The DPS Salt Mine

Suddwrath · June 2019

Do you happen to know what the combined group DPS was? Wayrest 2 isn't exactly a DPS check, so I'm not sure why someone would want to kick the other DPS even if they were doing 80% of the damage. Whenever I'm on my DPS and notice that I'm doing 70%+ of the total DPS it doesn't bother me because I have high enough numbers to compensate and still clear the dungeon quickly. That isn't to brag, it's simply to say that if that guy had high numbers he really shouldn't have cared whether or not your girlfriend had high numbers too. However, if he had low numbers too and the combined group DPS was only like 20k then it would have taken a while to clear the dungeon. There have been numerous times I've tanked a vet dungeon and the combined group DPS was barely over 20k. Was it extremely slow? Absolutely. But it was never an issue as long as there weren't any DPS checks. But Wayrest 2 doesn't have such checks so he shouldn't have voted to kick her simply for pulling low numbers.

The Dungeon Finder is a risky tool if you have low DPS since most people are looking to get in and out of the dungeons as quickly as possible. Unfortunately, if you queue for a vet dungeon with less than 15k DPS someone might try to kick you. I would recommend grouping up with friends or guild mates who wouldn't mind taking a lower DPS through vet dungeons. That way you guys can enjoy the content and not worry about experiencing toxicity.

I'm a support main, and when I first took my DPS character into a vet dungeon the tank was complaining about my DPS. I didn't know how to weave, didn't have a solid rotation, didn't have my maelstrom weapon, etc. So at that point I decided that I just wouldn't queue as a DPS again until I got my numbers up. I still took my DPS character into dungeons with guild mates, but they at least knew that I was still working on bringing up my numbers.

So I'm not justifying the guy, I'm just saying that the LFG tool is a risky thing because you have absolutely no idea who you are going to get paired with. So I hope that one experience didn't turn her away completely and that you guys are able to find a guild that you can run dungeons with

Nevasca · June 2019

A lot of people here are saying l2p but c'mon it was *** wayrest II, who cares if you are not doing 40k dps. Also I doubt the guy was actually doing 80% dps when your GF had those sets, she could've been literally light attack spamming and it would've done more than that. He was just being a jerk honestly. You could've tried to kick him, it would have been really funny if the other pug agreed.

I recommend joining some guilds and try to do dungeons with them, easier to avoid the jerks.

MojaveHeld · June 2019

Since we don't have the overall group dps, it's hard to say if the guy was being reasonable or just a jerk. But from your attitude in this thread, it's pretty clear that you don't think anyone has the right to be unhappy with your gf even if the former was the case, and overall group dps was quite low with your gf contributing comically low dps. That's completely and entirely wrong. If overall group dps was 20k or something like that and your gf was pulling less than 5k, she has no business whatsoever being a dps in a vet dungeon. And it happens sometimes where something like that is the case. Where one dps will be on the low end of what's good enough to be doing a vet dungeon, and the other is so comically bad that the entire dungeon is just torturous for the group. In those cases, the comically bad dps has no right to queue for a vet dungeon, they need to stick to normal until they improve.

Now, as I said, because we don't have the overall numbers, we can't say whether that was the case or whether this guy was just being an elitist jerk. But it is very important that you understand that if the former was the case, then he was entirely justified, and your gf was in the wrong and her reaction wasn't okay in the slightest. Sometimes, you encounter something where two people queued for a vet together and one of them is an absolutely horrendous dps. If the person who queued with them is an incredible dps who is personally willing to pick up the slack for them, that's fine (unless it's certain vet DLC dungeons). but if the person who queued with that terrible dps is a tank or healer and prevents the group from kicking their buddy when their absurdly low dps is hindering the group, then the two who queued together are being completely unreasonable and acting despicably. And they don't get to complain about being criticized for it, they were the ones selfishly trying to put the group through something unreasonable and then prevent them from fixing the issue.

So yeah, it's possible that the guy was being a jerk, but the attitude you showed in your post is something that we know is real, and is unacceptable. Work on fixing that first before slamming other players.

robertbmilesb14_ESO · June 2019

To some extant, no one wants to do a dungeon and it be painful.

On the other hand, "elites" (Really the word is Snobs, someone who is elite at what they do isn't a bad thing) act like well snobs a lot of the time.

I'm more of a team player and only complain when a dungeon becomes painful. I've actually joined as a DPS, ended up tanking, and healing all in one a few times in Mazz, and in Moon Hunter Keep (Normal). Even on my the "low dps" Magicka Necro I dpsed and healed a few groups *shrugs*. I did start the game when the idea of not adhering to the Holy Trinity was a thing though

.

It's all in who you group with.

BretonMage · June 2019

I think it would only be understandable if they were really struggling to survive, and even then, the other DPS could have left.

ArchMikem wrote: »

One stranger tries to kick her for not melting mobs and she takes it so hard she logs out.

The dude was an a-hole like every other dps monger but your GF should try and grow some thicker skin as well.

I'm sorry, but no. What we SHOULD do is try to be a decent society.

Having thicker skin wouldn't hurt but let's not put the responsibility back on the vulnerable party here.

Cadbury · June 2019

Kel wrote: »

It's ironic that your first sentence was about a past thread of you complaining about low dps, but apparently because it was your girlfriend this time, it's somehow alright.

Kalgert wrote: »

Let me preface this that this is me venting at the DPS role, only this time, it's not me being salty about doing 18k DPS when the supposed standard is 25k

Can't have it both ways. If you're going to be salty about low dps, you should make sure your girlfriend can meet your own expectations before you drag her into vet 2 anything. Or, have the same expectations you had bringing your girlfriend with you for random pugs. But you can't be both. That's just hypocritical.

-gets popcorn ready-

LeagueTroll · June 2019

Why the guy from que should carry a free loader?

OrphanHelgen · June 2019

It can have been me but I don't think I did wayrest 2 lately. I have a pure single target build. It's literally zero aoe dmg. I'm actually embarrassed how little AOE I have. I remember once I said I'm 80% group dps in a large trash fight with that single target build I have, and I wasnt even using potions. This is where I wonder how it's possible to not be even close to me. And When I'm 80% group dps, my healer have usually 10% group, which makes the other dd less than 10%. This means if I have lets say 50k in aoe, the other dd have 5k. And honestly, putting down ONE single endless hail for example or wall of elements, should have higher dmg.
I do understand your frustration ofc, but sometimes it's just awkward how bad a group can be, specially in a veteran dungeon where they queue with randoms. At least due to respect for others, check out a bit build and dungeon before going with randoms, or if you are really that bad at the game, go with friends or guild mates.
When this is said, I don't think this situation you describe is me, but it can be. In that case I apologize.

Grandesdar · June 2019

Kalgert wrote: »

Let me preface this that this is me venting at the DPS role, only this time, it's not me being salty about doing 18k DPS when the supposed standard is 25k

So I thought I'd do a dungeon with my girlfriend, hopefully so she and I can start doing dungeons together and have a good time. But the first dungeon we go to (Wayrest Sewers 2 on Veteran), after a while some dude wants to kick her out, because "I'm doing 80% DPS". This pretty much upset her, and it made her log out.

And this annoys both her and me. Her because she has some of the better magicka DPS gear (Mother's Sorrow, Julianos, courtesy from me), and even when she's trying her best, she doesn't do enough damage (According to that dilweed who was crying about doing 80% DPS). And it annoys me because I hate it when people try to make her upset (As it should be with any decent spouse).

So I thought about making this thread to vent a bit, and maybe see if anyone'd be interested in joining me and her. Preferably someone who won't throw tantrums over DPS.

Edit: PC EU, if anyone's wondering.

First things first, ESO is not a gear based game. Gear will have much less impact than rotation and game mech. I've seen many people with legendary vet trial builds do less damage compared to people with easily obtained overworld epic gear because they can't do rotations and can't positions themselves correctly and keep dying.

ryzen_gamer_gal · June 2019

Kalgert wrote: »

Let me preface this that this is me venting at the DPS role, only this time, it's not me being salty about doing 18k DPS when the supposed standard is 25k

So I thought I'd do a dungeon with my girlfriend, hopefully so she and I can start doing dungeons together and have a good time. But the first dungeon we go to (Wayrest Sewers 2 on Veteran), after a while some dude wants to kick her out, because "I'm doing 80% DPS". This pretty much upset her, and it made her log out.

And this annoys both her and me. Her because she has some of the better magicka DPS gear (Mother's Sorrow, Julianos, courtesy from me), and even when she's trying her best, she doesn't do enough damage (According to that dilweed who was crying about doing 80% DPS). And it annoys me because I hate it when people try to make her upset (As it should be with any decent spouse).

So I thought about making this thread to vent a bit, and maybe see if anyone'd be interested in joining me and her. Preferably someone who won't throw tantrums over DPS.

Edit: PC EU, if anyone's wondering.

Happy toy join you both. I'm on both servers. I'll be back on tomorrow around 9-10 pm eastern ntime usa - probably about 3am your time or maybe later.... Happy to dungeoneer with you.

Frankly i never understood people who get snooty about the amount of dps they are doing. I'm not impressed by it. What impresses me in a dungeon is people work together and include everyone in the process.

Esp annyoying are a tank or a dps who runs ahead of the group and acts like we are an inconvenience to their existence. For people like that i wish they had a way to queue for a solo dungeon so the rest of us dont have to deal with the inconvenience of booting them and waiting for a replacement.

Zacuel · June 2019

Have you considered dumping your gf for someone who can dps better? Sounds like that'd fix everything.

Kalgert · June 2019

Huh, quite a few comments have been made durimg the time of me sleeping. Some of them from people that I probably wouldn't want to help if they were stuck on the side of the road

Kel wrote: »

It's ironic that your first sentence was about a past thread of you complaining about low dps, but apparently because it was your girlfriend this time, it's somehow alright.

Kalgert wrote: »

Let me preface this that this is me venting at the DPS role, only this time, it's not me being salty about doing 18k DPS when the supposed standard is 25k

Can't have it both ways. If you're going to be salty about low dps, you should make sure your girlfriend can meet your own expectations before you drag her into vet 2 anything. Or, have the same expectations you had bringing your girlfriend with you for random pugs. But you can't be both. That's just hypocritical.

I don't care how much DPS she is doing, I wanted to do a dungeon with her. She can be doing 2k DPS and I'd still want to do a dungeon with her. I do however get annoyed and want to start punching when I see some insignificant individual start moaning about how there isn't enough DPS.

Stebarnz wrote: »

Do normal until you learn the game, alternatively I have to waste my time carrying and it gets old.

30k dps is very easy, you can do with heavy attacks! I have no sympathy.

X to Doubt on the heavy attacks claim, unless it's really going through a specialized build.

And let us think about it... Do normals, which are ***-easy and are boring, or do Veteran dungeons that actually provide a challenge? I think the latter choice is better

Muzzick wrote: »

Why was wayrest 2 vet the first dungeon you decided to do together?

It was the dungeon we got from the random dungeon finder

ArchMikem wrote: »

One stranger tries to kick her for not melting mobs and she takes it so hard she logs out.

The dude was an a-hole like every other dps monger but your GF should try and grow some thicker skin as well.

She simply has no desire to deal with children, that is all.

Zacuel wrote: »

Have you considered dumping your gf for someone who can dps better? Sounds like that'd fix everything.

I hope you never meet someone in your life to share a kinship together, or that you get dumped yourself. That is not only unfunny, but really disrespectful to someone to tell over something so stupid as a videogame MMO.

But hey, you probably are already single and have no one in your life, which would explain why you'd think this is such a topical "Joke".

Zacuel wrote: »

You both sound...

Just awful.

And you sound like an idiot, what about it? Neither of us pretend to be this "Perfect player" that some people imagine. Too much effort to do that. Better to be just ourselves. Don't like it? Then eat me.

Zacuel · June 2019

I feel named and shamed.

How dare you.

Cadbury · June 2019

Kalgert wrote: »

Huh, quite a few comments have been made durimg the time of me sleeping. Some of them from people that I probably wouldn't want to help if they were stuck on the side of the road

Kel wrote: »

It's ironic that your first sentence was about a past thread of you complaining about low dps, but apparently because it was your girlfriend this time, it's somehow alright.

Kalgert wrote: »

Let me preface this that this is me venting at the DPS role, only this time, it's not me being salty about doing 18k DPS when the supposed standard is 25k

Can't have it both ways. If you're going to be salty about low dps, you should make sure your girlfriend can meet your own expectations before you drag her into vet 2 anything. Or, have the same expectations you had bringing your girlfriend with you for random pugs. But you can't be both. That's just hypocritical.

I don't care how much DPS she is doing, I wanted to do a dungeon with her. She can be doing 2k DPS and I'd still want to do a dungeon with her. I do however get annoyed and want to start punching when I see some insignificant individual start moaning about how there isn't enough DPS.

Stebarnz wrote: »

Do normal until you learn the game, alternatively I have to waste my time carrying and it gets old.

30k dps is very easy, you can do with heavy attacks! I have no sympathy.

X to Doubt on the heavy attacks claim, unless it's really going through a specialized build.

And let us think about it... Do normals, which are ***-easy and are boring, or do Veteran dungeons that actually provide a challenge? I think the latter choice is better

Muzzick wrote: »

Why was wayrest 2 vet the first dungeon you decided to do together?

It was the dungeon we got from the random dungeon finder

ArchMikem wrote: »

One stranger tries to kick her for not melting mobs and she takes it so hard she logs out.

The dude was an a-hole like every other dps monger but your GF should try and grow some thicker skin as well.

She simply has no desire to deal with children, that is all.

Zacuel wrote: »

Have you considered dumping your gf for someone who can dps better? Sounds like that'd fix everything.

I hope you never meet someone in your life to share a kinship together, or that you get dumped yourself. That is not only unfunny, but really disrespectful to someone to tell over something so stupid as a videogame MMO.

But hey, you probably are already single and have no one in your life, which would explain why you'd think this is such a topical "Joke".

Zacuel wrote: »

You both sound...

Just awful.

And you sound like an idiot, what about it? Neither of us pretend to be this "Perfect player" that some people imagine. Too much effort to do that. Better to be just ourselves. Don't like it? Then eat me.

witchdoctor · June 2019

MojaveHeld wrote: »

But from your attitude in this thread, it's pretty clear that you don't think anyone has the right to be unhappy with your gf even if the former was the case, and overall group dps was quite low with your gf contributing comically low dps. That's completely and entirely wrong.

This is the guy here on the forums who refuses to take any build advice because he 'doesn't trust anyone.'

So ... you can probably only surmise the GF's build.

Sergykid · June 2019

1500: doctor, cut my leg or it will spread, i got bit by an animal while hunting
1800: we go to war in the north, we`ll freeze and bleed
2019: that guy said ugly words to me

stop being so sensible and enjoy the game maybe

Zypheran · June 2019

The problem with the typical responses to these types of threads is that in unearths a creeping issue in society, that many people are fast becoming incapable of distinguishing between facts and their opinions!
For those who challenge the OP with their "input" on what level of DPS is needed before doing vet dungeons and suggesting people are being "carried", can I just point out that these are expectations on your side.
Until such time as ZOS introduce a minimum dps requirement for dungeons, anybody who buys the DLC and meets the minimum level requirement can play the content.
That's the one and only fact here. It might be frustrating, but that's pug life! If people don't meet your arbitrary requirements of dps or speed, I'm sorry to tell you, but objectively, the problem is yours.
In truth, I wish ZOS would introduce min dps requirements via an achievement mechanic, but until they do, I recognise that I have no rights to try enforce my subjectivity on somebody else while playing a video game. (I would also encourage people to consider those last 4 words!!)
Besides, we don't know what dps his girlfriend was doing. Maybe she was doing 20k dps and other guy was doing 80k and just being a jerk.

ATomiX96 · June 2019

Thats fine, learn your rotation.
If you dont have an hour time to learn your rotation and figure out what every button does youre dead weight to the group.
And if youre dead weight you should be removed from a group as you arent helping but only wasting everyones time.
Dont look for empathy here, rather get your *** together and dont waste time on making useless threads.

FangOfTheTwoMoons · June 2019

Stebarnz wrote: »

Do normal until you learn the game, alternatively I have to waste my time carrying and it gets old.

30k dps is very easy, you can do with heavy attacks! I have no sympathy.

Give me a break. If you're hitting high DPS it shouldn't matter. If you're pulling 50k plus DPS, as long as they're at least hitting 15k the dungeon will still go by fast. Instead being a jerk off how about trying to help someone.

oddbasket · June 2019

This post is doing <1% of the QQ in this thread. I'm being carried hard!

Cadbury · June 2019

oddbasket wrote: »

This post is doing <1% of the QQ in this thread. I'm being carried hard!

Don't worry. I got my Ice/Bow StamDk here to help you.

MLGProPlayer · June 2019

Zypheran wrote: »

The problem with the typical responses to these types of threads is that in unearths a creeping issue in society, that many people are fast becoming incapable of distinguishing between facts and their opinions!
For those who challenge the OP with their "input" on what level of DPS is needed before doing vet dungeons and suggesting people are being "carried", can I just point out that these are expectations on your side.
Until such time as ZOS introduce a minimum dps requirement for dungeons, anybody who buys the DLC and meets the minimum level requirement can play the content.
That's the one and only fact here. It might be frustrating, but that's pug life! If people don't meet your arbitrary requirements of dps or speed, I'm sorry to tell you, but objectively, the problem is yours.
In truth, I wish ZOS would introduce min dps requirements via an achievement mechanic, but until they do, I recognise that I have no rights to try enforce my subjectivity on somebody else while playing a video game. (I would also encourage people to consider those last 4 words!!)
Besides, we don't know what dps his girlfriend was doing. Maybe she was doing 20k dps and other guy was doing 80k and just being a jerk.

You absolutely have a right to enforce your subjective standards, just as the other person has a right to be a potato.

SoLooney · June 2019

No offense but if your gf gets upset cause she isnt performing as well as she could, she needs to play another game.

When you're involved in group play, people are gonna judge and there are times they are gonna be blatantly honest about if someone is not carrying their weight

There is YouTube, Google, guides all over the internet. There are target dummies in the game made to practice your rotation. Honestly no excuse not to better yourself at the role you are playing

If dps is not her suit, then she can try healing or tanking

Tigerseye · June 2019

Game just has horrible combat build, design and mechanics.

It's all over the place, far too flexible (and not in a good way) and even worse, they have decided to "embrace" bugs that any other respectable developer on the planet would have apologised profusely for and fixed.

I used to do good DPS in WoW - people used to comment on it, lol.

I even real raided a bit.

I don't bother to measure it here, but I know I don't and I don't even feel ashamed about it.

Not being good at this Mickey Mouse game is a badge of honour, quite frankly; assuming you were good in all other games you have tried.

Don't get me wrong, it's a beautiful (if buggy) game, but you can't take it seriously in its current state.

Tsar_Gekkou · June 2019

Dungeons are a group effort, and if people aren't carrying their weight, it's unfair to those who are actually trying. Why should they do your share of the work, but not get your share of the gold/gear/xp?

Tigerseye · June 2019

^ Because it's not a question of "trying" in this game.

You could be trying your little heart out, but still fail for arbitrary reasons, like imbalance, bugs and lag.

Kel · June 2019

Kalgert wrote: »

Huh, quite a few comments have been made durimg the time of me sleeping. Some of them from people that I probably wouldn't want to help if they were stuck on the side of the road

Kel wrote: »

It's ironic that your first sentence was about a past thread of you complaining about low dps, but apparently because it was your girlfriend this time, it's somehow alright.

Kalgert wrote: »

Let me preface this that this is me venting at the DPS role, only this time, it's not me being salty about doing 18k DPS when the supposed standard is 25k

Can't have it both ways. If you're going to be salty about low dps, you should make sure your girlfriend can meet your own expectations before you drag her into vet 2 anything. Or, have the same expectations you had bringing your girlfriend with you for random pugs. But you can't be both. That's just hypocritical.

I don't care how much DPS she is doing, I wanted to do a dungeon with her. She can be doing 2k DPS and I'd still want to do a dungeon with her. I do however get annoyed and want to start punching when I see some insignificant individual start moaning about how there isn't enough DPS.

Then the next time you complain about a pug doing low DPS, punch yourself.

The point isn't about you caring about HER dps, but the fact that you are salty about others, yet make an exception for her. And this somehow baffles you why this make you a hypocrite.
Because...you are, by your own previous post, someone who would *** at a stranger for doing 2k dps, yet get all defensive when it's your girlfriend. You've got no ground to stand on complaining about other people if you think it's just fine for your girlfriend to do the same thing and magically get a pass.
Again...you don't get to have it both ways, and any credibility you may have had complaining about low dps pugs, you've just thrown out the window.

Zatox · June 2019

You need two more girlfriends to avoid random group.

Kalgert · June 2019

Kel wrote: »

Kalgert wrote: »

Huh, quite a few comments have been made durimg the time of me sleeping. Some of them from people that I probably wouldn't want to help if they were stuck on the side of the road

Kel wrote: »

It's ironic that your first sentence was about a past thread of you complaining about low dps, but apparently because it was your girlfriend this time, it's somehow alright.

Kalgert wrote: »

Let me preface this that this is me venting at the DPS role, only this time, it's not me being salty about doing 18k DPS when the supposed standard is 25k

Can't have it both ways. If you're going to be salty about low dps, you should make sure your girlfriend can meet your own expectations before you drag her into vet 2 anything. Or, have the same expectations you had bringing your girlfriend with you for random pugs. But you can't be both. That's just hypocritical.

I don't care how much DPS she is doing, I wanted to do a dungeon with her. She can be doing 2k DPS and I'd still want to do a dungeon with her. I do however get annoyed and want to start punching when I see some insignificant individual start moaning about how there isn't enough DPS.

Then the next time you complain about a pug doing low DPS, punch yourself.

The point isn't about you caring about HER dps, but the fact that you are salty about others, yet make an exception for her. And this somehow baffles you why this make you a hypocrite.
Because...you are, by your own previous post, someone who would *** at a stranger for doing 2k dps, yet get all defensive when it's your girlfriend. You've got no ground to stand on complaining about other people if you think it's just fine for your girlfriend to do the same thing and magically get a pass.
Again...you don't get to have it both ways, and any credibility you may have had complaining about low dps pugs, you've just thrown out the window.

Reading comprehension, do you have it?

Nowhere have I complained about other players having low DPS. If I did, highlight the part where I did. What I did highlight are those annoying backsides who go "There isn't enough group DPS, kick people, I'm doing 300% of group damage".

Zatox wrote: »

You need two more girlfriends to avoid random group.

No thanks.

Zacuel · June 2019

It's like you're just pinwheeling your arms around at people at this point.

You are out of control and need to stopped...

All because of your gf...