Anyone else feeling that TTC is bad for consumers.

danno8 · June 2019

TTC gives people more information about a wider variety of goods and the prices those goods are being listed for.

Can flippers use it? Sure. Just like they can use the current in game system to flip as well. TTC may make them better at it but it also makes the average consumer better at buying stuff as well. It's a wash overall.

Arguing against TTC is essentially arguing that it's better when consumers have less choice and are blind to what is available to them.

Emmagoldman · June 2019

I don't care that people spend their time flipping. I sell items low, knowing I will not get the full value, but I get a return and I can play content that I like. I'm not going to spend my time going trader to trader looking at 30 day whatever and making a guess on what i'll get. Good for them

Kagukan · June 2019

TTC is the only thing that makes this games horrible auction system tolerable.

Linaleah · June 2019

Skwor wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

I don't think you understand how TTC works. it does NOT update in Real time. information has to get uploaded and then processed and posted and there is a gap of at least an hour or more between the item getting scanned in game and the item showing up on the website.

people who are buying up those inexpensive items? are buying them the old fashioned way, while hoofing it around on foot and chances are - that posting you see on TTC website? is from an uploaded info by the very person who bought the lower priced item in a first place. TTC is NOT a centralized trade house. its at best - a snapshot of listings on any given day. delayed snapshot.

its useful for finding obscure items at mid range prices. it is very useless for finding deals to resell. the more in demand the item in question is? the less useful TTC is for buying it on a cheap.

I strongly disagree with your statement.

1. The data is instantly available to the people who run the site and any of thier friends as they choose.

2. I have tested it and have seen my listed sales go up in as little as 10 minutes.

as little as 10 minutes = instant!

and that still doesn't change the fact that its not good enough to look for deals to flip. even, lets assume that EVEN if TTC updated in real time - there are multiple flippers and it would waste their time to chase a listing that every other flipper is chasing so its a race against loading screens vs doing it the old fashioned way of doing a run through of every out of the way trader like you would and grabbing any resellable deals.

TTC is NOT used by resellers. at least not for reselling purposes. its used by CONSUMERS to have a glance at average listing prices so that they know how much they may not want to pay and to find specific mid range items at mid range prices without having to do too much of a loading screen mamba.

and it is STILl imperfect even at that, becasue i have also purchased somewhat recently listed items on guild traders, even though they were NOT listed on TTC.

Arunei · June 2019

I never use TTC as a means to try and sell things, only when I'm looking to buy something specific like a motif chapter or an overland set piece, things like that. I have, many many times, found the cheaper listings to still be there when I get to any given vendor. Do I get there a lot of the time and the listing is gone? I do, but more often than not I save money by checking TTC and going around to the vendors that have something at a price that isn't jacked up 150% above the average selling price.

Which is another thing. People claim that others are using this to lure people in with the promise of a cheap buy by listing something at x price, then immediately taking that listing down after updating TTC and relisting the same item at a higher price. Apparently this is to trick people to coming out, hoping to get a deal, and then...what, hoping that they buy the higher-priced thing just because they're there? I mean maybe it might work sometimes, if a person has been searching for a while or if they just don't care? But this whole conspiracy seems really situational and hit-or-miss, seeing most of the people who use TTC will more than likely go to the next cheapest vendor to get their item if it's less expensive than the one that was used to bait them to a more expensive listing.

For example, let's say someone wants a Chromium Plating. They check TTC and find someone has listed one for 20k. What a steal, considering these normally go for roughly 80k on PC! The next cheapest listing might be, say, 60k, then 89k, and then a lot of other listings that are way overinflated. You go out there and find that the 20k Chromium is gone, but there IS a 70k one listed. So do you buy that one since you're there, or do you decide to try and save some gold and go see if the 60k one is available? Were you lured out there by the person trying to peddle a 70k Chromium Plating who only put it up at 20k for five minutes to get you out there?

Here's the thing; I doubt this is happening. People need to remember that in order for TTC to get a listing, a person has to install and run the third-party .exe. Without that .exe TTC doesn't get any information about a listing someone makes. So when people think others are listing cheaper items and then immediately pulling them again and throwing them up for a higher price to lure people to any given vendor, I think what they're actually seeing is that deal getting snapped up (because c'mon guys, keep in mind how many people play this game and how many people check any given vendor at any given time) and the higher-priced listings that are there but not showing up on TTC aren't from someone trying to swindle people out of gold, but are instead posted by people who aren't using TTC.

So tl;dr, TTC is very helpful for what it is; a tool that shows you where any given item is listed and for the price it was put up for. There's no guarantee any of those items will still be available if you go to buy them, but then TTC never guarantees that anyways. If you go into using it expecting it to nab you fantastic deals every day all day, you're going to be disappointed. If you take it for what it is, you'll be much happier.

KMarble · June 2019

Emmagoldman wrote: »

I don't care that people spend their time flipping. I sell items low, knowing I will not get the full value, but I get a return and I can play content that I like. I'm not going to spend my time going trader to trader looking at 30 day whatever and making a guess on what i'll get. Good for them

Same here. My favorite activities in the game yield a lot of items I already have/know. Playing the market isn't a game I enjoy, and if I decided to do it, I rather do it in real life which would actually give me some benefit.

By listing low I don't lose gold on listing fees, don't need to upgrade my bank and/or bag and can spend my tokens from the master writs on things other than storage chests. The gold I get from sales isn't my main goal, it's the icing on the cake.

I only use TTC when I'm looking for specific items.

Skwor · June 2019

Linaleah wrote: »

Skwor wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

I don't think you understand how TTC works. it does NOT update in Real time. information has to get uploaded and then processed and posted and there is a gap of at least an hour or more between the item getting scanned in game and the item showing up on the website.

people who are buying up those inexpensive items? are buying them the old fashioned way, while hoofing it around on foot and chances are - that posting you see on TTC website? is from an uploaded info by the very person who bought the lower priced item in a first place. TTC is NOT a centralized trade house. its at best - a snapshot of listings on any given day. delayed snapshot.

its useful for finding obscure items at mid range prices. it is very useless for finding deals to resell. the more in demand the item in question is? the less useful TTC is for buying it on a cheap.

I strongly disagree with your statement.

1. The data is instantly available to the people who run the site and any of thier friends as they choose.

2. I have tested it and have seen my listed sales go up in as little as 10 minutes.

as little as 10 minutes = instant!

and that still doesn't change the fact that its not good enough to look for deals to flip. even, lets assume that EVEN if TTC updated in real time - there are multiple flippers and it would waste their time to chase a listing that every other flipper is chasing so its a race against loading screens vs doing it the old fashioned way of doing a run through of every out of the way trader like you would and grabbing any resellable deals.

TTC is NOT used by resellers. at least not for reselling purposes. its used by CONSUMERS to have a glance at average listing prices so that they know how much they may not want to pay and to find specific mid range items at mid range prices without having to do too much of a loading screen mamba.

and it is STILl imperfect even at that, becasue i have also purchased somewhat recently listed items on guild traders, even though they were NOT listed on TTC.

You keep making assertions but povide no basis.
10 minutes is short enough to allow for TTC to be used on a quick flip.

Also those who have access to the actual back end definitely can use TTC to scoop up all the good deals. The only question is if they actually take advantage of the data and do it.

TTC is also abused in the use of price manipulation. I have personally verified through observation and casual market analysis TTC's price point tool tip showing manipulated prices both high and low..

Granted it will typically catch the unaware but it does fool people. On more than one occasion I have saved a trade guidie from a bad price purchase becuase of TTC price manipulation

WolfingHour · June 2019

My issue with TTC is that it completely negates what the guild system sets out to do - decentralized or fragmented markets hubs that are more difficult (although not impossible) to corner and manipulate.

At this point, we would be better served with a global AH, which is a crying shame since I would much rather have the guild trader system.

Varana · June 2019

Skwor wrote: »

Also those who have access to the actual back end definitely can use TTC to scoop up all the good deals. The only question is if they actually take advantage of the data and do it.

Conspiracy much?

Humans in general are really bad at dealing with large numbers. And people routinely seem to underestimate how effing many people play this game at any given moment.
There are orders of magnitude more "good deals" around than any decently sized group of people could ever be scooping up. Assuming someone were using TTC raw data to find good deals before they get posted, that would be a drop in the ocean.
But that's like debating whether a lion with a turtle shell would be a good or bad thing.

Loralai_907 · June 2019

Anytime I am looking for a specific item I always check TTC to find it. The last thing I want to do is work my way through every single trader in the entire land hoping to find that one motif page or recipe somewhere. I don't want to spend all of my time in game hunting for whatever random items I find myself needing. So using it as a consumer, I appreciate the existence of TTC.

Skwor · June 2019

Skwor wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

Skwor wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

I don't think you understand how TTC works. it does NOT update in Real time. information has to get uploaded and then processed and posted and there is a gap of at least an hour or more between the item getting scanned in game and the item showing up on the website.

people who are buying up those inexpensive items? are buying them the old fashioned way, while hoofing it around on foot and chances are - that posting you see on TTC website? is from an uploaded info by the very person who bought the lower priced item in a first place. TTC is NOT a centralized trade house. its at best - a snapshot of listings on any given day. delayed snapshot.

its useful for finding obscure items at mid range prices. it is very useless for finding deals to resell. the more in demand the item in question is? the less useful TTC is for buying it on a cheap.

I strongly disagree with your statement.

1. The data is instantly available to the people who run the site and any of thier friends as they choose.

2. I have tested it and have seen my listed sales go up in as little as 10 minutes.

as little as 10 minutes = instant!

and that still doesn't change the fact that its not good enough to look for deals to flip. even, lets assume that EVEN if TTC updated in real time - there are multiple flippers and it would waste their time to chase a listing that every other flipper is chasing so its a race against loading screens vs doing it the old fashioned way of doing a run through of every out of the way trader like you would and grabbing any resellable deals.

TTC is NOT used by resellers. at least not for reselling purposes. its used by CONSUMERS to have a glance at average listing prices so that they know how much they may not want to pay and to find specific mid range items at mid range prices without having to do too much of a loading screen mamba.

and it is STILl imperfect even at that, becasue i have also purchased somewhat recently listed items on guild traders, even though they were NOT listed on TTC.

You keep making assertions but povide no basis.
10 minutes is short enough to allow for TTC to be used on a quick flip.

Also those who have access to the actual back end definitely can use TTC to scoop up all the good deals. The only question is if they actually take advantage of the data and do it.

TTC is also abused in the use of price manipulation. I have personally verified through observation and casual market analysis TTC's price point tool tip showing manipulated prices both high and low..

Granted it will typically catch the unaware but it does fool people. On more than one occasion I have saved a trade guidie from a bad price purchase becuase of TTC price manipulation

Varana wrote: »

Skwor wrote: »

Also those who have access to the actual back end definitely can use TTC to scoop up all the good deals. The only question is if they actually take advantage of the data and do it.

Conspiracy much?

Humans in general are really bad at dealing with large numbers. And people routinely seem to underestimate how effing many people play this game at any given moment.
There are orders of magnitude more "good deals" around than any decently sized group of people could ever be scooping up. Assuming someone were using TTC raw data to find good deals before they get posted, that would be a drop in the ocean.
But that's like debating whether a lion with a turtle shell would be a good or bad thing.

Assume much? I said it was something that could happen not was, I left that judgement up to the reader.

Also people may be bad with large numbers but computers are not and it is the program that does the work here not the person.

What I do know for a fact is price manipulation occurs and sometimes has been successful in TTC. The idea that it is impossible for other abuses to occur is the real stunning belief to have.