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Mag Sorcerer skills are becoming less effective than guild counterparts
Pdoherty4637_ESO
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For the most part, aside from ultimates, my mag sorc's PVP build has been fairly constant, with about an 80/20 split in class vs non class skills. However, with recent buffs to guild and world skills this is becoming less and less true.
Boundless storm has been a great skill for a long time providing speed,resistances and damage but is now a clear disadvantage from using Mighty Chudan and Race against time. (minor force, psijic shield, snare/root removal vs. very weak very close range aoe which no longer can proc implosion) While more effective this feels generic and flavorless. A range buff or a damage buff to the damage component of boundless could fix this issue while retaining the lightning mage flavor.
Power surge is a great HoT, but relies on frequent crits to be effective. With the removal of the DoT from destructive clench, power surge barely ever crits while on the defensive because you have no dots to crit and proc the heal from power surge. This stems from the issue that power surge was designed to work off burst damage, and the class was not given any normal DoT skills. Now with entropy offering a substantial dot and reliable healing or sustain, this guild skill begins to outpace power surge by a substantial margin.
My back bar is looking less and less like a sorcerer's and more and more like a guild and weapon skill line.
Boundless storm has been a great skill for a long time providing speed,resistances and damage but is now a clear disadvantage from using Mighty Chudan and Race against time. (minor force, psijic shield, snare/root removal vs. very weak very close range aoe which no longer can proc implosion) While more effective this feels generic and flavorless. A range buff or a damage buff to the damage component of boundless could fix this issue while retaining the lightning mage flavor.
Power surge is a great HoT, but relies on frequent crits to be effective. With the removal of the DoT from destructive clench, power surge barely ever crits while on the defensive because you have no dots to crit and proc the heal from power surge. This stems from the issue that power surge was designed to work off burst damage, and the class was not given any normal DoT skills. Now with entropy offering a substantial dot and reliable healing or sustain, this guild skill begins to outpace power surge by a substantial margin.
My back bar is looking less and less like a sorcerer's and more and more like a guild and weapon skill line.
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Betty_Booms✭✭✭Yep... i will be levelling a stam sorc very soon...and benching my mag sorc altogether.
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delichon✭✭But what's the point? Alternative skills doesn't make original skills any worse. If you find Mighty Chudan with Race against time is better for you, just use it. I believe there are a lot of ppl who won't use Mighty Chudan and will use Boundless storm instead. The same with power surge. You can just use any other DoT in combination with power surge and get the same effect, or use it even without DoT. And HoT of entropy comes with its own cost. While power surge also gives you bonuses from sorc passives.1
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MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭At least you can just switch to stamsorc without leveling other class and still be on top
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Galarthor✭✭✭✭✭
✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »At least you can just switch to stamsorc without leveling other class and still be on top
Maybe that's part of ZOS' plan. You can make a lot of money off of those race change tokens
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Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Pdoherty4637_ESO wrote: »
Boundless storm has been a great skill for a long time providing speed,resistances and damage but is now a clear disadvantage from using Mighty Chudan and Race against time. (minor force, psijic shield, snare/root removal vs. very weak very close range aoe which no longer can proc implosion) While more effective this feels generic and flavorless. A range buff or a damage buff to the damage component of boundless could fix this issue while retaining the lightning mage flavor.
You are not taking into account the opportunity cost of using chudan.
Basically you are saying that monster set+skill is more powerful than a skill alone. That's not really a fair comparison.1 -
CambionDaemon✭✭✭As others have stated this is not a problem just for Sorcerers, it is becoming very clear that we are getting pushed towards using non-class skills. Class skills should outperform (not by much) and be cheaper than non-class skills or just remove classes in general.
If a non-class skill is better/cheaper than a class skill then there is no reason for us to use the class skill.1 -
olsborg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭3 out of 5 skills (not ultimate) in the conjuration tree is basicly useless (on pts) for pvp. All except ward and curse.
PC EU
PvP only0 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Pure coincidence: general skills being sold on crown shop...Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO3 -
Shantu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Been testing my non-pet MagSorc on the PTS. Guess how many Sorc skills I'm using? Exactly one. Pets were the only skills that made the MagSorc useful...meanwhile the Twilight gets nerfed to obscurity. Talk about gutting class identity. I don't know where the devs are going with all this, but it's pretty damn depressing.1 -
Pdoherty4637_ESO✭✭✭For those saying it's not a sorcerer specific issue, I agree and was just bringing a few examples from my pts experience on sorcerer, i'm aware it is almost universally true in U23. Also, in terms of why I am upset about this, it is partly my fault specifically because in no-CP, where i play most frequently, resources are very sparse and it is quite difficult to just pass up statistical advantages. While it is true that I could just use boundless and something like bloodspwan (I used to), and just eat the lower healing output from power surge with the dot gone, its hard to justify intentionally putting myself at a disadvantage in the name of true-to-class playstyle.
As has been said above: guild, world and weapons skill line should be designed to fill holes missing from the class skill lines, and give ever so slightly less effective alternatives to class skills or offer different secondary effects to allow for more build variety. Care needs to be taken while they are buffing underused skills not to just create a new set of underused class skills.0 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭But what's the point? Alternative skills doesn't make original skills any worse. If you find Mighty Chudan with Race against time is better for you, just use it. I believe there are a lot of ppl who won't use Mighty Chudan and will use Boundless storm instead. The same with power surge. You can just use any other DoT in combination with power surge and get the same effect, or use it even without DoT. And HoT of entropy comes with its own cost. While power surge also gives you bonuses from sorc passives.
No, the bonus you get from crit surge will be back bar meaning it's useless. When using anthropy, you get mages guild passive which are far more powerful than sorcs. See sorc gets 2 spell dmg for each sorc ability. Mages guild get 2% max magicka and recovery for each mages guild ability, also cost reduction that synrgizes with sorcs pasaive cost reduction, and last thing is empower on every use of mages guild ability.0 -
Anti_Virus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Pdoherty4637_ESO wrote: »For the most part, aside from ultimates, my mag sorc's PVP build has been fairly constant, with about an 80/20 split in class vs non class skills. However, with recent buffs to guild and world skills this is becoming less and less true.
Boundless storm has been a great skill for a long time providing speed,resistances and damage but is now a clear disadvantage from using Mighty Chudan and Race against time. (minor force, psijic shield, snare/root removal vs. very weak very close range aoe which no longer can proc implosion) While more effective this feels generic and flavorless. A range buff or a damage buff to the damage component of boundless could fix this issue while retaining the lightning mage flavor.
Power surge is a great HoT, but relies on frequent crits to be effective. With the removal of the DoT from destructive clench, power surge barely ever crits while on the defensive because you have no dots to crit and proc the heal from power surge. This stems from the issue that power surge was designed to work off burst damage, and the class was not given any normal DoT skills. Now with entropy offering a substantial dot and reliable healing or sustain, this guild skill begins to outpace power surge by a substantial margin.
My back bar is looking less and less like a sorcerer's and more and more like a guild and weapon skill line.
Like most stam builds? Wow finally figured it out.
The solution: max offensive stat scaling for some skills.Power Wealth And Influence.0 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Welcome to the MagBlades world. Magblades have only cloak (available in some way for everyone via potions) and shade (which is bugged for almost a year without acknowledgement). All the rest is completely replaceable with something better.
Sorcs though at least have streak/BoL, curse, furry, frags, dark exchange, summons, most unique ulti in game (negate). They are not even close to the state of magblades.I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.0 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭Welcome to the MagBlades world. Magblades have only cloak (available in some way for everyone via potions) and shade (which is bugged for almost a year without acknowledgement). All the rest is completely replaceable with something better.
Sorcs though at least have streak/BoL, curse, furry, frags, dark exchange, summons, most unique ulti in game (negate). They are not even close to the state of magblades.
Welcome to stam sorc world, they only have hurricane for low dmg, streak that is countered by 80% dng in the games, and crit surge for in consistant heal. Stam sorc been like this for years now, glad we have some company now(sarcastic).0
