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Healers, how are you feeling?
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idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
While I am not thrilled about the changes your comments make no sense.
I will just touch on the coffee part. I cannot see a healer standing around doing nothing for 5 seconds with these changes go live. If you are that good of a healer that you can stand around half the time doing nothing in a vet trial then it seems you are suggesting Zos did not go far enough with these changes.0 -
Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭These changes are great and I can’t wait for the new play style next patchOkay.
In other MMOs i played, my healers were ... just that, healers. In ESO my healer is a debuffer, buffer, healer and somewhat DPSer. There was too many selfhealing compared with other MMOs for making the healer feel worthy.
After all these changes, i somewhat feel that healers could be "needed" again. Yup, some heavy AOE fights will have to get new ways of healing, but i think that in the end, we will manage.
Some sets as Sanctuary could be worthy to play as meta. We will need more healing output, and some classes have such capacity.
In general, im quite please with game going more difficult. I will accept the challenge.
0 -
msalvia✭✭✭✭These changes are meh, I’ll just have to adapt.Like any other change, it's just gonna change some strategies. So it goes.
What my takeaway here is is how many (bad) healers aren't currently running springs and orbs? Like, what skills ARE you running if you're not running the most important ones? If you aren't running orbs you're gimping your group, and admitting as much invalidates your opinions as a healer. Sorry, harsh but true.4 -
snarkomatic✭✭✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersSaril_Durzam wrote: »Okay.
In other MMOs i played, my healers were ... just that, healers. In ESO my healer is a debuffer, buffer, healer and somewhat DPSer. There was too many selfhealing compared with other MMOs for making the healer feel worthy.
After all these changes, i somewhat feel that healers could be "needed" again. Yup, some heavy AOE fights will have to get new ways of healing, but i think that in the end, we will manage.
Some sets as Sanctuary could be worthy to play as meta. We will need more healing output, and some classes have such capacity.
In general, im quite please with game going more difficult. I will accept the challenge.
I am interested, genuinely, to know what changes you feel will have the effect of making us be "more needed," and (if I understand correctly) why you feel that you will no longer be expected to buff/debuff/etc. the way you are on live.2 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersLike any other change, it's just gonna change some strategies. So it goes.
What my takeaway here is is how many (bad) healers aren't currently running springs and orbs? Like, what skills ARE you running if you're not running the most important ones? If you aren't running orbs you're gimping your group, and admitting as much invalidates your opinions as a healer. Sorry, harsh but true.
I run orbs for the synergy, but there are only a couple of encounters in dungeons where it’s useful. Combat Prayer is a full heal for everyone if it crits, hit it twice and it’s a definite full heal.
Trials are different, but in dungeons springs isn’t required.Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten0 -
danara✭✭✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
2 cases for me : you are not a healer and dont Know what you are talking about, OR you are not as expériences as you think you are. Healing now will be boring, only refrzsh your things, without smart placing your aoe to save your mate, we are now as useless as boring to play...2 -
phantasmalD✭✭✭✭✭OtherAs a DK healer the only change (other than the generic Resto staff changes) that happened was the nerfing of Cinder Storm.
And, well, making Cauterize even more pointless by doing a 180 in the last patch and introducing Radiating Regeneration.
Also they buffed Barrier while leaving Magma Armor in the dust. Not like it already outclassed MA by leagues, naaah.
Imagine nerfing an off-meta healer.
The generic skill changes are cool and/or fine, for the most part, imo. Like ayy, finally got rid off the cast time on Siphon.1 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersNot a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
2 cases for me : you are not a healer and dont Know what you are talking about, OR you are not as expériences as you think you are. Healing now will be boring, only refrzsh your things, without smart placing your aoe to save your mate, we are now as useless as boring to play...
As a warden healer you don’t use the bugs? What’s your dps in dungeons.... I can see why there are so many groups that prefer 3 dps. Guess what, if I’m healing and doing 20k dps ST and you’re doing 2k because you probably aren’t even light attack weaving, guess which group’s better?Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten1 -
danara✭✭✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.So to all you telling me that we have always something to do, the short to the long uptime on a warden (the one with the most things to keep up)
Seeds : 6 sec
Combat prayer : 8 sec
Orb : one every 10 sec to keep the healing up
Illustrous healing : 12 sec
Blockade : 12 sec
Enchanted growth : 20 sec
Blue betty : 24 sec
Ele drain : 24 sec
Cloak : 24 sec
Altar : 30 sec
As you can see, their will be plenty of time you will just have nothing to do, spam combat prayer ?
Come on tell me on what world this game play is great ?
@idk @Iskiab
Also think about this, if 10 dd put viguor in their rotation (because yeah necro stam will still rule the meta at scalebreaker) you have more healing output and more dps than with 8 dd + 2 healers.
So now give me real facts, prove me that i am wrong, show how usefull we are right Now, and how much it is to drop heavy attacks waiting for your buff to go away !3 -
danara✭✭✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
2 cases for me : you are not a healer and dont Know what you are talking about, OR you are not as expériences as you think you are. Healing now will be boring, only refrzsh your things, without smart placing your aoe to save your mate, we are now as useless as boring to play...
As a warden healer you don’t use the bugs? What’s your dps in dungeons.... I can see why there are so many groups that prefer 3 dps. Guess what, if I’m healing and doing 20k dps ST and you’re doing 2k because you probably aren’t even light attack weaving, guess which group’s better?
Guess what if i am taking my dps i can reach 85k and my group dont need healer because the tank is a good tank and we are not taking any damage from aoe or any thing because we Just burn the boss down, i guess that i am still the problem here ? The entire role is not needed in 95% of the content.
Plus i am talking about trials so your example is bad, but thats on me cause i didnt precise it.2 -
hasi✭✭✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersNot a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
Blockade only lasts 8 seconds. Even with Jorvuld.
Netch lasts 24 seconds, Combat with Jorvuld around 11 seconds, Healing Springs 12 seconds, Frost Cloak 30 seconds and Budding Seeds 6 seconds maximum. These are only 6 possible Skills.
When I put myself in a Situation like VSS, I take Bone Surge as extra with me. Or use Guard. Whatever.
Looking at the Numbers of how long the Spells stay, you will be casting Budding Seeds once it gets activated (by the Alkosh DD before the 6sec timer runs out), then instantly cast it new. At the same time you will be using Blockade, then Combat Prayer again. Maybe some HA in between, even when you are full Magicka. HA on the Destro most likely. If you use Bone Surge, you cast it several times in between and then it'll be already time to recast the long lasting Skills.
Shouldn't forget that an OH-*** Moment might happen in between duo to mechanics, and you might use Regeneration or such.0 -
Svenja✭✭✭✭✭
✭Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
Blockade only lasts 8 seconds.
Seems you have missed some upcoming changes.PC | EU
Svea Rochaud | Templar Healer | AD
Grand Overlord - Flawless Conqueror - Immortal Redeemer - Tick-Tock-Tormentor - Gryphon Heart - Spirit Slayer1 -
danara✭✭✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
Blockade only lasts 8 seconds. Even with Jorvuld.
Netch lasts 24 seconds, Combat with Jorvuld around 11 seconds, Healing Springs 12 seconds, Frost Cloak 30 seconds and Budding Seeds 6 seconds maximum. These are only 6 possible Skills.
When I put myself in a Situation like VSS, I take Bone Surge as extra with me. Or use Guard. Whatever.
Looking at the Numbers of how long the Spells stay, you will be casting Budding Seeds once it gets activated (by the Alkosh DD before the 6sec timer runs out), then instantly cast it new. At the same time you will be using Blockade, then Combat Prayer again. Maybe some HA in between, even when you are full Magicka. HA on the Destro most likely. If you use Bone Surge, you cast it several times in between and then it'll be already time to recast the long lasting Skills.
Shouldn't forget that an OH-*** Moment might happen in between duo to mechanics, and you might use Regeneration or such.
I didnt have the number in my head, i went to eso wiki to have the correct one, check just upside your comment.
Check also patch notes concerning Blockade you will have little surprise.
I dont take burst phase in my "rotation" cause you cant know when it happend (depend on the group dps...). So you are telling me that i will have something to do during what ? 4 minutes in à trial ? Sounds nice0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So to all you telling me that we have always something to do, the short to the long uptime on a warden (the one with the most things to keep up)
Seeds : 6 sec
Combat prayer : 8 sec
Orb : one every 10 sec to keep the healing up
Illustrous healing : 12 sec
Blockade : 12 sec
Enchanted growth : 20 sec
Blue betty : 24 sec
Ele drain : 24 sec
Cloak : 24 sec
Altar : 30 sec
As you can see, their will be plenty of time you will just have nothing to do, spam combat prayer ?
Come on tell me on what world this game play is great ?
@idk @Iskiab
Also think about this, if 10 dd put viguor in their rotation (because yeah necro stam will still rule the meta at scalebreaker) you have more healing output and more dps than with 8 dd + 2 healers.
So now give me real facts, prove me that i am wrong, show how usefull we are right Now, and how much it is to drop heavy attacks waiting for your buff to go away !
Real facts lol. Try that in HoF HM. Doubt you will make it through the burn phase. The group would have to be highly coordinated with the use of vigor to even have a chance. There are a couple other fights as well. Not sure why you tagged me on that comment because this has pretty much nothing to do with my comment itself. Maybe just trying to start an argument.
So it is you that needs to stick with real facts and post a video clearing the fight I mentioned with the group you just mentioned. You need to prove yourself right before anyone should bother trying to prove you wrong. vCR+3 might be a challenge as well.
Heck, I am the first one that will say healing in this game is boring, has always been boring, and due to the base design of this game will always be boring. Just to simplistic since it is all AoE heals.0 -
danara✭✭✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.So to all you telling me that we have always something to do, the short to the long uptime on a warden (the one with the most things to keep up)
Seeds : 6 sec
Combat prayer : 8 sec
Orb : one every 10 sec to keep the healing up
Illustrous healing : 12 sec
Blockade : 12 sec
Enchanted growth : 20 sec
Blue betty : 24 sec
Ele drain : 24 sec
Cloak : 24 sec
Altar : 30 sec
As you can see, their will be plenty of time you will just have nothing to do, spam combat prayer ?
Come on tell me on what world this game play is great ?
@idk @Iskiab
Also think about this, if 10 dd put viguor in their rotation (because yeah necro stam will still rule the meta at scalebreaker) you have more healing output and more dps than with 8 dd + 2 healers.
So now give me real facts, prove me that i am wrong, show how usefull we are right Now, and how much it is to drop heavy attacks waiting for your buff to go away !
Real facts lol. Try that in HoF HM. Doubt you will make it through the burn phase. The group would have to be highly coordinated with the use of vigor to even have a chance. There are a couple other fights as well. Not sure why you tagged me on that comment because this has pretty much nothing to do with my comment itself. Maybe just trying to start an argument.
So it is you that needs to stick with real facts and post a video clearing the fight I mentioned with the group you just mentioned. You need to prove yourself right before anyone should bother trying to prove you wrong. vCR+3 might be a challenge as well.
Heck, I am the first one that will say healing in this game is boring, has always been boring, and due to the base design of this game will always be boring. Just to simplistic since it is all AoE heals.
That is zxaclty my problem, i dont think hof HM execute phase is doable without dd doing your healee job, but i think than 10 dd can succeed by doing it without healer.
I May have misunderstood this comment :Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
While I am not thrilled about the changes your comments make no sense.
I will just touch on the coffee part. I cannot see a healer standing around doing nothing for 5 seconds with these changes go live. If you are that good of a healer that you can stand around half the time doing nothing in a vet trial then it seems you are suggesting Zos did not go far enough with these changes.
I thought you were saying that it is impossible for me to wait half of the time because everything is up ? My english is not that good sorry about that0 -
MyKillv2.0✭✭✭✭✭
✭Healers have been getting fazed out of this game for a long time on the PvE side of things. Most tanks can self substain on their own. We 3dd, even 4dd most dungeons. This has been going on for some time. I am not sure why suddenly now, people are up in arms about it.
But hey, you canot ride a zerg and spam healing springs now... so yay, right?0 -
SassiestAssassin✭✭✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.MyKillv2.0 wrote: »Healers have been getting fazed out of this game for a long time on the PvE side of things. Most tanks can self substain on their own. We 3dd, even 4dd most dungeons. This has been going on for some time. I am not sure why suddenly now, people are up in arms about it.
But hey, you canot ride a zerg and spam healing springs now... so yay, right?
Healers are currently needed in vet trials. This is what the fuss is about, the fear we’re being pushed out of the last endgame content we’re absolutely needed in*slams a gallon of Respecting Support Roles juice on the table* Take a sip, babes.1 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Like I don't know what any of my resto staff abilities are going to do once the patch goes Live.
ZOS keeps changing the details, so I guess I'll just wait and see.2 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So to all you telling me that we have always something to do, the short to the long uptime on a warden (the one with the most things to keep up)
Seeds : 6 sec
Combat prayer : 8 sec
Orb : one every 10 sec to keep the healing up
Illustrous healing : 12 sec
Blockade : 12 sec
Enchanted growth : 20 sec
Blue betty : 24 sec
Ele drain : 24 sec
Cloak : 24 sec
Altar : 30 sec
As you can see, their will be plenty of time you will just have nothing to do, spam combat prayer ?
Come on tell me on what world this game play is great ?
@idk @Iskiab
Also think about this, if 10 dd put viguor in their rotation (because yeah necro stam will still rule the meta at scalebreaker) you have more healing output and more dps than with 8 dd + 2 healers.
So now give me real facts, prove me that i am wrong, show how usefull we are right Now, and how much it is to drop heavy attacks waiting for your buff to go away !
Real facts lol. Try that in HoF HM. Doubt you will make it through the burn phase. The group would have to be highly coordinated with the use of vigor to even have a chance. There are a couple other fights as well. Not sure why you tagged me on that comment because this has pretty much nothing to do with my comment itself. Maybe just trying to start an argument.
So it is you that needs to stick with real facts and post a video clearing the fight I mentioned with the group you just mentioned. You need to prove yourself right before anyone should bother trying to prove you wrong. vCR+3 might be a challenge as well.
Heck, I am the first one that will say healing in this game is boring, has always been boring, and due to the base design of this game will always be boring. Just to simplistic since it is all AoE heals.
That is zxaclty my problem, i dont think hof HM execute phase is doable without dd doing your healee job, but i think than 10 dd can succeed by doing it without healer.
I May have misunderstood this comment :Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
While I am not thrilled about the changes your comments make no sense.
I will just touch on the coffee part. I cannot see a healer standing around doing nothing for 5 seconds with these changes go live. If you are that good of a healer that you can stand around half the time doing nothing in a vet trial then it seems you are suggesting Zos did not go far enough with these changes.
I thought you were saying that it is impossible for me to wait half of the time because everything is up ? My english is not that good sorry about that
To the first, you were clearly advocating that 10 DD vs 8 DD and 2 H could clear vet trials if that comment was intended to have meaning.
You finished it up challenging us to give you facts and prove you wrong, yet now you are making it clear you are the one who lacks the facts.
Then to the second, you seem to claim the healing is so OP you can regularly go AFK for 5 seconds at a time but that comes after you question you will be able to actually be able to heal some fights.
Which is it? Again, it seems you are just looking to argue for the sake of it as you are all over the place.1 -
danara✭✭✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.So to all you telling me that we have always something to do, the short to the long uptime on a warden (the one with the most things to keep up)
Seeds : 6 sec
Combat prayer : 8 sec
Orb : one every 10 sec to keep the healing up
Illustrous healing : 12 sec
Blockade : 12 sec
Enchanted growth : 20 sec
Blue betty : 24 sec
Ele drain : 24 sec
Cloak : 24 sec
Altar : 30 sec
As you can see, their will be plenty of time you will just have nothing to do, spam combat prayer ?
Come on tell me on what world this game play is great ?
@idk @Iskiab
Also think about this, if 10 dd put viguor in their rotation (because yeah necro stam will still rule the meta at scalebreaker) you have more healing output and more dps than with 8 dd + 2 healers.
So now give me real facts, prove me that i am wrong, show how usefull we are right Now, and how much it is to drop heavy attacks waiting for your buff to go away !
Real facts lol. Try that in HoF HM. Doubt you will make it through the burn phase. The group would have to be highly coordinated with the use of vigor to even have a chance. There are a couple other fights as well. Not sure why you tagged me on that comment because this has pretty much nothing to do with my comment itself. Maybe just trying to start an argument.
So it is you that needs to stick with real facts and post a video clearing the fight I mentioned with the group you just mentioned. You need to prove yourself right before anyone should bother trying to prove you wrong. vCR+3 might be a challenge as well.
Heck, I am the first one that will say healing in this game is boring, has always been boring, and due to the base design of this game will always be boring. Just to simplistic since it is all AoE heals.
That is zxaclty my problem, i dont think hof HM execute phase is doable without dd doing your healee job, but i think than 10 dd can succeed by doing it without healer.
I May have misunderstood this comment :Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
While I am not thrilled about the changes your comments make no sense.
I will just touch on the coffee part. I cannot see a healer standing around doing nothing for 5 seconds with these changes go live. If you are that good of a healer that you can stand around half the time doing nothing in a vet trial then it seems you are suggesting Zos did not go far enough with these changes.
I thought you were saying that it is impossible for me to wait half of the time because everything is up ? My english is not that good sorry about that
To the first, you were clearly advocating that 10 DD vs 8 DD and 2 H could clear vet trials if that comment was intended to have meaning.
You finished it up challenging us to give you facts and prove you wrong, yet now you are making it clear you are the one who lacks the facts.
Then to the second, you seem to claim the healing is so OP you can regularly go AFK for 5 seconds at a time but that comes after you question you will be able to actually be able to heal some fights.
Which is it? Again, it seems you are just looking to argue for the sake of it as you are all over the place.
I am not saying healing is OP, what i am saying is that once you have put everything you have to put you dont have any thing else to do, and this, for a long time, giving the long buff ultime.
But in burst phase when you have to burst heal : or the heal is not enough coming from 2 healers even spamming combat prayer (and the Best exemple is still hof HM execute phase cause you cant touch everyone with your prayer).
Now my concern is that dps can drop the same amount of heal, if it not more than we can. The différence is that we are healers and they are dd.
Conclusion : when you dont need to heal you have just nothing to do (except keeping your buff/debuff/ground aoe....), and what i was trying to show is this aspect of the healer game play. But when you need to burst heal, you dont have the tools for it and the'n cant do the job so dd need to do your job.
So a Quick sumarry of the conclusion :
When you dont have to burst heal, you have nothing to do (boring), and when you have to burst heal dd have to do your job (we are useless).2 -
Grandma✭✭✭✭✭Othernot great. I think the orb and spring changes make sense but there wasn't enough buff to class heals to compensate for the pure HPS loss that manifests itself in content like vSS hm and vHoF hm not being physically possible by the best players in the game, not to mention casual players who will now have to work 10x harder for the same amount of reward as this patch.GH / 3/04/2021 / Elemental Catalyst Necromancer1 -
hasi✭✭✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersNot a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
Blockade only lasts 8 seconds. Even with Jorvuld.
Netch lasts 24 seconds, Combat with Jorvuld around 11 seconds, Healing Springs 12 seconds, Frost Cloak 30 seconds and Budding Seeds 6 seconds maximum. These are only 6 possible Skills.
When I put myself in a Situation like VSS, I take Bone Surge as extra with me. Or use Guard. Whatever.
Looking at the Numbers of how long the Spells stay, you will be casting Budding Seeds once it gets activated (by the Alkosh DD before the 6sec timer runs out), then instantly cast it new. At the same time you will be using Blockade, then Combat Prayer again. Maybe some HA in between, even when you are full Magicka. HA on the Destro most likely. If you use Bone Surge, you cast it several times in between and then it'll be already time to recast the long lasting Skills.
Shouldn't forget that an OH-*** Moment might happen in between duo to mechanics, and you might use Regeneration or such.
I didnt have the number in my head, i went to eso wiki to have the correct one, check just upside your comment.
Check also patch notes concerning Blockade you will have little surprise.
I dont take burst phase in my "rotation" cause you cant know when it happend (depend on the group dps...). So you are telling me that i will have something to do during what ? 4 minutes in à trial ? Sounds nice
You will have something to do all the time. Depends on the Trial obviously too. And if you don't calculate in that certain mechanics happen, that need you to outheal in the right moment etc.(thus taking your time), you would practically have nothing to do Pre-Scalebreaker neither after putting your Buffs and Debuffs up.Edited by hasi on August 6, 2019 3:34PM0 -
hasi✭✭✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersNot a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
Blockade only lasts 8 seconds.
Seems you have missed some upcoming changes.
Oh, I am sorry that I can't remember every of 100 Changes whatsoever.🙄0 -
majulook✭✭✭✭✭
✭These changes are terrible and ZOS has completely lost it.I have 3 healers. On paper these changes seem bad, once it goes live I will see how it is.
That being said... I am expecting to retire my healers, as it appears they will no longer be needed, and no longer fun to play.Si vis pacem, para bellum3 -
Cinbri✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭These changes are great and I can’t wait for the new play style next patchSome questionable changes but overall it looks good.0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So to all you telling me that we have always something to do, the short to the long uptime on a warden (the one with the most things to keep up)
Seeds : 6 sec
Combat prayer : 8 sec
Orb : one every 10 sec to keep the healing up
Illustrous healing : 12 sec
Blockade : 12 sec
Enchanted growth : 20 sec
Blue betty : 24 sec
Ele drain : 24 sec
Cloak : 24 sec
Altar : 30 sec
As you can see, their will be plenty of time you will just have nothing to do, spam combat prayer ?
Come on tell me on what world this game play is great ?
@idk @Iskiab
Also think about this, if 10 dd put viguor in their rotation (because yeah necro stam will still rule the meta at scalebreaker) you have more healing output and more dps than with 8 dd + 2 healers.
So now give me real facts, prove me that i am wrong, show how usefull we are right Now, and how much it is to drop heavy attacks waiting for your buff to go away !
Real facts lol. Try that in HoF HM. Doubt you will make it through the burn phase. The group would have to be highly coordinated with the use of vigor to even have a chance. There are a couple other fights as well. Not sure why you tagged me on that comment because this has pretty much nothing to do with my comment itself. Maybe just trying to start an argument.
So it is you that needs to stick with real facts and post a video clearing the fight I mentioned with the group you just mentioned. You need to prove yourself right before anyone should bother trying to prove you wrong. vCR+3 might be a challenge as well.
Heck, I am the first one that will say healing in this game is boring, has always been boring, and due to the base design of this game will always be boring. Just to simplistic since it is all AoE heals.
That is zxaclty my problem, i dont think hof HM execute phase is doable without dd doing your healee job, but i think than 10 dd can succeed by doing it without healer.
I May have misunderstood this comment :Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
While I am not thrilled about the changes your comments make no sense.
I will just touch on the coffee part. I cannot see a healer standing around doing nothing for 5 seconds with these changes go live. If you are that good of a healer that you can stand around half the time doing nothing in a vet trial then it seems you are suggesting Zos did not go far enough with these changes.
I thought you were saying that it is impossible for me to wait half of the time because everything is up ? My english is not that good sorry about that
To the first, you were clearly advocating that 10 DD vs 8 DD and 2 H could clear vet trials if that comment was intended to have meaning.
You finished it up challenging us to give you facts and prove you wrong, yet now you are making it clear you are the one who lacks the facts.
Then to the second, you seem to claim the healing is so OP you can regularly go AFK for 5 seconds at a time but that comes after you question you will be able to actually be able to heal some fights.
Which is it? Again, it seems you are just looking to argue for the sake of it as you are all over the place.
I am not saying healing is OP, what i am saying is that once you have put everything you have to put you dont have any thing else to do, and this, for a long time, giving the long buff ultime.
But in burst phase when you have to burst heal : or the heal is not enough coming from 2 healers even spamming combat prayer (and the Best exemple is still hof HM execute phase cause you cant touch everyone with your prayer).
Now my concern is that dps can drop the same amount of heal, if it not more than we can. The différence is that we are healers and they are dd.
Conclusion : when you dont need to heal you have just nothing to do (except keeping your buff/debuff/ground aoe....), and what i was trying to show is this aspect of the healer game play. But when you need to burst heal, you dont have the tools for it and the'n cant do the job so dd need to do your job.
So a Quick sumarry of the conclusion :
When you dont have to burst heal, you have nothing to do (boring), and when you have to burst heal dd have to do your job (we are useless).
Healing in this game is boring as it is. It is the most boring healing I have seen in any MMORPG I have played. It is just to simplistic with how almost every heal is an AoE. BoL is an AoE heal, lol.
Regardless, I guess we are two totally different type of players. I remember from the first year of this game how much I enjoyed vDSA as a healer. I often put out much almost as much dps as the two dps and still healed and buffed. I never just stood around. Heck, healers healed, dpsed and tanked in vDSA, still do.
Granted, I am concerned about some of the nerfs, but I still think you are just looking to argue for the sake of it.1 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭These changes are meh, I’ll just have to adapt.Not a healer main; so i wont answer the poll but just gonna give my feeling about what healers told me:
We've been quite overhealing raids & *** for quite a while now (except very few stuffs; but for the most part it is.) which gave healer time to focus better on buffing the group & debuffing the boss.
now with these change; i'm not quite sure; but it seems that healers will lose a bit of that "room" for buffing; which will force healer to make more effort into sharing the buff/debuff job.
IMO we can't be really certain about how will it end; wether it's gonna be as awful as some players predicts or it's still gonna be fine for the most optimized groups? Never heard of any real testing with a serious group. I want to see how it will work on live?
I can see you are not a main healer yes
Tell me, once i drop my hot, my buff what do i do during these 5 seconds when everything is up ? I go make Coffee yes
Now we are over healing, yeah sure, but some mechanics are designed with the current springs, so... On trial where you are using 3 healers, what so you do now ? Use 6?
Debuff, heavy attacks and some damage... all the things you should have been doing on live.
OK, more precisely
when all my ground aoe, my buff, my debuff are up and i am full magicka ? What do i do ?
If you played warden (even more with jorvuld) it is obvious that you have nothing to do, most of your buff last for 30 seconds, you Just have to drop one blockade every 12 seconds, 1 combat prayer every 11.2 sec, and 1 orb every 10 sec (like that even if your mate cant proc the synnergy it is still a healing source), but come one, 3 spells to refrzsh every 12 seconds ? This is a great game play to you ?
Uptime are so long that you dont need to do any heavy attack for get your mana back regen will be enough
So what i am going to do only Light attack to gain ultimate point ?
2 cases for me : you are not a healer and dont Know what you are talking about, OR you are not as expériences as you think you are. Healing now will be boring, only refrzsh your things, without smart placing your aoe to save your mate, we are now as useless as boring to play...
Up to a point I share your concern, but I always try to make room for 3-4 damage skills on my destro bar. I haven't healed much on a warden recently, but those start with Blockade (perhaps changing morph next patch) and Shalks (which by the way provides an AoE debuff that from other skills is only single-target). The other non-ultimates now might be Netch, Orb, Budding Seeds, Combat Prayer, Siphon (instead of Elemental Drain), Healing Ward/Ward Ally, Mutagen and something else for damage. If that isn't enough healing, an 8th healing skill or Inner Light probably isn't going to make the difference. And a couple of those healing skills are flexible if there's something else I really, really want to run. (Cloak? Lotus?) And with Shalks and Seeds combining for 3 casts every 6 seconds, I don't foresee too too much thumb-twiddling in my future.0 -
JadonSky✭✭✭✭✭OtherI converted my stamplar to a healer because I just didn't like stamina and already have a magplar that I main and he has just been a crafter banker dummy for years now. But I did this about a week before the first patch notes released, so I figured i'll just wait to really learn the rotations until after this update comes out. So I guess you could say I will adapt but first time playing a healer role in the 4 years i'v played this game so really its just learning curve anyways so might as well wait until the changes :-).0 -
p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersNo problem for me, was afraid, I've even post to say how bad it's gonna be in hard content.
But after a lot of test and theory crafting, these change are very good imho.
Ppl will take time to adapt, but they gonna learn like they do at each big patch.
It's just a new meta, healer are not buff-bot force to pick the 2 same set anymore, that all.
That has never been the case for those of us who actually heal end game content. Ever.PC/Xbox NA
Unchained | Unstoppable | Mindmender | Swashbuckler Supreme | Planes Breaker | Dawnbringer | Godslayer | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Tick-tock Tormentor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Stormproof | Grand Overlord | Grand Mastercrafter | Master Grappler | Tamriel Hero3 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Mad at some changes, happy with othersFrom someone mainly interested in DD and only recently started healing for Dungeon's since I got tired of the long DD queue.
I see a lot of GCD's saved, less spamming of orbs and springs, more sustain so less mag reg, therefor more damage for higher healing tooltips and more off dps.
Duration changes to Ele Blockade/Illustrious Healing/Liquid Lightning to 12s instead of 8s just makes all abilities line up easier and saves a lot of GCD's.
I liked the changes to Force Siphon, Ele Drain can be replaced since Major Breach should be provided by tank ideally so you can just provide Minor Magicka/Life Steal with 1 ability instead of 2.
Combat Prayer is a pretty strong aoe burst heal and cheap to spam, I think I managed to see a 7.5k tooltip without proper optimization on PTS. Sadly Matriarch while a strong burst heal, has weak damage and isn't completely necessary. I felt Combat Prayer easily replaces it, thus allowing me to slot Inner Light or Bound Aegis for even higher Healing tooltips and potentially a free slot back bar.
I'll be trying Power Surge, but it definitely needs some work. Eg. 2s/1s cd + Major Sorcery/Dynamic Scaling on all morphs.
Overall, it actually looks fun to play. If end game content is still impossible in some areas as people claim, I expect people will adapt a way to overcome it or ZOS will eventually re-balance content or Healers. The overall direction is what I mostly agree with.0