I’m a DPS that queues as a tank...let me explain

SpacemanSpiff1 · May 2019

slot a taunt ffs. dps dont mean *** if the boss is running around.

SidraWillowsky · May 2019

gamerguy757 wrote: »

So yes...I will admit it I queue as a tank and I am a DPS. Now I have a tank that I use but I do queue as a tank. Let me explain.
A majority of the dungeons do not really require tanks. The DLC dungeons? Okay yeah those require tanks (except vWGT. You can 4 DPS that).
Now if you queue as a tank, be 110% sure you can A) Self heal effectively and DPS at a 25-30k.
We do this because we are sick of tanking really bad PUGs who can’t DPS an add. So if we queue as a tank, and we can DPS effectively we can speed through a dungeon without delay.
Look if you’re going to fake tank, make sure you have good DPS and can heal yourself.
But DO NOT fake tank DLC dungeons. That’s just cruel

How about you just don't fake tank? I don't care what your justification is. Just don't. Especially since YOU have somehow decided that most dungeons don't need tanks and that YOU have decided that you know what a group needs.

I usually run dungeons with at least one other guildie, so if you pull this crap -and I don't care WHAT your justification is- we will kick you right away. Because hi- I'm a DPS who queued as a DPS and waited in the DPS queue, vs you, who apparently thinks that they know what's best for a group of strangers and uses that as an excuse for skipping the DPS queue. I don't care how good of a fake tank you are- you get grouped with me, you're kicked.

Ardan147 · May 2019

I've queued as a healer on (primarily) dps toons, BUT I have always made sure to be able to perform the role well enough to get the group through the dungeon with a minimum of fuss. Of course, for most normal dungeons and even some of the easier vets, a twilight matriarch will perform the role just fine.

NordSwordnBoard · May 2019

I que as a real tank, and people like you cause some groups to treat me like the Messiah after they vote kick.

Some people can't be saved though

randomkeyhits · May 2019

You queue as a tank, you do a tanks job, same as I expect for every role.

It wouldn't be half as bad if a FT did enough damage to top the aggro table but that seems to end up as my job......

fake tank, fake healer.... at least poor DPS are simply bad.

If you want to fake role... go premade, as otherwise you are not wanted.

or is this all about you? in a pug?

CleymenZero · May 2019

I don't what those infused crusher dudes are on about... You DPS so adding 50%+ more DPS and not having crusher thus losing about 3%(?) DPS is the wrong way to look about it. If you don't breach/fracture, you're making the group lose about another 8% but you're still adding more Dps without these 2 factors.

Slotting a taunt is sufficient when needed. Some dungeon bosses don't stay up long enough to start attacking at all.

Dark_Lord_Kuro · May 2019

I do it too but i respect the group by
1 only base game version 1 dungeon
2 no random so im sure its not 1 i cant do
3 leaving if it cause a problem

888and888 · May 2019

gamerguy757 wrote: »

I am just a selfish player who wants to skip the queue and doesn't respect other people (in game)

I have corrected the typo in your original post.

Have a great day!

SidraWillowsky · May 2019

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

I do it too but i respect the group by
1 only base game version 1 dungeon
2 no random so im sure its not 1 i cant do
3 leaving if it cause a problem

Respecting the group would be not queueing as a fake tank in the first place.

Heelie · May 2019

SidraWillowsky wrote: »

Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »

I do it too but i respect the group by
1 only base game version 1 dungeon
2 no random so im sure its not 1 i cant do
3 leaving if it cause a problem

Respecting the group would be not queueing as a fake tank in the first place.

I can slot taunt on a dd, do 70% of the group damage, and get everyone through the dungeon, quicker than if I was a tank, in most normal dungeons, even the dlc ones. So i dont really see the issue here

DjMuscleboy02 · May 2019

If you're a skilled enough player you can tank any dungeon just fine on a damage dealer. If you can't then don't queue as a tank. You can just hold agro fine by attacking first and doing the most damage. Every dungeon except like 6 you can basically just solo nuke bosses anyway. I see no problem with what OP is doing. If you do, you're a bad player, sorry.

VaranisArano · May 2019

Protossyder wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As a healer, I can tell the difference if you aren't taunting.

Usually because the boss ends up in my face, and I wind up becoming the tank in addition to healing the rest of my PUG group, while also buffing and doing damage.

Just because I can do all three roles doesnt mean I want to. If I wanted to tank, I'd have queued up on my tank and done a better job of holding aggro.

If you queue as a tank, slot a taunt.

You talk as if a boss fight is a long and complicated process... In most 3DD runs's cases the boss dies before he can decide whose face to smash in.
Tanks are only important for fights that can't be burned through due to unskippable mechanics or undodgable one shots. That's where you need someone to hold aggro and debuff/buff as reliable as possible, but for non dlc vets... nothing beats a dps increase of 40-50k+ by another dd

On the other hand, I prefer running with 1 tank and 3 dds, that's why I mostly queue as healer on my DDs

You talk as if the majority of random dungeon groups have amazing DPS and survivability.

In my experience, especially if I'm leveling as a healer, most of my random dungeon runs have at least one player who is extra squishy, not very aware of mechanics, or who isn't pulling great DPS.

I can facetank on my healer, while doing my job as healer. Unsurprisingly, I'd rather the person who queued for tank actually do their job, instead of dumping their workload on me, like a jerk, because they want a fast, easy run.

In other words, if you don't slot a taunt, someone still has to tank the boss aggro. And I've seen that happen to a newbie DD who was not at all prepared or to healers who werent prepared, and it does not make for a pretty fight at all.

If I'm running with friends, we also run 1 Tank +3 DDs, because then the boss stays in one place, doesn't get pulled out of the arena and reset the fight, mechanics are followed, etc. The fights are just better when someone holds boss aggro. So I facetank with my healer if no one is taunting, but its much, much better when the person who queued as tank actually does their job.

Grandesdar · May 2019

I especially love it when those fake tanks are the squishiest(holy cows how did I even spell that?) builds, like a stamblade, proceed to die on the first boss and lead us to a wipe on the first boss and then start flaming us.

It's a cherry on top they wait for others to initiate but still manage to die first and foremost in less than 10 secs anyways.

I also should point out that people like you are the reason I quit maining a tank after 2 years. I was sick and tired of fake tanks taking my place and making queue times and grouping painful. I'm not interested in your half way finished dungeons. You think your 20-25k dps will help us? Now thanks to you, everyone is going to slot self heals, slot their utility/defensive ultimates and try to kite bosses around instead of dealing damage. We will be deprived of the buffs we would get and debuffs on bosses. Most likely we won't have the horn.

Anotherone773 · May 2019

Its great for you, OP, but as a healer, its more headache for me. Because you are not controlling anything everyone else is taking more damage. I have npcs chasing me im having to run,fight, block, instead of heal. And everyone else is taking more damage as well so i have spend more res on healing them as well as you despite how good you THINK you are at self healing and i have to spend resources and time doing the job you are suppose too, so that i can do my job.

While you may hit 30 to 40k dps normally, you wont get near that with trying to self heal. Your DPS will drop by a quarter or more as you spend more resources trying to stay alive and less on pure damage. I will of course have to make up the difference. And since you are not set up to tank... you will actually be very squishy and that is going to make you very difficult to heal as tank. For example if you are running a pure dps build everything is going towards mag or sta. Your hp even with a food buff will be below 20k and possibly as low as 15k which is pretty squishy when you are trying to take a brunt of the damage. This means i have to spend more resources trying to emergency heal you which is not near as efficient as gentle HoT toppers. So now i have resource problems trying to keep everyone a live.

At this point i usually make DPS my priority for heals and ignore the tank. Furthermore, if you properly tanked those npcs that "dont need to be tanked" then i could switch to my damage bar I can add 10 to 20k off a single bar to our dps depending on how good the tank is at controlling damage output and as long as people mostly stay out of stupid and run a food buff an HoT will keep everyone topped up and good players can mostly keep themselves mostly topped up or all the way topped up.

So with a good tank, we can basically run 3 dps with a healer safety net and a proper tank. Everyone only has to do their job and no one dies. If we do it your way, you get to do what you want, but it is a much bigger pain to the rest of the group and makes it much harder for us while it makes it easier for you.

Your version = Your life is easier everyone else has to work harder to accommodate you.
My version = No one works harder. Instead of heal focused, i can be damaged focused with topper and spot heals. Things die faster. Everyone goes home happy.

Class adjourned.

Mancombe_Nosehair · May 2019

I call them fankers...

siddique · May 2019

Seriously, don't. It doesn't matter whether you can do 2 dps it or 4 dps it, if you are a dps, queue as a dps.

CMDR_Un1k0rn · May 2019

Hopefully I never have the misfortune with having to put up with OP's selfish nonsense when I PuG.

Just gonna' say it: This is a jerk move.

kookster · May 2019

Guilty. I do this with my pet sorc, matriarch for heals, Shattering Prison for crowd control.

SoLooney · May 2019

I agree OP, most vet dungeons can be speed run with 4 dps, but people get defensive when there isnt a real tank

zaria · May 2019

DjMuscleboy02 wrote: »

If you're a skilled enough player you can tank any dungeon just fine on a damage dealer. If you can't then don't queue as a tank. You can just hold agro fine by attacking first and doing the most damage. Every dungeon except like 6 you can basically just solo nuke bosses anyway. I see no problem with what OP is doing. If you do, you're a bad player, sorry.

You take agro by doing initial damage but this just last 6 seconds or something.
Doing most damage has nothing to do with it, its random, yes having many AoE DoT down might increase chance you get agro, however most have two.

NocturnalSonata · May 2019

Normal dungeon (non dlc) - do not need a tank or taunt.

We can argue that it diminishes player experience without one, but this only really applies if you are playing with a bunch of new players. Even then, all it takes is one competent DD getting paired, and their experience is diminished anyway as that DD will steamroll it anyway.

Normal DLC - Mixed feeling son this one

These don't absolutely require a tank, but if you are gonna fake it, make sure you can hard carry, and if needed, slap on some tank gear/taunt and tank it if needed. I have a set of plague doctor for this exact purpose and inner fire. Only ever had to do this once, and it was actually for a trial because the tank we had disappeared and it was just quicker if someone just did their role instead of looking for a new one.

General Points

Don't fake queue for VET unless its a pre-made
If you fake queue normal, at least be able to hard carry if needed. And if for some reason its a dlc that really needs the tank, then have some tank gear and do what needs to be done.
If you do get paired with all low lvl's, use your savvy, and if needed just slot taunt and have some fun face tanking for them. its hardly a big deal.

Everyone moaning about chaining and grouping enemies in normal dungeons???? people must be high or something or i really hope this is intended for VET only comments. Because in normal, by the time the tank does that, everything dead already anyway, so its utterly pointless. Vet is different though, just dont fake queue, get a premade instead if you want that.

EvilCroc · May 2019

DDsplaining. No one cares. Just kick.

ClawOfTheTwoMoons · May 2019

Insta kick if your hp is below 30k. Had a dps with 17k hp queue up as a tank in vet scalecaller and would only use bow/bow. He tried saying that the undaunted taunt was better than the snb taunt and basically told us "too bad I'm only using this taunt". Proceeded to curse us out cause we kicked him. Even in non dlc's it's a vote kick. You wanna do that crap run with a pre made or find a group in zone to do it.

Nyladreas · May 2019

FastBen wrote: »

Why you all don't get it? It's not about needing a tank in a norm dungeon or not. In the same group you were, there was another dd, who queued as such fot 15 minutes. Then you come as fake tank waiting on the queue for 30 seconds. Well that is the problem for me! It's rude and selfish! What would happen if we all queue as tanks or healers??

The queues would all be faster as a result? He's actually helping that DD that was waiting there for a long time, by allowing the dungeon to start.

False logic here.

Demra · May 2019

I wish there was an option to que for a group of 4 self sustaining, healing heroes. I like building for all scenarios and don't want to be a tank or a dd nor a healer but rather all three at once.

SidraWillowsky · May 2019

Nyladreas wrote: »

FastBen wrote: »

Why you all don't get it? It's not about needing a tank in a norm dungeon or not. In the same group you were, there was another dd, who queued as such fot 15 minutes. Then you come as fake tank waiting on the queue for 30 seconds. Well that is the problem for me! It's rude and selfish! What would happen if we all queue as tanks or healers??

The queues would all be faster as a result? He's actually helping that DD that was waiting there for a long time, by allowing the dungeon to start.

False logic here.

*proceeds argue that something is false logic by using false logic*

John_Falstaff · May 2019

Nyladreas wrote: »

FastBen wrote: »

Why you all don't get it? It's not about needing a tank in a norm dungeon or not. In the same group you were, there was another dd, who queued as such fot 15 minutes. Then you come as fake tank waiting on the queue for 30 seconds. Well that is the problem for me! It's rude and selfish! What would happen if we all queue as tanks or healers??

The queues would all be faster as a result? He's actually helping that DD that was waiting there for a long time, by allowing the dungeon to start.

False logic here.

...and then the DD in question will lose position in the queue when they, after first wipe, will have to kick that "tank", so everyone will have to wait extra.

idk · May 2019

Sheezabeast wrote: »

But do you fulfill any of the tank duties? Crowd control, turning bosses and keeping them taunted so the Healer can do their job without unneeded aggro from everything? Debuffing the bosses? Offering any group utility beyond burning things? Your role effects your team...you're denying your team the chance of getting a tank that at least has a sword and shield at minimum, at least has HP or a taunt, at the least.

Tanking duties only consists of taunting and sometimes turning the boss. Many bosses in this game do not have a cleave. Crowd control is not a tanking duty as not all classes have effective crowd control, templar makes a good example here.

But yes, if they do not have taunt they are not fulfilling their roll and with only 25-30k dps they are not that good at DPS either.

Last time I had a fake tank in a vet dungeon they were a really bad player. DPS was not great and they died to Spawn of Mephala's PBAoE showing they were a bad dps to start with. Yes, they taunted buy when they allow themselves to get one shot by an easily avoidable one shot mechanic they are both a bad dps and bad tank.

starkerealm · May 2019

gamerguy757 wrote: »

Let me explain.

No.

Robo_Hobo · May 2019

I don't fake tank, I don't think I could do that because I'd feel too guilty about it, but I don't necessarily hate fake tanks either when it's not DLC dungeons.

Sure, the DPS who queued as DPS did wait a lot longer than the fake tank did, but lets face reality: If all fake tanks queued as DPS instead of tanks, the queue would take a lot longer for everyone, because then there would be more DPS taking up DPS spots and less "Tank spots" getting filled, thus less dungeons even starting.

Sure, all of the dungeons that did start would have a proper tank in this hypothetical situation, but that still doesn't mean other aspects of the group would be good. DPS could still be slow, which no amount of good tanking is going to change much about that, just a fact, and it doesn't mean that the proper tank that ends up in the dungeon is very experienced at tanking anyway.

The situation with fake tanks we have now is not an ideal situation, but in the end it's better than no fake tanks at all, until a better solution comes around.

But I do think at the very least though the fake tanks could do better by manually queuing for only non-dlc dungeons, and maybe perform at least the most basic of tanking functions so that ground DoTs aren't wasted, and bosses aren't running around.