Look Guys, Don’t Go Exploiting Bugs. Be Smart. Don’t Risk Your Account.

WuffyCerulei
WuffyCerulei
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I’m just saying this to remind people to not risk the account they’ve worked hard on over exploiting a bug. It’s stated clearly in the Code of Conduct to NOT do it:

5.2 Users will not exploit any bug, or abuse any game system (such as the scoring or award systems) in a ZeniMax Game, Service, forum, or other games or services provided by ZeniMax. Users will not intentionally use or share any bug found within any ZeniMax Game, real or fictitious, regardless of whether or not it grants an unfair advantage. You will not directly or indirectly communicate the existence of any such bug to any other user of the ZeniMax Service (in game or on a ZeniMax service).

Link: https://account.elderscrollsonline.com/code-of-conduct

Don’t be stupid. Don’t exploit things that’ll get you skins, gear, or an unfair advantage over others. I’m telling yall again after seeing a streamer (I will not name names) exploit the double jump/long jump bug on their stream like there’s no consequences to their actions. You can lose your account. Again, don’t be stupid.
"Buzz Lightyear toy isle shot" Stormcalling/Animal Companions/Assassination PVP build hater

Bring Back Pure Class Build Power
  • ChunkyCat
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    Thanks.
  • WuffyCerulei
    WuffyCerulei
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    ChunkyCat wrote: »
    Thanks.

    Ur welcome uwu Some people need reminders slapped into them. Why I made the thread.
    Edited by WuffyCerulei on August 5, 2019 1:12PM
    "Buzz Lightyear toy isle shot" Stormcalling/Animal Companions/Assassination PVP build hater

    Bring Back Pure Class Build Power
  • TheShadowScout
    TheShadowScout
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    Don’t be stupid. Don’t exploit things that’ll get you skins, gear, or an unfair advantage over others. I’m telling yall again after seeing a streamer (I will not name names) exploit the double jump/long jump bug on their stream like there’s no consequences to their actions. You can lose your account. Again, don’t be stupid.
    It -really- cannot be said often enough for some people.
    doyourwork.png
    It -really- cannot be said often enough for some people.
    Don’t be stupid. Don’t exploit things that’ll get you skins, gear, or an unfair advantage over others. I’m telling yall again after seeing a streamer (I will not name names) exploit the double jump/long jump bug on their stream like there’s no consequences to their actions. You can lose your account. Again, DO. NOT. BE. STUPID!
  • worrallj
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    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.
    Edited by worrallj on August 5, 2019 2:19PM
  • WuffyCerulei
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    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.

    I believe they’re trying to work on the bug, but it’s certainly not intended. Animation canceling, for the last time, is not a bug nor an exploit. Zos even put a tip in-game that says activating a light attack before a skill (a form of animation canceling) will do more damage. Thus intended.
    "Buzz Lightyear toy isle shot" Stormcalling/Animal Companions/Assassination PVP build hater

    Bring Back Pure Class Build Power
  • Jayman1000
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    Did he exploit to gain advantage over other players? Or did he just exploit to get atop a wayshrine that is otherwise inaccessible or something similarly harmless thing?
  • WuffyCerulei
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    Jayman1000 wrote: »
    Did he exploit to gain advantage over other players? Or did he just exploit to get atop a wayshrine that is otherwise inaccessible or something similarly harmless thing?

    Essentially streaking while jumping, in pvp.
    "Buzz Lightyear toy isle shot" Stormcalling/Animal Companions/Assassination PVP build hater

    Bring Back Pure Class Build Power
  • maxjapank
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    I bet I know who the streamer is. Saw them do it 3 times in a row during a battle this weekend.
  • LucyferLightbringer
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    I bet they won't do anything because it is a streamer.
  • worrallj
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    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.

    I believe they’re trying to work on the bug, but it’s certainly not intended. Animation canceling, for the last time, is not a bug nor an exploit. Zos even put a tip in-game that says activating a light attack before a skill (a form of animation canceling) will do more damage. Thus intended.

    True, and I know they've come out and said animation canceling isn't a bug, but it certainly didn't start that way and was absolutely not intended. For some time it was in a grey area, and then zeni decided it was a happy accident that made combat more interesting so they left it alone.

    Either way, my point is it's unfair to ban players for figuring out the most effective way to play the game. I never even heard of this bunny jumping thing before, but it seems rediculous that they'd ban someone for doing a sprint & jump with good timing.

    What if two armor bonuses interact with each other in an odd way that is very OP that seems maybe like an accident? Is it then a bannable offense to equip those two sets at the same time? I don't think it's fair to put this kind of stuff on players.
  • Veles
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    There are so many bugs in game. So u can exploits even if u dont know about it.
  • Sanguinor2
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    worrallj wrote: »

    Either way, my point is it's unfair to ban players for figuring out the most effective way to play the game. I never even heard of this bunny jumping thing before, but it seems rediculous that they'd ban someone for doing a sprint & jump with good timing.

    What if two armor bonuses interact with each other in an odd way that is very OP that seems maybe like an accident? Is it then a bannable offense to equip those two sets at the same time? I don't think it's fair to put this kind of stuff on players.

    It´s really not unfair, for example when IC Mobs were bugged to give like 1mil xp each, some People figured the most effective way to farm cp would be to just exploit those very obviously not intended xp gains, if they knowingly do so they deserve any ban they get.
    If People figure the most effective way to get the asylum Skin is to just snipe exploit it, they deserve any ban they get.

    There are different dimensions of exploits true, but if you knowingly exploit anything for your own gain then any punishment you get for that is fair game.
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  • zvavi
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    You hear it guys, you are not allowed to pvp because it is bugged and you are exploiting other players lag. Seriously though, it is written there to cover their back, i would understand if it was a game that was insta fixing bugs when they happen, but when bugs persist for more than half a year i am very sorry it is already part of the game.
    Edited by zvavi on August 5, 2019 3:02PM
  • Zer0_CooL
    Zer0_CooL
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    Users will not intentionally use or share any bug found within any ZeniMax Game, real or fictitious, regardless of whether or not it grants an unfair advantage.


    So if i report a bug like the "glued on a chair" bug here in the forum, or make a youtube video about any other gamebraking bug, i risk my account?!

    Well played ZeniMax, well played...


  • Shanehere
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    Zer0_CooL wrote: »
    Users will not intentionally use or share any bug found within any ZeniMax Game, real or fictitious, regardless of whether or not it grants an unfair advantage.


    So if i report a bug like the "glued on a chair" bug here in the forum, or make a youtube video about any other gamebraking bug, i risk my account?!

    Well played ZeniMax, well played...


    Posting a bug or exploit on the forums or on youtube gives people the ability to learn and use that exploit, so yeah.

    Just report it privately to ZOS.
    Edited by Shanehere on August 5, 2019 3:08PM
  • ArchMikem
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    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.

    I believe they’re trying to work on the bug, but it’s certainly not intended. Animation canceling, for the last time, is not a bug nor an exploit. Zos even put a tip in-game that says activating a light attack before a skill (a form of animation canceling) will do more damage. Thus intended.

    Lol, you do know that wasnt always the case right? Animation Cancelling is 100% originally an unintended side effect of the combat system. Thus, an Exploit. What inevitably happened however is just so many players started using the bug in their standard gameplay that ZOS knew if they ever finally fixed it, there would be a temper tantrum the likes this forum has never seen. So they saved face, and claimed it as a game mechanic.
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  • Zer0_CooL
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    Shanehere wrote: »

    Posting a bug or exploit on the forums or on youtube gives people the ability to learn and use that exploit, so yeah.

    Just report it privately to ZOS.

    An exploit always goes along with an "unfair advantage", so they must be talking about bugs in general. :/
    Edited by Zer0_CooL on August 5, 2019 3:14PM
  • Kalik_Gold
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    Thanks for telling the forums there is a double jump/ long jump exploit. Most of us had no idea. Will make more people look for said exploit and attempt it.
    Main: (PvP & PvE)
    Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar, the Vestige

    PvP:
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    Cacique the Sage of Ius a Redguard Warden
    Jux Blackheart a Redguard Nightblade
    Goliath of Hammerfell a Redguard Dragonknight
    Kaotik Von Dae'mon a Redguard* Sorcerer

    PvP: (Specialty)
    Tyrus Septim an Imperial Lycan Sorcerer
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    Movárth Piquine a Nord Vampiric Necromancer
    Uri Ice-Heart the Twin a Nord Vampiric Warden
    Voa a Priest of Sep a Redguard* Necromancer

    PvE:
    Cinan Tharn an Imperial Dragonknight (Tank)
    Bates Vesuius of Dawnstar an Imperial Dragonknight (Damage)
    Herzog Zwei the Genesis an Akavari* Templar (Healer)
    Tav'i at-Shinji a Redguard** Warden (One-Bar)
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    Leveling...
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    Zenovia at-Tura a Redguard** Sorcerer
    Yesi af-Kalik a Redguard Templar
    ======
    Passives of another race used. (RP)
    *Breton
    **Imperial




    __________________________Backstories:_________________________

    Ras Kalik the Vestige, a renown Redguard warrior; He has been blessed to save Tamriel from Molag Bal’s destructive Planemeld while reuniting the Five Companions. His further accomplishments after defeating Molag Bal, has been to stop the destruction of Morrowind, the Clockwork City, return order to the isle of Summerset and create a new king in Wrothgar and a queen in Elsywer. These events have made him a living legend and continue to lead him into new adventures throughout Tamriel, as well as into the hearts of many ladies including the Elf Queen, Aryenn. Over many years of adventurous travels, Ras Kalik had become a loner, until he re-visited his homeland of Alik'r.

    Alik'r and it's cities were overrun by the undead Ra-Netu and therefore he made an allegiance with Alik'r's own Ash'abah tribe. These Ash'abah with his help, cleansed the city of Sentinel in Alik'r desert and it's surrounding areas of the undead brought to life by the Withered Hand. After rescuing Sentinel from the undead zombies, King Fahara’jad’s personal bodyguard the Goliath of Hammerfell, who was given this name by Imperials in the region; was asked to assist the tribe after learning of the defeat of the Withered Hand to the Ash'abah. Kalik promised Goliath he would task him with fighting living enemies on the battlefield if he so desired. Goliath being a Yokudan warrior wields a massive sword in respect to the Ansei, a gift given by the Imperial, Cinan Tharn. Not many soldiers are able to wield double two handed weapons, but Goliath loves to get up and personal in a fight, so he also carries a giant maul, both weapons laced with magical flames.

    Jux Blackheart is a master thief that masquerades as a Bard at the Sisters of the Sands inn, with his younger sidekick Lucky Hunch for pilfering and gambling during this time. Jux was known to infiltrate any towns bank vault he came across and even delved into Ayelid ruins without detection. Kalik can vividly recall the night he met the famed thief. Jux found himself rummaging thru a slightly inebriated Kalik’s pocket for too long, on a full-mooned night and because of his greed and the glimmer of his golden armor in the moonlight. He lost his left pinky fingertip as a lesson! But in return, he gained a new friend, as it was his first time since a child being caught red-handed...

    Upon arrival back in the Alik'r after many moons of adventuring, Ras Kalik ventures to Bergama. Visiting The Winking Jackal, he runs into Jux Blackheart, who introduces him to the coin game Crowns vs Forebearers (Heads vs Tails) and Golden Dwemer (RBG).... Jux constantly takes gold from the unfortunate thru theft or gambling, his biggest gambling victim is actually his partner in crime known as Lucky Hunch the Gambler. Lucky doesn't mind losing any gold coins to Jux... as Jux saved him from Altmer slavers in Summerset, by stealing a key and sending him on a boat to the mainland years prior. Lucky spent years in slavery with Khajiits in Summerset and picked up the art of subterfuge, using illusion magic disguises and stealing there.

    Kaotik Von’Daemon an outcast, and a half-caste between a Breton mother and a Redguard father. Kaotik become a pariah due to his conjuration of Daedra pets. He was taught healing magic during his childhood years by his Breton mother. His father due to Redguard customs exiled him from the desert, sending him by wagon caravan to be a soldier in the war in Cyrodiil. He happened to meet Kalik while traveling from Alik'r, during this long caravan ride the caravan he was in was ambushed in Bangkorai by a group of bandits. Kalik by chance was also traveling thru this area on his Auridon Warhorse (which was bestowed to him by his friend, Darien Gautier). During this ambush, Kalik was able to rescue five hostages from the bandits. Kaotik was the first rescued, and Ras Kalik also recruited him to be in the Ash'abah tribe. These core Ash'abah tribesmen may never be seen together in travel as they partake in their own adventures but they always know what each other is doing; as they frequent a hideout in northern Bankorai. Their hideout an old Orc castle ruin, is kept watch by Nuzhimeh and she passes messages written between them, and frequently they also enjoy her company and her bed.

    The other men rescued were a Dunmer banker, an Imperial mercenary and two other soldiers, an Imperial and a Breton Knight, stating proudly he was an Akavir descendent. One of the Imperials, Cinan, claimed to be related to Abnur Tharn the Battlemage of the Imperial Elder Council (One of Ras Kalik's mentors in the Five Companions). Cinan Tharn was really Abnur's drunkard treasure hunting illegitimate son. He was caught smuggling artifacts out of the Ayleid ruins in Cyrodiil and the elder of the two Imperials was Tyrus Septim a retired Imperial navy battle-mage (now a Lycan mercenary living in the city of Rimmen) and guard to the Tharn family. As much as Abnur Tharn hated his half-sister Euraxia, he dislikes his bas†ard son Cinan more. Tyrus now a ruffian and privateer had been paid by Abnur Tharn to watch over Cinan as much as possible. Cinan Tharn a drunkard, loves to drink at least a quarter barrel of Nord mead before he raids various delves and dungeons for relics to sell on the black market. Cinan also plans to one day, run an illegal gambling ring... which he thinks will net him more gold for his wares.

    The Dunmer captive shackled to the Imperials looked familiar to Kalik from his time in Morrowind.... and he recognized him as Tythis Andromo a House Telvanni slave-owner and banker from Vvardenfell. During a rough interrogation to Tythis, Ras Kalik learnt why the bandits accosted him. The racist Dunmer was providing slaves as soldiers for the Three Banner War. The bandits were trying to negotiate a lucrative ransom for Andromo and the Imperials.... Kalik did not need any of this gold and he could never set Tythis free as he did with the two Imperial soldiers. His past involvement with slavery and war crimes, made Kalik's blood boil. He chose not to execute Tythis, as he figured the worse punishment for this former rich and opulent slave owner, is to now be an imprisoned servant for Ras Kalik and the tribe.

    Herzog Zwei the Genesis a reknown Imperial/Akavirri battle-mage. His roots going back to Akavir through his mother’s bloodline. (His mother is descended from the Akaviri, through Versidue-Shae, and his Imperial father met her in Hakoshae, while traveling) Herzog earned the nickname "the Genesis" from his father as a child, as he was his mother's first born child, and last, as she tragically died in child-birth.

    Herzog was seeking to purchase an artifact from Cinan Tharn, before their capture and was meeting Tyrus while in Rimmen, who introduced him to Cinan. This artifact being the Ayelid artifact; the sword Sinweaver. After their rescue and the exchange of gold to Cinan for the sword he decided to slip away before Ras Kalik could question who he was, and why the Akavir descendant really wanted that sword. Herzog was headed to Nagastani — An Ayleid ruin in eastern Cyrodiil. He had read in scrolls that the Sword would give him magical powers to meet his mothers spirit, if he performed an Ayleid ritual at an old shrine hidden there. Equipped with the artifact sword, he was off to start his own adventure but Ras Kalik, did indeed notice the sword however and instead sent a letter to Jux Blackheart (whom also was interested in Ayleid treasures), to attempt to find Herzog and acquire the sword. (*Azani Blackheart in Elder Scroll's Oblivion is Jux's descendant some 747 years later)

    And so the Redguard, Imperial and Akaviri men parted ways ... While Ras Kalik went off to Elsweyr to encounter the latest threat to Tamriel, with Abnur Tharn and Sai Sahan - - DRAGONS!! Little did Ras Kalik know a few people were awaiting him in Senchal besides Sai. A necromancer survived his attack on the Withered Hand, while in Alik'r. The necromancer known as Auriek Siet'ka is also following him to the land of the Khajiits and Cacique the Sage of Ius a Shaman mystic who has become attuned spiritually with Tu'whacca (a Redguard God) and Ius (the Animal God), after being burned severely by the escaped dragons in Elsywer, is awaiting his arrival also. Aurik is a soldier of the Daggerfall Covenant that was introduced to necromancy while in the military, even though this magicka art is not spoken of openly by most of the Military leaders. He came to Alik'r and worked with the Withered Hand before Ras Kalik intervened on their plans. After the defeat of the Withered Hand, he aligned with the Worm Cult, and is constantly adapting and perfecting his necromantic arts.

    After his journey to Rimmen, Kalik heads south to Senchal, in the southern regions of Elyswer. This new adventure will also put him on a path to meet a strange Redguard man. The stranger which was infected with an untreated Peyrite disease and also was the exiled from the Order of the New Moon cult, due to his sickness. He originally joined the cult to worship Laatvulon, the green dragon, mistakenly thinking it was the Daedric prince Peyrite. This confused and suffering cultist is known as Tsar al-Bomba and he is on a path to spread the disease. He was originally infected in Orccrest while recruiting members there. Can Ras Kalik and the shaman Cacique cure this poor soul, only time will tell. Little does Tsar al-Bomba know, that his infection is tied to Vampirism, and eventually the desire for blood will take over his mind. Senchal also offers Kalik his latest love interest... Aeliah. Whom he fondly led thru battles with the Dragonguard.

    After the trek thru the heat, tropical and desert climate of Northern and Southern Elyswer, Ras Kalik heads north to the cold mountain range of Skyrim. His companion friend Lyris beckons for him with a letter sent by crow...

    Movárth Piquine - a former vampire hunter (now infected), within the Fighter's Guild (and a secretive necromancer) was in Skyrim working with the Morthaal Guard. On a patrol mission he was caught in Frewien's ice curse outside of Morthaal with the frozen undead. Movárth's vampiric infection kept him from becoming an undead minion to the curse. He was able to use necromantic ice-magic to encase himself safely until he was freed with Freiwen, when the Vestige Ras Kalik broke the curse.

    Uri Ice-Heart - brother of Urfon Ice-Heart. The twin sons of Atli and Oljourn Ice-Heart. The Ice-Heart family are originally from Markarth but now reside on the Jerall Mountain range near Cyrodiil, with their younger sister Araki. The twins had joined the Winterborn Reachmen while living in Markarth. Urfon pushed west to Orsinium with the Winterborn Clan, leaving his family behind. Uri stayed behind with his parents and sister to live in the family cabin for safety, avoiding the Vampire plague infiltrating the Reach. After news reaches him and he hears of Urfon's death... Uri leaves and heads home and is seeking vengeance. Meanwhile, his sister has also moved on to Windhelm to join the Fighter's guild. He will visit his sister, once before going to seek vengeance and she will craft him armor mixed with ice, called Stalhrim armor. Uri fearing death, after his brother's passing, falls victim to the convincing talk of Movárth at a Nordic tavern, and will also becomes a vampire.

    {time moves forward through the hour-glass}
    PS5/NA - Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar - Daggerfall Covenant • 1550+ Champion
    Returning player - 2017-2022, back in 25'
  • BNOC
    BNOC
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    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.

    I believe they’re trying to work on the bug, but it’s certainly not intended. Animation canceling, for the last time, is not a bug nor an exploit. Zos even put a tip in-game that says activating a light attack before a skill (a form of animation canceling) will do more damage. Thus intended.

    That was added long after the debate surrounding it though, right? So they could easily add a load screen tip now that says "Bunny hopping will get you about quicker" or whatever.

    It's too hard to consistently replicate on console and honestly, most of the time you do it it happens by accident. Is it more consistent on PC, or can you macro it into jump?
    vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
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  • Thogard
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    Bunny hopping as an exploit? C’mon.

    Macroing is an exploit, and I’m sure that there are some bunny hoppers that macro since that is the only way to pull off the hop reliably without a ton of practice..

    But carrying your sprint momentum into a jump (which is what a bunny hop fundamentally is) isn’t an exploit lol
    PC NA - @dazkt - Dazk Ardoonkt / Sir Thogalot / Dask Dragoh’t / Dazk Dragoh’t / El Thogardo

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  • KerinKor
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    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.
    A typical defender of cheaters .. yes, sometimes there's a 'grey area' where something LOOKS odd but maybe it isn't .. that's NOT the case here, the effort/convolutions needed to pull this action off are CLEARLY not going to be intended by the developers.

    I look forward to the action ZOS will take on this issue.
    Edited by KerinKor on August 5, 2019 4:20PM
  • idk
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    Don’t be stupid. Don’t exploit things that’ll get you skins, gear, or an unfair advantage over others. I’m telling yall again after seeing a streamer (I will not name names) exploit the double jump/long jump bug on their stream like there’s no consequences to their actions. You can lose your account. Again, don’t be stupid.
    It -really- cannot be said often enough for some people.
    doyourwork.png

    Yes, but Stupid is as Stupid does.
  • CaffeinatedMayhem
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    BNOC wrote: »

    It's too hard to consistently replicate on console and honestly, most of the time you do it it happens by accident. Is it more consistent on PC, or can you macro it into jump?

    You can macro anything on PC, thus why macros are banned as well.

    And for the animation cancelling discussion - it *was* a bug and NOW it's not. I don't like it either but the "combat" team decided that making macros for combat more appealing was a good idea.

    BTW - yes, many people do make macros of their rotation, in PVE. They're not punished, but it's still against TOS.
  • Wolfpaw
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    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.

    I agree.

    Maybe if zos invested a little more in their product by hiring more competent people eso wouldn't be such a consistent mess. Instead we have months-to-years for performance/bug "fixes" that share content releases?...long overdue for new leadership with a dedication to quality over quantity.

    Reminds me of a consulting firm I worked at where the operations manager was also a project manager, & one of the principal engineers...for some reason he thought because he had his PE stamp he was qualified for the day-to-day operations and employees.
    Edited by Wolfpaw on August 5, 2019 4:38PM
  • zaria
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    worrallj wrote: »
    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.

    I believe they’re trying to work on the bug, but it’s certainly not intended. Animation canceling, for the last time, is not a bug nor an exploit. Zos even put a tip in-game that says activating a light attack before a skill (a form of animation canceling) will do more damage. Thus intended.

    True, and I know they've come out and said animation canceling isn't a bug, but it certainly didn't start that way and was absolutely not intended. For some time it was in a grey area, and then zeni decided it was a happy accident that made combat more interesting so they left it alone.

    Either way, my point is it's unfair to ban players for figuring out the most effective way to play the game. I never even heard of this bunny jumping thing before, but it seems rediculous that they'd ban someone for doing a sprint & jump with good timing.

    What if two armor bonuses interact with each other in an odd way that is very OP that seems maybe like an accident? Is it then a bannable offense to equip those two sets at the same time? I don't think it's fair to put this kind of stuff on players.
    Animation canceling exist because having an cast time on skills would be an major problem for heals and ranged interrupts.
    In PvP it would obviously be way worse as all skills would be telegraphed and would be interuptable.
    LA weaving was an decision they made. Probably the right one as laving only clipping medium attacks would be worse as in much harder to master.

    Not sure that benefit long jump give over sprint, does it save stamina, yes you can probably jump over obstacles but that is an stretch in combat.
    Grinding just make you go in circles.
    Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.
  • Delparis
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    That doesn't matter even if you're banned you've just to write an essay with 500 words on how you're a naughty boy to get the ban cleared.

    you can ask cheat engine users about this
  • worrallj
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    Sanguinor2 wrote: »
    worrallj wrote: »

    Either way, my point is it's unfair to ban players for figuring out the most effective way to play the game. I never even heard of this bunny jumping thing before, but it seems rediculous that they'd ban someone for doing a sprint & jump with good timing.

    What if two armor bonuses interact with each other in an odd way that is very OP that seems maybe like an accident? Is it then a bannable offense to equip those two sets at the same time? I don't think it's fair to put this kind of stuff on players.

    It´s really not unfair, for example when IC Mobs were bugged to give like 1mil xp each, some People figured the most effective way to farm cp would be to just exploit those very obviously not intended xp gains, if they knowingly do so they deserve any ban they get.
    If People figure the most effective way to get the asylum Skin is to just snipe exploit it, they deserve any ban they get.

    There are different dimensions of exploits true, but if you knowingly exploit anything for your own gain then any punishment you get for that is fair game.

    Well we just totally disagree then... Farming the mobs that give the most xp has been a staple behavior of every MMO that's ever been created. I would be outraged if I got banned for killing the mobs that gave the most xp just because some developer put a zero in the wrong spot and then suddenly it's my job to avoid that particular mob.
  • worrallj
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    KerinKor wrote: »
    worrallj wrote: »
    Fair enough PS announcement, but this part of the user agreement really ticks me off. I'm actually thinking about starting a petition to get it changed.

    It should not be players' responsibility to restrict their gameplay to compensate for mistakes on zenimax's side. We play the game they made to the best of our ability. We don't play the game we think they probably meant to make.

    If this jumping quirk is an exploit, wouldn't animation canceling be too? You can look at it as a bug, or you can look at it as a skill that you have to learn if you want to increase your performance. If zenimax thinks it shouldn't be in the game, they can remove it.
    A typical defender of cheaters .. yes, sometimes there's a 'grey area' where something LOOKS odd but maybe it isn't .. that's NOT the case here, the effort/convolutions needed to pull this action off are CLEARLY not going to be intended by the developers.

    I look forward to the action ZOS will take on this issue.

    I can't say I know what the effort/convolutions necessary are, but from what I've heard it's just a timing thing. It's not like you need some complex macro or something.

    I'm not a defender of cheaters- cheaters are people who HACK the game using software to alter the way the game plays, changing the rules. The game should be played according to its own rules, not the rules the user imposes on it. Hence why I'm opposed to this part of the users agreement.
  • Sanguinor2
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    worrallj wrote: »

    Well we just totally disagree then... Farming the mobs that give the most xp has been a staple behavior of every MMO that's ever been created. I would be outraged if I got banned for killing the mobs that gave the most xp just because some developer put a zero in the wrong spot and then suddenly it's my job to avoid that particular mob.

    We Arent Talking About regular Mobs with slighty higher xp gain here… they were bugged and gave over 100 times the experience they were supposed to give, how is farming them when knowing it is bugged not Exploitation of a bug? And why would punishment be unjustified if you exploit such a bug?
    If a dev accidentaly put one 0 too many on the akaviri dragonguard 5 piece for example making ults free to cast, would you not punish People that exploited that? Because thats basically cheating, just like the IC XP bug was basically an XP cheat.
    And yeah TOS makes it your Job to avoid exploiting Bugs you know, you dont have to agree with it but you cant be surprised if you get punished for knowingly Breaking them.
    Politeness is respecting others.
    Courage is doing what is fair.
    Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
    Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
    Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
    Honor is keeping ones word.
  • CaffeinatedMayhem
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    worrallj wrote: »

    Well we just totally disagree then... Farming the mobs that give the most xp has been a staple behavior of every MMO that's ever been created. I would be outraged if I got banned for killing the mobs that gave the most xp just because some developer put a zero in the wrong spot and then suddenly it's my job to avoid that particular mob.

    However, you (@worralij) agreed to the Terms of Service for THIS game thus it *IS* your job to report the bug, and not share the exploit with others, and not farm ONLY that mob to maximize your XP gain. If you kill them while farming the rest of IC, eh, whatever. But we're talking about those who DO NOT TELL ZOS so they can fix it, then *share* the exploit with others, and then specifically use this exploit for gain ( e.g.farm only this mob for fast XP gain) then cry when they get found out and banned.
    Edited by CaffeinatedMayhem on August 5, 2019 4:57PM
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