Disgusting pay to win

Attackfrog · July 2019

Git bad.

If you're not a very good player, you won't care about the current meta because you will never approach it. The worse you are, the less meta matters.

Git worse, man

Kadoin · July 2019

I never understand how and why players defend a company making decisions that cause players to leave, quite strange.

Ysbriel · July 2019

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Of course, there's the age-old conflict... if the gear in the new DLC isn't better, than the DLC is garbage and not worth paying for. If the gear in the new DLC is better, then it's paywalled & p2w. /facepalm

Thats a fair statement but for instance Tzovkins is a good set, worth farming have guild mates that use it but it doesn’t make older sets garbage and it did not come about such a huge overall Nerf. Jorvulnds guidance some people see it as meta or requirement but yet you can heal just fine without it.
Olorime came out, helpful? way yes of course but people who don’t use it still get the job done.

Jayman1000 · July 2019

I had a little trouble understanding exactly what it is you mean is pay to win. Though towards the end of your post it seemed as though you think having to pay for DLC is pay to win? I think that is a stretch, I mean which mmo's dont want you to pay for new content. But that's not pay to win, it's pay to play. You dont get the things that make you powerful by getting the DLC, you actually have to play the game to get those things.

idk · July 2019

Ysbriel wrote: »

idk wrote: »

I read the OP. It does not make any sense. Seems more someone is not happy and is just ranting about anything that comes to mind. I fail to see what they are even saying is P2W.

It really seems that they have not been subbing or buying many DLCs to begin with and for some reason feel they need to by the next one for gear. If the are not getting the new DLCs or subbing then their threat to stop supporting this game is rather empty. It seems this is not really a loss.

Did you read the patch notes? each and every damage and sustain nerf? did you read what the new gear gives you? When you introduce a New Class to a game by a new chapter, DLC or whatever you wanr to call it and nerf all other pre existing ones that is a pay to win move right there, When you nerf skills and introduce sets that give you back effects that were similar to the ones that you took away and only make them available through a DLC that is pay to win. I don’t get what is so hard to understand about that. We are talking about huge changes and nothing from the base game really being improved to compensate for any change. If you are saying that i just get the DLC for the gear then you really did not reas my post and just came over to do a rebutal.

That is your opinion and one that is based on text. You have not tested any of this and until and unless you actually test things out it cannot be anything more than an opinion.

I would say that if I was Zos I would disregard this thread. The reasons being it is nothing more than a rant and offers nothing constructive. It is generally a good practice to ignore posts that are just tirades. No offense.

Bobby_V_Rockit · July 2019

I seem to do just fine with my ol’ trusty vicious serpent and leviathan gear. That ain’t gonna change with the addition of more dlc dungeons.

Mitaka211 · July 2019

The amount of people who did not bother to read the ops post is just such a good depiction of how bad the forums are lol.

JamilaRaj · July 2019

Ysbriel wrote: »

I’ve been playing this game for three years now, bought every single collectors edition, have been on the plus subscription on and off and recently had decided to keep it up to support this game and simply keep the access to the plus benefits while at it. This being said having access to new gear launched has never been a problem and not really of particular interest unless it really fits a build idea. Seeing this new patch notes and all the so called “balance” to damage and sustain and how seamless the new sets seem to bee the solution to maintain the balance there is only one thing that can be said and is “pay to win”. It really looks like ZOS is way out of touch with what the community really wants and needs from this game since over and over people on this forum report bugs after bugs that are there for years and doing this balance seems to be the solution. Never before did i buy the new chapters in order to keep my Characters performance up to casual or competitive level.
Why Horns of the Reach, Shadows of the Hist, Dragonbones, Wrathstone? Well more addition to the story is always welcome but now it simply seems obligatory to have Shacklebreaker DLC set to keep your healer up to standards and so in with all the new sets.

I as a consumer will not continue to support this game with any subscription or purchase any further content if the business format of this game is to become like all generic MMOs out there that obligate their community to purchase the new content by nerfing older gear and classes or overpowering new ones. It is unfair for the player base and it provides no balance.
This a total disregard and disrespect to the community of this game.

What did you expect? If DLC gear was inferior to or at best on par with base game gear, DLC sales would be very low, because nobody would buy them for gear and, given that number of zones is already high and ever increasing, few are in need of a new zone for zone per se. Therefore gear has to be superior to some older gear, which can be achieved by one or combination of several methods: make bonuses flat out stronger, nerf something else or alter the game so that the same bonuses are more, or less desirable.
So DLCs are cash to gear P2W scheme with some additional grind on top of it to make it less obvious.

Evito · July 2019

Pay 2 Win starts with Pay 4 Convenience.

Nitribit · July 2019

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Xogath wrote: »

Oh, look, another person that doesn't understand what "pay to win" means.

Move along, folks, nothing to see here.

+1

I LOL’d.

yep, only a lot of bla, bla, bla

Rake · July 2019

yes

Gothrock · July 2019

You can't just buy the base game for like 10$ on a sale and then play for ten years without any payments and without any restrictions. ZOS have to introduce a new content to keep a game alive and interesting for old players, so they have to pay devs / support team all that time.
So you pay or play an old, restricted game version. Simple.

Update: btw, you can just buy all of DLC's for in-game gold, so what's the problem? Is it just whine-for-a-whine topic?

oxygen_thief · July 2019

so are you going to leave or not? iam asking because its very important to all of us here to know it.

JamilaRaj · July 2019

Gothrock wrote: »

You can't just buy the base game for like 10$ on a sale and then play for ten years without any payments and without any restrictions.

Well, then they should stop selling it for $10 and touting it as buy to play.

redlink1979 · July 2019

Pay to play, pay for convenience and pay for vanity: that's what this game is about.

pdblake · July 2019

Attackfrog wrote: »

Git bad.

If you're not a very good player, you won't care about the current meta because you will never approach it. The worse you are, the less meta matters.

Git worse, man

Already there.

Gothrock · July 2019

JamilaRaj wrote: »

Gothrock wrote: »

You can't just buy the base game for like 10$ on a sale and then play for ten years without any payments and without any restrictions.

Well, then they should stop selling it for $10 and touting it as buy to play.

It is buy to play, it's just not "buy to play and win all"

wolf486 · July 2019

Whether you want to call it p2w, p4c or a paywall. ESO has it. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy the game, but ESO is very much guilty of scummy monetization practices (race and class paywall, top weapons locked behind paid dlc content, craft bag). If they are going to do this, at least dump the guild based trading system and get a proper AH or marketplace, and let people sell crown store items on it for gold.

Beardimus · July 2019

wolf486 wrote: »

Whether you want to call it p2w, p4c or a paywall. ESO has it. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy the game, but ESO is very much guilty of scummy monetization practices (race and class paywall, top weapons locked behind paid dlc content, craft bag). If they are going to do this, at least dump the guild based trading system and get a proper AH or marketplace, and let people sell crown store items on it for gold.

WTH, from a claim about P2W that makes no sense to pro-AH? Dayum son, That's a stretch.

It's not P2W and we don't need an AH. Goodnight.

Grianasteri · July 2019

Ysbriel wrote: »

it simply seems obligatory to have Shacklebreaker DLC set to keep your healer up to standards and so in with all the new sets.

I do take your point regarding pay to win creep, which is sadly an increasing issue now, where it simply was not before.

However, I do not have Shacklebreaker on any of my healers. And I have 4. It is not a requirement, there are other more important sets for a healer running dungeons and trials, to have.

Shadowasrial · July 2019

While I agree that this is moving towards pay to win. It actually isn’t at the moment. Being able to buy skyshards at an extortionate price doesn’t make a player more powerful. And buying the leveled skill lines doesn’t either it simply saves time if your willing to pay the $$$. Let’s face it. Many of us refuse to make any new character a main character for the simple reason it’s a lot of work having to redo ALLL THE SKILL TREES, all the searching all the delves again and the books and quest lines you may not have liked. Does this automatically make a player more powerful than any other character for that reason? Not really. It’s just allowing those who have money to burn enjoy their other toons sooner rather than later

UppGRAYxDD · July 2019

ESO has always been pay to win... ppl still run in terror when I roll up on my Nightmare Courser...

Ysbriel · July 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

While I agree that this is moving towards pay to win. It actually isn’t at the moment. Being able to buy skyshards at an extortionate price doesn’t make a player more powerful. And buying the leveled skill lines doesn’t either it simply saves time if your willing to pay the $$$. Let’s face it. Many of us refuse to make any new character a main character for the simple reason it’s a lot of work having to redo ALLL THE SKILL TREES, all the searching all the delves again and the books and quest lines you may not have liked. Does this automatically make a player more powerful than any other character for that reason? Not really. It’s just allowing those who have money to burn enjoy their other toons sooner rather than later

This thread is not about the skill lines

Nyladreas · July 2019

Aznarb wrote: »

P2W ?
Plz, go play Archeage and tell us how you feel after

This. LOL.

Alucardo · July 2019

Grandma wrote: »

here we go again...

idk · July 2019

Xogath wrote: »

Oh, look, another person that doesn't understand what "pay to win" means.

Move along, folks, nothing to see here.

LOL. Very true.

Kalgert · July 2019

Ysbriel wrote: »

rynth wrote: »

I run bloodspawn, crafted hundang’s rage(however you spell it) and 7th legion and I do okay’ish in some pvp settings but that is just because I have only now just gotten into PvP last two months. Most gear I see people go for is 7th legion, warriors fury, blood spawn, spriggans, bone pirate for Stam builds all easy to obtain and don’t need dlc’s to obtain.

You are just raging hard and blaming ZOS for your not being good in PvP. I don’t think you have a clue as to what you are complaining about. Your best bet eat some humble pie and join a small PvP guild that will actually teach PvP and not Zerg mentality bs or just go and leave quietly and don’t come back till you’ve cooled off or ever. But either way don’t let the door hit you where the good lord split yeah.

Swing and a miss.

Not really. He makes a pretty valid point, in that most gear that you think is "Pay to Win" through Paid Dungeons is necessary, when it arguably ain't when there are sets that you get from the base game that are used and people do good with.

By the way: Who gives a damn about PvP?

SirMewser · July 2019

rynth wrote: »

That’s

Ysbriel wrote: »

I’ve been playing this game for three years now, bought every single collectors edition, have been on the plus subscription on and off and recently had decided to keep it up to support this game and simply keep the access to the plus benefits while at it. This being said having access to new gear launched has never been a problem and not really of particular interest unless it really fits a build idea. Seeing this new patch notes and all the so called “balance” to damage and sustain and how seamless the new sets seem to bee the solution to maintain the balance there is only one thing that can be said and is “pay to win”. It really looks like ZOS is way out of touch with what the community really wants and needs from this game since over and over people on this forum report bugs after bugs that are there for years and doing this balance seems to be the solution. Never before did i buy the new chapters in order to keep my Characters performance up to casual or competitive level.
Why Horns of the Reach, Shadows of the Hist, Dragonbones, Wrathstone? Well more addition to the story is always welcome but now it simply seems obligatory to have Shacklebreaker DLC set to keep your healer up to standards and so in with all the new sets.

I as a consumer will not continue to support this game with any subscription or purchase any further content if the business format of this game is to become like all generic MMOs out there that obligate their community to purchase the new content by nerfing older gear and classes or overpowering new ones. It is unfair for the player base and it provides no balance.
This a total disregard and disrespect to the community of this game.

That’s like totally your opinion man

A commonly shared one that is.

tgrippa · July 2019

The closest ESO example for pay to win is stamina necromancer being the strongest damage dealer by far.

Paying for convenience is something completely different.

wolf486 · July 2019

Beardimus wrote: »

wolf486 wrote: »

Whether you want to call it p2w, p4c or a paywall. ESO has it. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy the game, but ESO is very much guilty of scummy monetization practices (race and class paywall, top weapons locked behind paid dlc content, craft bag). If they are going to do this, at least dump the guild based trading system and get a proper AH or marketplace, and let people sell crown store items on it for gold.

WTH, from a claim about P2W that makes no sense to pro-AH? Dayum son, That's a stretch.

It's not P2W and we don't need an AH. Goodnight.

The game is p2w or at best has paywalls. And yes, the guild trading system is god awful in this game. The worst of any MMO