Which is best For Destro PvP

Only_Zeus
Only_Zeus
Soul Shriven
I simply want to see other peoples input for Destro flame staff PvP
The most common 3 are this

Nirn Bezerker
Infused bezerker
Infused Shock

Would just like people's point of view.

Which is best For Destro PvP 18 votes

Nirn Bezerker Enchant
27%
rudvilRedKialandiRaammzzaaOnly_ZeusNo_Division 5 votes
Infused Bezerker Enchant
5%
IneedaDollar 1 vote
Infused Shock enchant
44%
InvictusApollosusmitdsgp1680LittlebluelizardJierdanit_Ahala_NoBullInsco851 8 votes
Other ?
22%
RinaldoGandolphifrostz417Iskiabdarkblue5 4 votes
  • Only_Zeus
    Only_Zeus
    Soul Shriven
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    I personally Swap between all 3 depending on situtatuons but I find myself mainly using Nirn Bezerker for burst timed damage Where shock can add on to burst I see that But I haven't tested shock as much as Bezerker
  • _Ahala_
    _Ahala_
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    I like going infused berserker on my back bar weapon (resto or another destro) and then weave in a light attack on the back bar before going on the offensive. Only time I would go berserker on the front bar would be if I were running a melee backbar like s&b or 2h for some reason
  • darkblue5
    darkblue5
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Other ?
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09
  • Insco851
    Insco851
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.





  • MrBrownstone
    MrBrownstone
    ✭✭✭✭
    Shock vs Berserker why not both? Just keep shock on front, use berserker on backbar and light attack once before you switch to frontbar.
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.





    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    Shock vs Berserker why not both? Just keep shock on front, use berserker on backbar and light attack once before you switch to frontbar.

    can be clunky to use.
  • RinaldoGandolphi
    RinaldoGandolphi
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭
    Other ?
    I think it depends on your character class

    For a DK for example i'd say a Fire Glyph front bar and a Poison Glyph back bar.

    Why?

    Because every time you inflict the burning status effect you get magicka back, and every time you inflict the poison status effect you get stamina back. Furthermore the same passive, Combustion, also increases the damage of the poisoned and burning status effects by 50%

    What enchants or poisons you use in pvpI think depends on what class you are and what your play style is more than whats meta/popular. Lots of things work in pvp nowadays. You would be surprised.
    Edited by RinaldoGandolphi on August 1, 2019 4:44PM
    Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
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    "Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak

  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    I think it depends on your character class

    For a DK for example i'd say a Fire Glyph front bar and a Poison Glyph back bar.

    Why?

    Because every time you inflict the burning status effect you get magicka back, and every time you inflict the poison status effect you get stamina back. Furthermore the same passive, Combustion, also increases the damage of the poisoned and burning status effects by 50%

    What enchants or poisons you use in pvpI think depends on what class you are and what your play style is more than whats meta/popular. Lots of things work in pvp nowadays. You would be surprised.

    Good point!
  • Insco851
    Insco851
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.

    reduce clunky backbar mechanics. 100% uptime off infused but requires you to constantly bar swap every 3 seconds means you arent killing anything on your front bar if you are constantly bar swapping. Because you have to light attack, then bar swap, you lost 1-2s on the efficiency. And you lose 2k+ resists for backbar defense trait when you are about to be burst.
  • Insco851
    Insco851
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.

    reduce clunky backbar mechanics. 100% uptime off infused but requires you to constantly bar swap every 3 seconds means you arent killing anything on your front bar if you are constantly bar swapping. Because you have to light attack, then bar swap, you lost 1-2s on the efficiency. And you lose 2k+ resists for backbar defense trait when you are about to be burst.

    Yea I’m speaking Front bar only on this example. That’s why I asked about what enchant you were running. Berserk from what I’ve gathered on a nirn staff front bar. Correct?

    So if that’s correct:
    Nirn +200
    Berserk +348
    548sd total not including modifiers.
    At 50% uptime.

    Compared to:
    Infused + berserk
    452sd total. Also not including modifiers.
    100% uptime- all front bar.

    Yes nirn+berserk gets +100~ sd but only half the uptime.

    For the record I prefer infused shock so this is honestly just trying to understand the theory behind your setup.
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.

    reduce clunky backbar mechanics. 100% uptime off infused but requires you to constantly bar swap every 3 seconds means you arent killing anything on your front bar if you are constantly bar swapping. Because you have to light attack, then bar swap, you lost 1-2s on the efficiency. And you lose 2k+ resists for backbar defense trait when you are about to be burst.

    Yea I’m speaking Front bar only on this example. That’s why I asked about what enchant you were running. Berserk from what I’ve gathered on a nirn staff front bar. Correct?

    So if that’s correct:
    Nirn +200
    Berserk +348
    548sd total not including modifiers.
    At 50% uptime.

    Compared to:
    Infused + berserk
    452sd total. Also not including modifiers.
    100% uptime- all front bar.

    Yes nirn+berserk gets +100~ sd but only half the uptime.

    For the record I prefer infused shock so this is honestly just trying to understand the theory behind your setup.

    infused+shock only impacts 1 target, nirn+beserk impacts all your dmg. For a class with heavy emphasis on AOE cleave (templar) debuffing one out of 5 targets is less efficient because most of the time the target you want to focus isnt the one that just received the shock enchant. Trying to bar swap to infused beserk backbar in the same scenario isnt as easy to do when being dogpiled by multiple targets and it increases clunky templar backbar defense mechanics because you are stuck trying to fire off the beserker enchant at the right moment.

    This way nirn/defending is the best approach.
  • Insco851
    Insco851
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.

    reduce clunky backbar mechanics. 100% uptime off infused but requires you to constantly bar swap every 3 seconds means you arent killing anything on your front bar if you are constantly bar swapping. Because you have to light attack, then bar swap, you lost 1-2s on the efficiency. And you lose 2k+ resists for backbar defense trait when you are about to be burst.

    Yea I’m speaking Front bar only on this example. That’s why I asked about what enchant you were running. Berserk from what I’ve gathered on a nirn staff front bar. Correct?

    So if that’s correct:
    Nirn +200
    Berserk +348
    548sd total not including modifiers.
    At 50% uptime.

    Compared to:
    Infused + berserk
    452sd total. Also not including modifiers.
    100% uptime- all front bar.

    Yes nirn+berserk gets +100~ sd but only half the uptime.

    For the record I prefer infused shock so this is honestly just trying to understand the theory behind your setup.

    infused+shock only impacts 1 target, nirn+beserk impacts all your dmg. For a class with heavy emphasis on AOE cleave (templar) debuffing one out of 5 targets is less efficient because most of the time the target you want to focus isnt the one that just received the shock enchant. Trying to bar swap to infused beserk backbar in the same scenario isnt as easy to do when being dogpiled by multiple targets and it increases clunky templar backbar defense mechanics because you are stuck trying to fire off the beserker enchant at the right moment.

    This way nirn/defending is the best approach.

    Also agreed for Templar approach. Completely understand that concept with shock not being the top choice for an AOE build.

    And infused+shock preference comes from MNb which is obviously a single target build.

    Back to my other question tho, with Templar in mind.

    Fb:Nirn+Berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    This setup will give the 548+modifiers @50% uptime.

    My main question is why you wouldn’t prefer:

    Fb:Infused+berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    For 452+ modifiers @100% uptime?

    Is the +100~ sd at 50% uptime worth that much to you?
    Edited by Insco851 on August 1, 2019 6:53PM
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.

    reduce clunky backbar mechanics. 100% uptime off infused but requires you to constantly bar swap every 3 seconds means you arent killing anything on your front bar if you are constantly bar swapping. Because you have to light attack, then bar swap, you lost 1-2s on the efficiency. And you lose 2k+ resists for backbar defense trait when you are about to be burst.

    Yea I’m speaking Front bar only on this example. That’s why I asked about what enchant you were running. Berserk from what I’ve gathered on a nirn staff front bar. Correct?

    So if that’s correct:
    Nirn +200
    Berserk +348
    548sd total not including modifiers.
    At 50% uptime.

    Compared to:
    Infused + berserk
    452sd total. Also not including modifiers.
    100% uptime- all front bar.

    Yes nirn+berserk gets +100~ sd but only half the uptime.

    For the record I prefer infused shock so this is honestly just trying to understand the theory behind your setup.

    infused+shock only impacts 1 target, nirn+beserk impacts all your dmg. For a class with heavy emphasis on AOE cleave (templar) debuffing one out of 5 targets is less efficient because most of the time the target you want to focus isnt the one that just received the shock enchant. Trying to bar swap to infused beserk backbar in the same scenario isnt as easy to do when being dogpiled by multiple targets and it increases clunky templar backbar defense mechanics because you are stuck trying to fire off the beserker enchant at the right moment.

    This way nirn/defending is the best approach.

    Also agreed for Templar approach. Completely understand that concept with shock not being the top choice for an AOE build.

    And infused+shock preference comes from MNb which is obviously a single target build.

    Back to my other question tho, with Templar in mind.

    Fb:Nirn+Berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    This setup will give the 548+modifiers @50% uptime.

    My main question is why you wouldn’t prefer:

    Fb:Infused+berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    For 452+ modifiers @100% uptime?

    Is the +100~ sd at 50% uptime worth that much to you?

    good question. Infused_beserk is about 7591 ESP with a 4200 jabs tooltip. Nirn+Beserk is 4300 jabs tooltip with 7744 ESP value. BUT then beserk is not on its 7196 ESP but 4k jabs tooltip.

    If infused isnt procing with beserk, jabs is 3998 dmg with an ESP of 6880. There are times you dont get enchants off (failed light attack during lag, and missing light attack during mistakes in rotation and more importantly, someone dodging your light attack.)

    Therefore I would rather have 4k jabs 50% of the time at 7196 ESP against a 26k resist/3300 CR target than 7591 during the best weaving/situations that has a potential for dropping down to 6880 when I am CC'd or targets are dodging.
  • Littlebluelizard
    Littlebluelizard
    ✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    You could even use Infused + Disease for major defile procs. I personally prefer Infused + Shock front bar and berserker enchant on backbar, which is either infused or defending depending on what I drop first (or build).

    EDIT: Also kinda depends on what is the purpose of the build. If you plan on doing a lot of AoE damage Nirn is BiS. I usually run solo so I prefer infused.
    Edited by Littlebluelizard on August 1, 2019 8:20PM
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    You could even use Infused + Disease for major defile procs. I personally prefer Infused + Shock front bar and berserker enchant on backbar, which is either infused or defending depending on what I drop first (or build).

    EDIT: Also kinda depends on what is the purpose of the build. If you plan on doing a lot of AoE damage Nirn is BiS. I usually run solo so I prefer infused.

    AGREED. I am usually solo, but even then 2 targets come out of stealth and I know ill have to try to DPS one or two of them.
  • Insco851
    Insco851
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.

    reduce clunky backbar mechanics. 100% uptime off infused but requires you to constantly bar swap every 3 seconds means you arent killing anything on your front bar if you are constantly bar swapping. Because you have to light attack, then bar swap, you lost 1-2s on the efficiency. And you lose 2k+ resists for backbar defense trait when you are about to be burst.

    Yea I’m speaking Front bar only on this example. That’s why I asked about what enchant you were running. Berserk from what I’ve gathered on a nirn staff front bar. Correct?

    So if that’s correct:
    Nirn +200
    Berserk +348
    548sd total not including modifiers.
    At 50% uptime.

    Compared to:
    Infused + berserk
    452sd total. Also not including modifiers.
    100% uptime- all front bar.

    Yes nirn+berserk gets +100~ sd but only half the uptime.

    For the record I prefer infused shock so this is honestly just trying to understand the theory behind your setup.

    infused+shock only impacts 1 target, nirn+beserk impacts all your dmg. For a class with heavy emphasis on AOE cleave (templar) debuffing one out of 5 targets is less efficient because most of the time the target you want to focus isnt the one that just received the shock enchant. Trying to bar swap to infused beserk backbar in the same scenario isnt as easy to do when being dogpiled by multiple targets and it increases clunky templar backbar defense mechanics because you are stuck trying to fire off the beserker enchant at the right moment.

    This way nirn/defending is the best approach.

    Also agreed for Templar approach. Completely understand that concept with shock not being the top choice for an AOE build.

    And infused+shock preference comes from MNb which is obviously a single target build.

    Back to my other question tho, with Templar in mind.

    Fb:Nirn+Berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    This setup will give the 548+modifiers @50% uptime.

    My main question is why you wouldn’t prefer:

    Fb:Infused+berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    For 452+ modifiers @100% uptime?

    Is the +100~ sd at 50% uptime worth that much to you?

    good question. Infused_beserk is about 7591 ESP with a 4200 jabs tooltip. Nirn+Beserk is 4300 jabs tooltip with 7744 ESP value. BUT then beserk is not on its 7196 ESP but 4k jabs tooltip.

    If infused isnt procing with beserk, jabs is 3998 dmg with an ESP of 6880. There are times you dont get enchants off (failed light attack during lag, and missing light attack during mistakes in rotation and more importantly, someone dodging your light attack.)

    Therefore I would rather have 4k jabs 50% of the time at 7196 ESP against a 26k resist/3300 CR target than 7591 during the best weaving/situations that has a potential for dropping down to 6880 when I am CC'd or targets are dodging.

    Well thought out approach, even if preferential. Bravo.

    Nirn also gives additional healing power front bar for possible hots that are ticking while you are CC’d/lagged on front bar as well.
  • InvictusApollo
    InvictusApollo
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Infused Shock enchant
    Only_Zeus wrote: »
    I simply want to see other peoples input for Destro flame staff PvP
    The most common 3 are this

    Nirn Bezerker
    Infused bezerker
    Infused Shock

    Would just like people's point of view.

    I clicked the wrong option. But the best will be Nirnhoned Shock or Disease on front bar and Infused Berserker on back bar.
  • Only_Zeus
    Only_Zeus
    Soul Shriven
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    Love all the replies guys
  • No_Division
    No_Division
    ✭✭✭
    Nirn Bezerker Enchant
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    Insco851 wrote: »
    darkblue5 wrote: »
    Sharpened has been pretty good in the Heavy/Protective/Pirate Skele one piece meta. Scalebreaker will look a lot like that IMO even with the heavy stam, Protective, and Pirate Skeleton 2-piece nerfs.

    sharp isnt bad, but I think the calculations points towards nirn if you already have 4k pen+ele drain. This is what I was using:

    PENETRATION (NIRN):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 8947)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 8947)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(11773)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.1783787878787879)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8216
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 4043 * 0.8216 = 3321.72

    PENETRATION (SHARP):
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((((armor - major/minor pen)*(1 - percentage debuff ) - flat debuff)/(66 * 1000))))= final percentage
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(((26000 - 5280)*(1 - 0) - 10323)/(66 * 1000)))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-((20720)- 10323)/(66000))
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(10397)/(66000)
    Armor Mitigation = 1-(0.157530303030303)
    Armor Mitigation = 0.8424
    SWEEPS TOOLTIP = 3889 * 0.8424 = 3,276.09

    And the enchant here would be berserk?

    Nirn+berserk would end up with 100~ SD more than Infused Berserk but with only half the up time.


    no enchant on those tooltips. With enchant jabs is at 4300 tolltip on my build.

    If you’re just going for max sd wouldn’t you rather have 4200~ at 100% uptime over 4300 at 50%?

    If I’m missing something, clue me in.

    reduce clunky backbar mechanics. 100% uptime off infused but requires you to constantly bar swap every 3 seconds means you arent killing anything on your front bar if you are constantly bar swapping. Because you have to light attack, then bar swap, you lost 1-2s on the efficiency. And you lose 2k+ resists for backbar defense trait when you are about to be burst.

    Yea I’m speaking Front bar only on this example. That’s why I asked about what enchant you were running. Berserk from what I’ve gathered on a nirn staff front bar. Correct?

    So if that’s correct:
    Nirn +200
    Berserk +348
    548sd total not including modifiers.
    At 50% uptime.

    Compared to:
    Infused + berserk
    452sd total. Also not including modifiers.
    100% uptime- all front bar.

    Yes nirn+berserk gets +100~ sd but only half the uptime.

    For the record I prefer infused shock so this is honestly just trying to understand the theory behind your setup.

    infused+shock only impacts 1 target, nirn+beserk impacts all your dmg. For a class with heavy emphasis on AOE cleave (templar) debuffing one out of 5 targets is less efficient because most of the time the target you want to focus isnt the one that just received the shock enchant. Trying to bar swap to infused beserk backbar in the same scenario isnt as easy to do when being dogpiled by multiple targets and it increases clunky templar backbar defense mechanics because you are stuck trying to fire off the beserker enchant at the right moment.

    This way nirn/defending is the best approach.

    Also agreed for Templar approach. Completely understand that concept with shock not being the top choice for an AOE build.

    And infused+shock preference comes from MNb which is obviously a single target build.

    Back to my other question tho, with Templar in mind.

    Fb:Nirn+Berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    This setup will give the 548+modifiers @50% uptime.

    My main question is why you wouldn’t prefer:

    Fb:Infused+berserk
    Bb:Defending+?
    For 452+ modifiers @100% uptime?

    Is the +100~ sd at 50% uptime worth that much to you?

    good question. Infused_beserk is about 7591 ESP with a 4200 jabs tooltip. Nirn+Beserk is 4300 jabs tooltip with 7744 ESP value. BUT then beserk is not on its 7196 ESP but 4k jabs tooltip.

    If infused isnt procing with beserk, jabs is 3998 dmg with an ESP of 6880. There are times you dont get enchants off (failed light attack during lag, and missing light attack during mistakes in rotation and more importantly, someone dodging your light attack.)

    Therefore I would rather have 4k jabs 50% of the time at 7196 ESP against a 26k resist/3300 CR target than 7591 during the best weaving/situations that has a potential for dropping down to 6880 when I am CC'd or targets are dodging.

    Well thought out approach, even if preferential. Bravo.

    Nirn also gives additional healing power front bar for possible hots that are ticking while you are CC’d/lagged on front bar as well.

    great discussion, thanks for the questions!
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