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Why can’t we leave well enough alone?
Skoomah
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The changes to the game are so frequent and drastic. Every 3 months, we have to figure out how to play this game again like a newb. There isn’t clear communication as to where all this is going. It just feels like ZOS is changing the game for the sake of change. And honestly, it’s not for the better. The core of the game being server performance is terrible, but so many resources are devoted to changing how the game is played instead of actually being able to play the game. Busy people that aren’t kids with no jobs don’t have time to keep up with the frequency and level of changes.
Gameplay is going to be clunky with the cast time added to bash, eliminating the ability to have fluid animation canceling, which is the hallmark of high end gameplay that requires precision. The cast time added to abilities is terrible. ESO is supposed to be fast paced action oriented gameplay, not a turn based board game.
The skills audit is homogenizing all the classes and gameplay. There used to be certain classes that would hard counter other classes but now every class has access to everything, so the uniqueness is gone. There’s way less thought that has to go into planning out group composition and synergies. It’s a total dumbing down of the game.
So in summary, players can’t play the game because of lag, every patch is either a nerf to player power or a revamp of how they play the game, more and more pay to win mechanics slowly added to the game, and what made you you special is stripped from you through homogenization.
Edited by Skoomah on July 14, 2019 1:25AM Gameplay is going to be clunky with the cast time added to bash, eliminating the ability to have fluid animation canceling, which is the hallmark of high end gameplay that requires precision. The cast time added to abilities is terrible. ESO is supposed to be fast paced action oriented gameplay, not a turn based board game.
The skills audit is homogenizing all the classes and gameplay. There used to be certain classes that would hard counter other classes but now every class has access to everything, so the uniqueness is gone. There’s way less thought that has to go into planning out group composition and synergies. It’s a total dumbing down of the game.
So in summary, players can’t play the game because of lag, every patch is either a nerf to player power or a revamp of how they play the game, more and more pay to win mechanics slowly added to the game, and what made you you special is stripped from you through homogenization.
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Dalsinthus✭✭✭✭✭
✭I strongly agree with you, particularly the part about the frequency of change. This...Busy people that aren’t kids with no jobs don’t have time to keep up with the frequency and level of changes.
nails it.
Where is this all headed? We're in an audit of skills where things are being standardized, but we have scant details about the standards and no road map for where the game is headed. I want my classes to have an identity and unique features, I want my characters to play consistently from patch to patch.14 -
Vlad9425✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Completely agree. Some of the proposed changes are going to ruin so many fun aspects of the game and it gets very frustrating when they keep changing so many of the gameplay aspects patch by patch but most of the changes aren't even positive (especially concerning the classes and homogenization). The main focus should be fixes to the awful performance though because that's what is ultimately hurting this game the most.7 -
JackDaniell✭✭✭✭✭
✭Zenimax has no direction for combat. After Elswyer I was looking forward to a golden age of pvp, but this new patch is a massive step back that just reaks of a lack of direction.Ebonheart Templar
www.youtube.com/user/kristofersommermusic15 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It's called job security, make completely ridiculous changes that require you to stay on for at least one more patch cycle just to undue those changes and then start all over again.
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ZarkingFrued✭✭✭✭✭
✭It's going downhill. And the server is destroyed. To many sets and animations and procs, ect. ect. Broken coding for everything. Let me explain tho. They nerf the heck out of everything all the time, and introduce tons of dlc gear and skill lines ect., so you HAVE to get it to stay competitive. Its money fam. Just keep pace and learn the new junk if you wanna playEdited by ZarkingFrued on July 14, 2019 5:18AM2 -
Narvuntien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Changes keep the game fresh and interesting.
If you just level up the basic skills while collecting the skillshards for all the passives you need then you farm your gear then what do you even do???
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BalticBlues✭✭✭✭✭
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THIS. The development of the game seems looks like pure luck of the draw.The changes to the game are so frequent and drastic. Every 3 months, we have to figure out how to play this game again like a newb.
Example:
PetSorcs were trash in PvP for years. Powerless and NOT FUN AT ALL.
Then they gave pets power. THEY WERE FUN TO PLAY.
Then they removed the Overload bar, so that PetsSorcs struggle with Slot space. HARD TO PLAY.
Then they butcher shields. OK TO PLAY.
Now they butcher pets again. FINALLY PETSORCS ARE DEAD. WORSE THAN EVER BEFORE:
POWERLESS PETS - NO BAR SPACE - SHIELDS LOW POWER AND EXPENSIVE
No matter if Warden, Necro or now Sorc.
Every magicka toon I made ends up becoming a Stamina toon to stay competitive.
"Play Stamina or get out of PvP." This development SUCKS.
I am fed up playing Stamina. Every class feels the same. ESO Plus subscription cancelled.
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Vortigaunt✭✭✭JackDaniell wrote: »Zenimax has no direction for combat. After Elswyer I was looking forward to a golden age of pvp, but this new patch is a massive step back that just reaks of a lack of direction.
Agree. I was hoping that Gilliam would change it all, since he’s playing the game as well; when a player introduces cast time, adds the second coming of viper back into the game, makes vigor beyond broken and nerfs shields without any reason to you start to wonder.
It’s like ZOS doesn’t learn from history. Which is sad.
Also to op, I’m in the same boat. I’m sick of having to relearn the game every 3 months. I fell in love with a game, and now I’m playing another one entirely. My magblade build/playstyle is COMPLETELY dead, killed by ZOS chopping away at it little by little throughout the years until was no more. Now they’re about to kill sorc and force me into the same *** they want on every other class.
This is not why I fell in love with the game. Class identity made me love it, NOT the fact that classes are the same. I’m from the MMO generation where if I want to play a tank as a primarily dps class main, I LEVEL A NEW ONE. I don’t start crying that I can’t play a tank on my dps class... I loved how mag classes had to go with shieldstacking and refreshing them mid combat, it was a dynamic that I’ve never experienced before. Now we’re forced into hots like a stamtard, which is why I don’t play stamina to begin with. Boring and bland.
Awful patch. I can live with everything else, but it cast times come on ultimates (to cater to bottom tier players like the ones defending it in the other thread) I’m out. 5 years ending like this, who would’ve known...3 -
Dashmatt✭✭✭✭What gets me is changing so many things that completely change the way your character is played. For example, my wife barely ever plays. When she does, she runs around collecting stuff and fishing. Her favorite combat skill is Shrouded daggers. I told her about the changes on PTS and her response was “that’s complicated and stupid.” She’s losing interest in the game - and guess who was driving more than half of our crown purchases?
I tried to explain to her the importance of changing up the PvP meta and ZOS’ vision for balance... just kidding no I didn’t say any of that, obviously.
Here’s a thought: try changing the game to make it MORE FUN TO PLAY. Not less. No one is going to notice if you make minor tweaks to numbers, but if you keep pulling the rug out from under people by fundamentally changing the purpose of skills/sets, they are going to lose interest.10 -
RebornV3x✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I'm feel the same way I hate having to relearn the game every three months because of ZOS drastically nerfing or buffing skills every patch
I don't mind grinding for some of the new gear sets that come out with new content or even having to grind all over because of a new level cap it happens and its expected for games like this.
But having to relearn my dps rotation every three months just because of ZOS has no idea what there doing is just dumb.Xbox One - NA GT: RebornV3x
I also play on PC from time to time but I just wanna be left alone on there so sorry.8 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What are people doing in this game that they need to relearn how to play every 3 months? This is probably first time since Morrowind there has been any big shake up. And back then it was just learning to heavy attack more.Edited by SodanTok on July 14, 2019 2:19PM4 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, great. But I think every (stamina) player complaining about bash lag and cast times on Dawnbreaker should ALSO be complaining about the fact that it's almost impossible to land a supposedly "instant" procced Frag within melee range. There are other spells that are difficult to land in close quarters combat as well, such as Flame Reach. It's hard to get enthusiastic about jumping on your bandwagon when stamina/melee builds have been exploiting ESO's buggy combat mechanics at close range... for YEARS. It should NEVER be possible to LOS a player (with nothing actually obstructing line-of-sight) at close range (less than 5 meters) simply by wiggling back and forth!
#CAREBEARMASTERRACE1 -
Moonsorrow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭*Molag Bal laughter*
Okay now that got the laughing part out of the way.. gotta comment with a fact of the day:
ALL of these nerfs in the PTS notes were things that the forum people (players) wanted and asked for a long time. But, they should always know when asking, that all things connected will also get the hammer. Should not ask for a "small nerfs" unless ready for a full nuclear devastation to other skills also.
ZOS did what the people wanted.
I`ve been going on different topics over a year where people ask for nerfs to this and that, saying there will eventually come again huge nerfs to them and all things connected to them. And here we are.
Always same "no one wanted these changes.." then when check forum and its history, even the people who say those are also demanding nerfs to some other things, classes, skill lines.. and so it continues. Next year, new chapter comes.. and new nerfs, people are already asking for them.
Just saying.
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hollywood✭✭✭I like that the game pretty much changes every 3 months. Keeps things fresh. That doesn't mean I agree with every change they make, but I have to admit that I look forward for the PTS topics filled with righteous indignation , overreaction etc.Arkos Fortune - Kaor - Koras Fortune - Delaia - Leorio - Niota - Nyraele - Karos Fortune - Elara Fortune - Penélope - Frolics-in-the-swamp - Arynael - Sarovius - Eranyel1 -
Miraslova✭✭✭Here's the thing though; why is ZOS listening, don't they have the brain capacity to differentiate what is wrong and what is right?"An it harm none, do what thou wilt"0 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Yeah, great. But I think every (stamina) player complaining about bash lag and cast times on Dawnbreaker should ALSO be complaining about the fact that it's almost impossible to land a supposedly "instant" procced Frag within melee range. There are other spells that are difficult to land in close quarters combat as well, such as Flame Reach. It's hard to get enthusiastic about jumping on your bandwagon when stamina/melee builds have been exploiting ESO's buggy combat mechanics at close range... for YEARS. It should NEVER be possible to LOS a player (with nothing actually obstructing line-of-sight) at close range (less than 5 meters) simply by wiggling back and forth!
Hell ya, preach it!1 -
Sandman929✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's weird that I seem like an optimist lately, but the first round of patch notes looked like the first real changes in a long time in terms of skill changes. To me, it looks like the first steps in an actual direction I've seen. Sure, there are the usual minor adjustments that make me wonder why bother doing anything, and there are some huge changes that I don't really like, but at least it looks like some big decisions were made and they're moving toward something.
CP is frozen while the system is being examined. If you believe the system is really being looked at that's a huge move. If you believe there's no simple tweak to address complex balance issues you should expect some big changes.
Anyway, there have been so many updates where it feel like nothing really changed. If 80-90% of the current notes stick, this update will have some very real changes from what's on live.Edited by Sandman929 on July 15, 2019 1:18AM1 -
Dalsinthus✭✭✭✭✭
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Play the 100s and 100s of hours of story content? Level a new class and its skill lines? Play pvp? Duel randoms? Do a daily bg? Run dungeons? Get a group together for trials? Farm the newest item sets, motifs, or cosmetics? Help guild mates get the things they need for their toons? Teach a new player aspects of the game? Fish? Hunt for unfinished achievements? Get another toon to grand overlord? Do the latest event? Work on my houses? Farm things to sell in my guild trader?Narvuntien wrote: »Changes keep the game fresh and interesting.
If you just level up the basic skills while collecting the skillshards for all the passives you need then you farm your gear then what do you even do???
With quarterly releases and all the possible builds out there to try, there is tons of stuff to do in this game. I’ve played 1000s of hours and I’m not bored. There’s no need to upend skills every 3 months to keep things “fresh.” Especially changes as drastic as we’ve seen every patch since Murkemire.
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Jagdkommando✭✭✭✭@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom , @ZOS_Gilliam , @ZOS_GaryA
Read this article 3 times, and remember payable guys not kids without job and free time...
Players love to feel their power in game, but you continuously nerfing, mixing everything and simply ruining the game.1 -
NeillMcAttack✭✭✭✭✭
✭The drama around here like.
“Having to Re-learn the whole game every three months”
“The game is being destroyed”
“Continuously ruining the game”
Not to mention calling out devs by name telling them you know how to do their job better than them. It’s childish. And people will still expect to be taken seriously!!? Amazing.PC EU - NoCP PvP, is real PvPTiidehunter Nord StamDK EP PvP MainLegion Commander Tresdin Stamplar DC PvE MainSephirith Altmer MagPlar EP Gondar the Bounty Hunter Khajiit StamBlade DCThe Dirge Redguard StamNecro EP Disruptor Stormcrafter Nord StamSorc ADLone Druid Bosmer Stam Warden EP Necro-Phos Argonian MagBlade AD@ McAttack in gamePlayed since beta, and then on console at release, until the game became unplayable on console.4 -
VoidParticle✭✭NeillMcAttack wrote: »Not to mention calling out devs by name telling them you know how to do their job better than them. It’s childish. And people will still expect to be taken seriously!!? Amazing.
This is getting to me. I can't stand that they are pretending this is twitter. These Devs are looking for constructive feedback, not rants from children. The more you complain like this, the more they will think the forums are useless for player feedback.
Honestly it would probably be 100% better if they made PTS forums back into something similar to their closed betas. You have people NOT EVEN GETTING ON THE SERVERS TO TEST and are complaining. Show us your parses. Tell us how hard it was running the new dungeon, tell us why you think this ability needs more damage on it.
Edited by VoidParticle on July 15, 2019 9:57AM1 -
evoniee✭✭✭✭more than 50% of the player base dont know what they are talking.
so dont listen to plebs and keep doing what best for the game devs.0 -
Jagdkommando✭✭✭✭NeillMcAttack wrote: »The drama around here like.
“Having to Re-learn the whole game every three months”
“The game is being destroyed”
“Continuously ruining the game”
Not to mention calling out devs by name telling them you know how to do their job better than them. It’s childish. And people will still expect to be taken seriously!!? Amazing.
Listen dude, im paying money (and not only me, every player does) so we need to have fun in game. And i dont give a [removed profanity] what you or devs think is right.
Who pays money has the right to tellEdited by ZOS_JesC on July 15, 2019 5:30PM4 -
IneedaDollar✭✭✭Tbh 3 month patch frequency is kinda fine. Some games (you probably all know which game im talking about) patch every 2 weeks. But i agree that sometimes changes feel a little bit random and unnecessary.0
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Sephyr✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NeillMcAttack wrote: »The drama around here like.
“Having to Re-learn the whole game every three months”
“The game is being destroyed”
“Continuously ruining the game”
Not to mention calling out devs by name telling them you know how to do their job better than them. It’s childish. And people will still expect to be taken seriously!!? Amazing.
Adding to your post. I'm sure ZoS would love to have them.
https://www.zenimaxonline.com/careers1 -
Skoomah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Server Performance is unplayable daily when people fill up the server. Baseline functionality doesn’t work - FACT
Classes and Playstyles nerfed every patch. Players have to figure out what still works and what doesn’t - FACT
Classes and playstyles completely revamped at random. Players have to figure out what still works and what doesn’t - FACT
Cast times in PvP breaks up fluid combat and fundamentally goes away from fast paced combat system. Skillful play is no longer rewarded - FACT
Class Homogenization takes away differentiation and importance of class choice. Everyone has mostly everything and everything is more closely functioning the same (everybody gets fear, everybody gets a HOT that acts like vigor, bleeds function the same as other DOTs, etc etc). Skillful play is no longer rewarded - FACT
Pay for Convenience is borderline Pay to Win. The grindiness of leveling up skills lines is being converted into revenue streams. Where does it stop? Class skill lines? Weapon skill lines? All these upgrades people can pay for increases a players power level. - FACT
How much more testing is required. Been playing this game since 2014.3 -
Artemiisia✭✭✭✭✭
✭It’s quite simple:
They do this so people have to grind new gear again, it started around when they locked gear to cp1601 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Yeah, great. But I think every (stamina) player complaining about bash lag and cast times on Dawnbreaker should ALSO be complaining about the fact that it's almost impossible to land a supposedly "instant" procced Frag within melee range. There are other spells that are difficult to land in close quarters combat as well, such as Flame Reach. It's hard to get enthusiastic about jumping on your bandwagon when stamina/melee builds have been exploiting ESO's buggy combat mechanics at close range... for YEARS. It should NEVER be possible to LOS a player (with nothing actually obstructing line-of-sight) at close range (less than 5 meters) simply by wiggling back and forth!
Do you literally do anything but sit here all day trying to get mag sorc buffs, crying about literally everything else? Like really.
Play something else already and stop making stuff up as you desperately try get your carry class buffed.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...4
This discussion has been closed.