Minno wrote: »

Vajrak wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

I agree with Vajrak, I don't see how I could use your chart Tasear. I really like his chart better. It just needs to be bigger to be able to see it better.

Now if you are making the chart to compare other classes to then yes it is great for that.

my only gripe with that other chart, is that:
1) yellow on white background is REALLY hard to read. should choose black.
2) the color legend at top makes the chart feel like there are 3 columns of buffs that match the header of each column. Took me a couple of tries to realize it was a legend lol.
3) how is this any different from pulling up the build editor and reading the skills yourself?

I would like to see a marriage between the two graphs. Maybe more of a tree/bubble diagram so you can see the branches/connections to show zos that templars dont have much flexibility as they want us to have.

1) You may want to check your color settings; mine are balanced to true daylight since I edit photography on this system also, and it is orange on gray.

2) agreed, it is a clumsy format for it, but this was something I put together just as an example for Tasear, not for use/implement.

3) Where a chart like this differs from pulling up the build editor is by giving you access to an "at a glance" method, so you can build an initial idea of what tools you can use for what you want your build to accomplish.

I threw mine together in about 15 minutes; I'm the head of a guild that teaches people Templar as a main for any/all roles, content and builds --- I even just made it in word and took a screenshot of it, because couldn't be arsed to make the full line of it.

While my guild will always remain small as people come and go, or move to different aspects of the game (though I may eventually work to turn it into a Templar-All-Content guild), the information Tasear is trying to make into a quick graph is something I have been teaching people one to one for several years in-game now.

In terms of all classes, generalized into fantasy archetypes.

Dragonknight is about buffing and sustaining through a fight, wearing down a large pack of enemies while keeping the attention of a few heavy hitters. Dragonknight is your Knight in Shining Armor or your Defending Cleric.

Sorcerer is all about that splish-splash INFINITE COSMIC POWER (ala Robin Williams!); whether close or far, it is going to lay down the pain train in a wide swath around it's target. This is your Wizard, or your Berserker Shock Trooper (no pun intended).

Nightblade is all about making you not live long enough to regret having wasted your life; high mobility, high single target "instant" elimination. Mag or Stam, Nightblade is your (not so friendly) Scout-Assassin.

Warden is all about the sustain, sustain, sustain, and sustain some more -- through heals, mitigations, proc pet damage effects and riders, but overall it is your protective class. Warden is your Druid. Hug that Tree, or the Bear shall maul thee!

Necromancer is your boom-boom "I am Batman" fanboyism -- it does a lot of things that look cool, and with enough planning it will pull off almost anything it wants. Here you have your (possible insane) Warlord/Overlord.

Templar...is where it gets to be messed up. It closes in fast, leaves no retreat, and keeps fighting until everyone is dead, or it's allies have escaped. Templar is your Lancer/Dragoon mixed a bit with your Holy Monk or Paladin.

On the pain points thread, I've said many times they either need to reduce the cost, or revert Healing Ritual back to having a cast time and lower cost for the efficiency of the effect, in terms of healing and in ult generation capability, especially during execute phase mechanics. The only change it needed was the removal of the slow while channeling it, and a reduction to 1 second cast time to be in line with what is current standards; Having a primary and secondary heal on it after a 3 second wait made it an awesome skill, viable for both Tank or Healer to use.

With all of that said, neither chart as presented really gives much in terms of build information. Mine is lacking build-direction, it just gives a list of the spec utilization (mag, stam, or both), and the rider effects Templar can bring in to a group. In terms of build directions, well....

I currently have in play or in the works:
A mixed PvE/PvP Magplar with moderate health, damage, and multiple flex skills for healing assistance, gap close, soft-controls, or pure dps --and Radiant Shield is actually part of its latest dps rotation in both PvE and PvP.

A full "Bubbletank" that emphasizes shields and heavy attack sustain to them cycling so that the first 30-50k damage doesn't even begin to touch the HP, while still putting out reasonable damage ~8-10k.

A Paladin healtank that emphasizes PBAoE slows and heals.

A critplar stam build for high single target and burst damage.

A debuff stamplar offtank, that is optimized around removing armor from a single target and can off-tank in an emergency while maintaining moderate to high (30-35k) dps.

A Lifeguardian healer (double resto) that emphasizes HoTs while cycling a shield and party damage amplification with Combat Prayer and Purifying Light.

A single target Purifier ranged magplar build, optimized about laying down constant damage from as far back as possible, but offering little beyond pure damage and "permanent" Major Breach.

A War Cleric build (destro/resto) that maintains HoTs and an emergency burst heal or two, while getting into the mix of the fight and healing from the front lines instead of from the back/side.

These aren't even all of the options available to Templar, and with the coming changes I may need another slot to make a Debuff Tank Trollkin Warrior, emphasizing debuffs and HoTs at the cost of any ability to deal damage.

If you want the chart at it's simplest (based on spec and class skills only):
Tank
Consistent resource gain (~480 recovery); Magicka or Stamina: Rune Focus
High Damage reactive shield (hp rider): Blazing Shield
Moderate value Burst Heal: Honor the Dead
Self-Cleanse and HoT PBAoE: Cleansing Ritual
Spell damage increase: Any Dawns Wrath
Major Maim: Nova
AoE gap closer/interrupt: Explosive Charge

Stamina DPS
Group Heal (requires corpses): Repentance
Minor Fracture/Breach: Power of the Light
Ranged Stun, single target: Binding Javelin
Self-Cleanse and HoT PBAoE, plus moderate slow and DoT: Ritual of Retribution
Single target high value slow, 1 second delay: Biting Jabs
Spell damage increase: Any Dawns Wrath

Magicka DPS
Resource Restore (highest attribute) mixed with ground DoT: Blazing Spear
High Damage proactive shield: Radiant Ward
Self-Cleanse and HoT PBAoE, plus moderate slow and moderate DoT: Ritual of Retribution
Single target high value slow, 1 second delay: Puncturing Sweep
High damage execute (with option of more damage or self-heal rider): Radiant Destruction
Moderate Duration Empower: Dark Flare (5s) or Solar Barrage (8s)
AoE Major Defile: Dark Flare
Major Maim: Nova
AoE gap closer/interrupt: Explosive Charge
Gap closer/stun: Toppling Charge
Self-heal based on damage: Puncturing Sweep
Spell damage increase: Any Dawns Wrath

Healer
Resource Restore (both attributes) mixed with ground DoT: Luminous Shards
High Value Burst Heals: Healing Ritual, Rushed Ceremony, Rite of Passage
Self-Cleanse and HoT PBAoE, plus moderate slow and moderate DoT: Ritual of Retribution
Damage amplification and HoT: Purifying Light
AoE Major Defile: Dark Flare
Major Maim: Nova
Spell damage increase: Any Dawns Wrath


When you look at the organization and overlap, it does a good job of pointing out why I am not a fan of Templar as a healer (party buffs, debuffs, and damage mitigation) as it overlaps heavily with Magicka DPS and Tank, so that bringing a good templar healer is really just adding more DPS with some emergency heals.

Thank you for this!
This thread has more of a road map than the devs do lol.

Tasear wrote: »

I have swirl eyes...this is more complex then I first thought. My first chart took an hour or so. Not to mention time spending pondering how to organize the information. What I have come to terms with is I could definitely do better, just now it's getting how.

Once again thanks for all insight. I might use some of advice or suggestions presented but definitely has made me consider how to present infromation.