZarkingFrued on August 13, 2019 3:57AM2 -
Anyron✭✭✭✭✭
✭This was good change. I like it since i have no insta-cast ultimates
Overload
Atronach
Negate
Meteor
Nerfed Soul Assault
???1 -
david_m_18b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I dont get why some of you say it dumbed down the since its the reverse. Skilled player will be ably to dodge/block ult now that was impossible to prevent b4.
It actusly upped the ceiling.
Now you can argue its clunky or not fun but it surely not shortened the gap betwen bad and good players.1 -
TriangularChicken✭✭✭✭Lord_Eomer wrote: »TriangularChicken wrote: »..are simply horrible. Why do you want to slow down combat ZOS? Most people are playing ESO for the awesome fluid (disregard lag for a second) PvE and PvP fights. If I wanted to play slow round based games I'd have moved to Tera or Rome: Total War.
"Adjusted the animations and cast times for many Ultimates that are meant to have high impact to better synchronize their attacks to their animations. These abilities cannot be interrupted, and canceling them or being stopped while casting them will not consume your Ultimate."
"This ability and its morphs now all have a minor cast time to match their animation of slamming down the glorious Dawnbreaker."
Synchronizing their attacks to their animations? Glorious Dawnbraker? Are you guys Role Players or Game Developers?
Have u used even an ultimate or just reading patch notes and start complaining?
Yes I did indeed test ultimates on live, thanks for asking. I am still complaining and so are many other people: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/484787/do-you-like-cast-times/p1
I agree that it's nice to have both RP elements and "balanced" Pve and Pvp combat, but it's a problem that they change combat for RP reasons. Cast times on ultimates were not needed, you were always able to see the animation of Dawnbreaker and co. and if you were fast enough you could block it...and if you're good enough you were able to anticipate the enemies next move.
Now it feels a bit dumbed down and it's probably the beginning of more and more cast times...
1 -
Casul✭✭✭✭✭
✭I almost wonder if they are trying to slow combat to help with lag. Not sure if that is even a factor, just a random thought I had.PvP needs more love.1
