Maintenance for the week of December 22:
• NA megaservers for maintenance – December 22, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EST (13:00 UTC)
• EU megaservers for maintenance – December 22, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 8:00AM EST (13:00 UTC)

it's time to face and accept it...proccing has to go...it's one of the contributors to lag....

  • david_m_18b16_ESO
    david_m_18b16_ESO
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    If EQ that is over 30 years old csn handle proc and ESO cant. Id say this game is ran by a commodor 64.
  • Bobby_V_Rockit
    Bobby_V_Rockit
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    We all know that players are the main source of lag in PvP. So lets remove all players from PvP zones so that the rest of the game can have its fun
  • danara
    danara
    ✭✭✭
    Before removing them, can we fix them ? I guess dragon hitbox from SS is not big enough for zaan to hit them
  • Marcus684
    Marcus684
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ok... but why... do you... type... like... this...?

    He's...obviously a...graduate of the...William Shatner...School of...Oratory Emphasis.
  • Marcus684
    Marcus684
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    But seriously, maybe getting rid of fancy visual procs would help with game performance, but I wouldn't bet the farm on it.
  • Elwendryll
    Elwendryll
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    All the lag in this game is caused by relequen. Remove it :3
    Edited by Elwendryll on July 17, 2019 6:28AM
    PC - EU - France - AD
    Main character: Qojikrin - Khajiit Sorcerer Tank/Stamina DD - since March 25, 2015.
    Guildmaster of Oriflamme: Focus on 4 player endgame content.
    Member of Brave Cat Trade, Panda Division and Toadhuggers.

    All 4-man trifectas - TTT, IR, GH
  • iLLcrime
    iLLcrime
    ✭✭✭✭
    Is that what we're doing now? Blaming stuff we don't like as the cause of lag, kind of like the healer nerfs?
    I put on my robe and wizard hat
  • barney2525
    barney2525
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭
    Huyen wrote: »
    And another pvper crying to nerf a perfectly viable pve mechanic...Please stop! Go play a pvp oriented game instead of ruining it for the other players.

    I have the solution - pvp has to go - it seems to be the main source of lagg...


    Now THAT's funny


    :#
  • barney2525
    barney2525
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭
    Proc sets, be it dmg or bonus effect...

    We got:
    1) 6 classes
    2)We got mages, fighters.
    3)Four stamina weapons and sadly staves only for mages
    4)Vamp/ww
    5)Other combat skill lines

    The combination of all these should (but they dont) let people play as they want and create various playstyles.

    I find it very very very sad that ESO is all about number crunching, rather than active combat.
    I see countless "new builds" in which only the armor sets are changing most of the time unless a big nerf/buff affected active abilities on the bars.
    The reason being because AvAvA does not give guild satisfaction and PvE is so repetitive. How else will people seek some sense of accomplishment.

    And yet here we are, people saying that proc sets create uniqueness, without seeing what a meta trap they are, and a balance nightmare.

    I doubt that this game will ever use stats/bonuses for their intented purpose, progression and modification, rather as an ability.
    Penetration is a more aggresive stat.
    WD is a more balance stat(healing)
    Crit fits with class/racial passives.
    Regen targets combat duration.

    Monster sets could buff features of the list mentioned at the begining of the post to enhance an identity.
    Weapon sets could add a visual enhancement to active abilities be it class or weapon (devs can do anything if they decide to)

    But no... proc sets are too shiny for people to let go off, no matter how bad they have been for PvP.
    VD
    Skely magsorc/magplar
    Skoria dk/templar
    BS/TK 1vX
    Viper/veli/selene and the like ever since
    Calurions/Zaan.

    Yep... a class and a weapon combo was not good enough to enjoy a play style. Proc sets were the ESO play as you want essence.
    And here we are.
    Meta PvP and lag.


    And CP. Omg what a terrible idea to promote progression artificially.

    PvE irrelevant, rage all you want.



    Sticking to ESO only because I like the theme of my character [stupid poison dmg tho...] while Im constantly googleing for other news....




    VD? Proc sets give ya VD?

    I'm not usin them!


    :#
  • Zenzuki
    Zenzuki
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Remember the days when it was the crickets, fireflies and deer that were causing all the LAG?








    Pepperidge Farms remembers! :lol:
    Can Open...
    Worms EVERYWHERE!
  • Grianasteri
    Grianasteri
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Proc sets are one of the redeeming features of ESO, they are a fun, enjoyable, useful mechanic. So no, they do not need to go.

    Lag is incredibly frustrating, but I do not think the answer is to make the game more bland and boring.
  • Dark_Lord_Kuro
    Dark_Lord_Kuro
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    Aurielle wrote: »
    Wolfpaw wrote: »
    Huyen wrote: »
    And another pvper crying to nerf a perfectly viable pve mechanic...Please stop! Go play a pvp oriented game instead of ruining it for the other players.

    Cyrodiil was here before trials & playing house, Matt Firor is from DAOC...

    Right? These guys forget that Cyrodiil was the original endgame, LOL.

    Was is the key word
  • Dark_Lord_Kuro
    Dark_Lord_Kuro
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    I like the random part it add to combat
  • Kel
    Kel
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Calculations are the cause of lag in most cases period.
    Including the servers calculating things like healing, penetration vs. mitigation, weapon damage/spell damage vs. resistance...guess we should get rid of stats too?


  • redlink1979
    redlink1979
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭
    LuxLunae wrote: »
    I have not a clue...

    Agree. lol

    "Sweet Mother, sweet Mother, send your child unto me, for the sins of the unworthy must be baptized in blood and fear"
    • Sons of the Night Mother | VforVendetta | Grownups Gaming EU | English Elders [PS][EU] 2500 CP
    • Daggerfall's Mightiest | Eternal Champions | Legacy | Tamriel Melting Pot [PS][NA] 2300 CP
    • SweetTrolls | Spring Rose | Daggerfall Royal Legion | Tinnitus Delux [PC][EU] 2525 CP
    • Bacon Rats | Silverlight Brotherhood | Canis Root Tea Party | Vincula Doloris [PC][NA] 2300 CP
  • peoplething
    peoplething
    ✭✭✭
    Huyen wrote: »
    And another pvper crying to nerf a perfectly viable pve mechanic...Please stop! Go play a pvp oriented game instead of ruining it for the other players.

    I have the solution - pvp has to go - it seems to be the main source of lagg...

    have an Awesome from me. Not becuase I agree (I disagree 110%) but for having the stones to say it.

    :D

    Nice.

    afa procs sets, never liked them because of the inconsistency. And attaching giant animations to them in this game is just plain dumb.
  • LuxLunae
    LuxLunae
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kel wrote: »
    Calculations are the cause of lag in most cases period.
    Including the servers calculating things like healing, penetration vs. mitigation, weapon damage/spell damage vs. resistance...guess we should get rid of stats too?


    no because if the stats are all numbers and are raised by numbers and are not modified in pvp or pve..then there are no need for new calculations...

    yes all static from beginning to end...

    instead of healing doing

    weapon damage+weapon damage*(heal modifiers)+ 20%*weapon damage

    we should get base stats...

    major brutality= increase your weapon damage by 350 when used...

    this way when things like ravager, fury etc turn on....that 20%*weapon damage is now just an added +350 (or whatever is value is to be created there) removing the need to call the function to increase the weapon damage each tick..(maybe zos does it differently lol who knows)

    cleans things up a bit..

  • Kel
    Kel
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    LuxLunae wrote: »
    Kel wrote: »
    Calculations are the cause of lag in most cases period.
    Including the servers calculating things like healing, penetration vs. mitigation, weapon damage/spell damage vs. resistance...guess we should get rid of stats too?


    no because if the stats are all numbers and are raised by numbers and are not modified in pvp or pve..then there are no need for new calculations...

    yes all static from beginning to end...

    instead of healing doing

    weapon damage+weapon damage*(heal modifiers)+ 20%*weapon damage

    we should get base stats...

    major brutality= increase your weapon damage by 350 when used...

    this way when things like ravager, fury etc turn on....that 20%*weapon damage is now just an added +350 (or whatever is value is to be created there) removing the need to call the function to increase the weapon damage each tick..(maybe zos does it differently lol who knows)

    cleans things up a bit..

    All nice, and I agree with you.
    However, at the moment, that's not reality or how this game functions.

    Hence why I said you can't just point at proc sets as a reason. All calculations are the reason.
  • LuxLunae
    LuxLunae
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    If EQ that is over 30 years old csn handle proc and ESO cant. Id say this game is ran by a commodor 64.

    but can eq handle 100 players at once in one location with different builds , different skills, different playstyles causing unique calculations to be sent to the server?

    Most of these older games have builds that are set in stone...a certain class has a certain skill has a certain armor...which all looks the same with the same color etc....this game does not...

    The CP system must go as well!!!

    it must be all added raw numbers
  • Aurielle
    Aurielle
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Aurielle wrote: »
    Wolfpaw wrote: »
    Huyen wrote: »
    And another pvper crying to nerf a perfectly viable pve mechanic...Please stop! Go play a pvp oriented game instead of ruining it for the other players.

    Cyrodiil was here before trials & playing house, Matt Firor is from DAOC...

    Right? These guys forget that Cyrodiil was the original endgame, LOL.

    Was is the key word

    It’s still a game that was designed from the ground up with endgame PVP in mind, whether you guys like it or not. :) A lot of anti-PVP types try to ignore the game’s history and pretend that PVP was an “afterthought” or a “side game” in ESO, but it wasn’t. For many of us, Cyrodiil remains the true endgame.
  • Eldartar
    Eldartar
    ✭✭✭✭

    Nemesis7884 wrote: »
    » show previous quotes

    I have the solution - pvp has to go - it seems to be the main source of lagg...




    Yes, Yes and Thrice YES!!!
    Edited by Eldartar on July 17, 2019 12:35PM
  • LuxLunae
    LuxLunae
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Huyen wrote: »
    And another pvper crying to nerf a perfectly viable pve mechanic...Please stop! Go play a pvp oriented game instead of ruining it for the other players.

    hey maybe zos might add in a 100 man pve raid... don't you want the servers to be ready?
  • LuxLunae
    LuxLunae
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ok... but why... do you... type... like... this...?

    Signature...just in case I need an alibi online... I am a black man.... and paranoid...
  • Verbal_Earthworm
    Verbal_Earthworm
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Lunae ellipsis?
  • Kalik_Gold
    Kalik_Gold
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Just introduce better armor sets that are static and proc sets will eventually phase out or be lessened in use.
    Main: (PvP & PvE)
    Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar, the Vestige

    PvP:
    Aurik Siet'ka a Redguard Necromancer
    Cacique the Sage of Ius a Redguard Warden
    Jux Blackheart a Redguard Nightblade
    Goliath of Hammerfell a Redguard Dragonknight
    Kaotik Von Dae'mon a Redguard* Sorcerer

    PvP: (Specialty)
    Tyrus Septim an Imperial Lycan Sorcerer
    Tsar af-Bomba a Redguard Vampiric Nightblade (Bomber)
    Movárth Piquine a Nord Vampiric Necromancer
    Uri Ice-Heart the Twin a Nord Vampiric Warden
    Voa a Priest of Sep a Redguard* Necromancer

    PvE:
    Cinan Tharn an Imperial Dragonknight (Tank)
    Bates Vesuius of Dawnstar an Imperial Dragonknight (Damage)
    Herzog Zwei the Genesis an Akavari* Templar (Healer)
    Tav'i at-Shinji a Redguard** Warden (One-Bar)
    Lucky Hunch the Gambler - a Redguard Nightblade (Thief)

    Leveling...
    Two-Big-Horns an Argonian Arcanist
    Styx of Akatosh a Goblin* Arcanist
    Zenovia at-Tura a Redguard** Sorcerer
    Yesi af-Kalik a Redguard Templar
    ======
    Passives of another race used. (RP)
    *Breton
    **Imperial




    __________________________Backstories:_________________________

    Ras Kalik the Vestige, a renown Redguard warrior; He has been blessed to save Tamriel from Molag Bal’s destructive Planemeld while reuniting the Five Companions. His further accomplishments after defeating Molag Bal, has been to stop the destruction of Morrowind, the Clockwork City, return order to the isle of Summerset and create a new king in Wrothgar and a queen in Elsywer. These events have made him a living legend and continue to lead him into new adventures throughout Tamriel, as well as into the hearts of many ladies including the Elf Queen, Aryenn. Over many years of adventurous travels, Ras Kalik had become a loner, until he re-visited his homeland of Alik'r.

    Alik'r and it's cities were overrun by the undead Ra-Netu and therefore he made an allegiance with Alik'r's own Ash'abah tribe. These Ash'abah with his help, cleansed the city of Sentinel in Alik'r desert and it's surrounding areas of the undead brought to life by the Withered Hand. After rescuing Sentinel from the undead zombies, King Fahara’jad’s personal bodyguard the Goliath of Hammerfell, who was given this name by Imperials in the region; was asked to assist the tribe after learning of the defeat of the Withered Hand to the Ash'abah. Kalik promised Goliath he would task him with fighting living enemies on the battlefield if he so desired. Goliath being a Yokudan warrior wields a massive sword in respect to the Ansei, a gift given by the Imperial, Cinan Tharn. Not many soldiers are able to wield double two handed weapons, but Goliath loves to get up and personal in a fight, so he also carries a giant maul, both weapons laced with magical flames.

    Jux Blackheart is a master thief that masquerades as a Bard at the Sisters of the Sands inn, with his younger sidekick Lucky Hunch for pilfering and gambling during this time. Jux was known to infiltrate any towns bank vault he came across and even delved into Ayelid ruins without detection. Kalik can vividly recall the night he met the famed thief. Jux found himself rummaging thru a slightly inebriated Kalik’s pocket for too long, on a full-mooned night and because of his greed and the glimmer of his golden armor in the moonlight. He lost his left pinky fingertip as a lesson! But in return, he gained a new friend, as it was his first time since a child being caught red-handed...

    Upon arrival back in the Alik'r after many moons of adventuring, Ras Kalik ventures to Bergama. Visiting The Winking Jackal, he runs into Jux Blackheart, who introduces him to the coin game Crowns vs Forebearers (Heads vs Tails) and Golden Dwemer (RBG).... Jux constantly takes gold from the unfortunate thru theft or gambling, his biggest gambling victim is actually his partner in crime known as Lucky Hunch the Gambler. Lucky doesn't mind losing any gold coins to Jux... as Jux saved him from Altmer slavers in Summerset, by stealing a key and sending him on a boat to the mainland years prior. Lucky spent years in slavery with Khajiits in Summerset and picked up the art of subterfuge, using illusion magic disguises and stealing there.

    Kaotik Von’Daemon an outcast, and a half-caste between a Breton mother and a Redguard father. Kaotik become a pariah due to his conjuration of Daedra pets. He was taught healing magic during his childhood years by his Breton mother. His father due to Redguard customs exiled him from the desert, sending him by wagon caravan to be a soldier in the war in Cyrodiil. He happened to meet Kalik while traveling from Alik'r, during this long caravan ride the caravan he was in was ambushed in Bangkorai by a group of bandits. Kalik by chance was also traveling thru this area on his Auridon Warhorse (which was bestowed to him by his friend, Darien Gautier). During this ambush, Kalik was able to rescue five hostages from the bandits. Kaotik was the first rescued, and Ras Kalik also recruited him to be in the Ash'abah tribe. These core Ash'abah tribesmen may never be seen together in travel as they partake in their own adventures but they always know what each other is doing; as they frequent a hideout in northern Bankorai. Their hideout an old Orc castle ruin, is kept watch by Nuzhimeh and she passes messages written between them, and frequently they also enjoy her company and her bed.

    The other men rescued were a Dunmer banker, an Imperial mercenary and two other soldiers, an Imperial and a Breton Knight, stating proudly he was an Akavir descendent. One of the Imperials, Cinan, claimed to be related to Abnur Tharn the Battlemage of the Imperial Elder Council (One of Ras Kalik's mentors in the Five Companions). Cinan Tharn was really Abnur's drunkard treasure hunting illegitimate son. He was caught smuggling artifacts out of the Ayleid ruins in Cyrodiil and the elder of the two Imperials was Tyrus Septim a retired Imperial navy battle-mage (now a Lycan mercenary living in the city of Rimmen) and guard to the Tharn family. As much as Abnur Tharn hated his half-sister Euraxia, he dislikes his bas†ard son Cinan more. Tyrus now a ruffian and privateer had been paid by Abnur Tharn to watch over Cinan as much as possible. Cinan Tharn a drunkard, loves to drink at least a quarter barrel of Nord mead before he raids various delves and dungeons for relics to sell on the black market. Cinan also plans to one day, run an illegal gambling ring... which he thinks will net him more gold for his wares.

    The Dunmer captive shackled to the Imperials looked familiar to Kalik from his time in Morrowind.... and he recognized him as Tythis Andromo a House Telvanni slave-owner and banker from Vvardenfell. During a rough interrogation to Tythis, Ras Kalik learnt why the bandits accosted him. The racist Dunmer was providing slaves as soldiers for the Three Banner War. The bandits were trying to negotiate a lucrative ransom for Andromo and the Imperials.... Kalik did not need any of this gold and he could never set Tythis free as he did with the two Imperial soldiers. His past involvement with slavery and war crimes, made Kalik's blood boil. He chose not to execute Tythis, as he figured the worse punishment for this former rich and opulent slave owner, is to now be an imprisoned servant for Ras Kalik and the tribe.

    Herzog Zwei the Genesis a reknown Imperial/Akavirri battle-mage. His roots going back to Akavir through his mother’s bloodline. (His mother is descended from the Akaviri, through Versidue-Shae, and his Imperial father met her in Hakoshae, while traveling) Herzog earned the nickname "the Genesis" from his father as a child, as he was his mother's first born child, and last, as she tragically died in child-birth.

    Herzog was seeking to purchase an artifact from Cinan Tharn, before their capture and was meeting Tyrus while in Rimmen, who introduced him to Cinan. This artifact being the Ayelid artifact; the sword Sinweaver. After their rescue and the exchange of gold to Cinan for the sword he decided to slip away before Ras Kalik could question who he was, and why the Akavir descendant really wanted that sword. Herzog was headed to Nagastani — An Ayleid ruin in eastern Cyrodiil. He had read in scrolls that the Sword would give him magical powers to meet his mothers spirit, if he performed an Ayleid ritual at an old shrine hidden there. Equipped with the artifact sword, he was off to start his own adventure but Ras Kalik, did indeed notice the sword however and instead sent a letter to Jux Blackheart (whom also was interested in Ayleid treasures), to attempt to find Herzog and acquire the sword. (*Azani Blackheart in Elder Scroll's Oblivion is Jux's descendant some 747 years later)

    And so the Redguard, Imperial and Akaviri men parted ways ... While Ras Kalik went off to Elsweyr to encounter the latest threat to Tamriel, with Abnur Tharn and Sai Sahan - - DRAGONS!! Little did Ras Kalik know a few people were awaiting him in Senchal besides Sai. A necromancer survived his attack on the Withered Hand, while in Alik'r. The necromancer known as Auriek Siet'ka is also following him to the land of the Khajiits and Cacique the Sage of Ius a Shaman mystic who has become attuned spiritually with Tu'whacca (a Redguard God) and Ius (the Animal God), after being burned severely by the escaped dragons in Elsywer, is awaiting his arrival also. Aurik is a soldier of the Daggerfall Covenant that was introduced to necromancy while in the military, even though this magicka art is not spoken of openly by most of the Military leaders. He came to Alik'r and worked with the Withered Hand before Ras Kalik intervened on their plans. After the defeat of the Withered Hand, he aligned with the Worm Cult, and is constantly adapting and perfecting his necromantic arts.

    After his journey to Rimmen, Kalik heads south to Senchal, in the southern regions of Elyswer. This new adventure will also put him on a path to meet a strange Redguard man. The stranger which was infected with an untreated Peyrite disease and also was the exiled from the Order of the New Moon cult, due to his sickness. He originally joined the cult to worship Laatvulon, the green dragon, mistakenly thinking it was the Daedric prince Peyrite. This confused and suffering cultist is known as Tsar al-Bomba and he is on a path to spread the disease. He was originally infected in Orccrest while recruiting members there. Can Ras Kalik and the shaman Cacique cure this poor soul, only time will tell. Little does Tsar al-Bomba know, that his infection is tied to Vampirism, and eventually the desire for blood will take over his mind. Senchal also offers Kalik his latest love interest... Aeliah. Whom he fondly led thru battles with the Dragonguard.

    After the trek thru the heat, tropical and desert climate of Northern and Southern Elyswer, Ras Kalik heads north to the cold mountain range of Skyrim. His companion friend Lyris beckons for him with a letter sent by crow...

    Movárth Piquine - a former vampire hunter (now infected), within the Fighter's Guild (and a secretive necromancer) was in Skyrim working with the Morthaal Guard. On a patrol mission he was caught in Frewien's ice curse outside of Morthaal with the frozen undead. Movárth's vampiric infection kept him from becoming an undead minion to the curse. He was able to use necromantic ice-magic to encase himself safely until he was freed with Freiwen, when the Vestige Ras Kalik broke the curse.

    Uri Ice-Heart - brother of Urfon Ice-Heart. The twin sons of Atli and Oljourn Ice-Heart. The Ice-Heart family are originally from Markarth but now reside on the Jerall Mountain range near Cyrodiil, with their younger sister Araki. The twins had joined the Winterborn Reachmen while living in Markarth. Urfon pushed west to Orsinium with the Winterborn Clan, leaving his family behind. Uri stayed behind with his parents and sister to live in the family cabin for safety, avoiding the Vampire plague infiltrating the Reach. After news reaches him and he hears of Urfon's death... Uri leaves and heads home and is seeking vengeance. Meanwhile, his sister has also moved on to Windhelm to join the Fighter's guild. He will visit his sister, once before going to seek vengeance and she will craft him armor mixed with ice, called Stalhrim armor. Uri fearing death, after his brother's passing, falls victim to the convincing talk of Movárth at a Nordic tavern, and will also becomes a vampire.

    {time moves forward through the hour-glass}
    PS5/NA - Ras Kalik a Redguard Templar - Daggerfall Covenant • 1550+ Champion
    Returning player - 2017-2022, back in 25'
  • kylewwefan
    kylewwefan
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    The proctopalypse was a long time ago. When they could Crit, did serious damage, and were relatively new. They killed that.

    Once I suggested getting rid of percentage stuff in sets. They (forum junkies) beat me up pretty good and showed me how stupid that would be. Apparently percentages are where the magic happens.

    Proc Damage sets are generally Not as good in PvE because of the no Crit and long cooldown except for a very select few. Heck, they’re not really worth much in PvP either at this point.

    Proc Stat altering sets perform better because they buff everything and can Crit and stuff.
  • Zer0_CooL
    Zer0_CooL
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sure change the game fundamentaly to increase the performance, meanwhile ESO PvP server:

    MwvKb.jpg

    Why not make an 8bit, round based pvp zone?

  • LuxLunae
    LuxLunae
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Zer0_CooL wrote: »
    Sure change the game fundamentaly to increase the performance, meanwhile ESO PvP server:

    MwvKb.jpg

    Why not make an 8bit, round based pvp zone?

    that would acutally be fun.. a 2D Turned based TESO game where each character is a player...

    So in pvp 4 v 4 v 4 (too much text i gave up...)

    ...
    ...
    DC1 uses SOUL ASSAULT on AD2 the hit is CRITICAL!!
    DC2 uses EXECUTIONER on AD2 the hit is CRITICAL!!
    AD2 has DIED!!
    DC2 has gained MAJOR EXPEDITION from DREUGH KING SLAYER
    ...
    ...
    AD1 (Templar) uses SOUL STONE to RESURRECT AD2
    AD2 has been REVIVED
    AD1 SOUL STONE was not CONSUMED
    ...
    ...

    I'd play it...
    Edited by LuxLunae on July 18, 2019 10:55PM
Sign In or Register to comment.