Mag pvp builds in a bad spot.

iCaliban · July 2019

The current set of patch notes when combined with the previous patch, is rendering mag dps nearly obsolete in pvp that isnt zerg based.

First we have the massive nerf to ranged stuns from flame/shock reach. The ability lost 13 meters of range, 17% damage and a dot (if you want to keep the stun)
Then we have the buff to vigor, which gives better self healing to stamina builds
Gap closers were buffed.
Protective jewlerly is primarily used by light armor mag toons, and is now nearly useless.
Pirate skeleton, was also primarily used by light armor builds, and is now nearly useless.
Shields were nerfed twice.
Roll dodge based builds are receiving significant buffs in the form of the new shuffle. Aoe is nerfed. Soul assault, which is a direct counter to such builds, is nerfed.
Onslaught and dawnbreaker are buffed (once the silly cast time is reverted, which we all know will happen)
Mag templars, and pet sorcs nerfed. Fossilize nerfed.

Perhaps any of these changes in isolation was perfectly fine. But the sum total equals a drastic increase in stamina pvp effectiveness at the expense of mag effectiveness.

Edit: Some potential solutions, increase the base range on destructive clench to 20 meters. Guarantee application of RR or mutagen on caster. Bring back stuns on deep fissure/frags/etc. Undo the nerf to protective trait.

ItsNotLiving · July 2019

And potatoes next patch will still complain about mags sorcs mark my words

SeaUnicorn · July 2019

Both PVP and PvE magicka classes are useless now.

brandonv516 · July 2019

For PvP the Healing Ward changes have some good potential...like really good.

That and Regeneration are things I'm slightly titillated about.

wheem_ESO · July 2019

And Stamina was already better in most cases.

Magicka Necromancer finally got some offensive options that might be worthwhile, via the new "generic" Magicka DOTs, but survivability got gutted at the same time. With mobility and sustain that are rock bottom, and no more Pirate Skeleton (unless you want both Major and Minor Defile on yourself), I have a feeling the class will generally be a free kill if not in a dedicated premade with a solid healer.

Seraphayel · July 2019

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

And potatoes next patch will still complain about mags sorcs mark my words

MagSorc is super strong for PvP, the best Magicka spec at the moment. MagPlar is next yet MagSorc is superior. I wouldn't really use MagSorc as an example for anything "weak" at the moment and I don't know if I'd call them weak with U23 either. They might be weaker, yes, yet still better than the majority of the other Magicka builds.

templesus · July 2019

L2P

CambionDaemon · July 2019

Seraphayel wrote: »

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

And potatoes next patch will still complain about mags sorcs mark my words

MagSorc is super strong for PvP, the best Magicka spec at the moment. MagPlar is next yet MagSorc is superior. I wouldn't really use MagSorc as an example for anything "weak" at the moment and I don't know if I'd call them weak with U23 either. They might be weaker, yes, yet still better than the majority of the other Magicka builds.

So stop advocating nerfs to MagSorc's (its Pets that were overperforming, NonPet are near the bottom) and try and get buffs for the other Magicka classes. And MagPlars are probably the top Magicka class next update.

MartiniDaniels · July 2019

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

And potatoes next patch will still complain about mags sorcs mark my words

So Kristofer and his friends are potatoes? They put magsorc as unmatched top class for PVP, with stamblade and stamDK one step lower.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpHD2aVEj6A

Derra · July 2019

Seraphayel wrote: »

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

And potatoes next patch will still complain about mags sorcs mark my words

MagSorc is super strong for PvP, the best Magicka spec at the moment. MagPlar is next yet MagSorc is superior. I wouldn't really use MagSorc as an example for anything "weak" at the moment and I don't know if I'd call them weak with U23 either. They might be weaker, yes, yet still better than the majority of the other Magicka builds.

magplar and DK eat sorc alive on pts.

Rohamad_Ali · July 2019

What else is new ? ZoS changed us so much it's no longer the class of skilled play . So many just left all together .

iCaliban · July 2019

Derra wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

And potatoes next patch will still complain about mags sorcs mark my words

MagSorc is super strong for PvP, the best Magicka spec at the moment. MagPlar is next yet MagSorc is superior. I wouldn't really use MagSorc as an example for anything "weak" at the moment and I don't know if I'd call them weak with U23 either. They might be weaker, yes, yet still better than the majority of the other Magicka builds.

magplar and DK eat sorc alive on pts.

Yes. But this is not a mag sorc debate thread. Mag toons in general have lost too many tools this patch and will be eaten alive by their stam counterparts.

Some sort of re balancing is needed. As it stands, gap close into onslaught + execute will be the death recap over and over and over for mag toons.

Seraphayel · July 2019

Well with the new buff to Healing Ward... it might not look that bad.

JadonSky · July 2019

I don't feel like magplar is nurfed. If anything they got buffed for PVP and nurfed for PVE (AOE nurfs) or did I miss something in the patch notes?

From what iv seen on PTS magplar is owning it right now.

iCaliban · July 2019

Seraphayel wrote: »

Well with the new buff to Healing Ward... it might not look that bad.

1) Healing ward will get nerfed when people remember BRP resto exists.
2) a hot, even a strong one, isnt sufficient to protect a light armor mag toon from the sheer amount of damage stam is going to do next patch
3) 1 broken item is in no way compensation for a series of nerfs to mag toolkit.
4) Healing ward costs 3.5k, and the heal is dependent on still existing. Spamming that while in combat with a stam player wont save you, especially with buffed bleeds and dizzy swing.

JadonSky wrote: »

I don't feel like magplar is nurfed. If anything they got buffed for PVP and nurfed for PVE (AOE nurfs) or did I miss something in the patch notes?

From what iv seen on PTS magplar is owning it right now.

Mag plar is heavily crutching on a broken new skill. Once that gets hit, they will be in the same spot as the rest.

validifyedneb18_ESO · July 2019

As a mag player myself, you just explained how a bunch of stuff I dont use but find super annoying got nerfed...

sounds good to me.

you cheese with the meta, you die with the meta.

Iskiab · July 2019

What I’m worried most about is burst and not healing.

Against an organized premade every Ult dump will be a group one shot. Everything else you can adapt to, how do you adapt to going from 100 to dead in one GCD?

TheHsN · July 2019

Magicka Builds Need Little Buffs to Their SUSTAINS and Damages For Sure,

Since Beta, I play This Game I have 11 Character Magicka and Stamina. For Sure Stamina is way Better.

Stamina Has:

More sustain
More damage
More mobility
more survivable

I Love Both of them But the game always pushes me to play Stamina.

And I make trials, Dungeons, and PVP with My Stamina Builds

HArvesting and questing with my Magicka Builds

Not Fair at all

Seraphayel · July 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

What I’m worried most about is burst and not healing.

Against an organized premade every Ult dump will be a group one shot. Everything else you can adapt to, how do you adapt to going from 100 to dead in one GCD?

By fighting a group as a group. A group is attacking you? You should die fast, inevitably.

Anyron · July 2019

Magsorc has trained adaptation on zos "fixes"
As now one of most nerfed m.classes (along with mDK and mPlar), we were able to survive their deadly blows for 5 years now

Bring it on, Zos!

ScruffyWhiskers · July 2019

Anyron wrote: »

Magsorc has trained adaptation on zos "fixes"
As now one of most nerfed m.classes (along with mDK and mPlar), we were able to survive their deadly blows for 5 years now

Bring it on, Zos

Ok here you go. Cast times on shields. Adapt to that

Anyron · July 2019

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

Anyron wrote: »

Magsorc has trained adaptation on zos "fixes"
As now one of most nerfed m.classes (along with mDK and mPlar), we were able to survive their deadly blows for 5 years now

Bring it on, Zos

Ok here you go. Cast times on shields. Adapt to that

Streaky streak,rr+healing ward,streaky streak xD

Iskiab · July 2019

Seraphayel wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

What I’m worried most about is burst and not healing.

Against an organized premade every Ult dump will be a group one shot. Everything else you can adapt to, how do you adapt to going from 100 to dead in one GCD?

By fighting a group as a group. A group is attacking you? You should die fast, inevitably.

I get what you’re saying, what I mean is even in a BG context 4 people ulting will one shot another group. Healing values on rapid regen and vigor don’t really matter once you’re up against organized groups.

Maybe that’s the intent to help the small scale whiners, I mean players, but good luck ever taking a defended keep if mitigation is too low. Some times the environment forces people to group up and ball group busters have effects on other parts of the game.

All the other parts of the patch I don’t mind, it’s just a matter of adapting, but mitigation changes will heavily effect pvp. If there’s one thing I hate it’s being full health doing my thing and then instantly die and be left thinking, ‘wtf just happened’.

Revokus · July 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

What I’m worried most about is burst and not healing.

Against an organized premade every Ult dump will be a group one shot. Everything else you can adapt to, how do you adapt to going from 100 to dead in one GCD?

By fighting a group as a group. A group is attacking you? You should die fast, inevitably.

I get what you’re saying, what I mean is even in a BG context 4 people ulting will one shot another group. Healing values on rapid regen and vigor don’t really matter once you’re up against organized groups.

Maybe that’s the intent to help the small scale whiners, I mean players, but good luck ever taking a defended keep if mitigation is too low. Some times the environment forces people to group up and ball group busters have effects on other parts of the game.

All the other parts of the patch I don’t mind, it’s just a matter of adapting, but mitigation changes will heavily effect pvp. If there’s one thing I hate it’s being full health doing my thing and then instantly die and be left thinking, ‘wtf just happened’.

No point of arguing with a guy that thinks a group of potatoes that don’t know how to cc break which is the majority in cyrodiil should always win against a good solo player because they are in a group.

HEBREWHAMMERRR · July 2019

The protective nerf is ridiculous. They forced a protective meta for mag builds for survivability due to the ward nerf. I’m done with the pony show of grinding and grinding, nerf, grind, grind, repeat.

ScruffyWhiskers · July 2019

Anyron wrote: »

ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »

Anyron wrote: »

Magsorc has trained adaptation on zos "fixes"
As now one of most nerfed m.classes (along with mDK and mPlar), we were able to survive their deadly blows for 5 years now

Bring it on, Zos

Ok here you go. Cast times on shields. Adapt to that

Streaky streak,rr+healing ward,streaky streak xD

Yeah, that would work once. But try keeping those shields up when you are in a fur ball and going in for a kill. You will get hit and stunned mid channel and that will be that. Cast times are just a bad idea unless its a buff or resource ability.

usmcjdking · July 2019

Seraphayel wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

What I’m worried most about is burst and not healing.

Against an organized premade every Ult dump will be a group one shot. Everything else you can adapt to, how do you adapt to going from 100 to dead in one GCD?

By fighting a group as a group. A group is attacking you? You should die fast, inevitably.

A competent group of players can easily dispatch of any solo player, regardless of skill.

ecru · July 2019

The fossilize cost increase was pretty dumb, it does two things and costs more than other stuns or stuns + gap closers (hello templar), which doesn't make any sense. The secondary root effect is especially good for magdk's because they don't have the stam to chase down a target, but 4k mag is just too much IMO.

Anyron · July 2019

usmcjdking wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

What I’m worried most about is burst and not healing.

Against an organized premade every Ult dump will be a group one shot. Everything else you can adapt to, how do you adapt to going from 100 to dead in one GCD?

By fighting a group as a group. A group is attacking you? You should die fast, inevitably.

A competent group of players can easily dispatch of any solo player, regardless of skill.

No, if you have proper build and in right situations.
Stamina has as advantage speed, while magicka HAD healing. And with speed is nice - what you cannot see, you cannot kill.

With buffed vigor, overpowered shuffle and dissapearance of proper ranged stuns (reach), tower trolls can be even worse to kill they are now. What could help are new single target dots, but thats double-edged sword.

I think next patch will be real "fun" in Cyrodiil, and by fun i mean unkilable stamtrolls in heavy with incredible speed and healing and decend bomb damage.

Brace yourselves, it will be worse.

Wolfpaw · July 2019

Good thing my magden & bear are still king of pvp.

Derra · July 2019

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

And potatoes next patch will still complain about mags sorcs mark my words

So Kristofer and his friends are potatoes? They put magsorc as unmatched top class for PVP, with stamblade and stamDK one step lower.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpHD2aVEj6A

Anyone who puts magsorc as unmatched top tier for anything but solo (or dueling as petsorc :,D) pvp is a potato imo.
And even for solo pvp it shares it´s crown with stamblade.

Then also what you see in the video does not exist anymore next patch. Matriarch does literally less dmg than shade on pts and harness will no longer sustain you while hardened got a massive cost increase and reach lost it´s cc.