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34 Flame Crates, Zero Mounts
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Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lordrichter wrote: »It's a matter of consumer protections needing to step up to regulate the unethical spiral that AAA gaming companies have sucked themselves into over the past decade or so, ESO included. The gaming industry is VERY well aware that they are using microstransaction models - including but not limited to gamble boxes - that prey on human psychology. It's unethical, and it won't stop until regulation steps in.
I don't like loot boxes, and that includes Crown Crates, but where stuff like this is concerned, adults need to be treated like adults. Adults need to be able to make informed decisions, not be told by the government what they can and cannot do.
Absolutely. If I want to take my neighbors car for ride down the sidewalk no government should be telling me what I can and cannot do.
Yes, because stealing a car and driving on the sidewalk is just more of the "stuff like" loot boxes. What was I thinking.
As much as I don't like them, my objection isn't against players BUYING them, it is that ZOS put them into the game in the first place. Crown Crates do no harm to the overwhelming majority of players, and contrary to what appears to be general evidence, most adults are not stupid. If they know the facts, they can make decisions about whether to buy them. They are not mindless slaves to loot boxes.XBox EU/NA:@ElsonsoJannus
PC NA/EU: @Elsonso
PSN NA/EU: @ElsonsoJannus
Total in-game hours: 11321
X/Twitter: ElsonsoJannus6 -
Wolfpaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Nordic__Knights wrote: »Nordic__Knights wrote: »YaYaPineapple wrote: »chuck-18_ESO wrote: »
Actually it was only 404. barely enough to get a mount. I've been unlucky before, but never this unlucky.
So... you weren't just trying to get "A" mount, you were trying to get an APEX mount? APEX mounts (400 gem cost) only have around a 0.28% chance to drop from a crate. Not sure why you expected to get something that has less than a 1% drop rate from only 34 crates.
If you've gotten APEX mounts from only 34 crates in the past, then you have been very lucky. Sounds like RNGesus actually loves you a lot, he just didn't love you quite as much this time.
You DID get enough gems (404) to get ALL FOUR of the non-Apex mounts from the Fire Atronach crates. You could get the Senche Leopard, the Masked Bear, the Ice Wolf AND the Black Camel of Ill Omen... and still have 4 gems left over.
My five-year-old got the flame wolf mount buying 4 with his eso+ sub crowns hes just starting out and it made him so happy hes now cp 35 and loves the game
Bait was too strong lol.
No cuz you know unless it's Subs crowns he'll never spend another dollar on it and the fact that he pays for a sub to play with his dad in The dlc Dungeons I'm okay with that 14.99 for a whole month of fun is way better then 140.00+ to take family out for 1 day of fun
And the only bait that was used was a kid wanting to play with his dad maybe you should have kids then you'd understand
Wow you were being serious..I thought your post was bait.0 -
Nordic__Knights✭✭✭✭✭
✭
stated my five-year-old plays the game with his dad uses his Subs to buyNordic__Knights wrote: »Nordic__Knights wrote: »YaYaPineapple wrote: »chuck-18_ESO wrote: »
Actually it was only 404. barely enough to get a mount. I've been unlucky before, but never this unlucky.
So... you weren't just trying to get "A" mount, you were trying to get an APEX mount? APEX mounts (400 gem cost) only have around a 0.28% chance to drop from a crate. Not sure why you expected to get something that has less than a 1% drop rate from only 34 crates.
If you've gotten APEX mounts from only 34 crates in the past, then you have been very lucky. Sounds like RNGesus actually loves you a lot, he just didn't love you quite as much this time.
You DID get enough gems (404) to get ALL FOUR of the non-Apex mounts from the Fire Atronach crates. You could get the Senche Leopard, the Masked Bear, the Ice Wolf AND the Black Camel of Ill Omen... and still have 4 gems left over.
My five-year-old got the flame wolf mount buying 4 with his eso+ sub crowns hes just starting out and it made him so happy hes now cp 35 and loves the game
Bait was too strong lol.
No cuz you know unless it's Subs crowns he'll never spend another dollar on it and the fact that he pays for a sub to play with his dad in The dlc Dungeons I'm okay with that 14.99 for a whole month of fun is way better then 140.00+ to take family out for 1 day of fun
And the only bait that was used was a kid wanting to play with his dad maybe you should have kids then you'd understand
Wow you were being serious..I thought your post was bait.Nordic__Knights wrote: »Nordic__Knights wrote: »YaYaPineapple wrote: »chuck-18_ESO wrote: »
Actually it was only 404. barely enough to get a mount. I've been unlucky before, but never this unlucky.
So... you weren't just trying to get "A" mount, you were trying to get an APEX mount? APEX mounts (400 gem cost) only have around a 0.28% chance to drop from a crate. Not sure why you expected to get something that has less than a 1% drop rate from only 34 crates.
If you've gotten APEX mounts from only 34 crates in the past, then you have been very lucky. Sounds like RNGesus actually loves you a lot, he just didn't love you quite as much this time.
You DID get enough gems (404) to get ALL FOUR of the non-Apex mounts from the Fire Atronach crates. You could get the Senche Leopard, the Masked Bear, the Ice Wolf AND the Black Camel of Ill Omen... and still have 4 gems left over.
My five-year-old got the flame wolf mount buying 4 with his eso+ sub crowns hes just starting out and it made him so happy hes now cp 35 and loves the game
Bait was too strong lol.
No cuz you know unless it's Subs crowns he'll never spend another dollar on it and the fact that he pays for a sub to play with his dad in The dlc Dungeons I'm okay with that 14.99 for a whole month of fun is way better then 140.00+ to take family out for 1 day of fun
And the only bait that was used was a kid wanting to play with his dad maybe you should have kids then you'd understand
Wow you were being serious..I thought your post was bait.
Nope I'm a five-year veteran of the game my son who is now five he's always wanted to play the game with his dad we have extra systems so we bought him the game I mean it's 12 bucks myself having all the DLCs and him not we sub for him he uses sub crowns to buy crates only four and got himself a wolf mount1 -
Avariprivateer✭✭✭stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »Avariprivateer wrote: »
Is it worth real money to watch an animated cat flip cards for five minutes? Is that legitimately classifiable as a form of entertainment? What if we had blind vending machines, pop 20 in, maybe you get merlot from Bordeaux maybe you get Pabst Blue Ribbon or a PS4 versus a stick of gum.stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »Holycannoli wrote: »stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »Sorry you feel that way, but it's OP's $$ just like it is my $$. I am an adult. I can spend my $$ however I may choose. What a person thinks is a "waste of money" is different person to person.
But if you didn't get what you want you did waste your money.
Loot boxes need to go. Add every item as directly purchasable at any time.
Not necessarily true. The OP (or anyone) may not have gotten what they were hoping for, but they may have gotten other items they liked, and thus, would not necessarily be a "waste of money". It's in the eye of the beholder. There are also those that don't necessarily want a specific item but do enjoy the random aspect of the loot drop. Individual choice.
To some it is worth real money. To others it is not. A person cannot decide what is "legitimately classifiable as a form of entertainment" for someone else. You may have an opinion on the matter, but that is all it is. Entertainment value is different for everyone.
It sounds like a good way to build an economy on a foundation of peat mud. Poor spending habits are not sustainable and lead eventually to a cascading , erratic monetary environment.0 -
Ackwalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Dagoth_Rac wrote: »The odds of getting a mount are about 2%. Which means the odds you do not get a mount are 98%. Chain that together 34 times:
0.98 ^ 34 = 0.5031 = 50.31%
Thus, the odds of not getting a mount after 34 crates is actually slighter higher than the odds of getting a mount.
The odds are not cumulative. Each box as no affect on the box before or after it.
he didn't make them "cumulative". He did the calculation as if they were all independent events.
I love when people who don't know math try and "catch" somebody doing math wrong.
Good job proving your own statement.
I notice you still haven't done any math, you've just said it's wrong. No proof, no counter, nothing.
You realize you're wrong, and you're just trying to cover your pride at this point.
So you proved me wrong just by saying I'm wrong. Holy crap, did you even read your own post.0 -
Shantu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭People are overreacting and need to get a grip. It's not like the OP sold their house to support their crate habit. I blow more money just taking the family out to dinner. A little gambling is entertainment to some and they have a right to throw a little pocket change at it. Sometimes you don't win. Big deal. This entire game is rife with RGN, so if you're spending money at all to play and grind for stuff, you are gambling to some degree. Doesn't mean ZOS is exploiting a mental health issue.
Personally, I'm not a gambler and have never spent a dime on a crown crate. But I do maintain a subscription and buy crowns to support the game. I don't enjoy RGN, but keep it in perspective. Now I think whoever designed the poison flower round in vMA was downright evil. ZOS and crown crates? Not so much.
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kmcaj✭✭✭✭✭lordrichter wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »It's a matter of consumer protections needing to step up to regulate the unethical spiral that AAA gaming companies have sucked themselves into over the past decade or so, ESO included. The gaming industry is VERY well aware that they are using microstransaction models - including but not limited to gamble boxes - that prey on human psychology. It's unethical, and it won't stop until regulation steps in.
I don't like loot boxes, and that includes Crown Crates, but where stuff like this is concerned, adults need to be treated like adults. Adults need to be able to make informed decisions, not be told by the government what they can and cannot do.
Absolutely. If I want to take my neighbors car for ride down the sidewalk no government should be telling me what I can and cannot do.
Yes, because stealing a car and driving on the sidewalk is just more of the "stuff like" loot boxes. What was I thinking.
As much as I don't like them, my objection isn't against players BUYING them, it is that ZOS put them into the game in the first place. Crown Crates do no harm to the overwhelming majority of players, and contrary to what appears to be general evidence, most adults are not stupid. If they know the facts, they can make decisions about whether to buy them. They are not mindless slaves to loot boxes.
Bro I'm on your side. Laws and regulations are ridiculous for adults.0 -
tmbrinks✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Dagoth_Rac wrote: »The odds of getting a mount are about 2%. Which means the odds you do not get a mount are 98%. Chain that together 34 times:
0.98 ^ 34 = 0.5031 = 50.31%
Thus, the odds of not getting a mount after 34 crates is actually slighter higher than the odds of getting a mount.
The odds are not cumulative. Each box as no affect on the box before or after it.
he didn't make them "cumulative". He did the calculation as if they were all independent events.
I love when people who don't know math try and "catch" somebody doing math wrong.
Good job proving your own statement.
I notice you still haven't done any math, you've just said it's wrong. No proof, no counter, nothing.
You realize you're wrong, and you're just trying to cover your pride at this point.
So you proved me wrong just by saying I'm wrong. Holy crap, did you even read your own post.
No, I stated the original post was correct. He did the math correctly. You've said nothing. Do I need to do the same math again?
2% chance of getting a mount (I don't know if this is correct or not, but for this sake it's doesn't matter)
98% of not getting a mount in any one "set" of cards
0.98 ^ 34 = 0.5031 (50.31%) probability of getting "not mount" in 34 straight tries when the events are independent of one another.
Please, please for the love of god, prove that this is not the correct calculation. I'd love to see you prove this math teacher wrong.
The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra DestroyerThe Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger70,730 achievement points1 -
Dojohoda✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭That's some rotten luck.
Fan of playing magblade since 2015. (PC NA)
Might be joking in comments.
-->(((Cyrodiil)))<--0 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
2% chance of getting a mount (I don't know if this is correct or not, but for this sake it's doesn't matter)
98% of not getting a mount in any one "set" of cards
0.98 ^ 34 = 0.5031 (50.31%) probability of getting "not mount" in 34 straight tries when the events are independent of one another.
Please, please for the love of god, prove that this is not the correct calculation. I'd love to see you prove this math teacher wrong.
The Apex reward is 2%, but that includes a skin and a sweetroll. I think it is 1.7% for Apex mounts. That comes out to about 41 Crown Crates (rounding up) before things get to a 50% probability.XBox EU/NA:@ElsonsoJannus
PC NA/EU: @Elsonso
PSN NA/EU: @ElsonsoJannus
Total in-game hours: 11321
X/Twitter: ElsonsoJannus1 -
tmbrinks✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lordrichter wrote: »
2% chance of getting a mount (I don't know if this is correct or not, but for this sake it's doesn't matter)
98% of not getting a mount in any one "set" of cards
0.98 ^ 34 = 0.5031 (50.31%) probability of getting "not mount" in 34 straight tries when the events are independent of one another.
Please, please for the love of god, prove that this is not the correct calculation. I'd love to see you prove this math teacher wrong.
The Apex reward is 2%, but that includes a skin and a sweetroll. I think it is 1.7% for Apex mounts. That comes out to about 41 Crown Crates (rounding up) before things get to a 50% probability.
I was just going on what the OP (in that comment thread) said for percentage... He said the methodology was wrong, yet refuses to either explain, or show evidence of it.
Pretty sure he's just trolling at this point.Edited by tmbrinks on August 4, 2019 6:33PMThe Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra DestroyerThe Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger70,730 achievement points0 -
Iluvrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭lordrichter wrote: »As much as I don't like them, my objection isn't against players BUYING them, it is that ZOS put them into the game in the first place.
Under what circumstances do you believe that developers will choose to stop putting loot boxes into games?
Or, put another way, do you see a realistic inducement apart from legislation that would cause them to do so?2 -
stewhead2ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Avariprivateer wrote: »stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »Avariprivateer wrote: »
Is it worth real money to watch an animated cat flip cards for five minutes? Is that legitimately classifiable as a form of entertainment? What if we had blind vending machines, pop 20 in, maybe you get merlot from Bordeaux maybe you get Pabst Blue Ribbon or a PS4 versus a stick of gum.stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »Holycannoli wrote: »stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »Sorry you feel that way, but it's OP's $$ just like it is my $$. I am an adult. I can spend my $$ however I may choose. What a person thinks is a "waste of money" is different person to person.
But if you didn't get what you want you did waste your money.
Loot boxes need to go. Add every item as directly purchasable at any time.
Not necessarily true. The OP (or anyone) may not have gotten what they were hoping for, but they may have gotten other items they liked, and thus, would not necessarily be a "waste of money". It's in the eye of the beholder. There are also those that don't necessarily want a specific item but do enjoy the random aspect of the loot drop. Individual choice.
To some it is worth real money. To others it is not. A person cannot decide what is "legitimately classifiable as a form of entertainment" for someone else. You may have an opinion on the matter, but that is all it is. Entertainment value is different for everyone.
It sounds like a good way to build an economy on a foundation of peat mud. Poor spending habits are not sustainable and lead eventually to a cascading , erratic monetary environment.
We're not talking about building an economy here. It is also not your place to define what is another's "poor spending habits". Some people are fortunate to have what they deem "disposable income". It is an individual's prerogative to decide what to spend their own money on.3 -
Darkenarlol✭✭✭✭✭
✭lol you've got 400 + gems from just 34 crates
which is almost twice than usual and still complaining?
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Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lordrichter wrote: »As much as I don't like them, my objection isn't against players BUYING them, it is that ZOS put them into the game in the first place.
Under what circumstances do you believe that developers will choose to stop putting loot boxes into games?
Or, put another way, do you see a realistic inducement apart from legislation that would cause them to do so?
There is going to be no legislation that removes every Crown Crate from ESO. The only way that they will ever be removed from the game is if ZOS does it. So, yeah, I am resigned to the fact that they will be in the game "forever". I will still suggest to anyone who seem to be frustrated with them to stop buying them, though.XBox EU/NA:@ElsonsoJannus
PC NA/EU: @Elsonso
PSN NA/EU: @ElsonsoJannus
Total in-game hours: 11321
X/Twitter: ElsonsoJannus0 -
YaYaPineapple✭✭✭✭Sure. But can also let them know their spending decisions are stupid.
You realize that is just a matter of opinion, right?
Some people can spend money on crates the way you would buy a dozen eggs. That doesn't mean "their spending decisions are stupid". It could mean they have more disposable income than you do, or that they simply make different decisions with their entertainment dollars than you do.
You don't have to like what other people do with their money. Its none of your business.
Edited by YaYaPineapple on August 4, 2019 7:25PM4 -
CAB_LifeClass RepresentativeTommy_The_Gun wrote: »With every game today, that has microstratification in them, there should be an enforced law (just like in some countries there are laws that forces cigarettes / smokes manufactures to place a big label on their products, that it is harmful for your health), to place this unskip-able "intro" when you boot the game 1st time:
That video is both enlightening and appalling. Jim Sterling did a piece that works with clips of that presentation and it’s even more illuminating.
More on topic, it would be nice to at least have the odds posted as with most recent gacha games and gamble boxes. I think that’s what makes crown crates worse—even if they don’t contain gamebreaking contents.Fitness/ Gaming/ Fantasy: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2qoTV-kge_bU90i2lgkyvA3 -
kmcaj✭✭✭✭✭YaYaPineapple wrote: »Sure. But can also let them know their spending decisions are stupid.
You realize that is just a matter of opinion, right?
Some people can spend money on crates the way you would buy a dozen eggs. That doesn't mean "their spending decisions are stupid". It could mean they have more disposable income than you do, or that they simply make different decisions with their entertainment dollars than you do.
You don't have to like what other people do with their money. Its none of your business.
It's a waste of money and if you're posting on forums it's anyone's business.4 -
YaYaPineapple✭✭✭✭More on topic, it would be nice to at least have the odds posted as with most recent gacha games and gamble boxes..
I can agree with this. If odds are posted next to the item in the store (via link or hover-over pop-up perhaps), then adults can make their own personal, informed decisions.
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Nordic__Knights✭✭✭✭✭
✭YaYaPineapple wrote: »More on topic, it would be nice to at least have the odds posted as with most recent gacha games and gamble boxes..
I can agree with this. If odds are posted next to the item in the store (via link or hover-over pop-up perhaps), then adults can make their own personal, informed decisions.
I would think that every adult is already informed that the fact it is a very rare rate drop and if they're not then I guess you got to check their IQ0 -
Hippie4927✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭YaYaPineapple wrote: »Sure. But can also let them know their spending decisions are stupid.
You realize that is just a matter of opinion, right?
Some people can spend money on crates the way you would buy a dozen eggs. That doesn't mean "their spending decisions are stupid". It could mean they have more disposable income than you do, or that they simply make different decisions with their entertainment dollars than you do.
You don't have to like what other people do with their money. Its none of your business.
It's a waste of money and if you're posting on forums it's anyone's business.
When you start earning MY money, then and only then, can you decide what is a waste of MY money! If you gave an accounting of everything that you spend money on, I could probably find several things that I consider a waste of money. But I don't concern myself with what others do with their money.PC/NA/EP ✌️4 -
YaYaPineapple✭✭✭✭Nordic__Knights wrote: »I would think that every adult is already informed that the fact it is a very rare rate drop and if they're not then I guess you got to check their IQ
True, but before the crowncrates.com site started tracking drops, I think some didn't realize just how low that "rare" drop rate actually was.
If rates were posted, maybe all this "OMG gambling evil!!! / Evil gaming company tricks!!! / Ban crates!!" screams would stop. One can dream...
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ZOS_JesCadminGreetings, we've closed this thread as it is no longer on topic and the conversation has derailed.The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNjI03CGkb4This discussion has been closed.