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The light attack meta
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Wuuffyy✭✭✭✭✭
✭Imagine complaining about LAing in ESO halfway thru 2019.Wuuffyy,
WW/berserker playstyle advocate (I play ALL classes proficiently in PvP outside of WW as well)
ESO player since 2014 (Xbox and PC for PTS)
-DM for questions5 -
Delparis✭✭✭✭✭Wolf_Watching wrote: »Imagine complaining about LAing in ESO halfway thru 2019.
Imagine complaining about ESO performance/bugs halfway thru 2019.
Zenimax don't fix old bugs, they harbor them3 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I mean, complaing about WW will be simply silly next patch as it will make you look like an idiot, so ppl complain about LA...
Classic...
Is it just me or it is like calling loot-boxes "surprise mechanics" and counting that no one will notice ?
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ThePedge✭✭✭✭✭It's 25% of you parse but you will using it 5x more than any skill.
It's still only 25% if you can successfully weave.
Stand there and only LA your DPS is garbage. Stand there and only use spammable it will be higher.
Combining more than one element of the game gives the best results? *** better lower the skill ceiling.2 -
Naftal✭✭✭✭✭I propose that people who don't like light attacking go back to MMOs with worse combat mechanics and don't propose to ruin this game.5
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Delparis✭✭✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack and no elemental weapons
@ZOS_BrianWheelerEdited by Delparis on August 5, 2019 11:39AM4 -
Naftal✭✭✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.6 -
Delparis✭✭✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.5 -
Naftal✭✭✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
Can you explain why it doesn't make any sense? If you can weave well you're rewarded by more damage.3 -
bol✭✭✭I personally like the weaving aspect. It makes a bigger difference between the best and the rest. But what I don't like is its implementation. Since I move around different countries I have parsed on exact same PC (my laptop) in different locations that have different latency. What I can tell you from testing is that going from avg 160ms to avg 70ms ping (what is shown in game) is around 7% boost of DPS on the trial dummy.
Basically the game favours heavily those living near the servers, which is not so good imho. And I would be glad if something was done to ease the issue. For example the whole weaving aspect could be handled by the client-side and as such not be impacted by the latency.3 -
Delparis✭✭✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
Can you explain why it doesn't make any sense? If you can weave well you're rewarded by more damage.
Because LA dps should be 5%-7% of the total dps,
That's the range in every other serious mmorpg as automatic attacks are only to fill the blank between fired skills and does around 5% of the total dps.4 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
Can you explain why it doesn't make any sense? If you can weave well you're rewarded by more damage.
Look at OPs past threads. That should give you clear idea.4 -
Naftal✭✭✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
Can you explain why it doesn't make any sense? If you can weave well you're rewarded by more damage.
Because LA dps should be 5%-7% of the total dps,
That's the range in every other serious mmorpg as automatic attacks are only to fill the blank between fired skills and does around 5% of the total dps.
But there are no automatic attacks in ESO. If you want to play the MMOs with bad automatic combat mechanics, go play those. Don't try to ruin ESO because you can't use manual attacks.9 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Quite bizarre that this thread even exists, people that can't comprehend simple button pressing should not talk balance or what should exists in a game and what's not.7 -
SidraWillowsky✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
vMA staff, yo- it buffs LAs like crazy.
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Wuuffyy✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wolf_Watching wrote: »Imagine complaining about LAing in ESO halfway thru 2019.
Imagine complaining about ESO performance/bugs halfway thru 2019.
Zenimax don't fix old bugs, they harbor them
Your right. They get paid to fix issues with their fame. Esp major ones. Not... working noproblematic mechanics of the game that are easy to learn...Wuuffyy,
WW/berserker playstyle advocate (I play ALL classes proficiently in PvP outside of WW as well)
ESO player since 2014 (Xbox and PC for PTS)
-DM for questions0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I am not arguing with OP that LAs are doing far to much damage compared to HAs.
LAs and HAs just need to be adjusted back to pre Morrowind update. iirc, that is where Zos reduced the damage of HA and increased the damage of LAs. Even then weaving basic attacks were a significant part of a DPS parse. However, it was this patch where Zos falsly claimed they were raising the floor and lowering the ceiling but in fact did the opposite and drove a wedge between the two. This is something we have discussed in passing in competitive raid groups when discussing the choices Zos made because we see it as bad for the game itself.
However, the overall changes OP is suggesting is far to much. Regardless, I doubt Zos will adjust LA/HA back to where they were or even drop the current design as it would be an obvious admission of how dumb their changes were a couple years ago.5 -
Delparis✭✭✭✭✭I am not arguing with OP that LAs are doing far to much damage compared to HAs.
LAs and HAs just need to be adjusted back to pre Morrowind update. iirc, that is where Zos reduced the damage of HA and increased the damage of LAs. Even then weaving basic attacks were a significant part of a DPS parse. However, it was this patch where Zos falsly claimed they were raising the floor and lowering the ceiling but in fact did the opposite and drove a wedge between the two. This is something we have discussed in passing in competitive raid groups when discussing the choices Zos made because we see it as bad for the game itself.
However, the overall changes OP is suggesting is far to much. Regardless, I doubt Zos will adjust LA/HA back to where they were or even drop the current design as it would be an obvious admission of how dumb their changes were a couple years ago.
Those choices were made by bad deciders and keeping them will only make the new deciders looks worst.
They have to clean the mess the others made before they left.1 -
Ogou✭✭✭✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
Can you explain why it doesn't make any sense? If you can weave well you're rewarded by more damage.
Because LA dps should be 5%-7% of the total dps,
That's the range in every other serious mmorpg as automatic attacks are only to fill the blank between fired skills and does around 5% of the total dps.
According to who? You say the current situation is bad but you never say why. What's the downside of having your light attacks being 20% of your damage instead of 5%?5 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I am not arguing with OP that LAs are doing far to much damage compared to HAs.
LAs and HAs just need to be adjusted back to pre Morrowind update. iirc, that is where Zos reduced the damage of HA and increased the damage of LAs. Even then weaving basic attacks were a significant part of a DPS parse. However, it was this patch where Zos falsly claimed they were raising the floor and lowering the ceiling but in fact did the opposite and drove a wedge between the two. This is something we have discussed in passing in competitive raid groups when discussing the choices Zos made because we see it as bad for the game itself.
However, the overall changes OP is suggesting is far to much. Regardless, I doubt Zos will adjust LA/HA back to where they were or even drop the current design as it would be an obvious admission of how dumb their changes were a couple years ago.
Those choices were made by bad deciders and keeping them will only make the new deciders looks worst.
They have to clean the mess the others made before they left.
There is only one person who makes the choices. In the end it is Matt Firor who determines the direction of the game. So not sure what you mean by new deciders (George W does not work there).2 -
p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
Can you explain why it doesn't make any sense? If you can weave well you're rewarded by more damage.
Because LA dps should be 5%-7% of the total dps,
That's the range in every other serious mmorpg as automatic attacks are only to fill the blank between fired skills and does around 5% of the total dps.
This. is. not. every. other. game.
Please stop insisting that this game conform to the mechanics of a bunch of dead or dying games. Things are different here and I personally think it's kinda cool that we have such a dynamic means of creating damage. It also ensures a nice high skill floor in end game that rewards those who are willing to spend the time to actually learn to use the game's damage mechanics properly.PC/Xbox NA
Unchained | Unstoppable | Mindmender | Swashbuckler Supreme | Planes Breaker | Dawnbringer | Godslayer | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Tick-tock Tormentor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Stormproof | Grand Overlord | Grand Mastercrafter | Master Grappler | Tamriel Hero9 -
Veinblood1965✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Maybe we should just have one button to press for all attacks....... I'm lazy.2 -
Conduit0✭✭✭✭✭
✭worst design ever.
between this and the traders im not sure how much more anti player you can get.
people literally flee this game to ffix because of these two grotesque abominations.
lol
The traders aside, how is light attack weaving "anti-player"? A system that rewards skilled gameplay is usually considered pro-gamer.
I hope you see that in that video Alcast is using the Maelstrom Inferno Staff which buffs light and heavy attack damage, I hope you also see that he is using multiple Mage's Guild skills per rotation which give Empower with each cast, increasing the damage of the next light attack by 40%. Without those two things his light attack DPS wouldn't be nearly that high.Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack and no elemental weapons
Those other "serious" MMOs also use ability cooldowns and tab target combat. Should ZOS implement those as well?Because LA dps should be 5%-7% of the total dps,
That's the range in every other serious mmorpg as automatic attacks are only to fill the blank between fired skills and does around 5% of the total dps.3 -
Heatnix90✭✭✭✭✭
✭ITT OP is a dum-dum who can't weave properly so he wants everyone to be as bad as him. Next he's going to suggest that jumping should have a stamina cost.
Thanks for sharing this video
I hope you see those 21% light attack
I hope you understand that it is fine. What you're proposing is only for people who can't light attack properly so they don't fall behind in dps.
Nop this isn't fine at all, +20% dps from LA is nuts and make no sense.
Can you explain why it doesn't make any sense? If you can weave well you're rewarded by more damage.
Because LA dps should be 5%-7% of the total dps,
That's the range in every other serious mmorpg as automatic attacks are only to fill the blank between fired skills and does around 5% of the total dps.
Except this isn't your typical mmo. Hell, even Firor himself said in an interview that he doesn't like to call it an MMO. ESO's combat system is probably one of the better ones out there and that's because of mechanics like weaving, bash-canceling.
Like others have said, if you want typical mmo combat, go back to WoW with cooldowns and let everyone else enjoy ESO's fast paced combat system.6 -
usmcjdking✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Light attack weaving being such a substantial portion of DPS is honestly one of the worst things the game has seen. It has little to do with "muh skill". It doesn't take any amount of skill to button mash LMB or bind it to your high speed naga mouse with 18 buttons.
LA/HA meta sucks because it strips away the strength behind skills. Anyone who is waving "muh skill cap" flag and advocating for a LA meta over the Medium weave meta may actually have the computational brain power of your standard garden variety vegetable.
Weaving needs to go back to pre-1T where medium weaves were king and light weaves were for people who were bad.0331
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Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭usmcjdking wrote: »Light attack weaving being such a substantial portion of DPS is honestly one of the worst things the game has seen. It has little to do with "muh skill". It doesn't take any amount of skill to button mash LMB or bind it to your high speed naga mouse with 18 buttons.
LA/HA meta sucks because it strips away the strength behind skills. Anyone who is waving "muh skill cap" flag and advocating for a LA meta over the Medium weave meta may actually have the computational brain power of your standard garden variety vegetable.
Weaving needs to go back to pre-1T where medium weaves were king and light weaves were for people who were bad.
Pretty much this. Medium weave was fluid and fun Light weave is just hystericalSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique4 -
Hotdog_23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Strange as this maybe for some of you my only issue with the light attack meta is the as an older console player is the muscle and ligaments used in the trigger finger. Bear with me a second to explain. With a controller on console and no way to change button configuration outside of in the main system for all setting on the ps4 you are forced to use the trigger button. By using the trigger button you are using the smaller muscles and ligament in finger and hand. But with a mouse you are also using some larger muscles in the wrist and forearm. I have not found any ps4 ergonomic controllers before.
I see videos of people getting 150 to 200 light attacks on the new target dummy and I think no way I can physically do that and play for any extended period of time without a good deal of pain. So I shoot for 25% light attacks between skills. With the higher damage on light attacks is actually a good thing for ESO overall because some people only use light attacks most of the time and this make pve content doable for them.
My 2 cents.
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vesselwiththepestle✭✭✭✭✭
✭Many players are just button smashing their light attacks, others are using their mouse wheel for light attacks. I can't play like that, I need to keep a rhythm. That's the reason I don't like channeling attacks like Flurry, they break my rhythm. So I just don't use them and when vma dagger rotation becomes meta I probably won't play meta and do 1k less. Oh no, not true, I wouldn't reach 100k+ anyway and I'll actually do more dps in my own rotation than on a meta rotation which I can't do perfectly. So deal with it.
ZOS should introduce a setting for console players to switch buttons on the gamepad as they wish.
However, there's no reason to nerf light attack damage.
Other games have automatic attacks. ESO doesn't have automatic attacks. You always have a choice to block, light attack, medium attack or heavy attack. I prefer to do heavy attacks when the enemy is off-balance, for example.Edited by vesselwiththepestle on August 6, 2019 5:43AM1000+ CP
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