Sword and board nerfs long overdue

bulbousb16_ESO · May 2019

There is definitely something wrong when all players choose this one 2h melee weapon type. "Tanks" should be able to take more damage than regular players, but not vastly more. More diversity among the 2h weapons is desirable, they shouldn't just be cosmetic differences.

DemonDruaga · May 2019

Buff the other weapons and class abilities instead of nerfing snb.
What you want? Every stam toon with dual wield?

Marcus684 · May 2019

SnB back bar + offensive weapon front bar is called “Putting together a well-rounded build”. If you want to go full offense 2H/bow and get blown up when your gank attempt fails, that’s your choice. Everyone has access to the same weapon skill lines. If you choose to avoid one that not a balance issue.

Fawn4287 · May 2019

“Tanks are supposed to be tanky” - guy with 30k health, 29k stam and 6k buffed weapon damage running lingering health pots. If you think that enchantment nerfs to 1h weapons makes any difference in pvp you aren’t playing the same game as me, nearly every cheesy build using a sword and board is running bi stat or damage health poisons on the bar.

JumpmanLane · May 2019

Run more pen lol or defiles or oblivion damage. No one is unkillable. Just Zerg em down or sumfin.

Druid40 · May 2019

Heavy armor and one hand + shield should not have any damage buffs. Strictly survivability and debuffing. As things are now, you give up very little for the massive boost in tankiness. Tanks do not need to do damage. Keep the utility, but make it extremely unattractive to non-tanks. Why does reverb bash have a stun AND spammable major defile?

Iskiab · May 2019

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

This is a separate issue, but I would like to point out this is incorrect. You can hit 30k resistances wearing 5x light.

My issue with sword and board is moreso that it’s loaded up with cc and pvp offensive abilities making it more potent offensively then other damage weapon lines. If someone wants to be a tank that’s fine. but do they really need a spammable that gives major defile plus stun, or the best charge?

Sleep724 · May 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

This is a separate issue, but I would like to point out this is incorrect. You can hit 30k resistances wearing 5x light.

My issue with sword and board is moreso that it’s loaded up with cc and pvp offensive abilities making it more potent offensively then other damage weapon lines. If someone wants to be a tank that’s fine. but do they really need a spammable that gives major defile plus stun, or the best charge?

S/B damage abilites is sustained pressure. No one is spamming reverb that knows how to play anyway. Its timed correctly to keep the pressure up with other abilities and dots and its also a melee ability that comes with risk and reward. Its already been nerfed down to four seconds. Stop trying to nerf playstyles that you got beat by.

Murador178 · May 2019

I think the problem why every stam class is running SnB except a few rollerblades is NOT having access to a strong spammable.

And reverb shouldnt give defile if its seen as too strong on a ultimate like incap.

With the new patch we will see MORE SnB players since Nightblades lose minor maim from fear and SA is getting weaker than heroic slash with the loss of major fracture. Since they also remove major defile from incap, nbs will go reverb resulting in more 30k hp SnB tanks...

Ragnaroek93 · May 2019

Definitely something needs to happen. Either nerf s&b skill line or buff the others. Heroic Slash and Reverb Bash are overtuned in PvP compared to the other weapon skill spammables.

Iskiab · May 2019

Sleep724 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

This is a separate issue, but I would like to point out this is incorrect. You can hit 30k resistances wearing 5x light.

My issue with sword and board is moreso that it’s loaded up with cc and pvp offensive abilities making it more potent offensively then other damage weapon lines. If someone wants to be a tank that’s fine. but do they really need a spammable that gives major defile plus stun, or the best charge?

S/B damage abilites is sustained pressure. No one is spamming reverb that knows how to play anyway. Its timed correctly to keep the pressure up with other abilities and dots and its also a melee ability that comes with risk and reward. Its already been nerfed down to four seconds. Stop trying to nerf playstyles that you got beat by.

They don’t beat me, but since defile is seen as too strong for an ultimate I have no idea how people can defend it being on a spammable.

kathandira · May 2019

Fawn4287 wrote: »

The quality of the game is constantly going downhill with the number of people playing tank builds that put everything into survival, the main factor supporting that playstyle is sword and board. The defensive weaponset offers major defile, major fracture & breach, minor maim and minor heroism, a cc and a gap close on a defensive set. It also has an and armour trait, a champion point option and a jewellery glyph that work to reduce its cost. The mitigation it offers is easily the far best option for nearly every build and there is no negative effect to continually block unlike streaking or dodge rolling making it have no downside for constantly using it. It is in fact so effective that you can easily make a permablock magica build that utilises it as well as a stamina build. A huge nerf to it would drastically improve and speed up gameplay.

Think of the consequences. It sounds like you are talking about PvP. But think of the other part of the game. If you nerf S&B in PvP, how would that affect PvE? I would rather not have our Tanks in Vet Trials screwed because of PvP.

Chilly-McFreeze · May 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

Sleep724 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

This is a separate issue, but I would like to point out this is incorrect. You can hit 30k resistances wearing 5x light.

My issue with sword and board is moreso that it’s loaded up with cc and pvp offensive abilities making it more potent offensively then other damage weapon lines. If someone wants to be a tank that’s fine. but do they really need a spammable that gives major defile plus stun, or the best charge?

S/B damage abilites is sustained pressure. No one is spamming reverb that knows how to play anyway. Its timed correctly to keep the pressure up with other abilities and dots and its also a melee ability that comes with risk and reward. Its already been nerfed down to four seconds. Stop trying to nerf playstyles that you got beat by.

They don’t beat me, but since defile is seen as too strong for an ultimate I have no idea how people can defend it being on a spammable.

You're intentionally misleading, aren't you? They didn't saw defile as "too strong for an ultimate" per se. They saw that a combination of the following was too much:

instant
stun
good damage
20% damage amplifier
major defile

So stop with this nonsense already.

Iskiab · May 2019

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Sleep724 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

This is a separate issue, but I would like to point out this is incorrect. You can hit 30k resistances wearing 5x light.

My issue with sword and board is moreso that it’s loaded up with cc and pvp offensive abilities making it more potent offensively then other damage weapon lines. If someone wants to be a tank that’s fine. but do they really need a spammable that gives major defile plus stun, or the best charge?

S/B damage abilites is sustained pressure. No one is spamming reverb that knows how to play anyway. Its timed correctly to keep the pressure up with other abilities and dots and its also a melee ability that comes with risk and reward. Its already been nerfed down to four seconds. Stop trying to nerf playstyles that you got beat by.

They don’t beat me, but since defile is seen as too strong for an ultimate I have no idea how people can defend it being on a spammable.

You're intentionally misleading, aren't you? They didn't saw defile as "too strong for an ultimate" per se. They saw that a combination of the following was too much:
instant

stun

good damage

20% damage amplifier

major defile

So stop with this nonsense already.

Exactly, and what is reverberating smash:

- instant
- stun
- good damage
- major defile

The only difference I see is the ultimate has a 20% damage boost and the spammable isn’t an ultimate.

Chilly-McFreeze · May 2019

Iskiab wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Sleep724 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

This is a separate issue, but I would like to point out this is incorrect. You can hit 30k resistances wearing 5x light.

My issue with sword and board is moreso that it’s loaded up with cc and pvp offensive abilities making it more potent offensively then other damage weapon lines. If someone wants to be a tank that’s fine. but do they really need a spammable that gives major defile plus stun, or the best charge?

S/B damage abilites is sustained pressure. No one is spamming reverb that knows how to play anyway. Its timed correctly to keep the pressure up with other abilities and dots and its also a melee ability that comes with risk and reward. Its already been nerfed down to four seconds. Stop trying to nerf playstyles that you got beat by.

They don’t beat me, but since defile is seen as too strong for an ultimate I have no idea how people can defend it being on a spammable.

You're intentionally misleading, aren't you? They didn't saw defile as "too strong for an ultimate" per se. They saw that a combination of the following was too much:
instant

stun

good damage

20% damage amplifier

major defile

So stop with this nonsense already.

Exactly, and what is reverberating smash:

- instant
- stun
- good damage
- major defile

The only difference I see is the ultimate has a 20% damage boost and the spammable isn’t an ultimate.

Not every instant cast ability is a spam, or get's used as one. But of course, if you're implying that a reapplication of debuffs/ stuns on cooldown is considered as spamming then sure. Nobody uses Reverb as a spam. Ransack and Heroic are far to compelling as a spam in comparison to this. BTW if you're using Reverb it means you're bound to a specific weapon line. Something that your "ultimate vs "spam" comparison doesn't consider.
Nonetheless that "good damage" is merely around 30% of Incap - and don't act like 20% damage boost is nothing. Or what are you on about? Next patch gank via Reverb?

Honestly, this sounds rather like another episode of "they took mah toys, now I take yours."

imredneckson · May 2019

DarkerDreams wrote: »

imredneckson wrote: »

TheRealPotoroo wrote: »

Blocking costs stamina and I presume you're talking about PVP, in which case leave your nonsense out of PVE where sword and board tanks have suffered bitterly already because of PVP 'balancing'.

^ Dudes right. We PvP players have destroyed much of the game for the PvE community like regening stamina while blocking, heavy attacks with bows, crits with proc sets, and Camo Hunter to name only a few.

No! I really hate every time I see one of these statements. PvP players did not ruin anything for PvE, just as PvE didn't ruin anything for PvP. What ruined it is ZOS not separating the two and trying to "balance" every thing together. (( Of course 'balance' is really code for lets keep moving the bar on purpose without ever really balancing anything ))

And as of a result of ZOS not separating the two, nerfs from PvP have caused a good amount of problems for the PvE community. I'm not saying ZOS could fix this if they wanted to but till then PvP and PvE will be negatively affected by each other.

The Uninvited · May 2019

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I agree with op. Snb builds (with the sets available in heavy armor) can easily tank and deal decent dmg in pvp. A friend if mine call it the tank and spank meta😂

The bolded part is the problem, not the S&B skill line.

The sets are fine. Heavy Armor Passives have already been nerfed, and they aren't very strong compared to Medium and Light passives.

So, you know what specific sets I was thinking about?

Fury
7th
Ravager
Veiled
etc

Those are some of the sets that are popular to complain about for being too strong. I would imagine those are the sets that you are thinking about. Sure you can pull a "You're wrong, I was thinking about... Shalk!" but we both know that isn't true.

You could have stopped after the first 2 sets. Ravager and Veiled are fine, the 7th/Fury combo imo is not.

Ravager? A set that only 1 class can effectively use + demands to deal damage is fine while a set that demands to get critted 25 times is not? Why? Because if grants ~100 more wpn dmg?

Nope, like I said it's the combination of 7th + Fury. With the right CP allocation in the mix, it grants a lot of damage mitigation while still providing a ton of weapon damage.

Chilly-McFreeze · May 2019

The Uninvited wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I agree with op. Snb builds (with the sets available in heavy armor) can easily tank and deal decent dmg in pvp. A friend if mine call it the tank and spank meta😂

The bolded part is the problem, not the S&B skill line.

The sets are fine. Heavy Armor Passives have already been nerfed, and they aren't very strong compared to Medium and Light passives.

So, you know what specific sets I was thinking about?

Fury
7th
Ravager
Veiled
etc

Those are some of the sets that are popular to complain about for being too strong. I would imagine those are the sets that you are thinking about. Sure you can pull a "You're wrong, I was thinking about... Shalk!" but we both know that isn't true.

You could have stopped after the first 2 sets. Ravager and Veiled are fine, the 7th/Fury combo imo is not.

Ravager? A set that only 1 class can effectively use + demands to deal damage is fine while a set that demands to get critted 25 times is not? Why? Because if grants ~100 more wpn dmg?

Nope, like I said it's the combination of 7th + Fury. With the right CP allocation in the mix, it grants a lot of damage mitigation while still providing a ton of weapon damage.

Right. With *** sustain and average at best regen crit.
E: whoopsy

Druid40 · May 2019

kathandira wrote: »

Think of the consequences. It sounds like you are talking about PvP. But think of the other part of the game. If you nerf S&B in PvP, how would that affect PvE? I would rather not have our Tanks in Vet Trials screwed because of PvP.

There are plenty of ways to change the skill line without interfering with tanking. 3 of the skills in the line are used in tanking with 1 of them being situational.

p00tx · May 2019

Players who "tank up" for PvP, outside of support like healers (who get heavily focused, but they're a whole other issue) tend to be less skilled players. Not always (there are always exceptions), but most often. If you can't take down a clumsy, inexperienced player holding block, then the problem is with your own setup. Take off your [presumably] heavy armor and spec better into dmg and penetration, and stop blaming other players for your own build challenges.

Everyone else has already said it, so I don't need to reiterate in detail, but we in the PvP community need to be better about making suggestions that wouldn't instantly gut PvE. Getting through a 4 person instance does not instantly mean you have some amazing insight into PvE and all 12 person content. I would suggest hitting some hm dlc raids before you try to dismiss the whole of PvE off-hand.

The Uninvited · May 2019

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I agree with op. Snb builds (with the sets available in heavy armor) can easily tank and deal decent dmg in pvp. A friend if mine call it the tank and spank meta😂

The bolded part is the problem, not the S&B skill line.

The sets are fine. Heavy Armor Passives have already been nerfed, and they aren't very strong compared to Medium and Light passives.

So, you know what specific sets I was thinking about?

Fury
7th
Ravager
Veiled
etc

Those are some of the sets that are popular to complain about for being too strong. I would imagine those are the sets that you are thinking about. Sure you can pull a "You're wrong, I was thinking about... Shalk!" but we both know that isn't true.

You could have stopped after the first 2 sets. Ravager and Veiled are fine, the 7th/Fury combo imo is not.

Ravager? A set that only 1 class can effectively use + demands to deal damage is fine while a set that demands to get critted 25 times is not? Why? Because if grants ~100 more wpn dmg?

Nope, like I said it's the combination of 7th + Fury. With the right CP allocation in the mix, it grants a lot of damage mitigation while still providing a ton of weapon damage.

Right. With *** sustain and average at best regen crit.
E: whoopsy

https://youtu.be/47MmrX-uUiE

whoopsy indeed. Not my build, just an example

Lumsdenml · May 2019

Kurat wrote: »

Huh, what?

If someone is unkillable tank then why bother, leave him and go after someone else. Most likely he can't kill you either.

No need to make these nerf threads. Do you realize that pve also exists? What are tanks supposed to do then if they cant be tanky.

What's PVE?

Sleep724 · May 2019

The Uninvited wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

sionIV wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I agree with op. Snb builds (with the sets available in heavy armor) can easily tank and deal decent dmg in pvp. A friend if mine call it the tank and spank meta😂

The bolded part is the problem, not the S&B skill line.

The sets are fine. Heavy Armor Passives have already been nerfed, and they aren't very strong compared to Medium and Light passives.

So, you know what specific sets I was thinking about?

Fury
7th
Ravager
Veiled
etc

Those are some of the sets that are popular to complain about for being too strong. I would imagine those are the sets that you are thinking about. Sure you can pull a "You're wrong, I was thinking about... Shalk!" but we both know that isn't true.

You could have stopped after the first 2 sets. Ravager and Veiled are fine, the 7th/Fury combo imo is not.

Ravager? A set that only 1 class can effectively use + demands to deal damage is fine while a set that demands to get critted 25 times is not? Why? Because if grants ~100 more wpn dmg?

Nope, like I said it's the combination of 7th + Fury. With the right CP allocation in the mix, it grants a lot of damage mitigation while still providing a ton of weapon damage.

Right. With *** sustain and average at best regen crit.
E: whoopsy

https://youtu.be/47MmrX-uUiE

whoopsy indeed. Not my build, just an example

What are you trying to say? That a good player can 1vx pugs? So can every other class. Kristofer ESO top 5 videos shows this all the time, good players beating generally average players, no matter their class and setup. Hardly anyone is going to be able to 1vX other good players.

Edit: Apologies as I thought this was a 1vx video. While I do agree having a discussion about possibly over performing armor sets is warranted thats separate from s/b issues.

SoLooney · May 2019

Either the OP is mad that tanks are too tanky cause they have good builds or the OP does garbage damage or people in tanky builds are killing him cause he is a squish

We already suffered the 1h enchant to our 1h handed weapon and now have to run crusher on our staff or bow, learn to play

Ragnarock41 · May 2019

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

implying petsorcs are easier to kill than those 30k hp sword and board tanks

The Uninvited · May 2019

Sleep724 wrote: »

Edit: Apologies as I thought this was a 1vx video. While I do agree having a discussion about possibly over performing armor sets is warranted thats separate from s/b issues.

OP is stating that S/B is the issue of being tanky and still putting out a lot of damage, I say the sets/CP combo is. So I think my comment was warranted in this discussion.

Silver_Strider · May 2019

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Sleep724 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

This is a separate issue, but I would like to point out this is incorrect. You can hit 30k resistances wearing 5x light.

My issue with sword and board is moreso that it’s loaded up with cc and pvp offensive abilities making it more potent offensively then other damage weapon lines. If someone wants to be a tank that’s fine. but do they really need a spammable that gives major defile plus stun, or the best charge?

S/B damage abilites is sustained pressure. No one is spamming reverb that knows how to play anyway. Its timed correctly to keep the pressure up with other abilities and dots and its also a melee ability that comes with risk and reward. Its already been nerfed down to four seconds. Stop trying to nerf playstyles that you got beat by.

They don’t beat me, but since defile is seen as too strong for an ultimate I have no idea how people can defend it being on a spammable.

You're intentionally misleading, aren't you? They didn't saw defile as "too strong for an ultimate" per se. They saw that a combination of the following was too much:
instant

stun

good damage

20% damage amplifier

major defile

So stop with this nonsense already.

Exactly, and what is reverberating smash:

- instant
- stun
- good damage
- major defile

The only difference I see is the ultimate has a 20% damage boost and the spammable isn’t an ultimate.

Not every instant cast ability is a spam, or get's used as one. But of course, if you're implying that a reapplication of debuffs/ stuns on cooldown is considered as spamming then sure. Nobody uses Reverb as a spam. Ransack and Heroic are far to compelling as a spam in comparison to this. BTW if you're using Reverb it means you're bound to a specific weapon line. Something that your "ultimate vs "spam" comparison doesn't consider.
Nonetheless that "good damage" is merely around 30% of Incap - and don't act like 20% damage boost is nothing. Or what are you on about? Next patch gank via Reverb?

Honestly, this sounds rather like another episode of "they took mah toys, now I take yours."

You aren't keeping Incap on CD either since the stun requires 120 Ultimate to even be applicable at all and last I checked, it takes a hell of a lot longer to get 120 ultimate than it is to reapply Reverb. You trying to defend Reverb when it does literally everything that Incap does with the only discrepancy between the 2 being that Reverb hits for less but can being applied on CD with its stun being consistent, vs Incap is a clear bias. I can keep the Defile from Reverb on CD while also being a stamina drain for my opponent due to the 100% guaranteed stun on it vs Incap only having a stun at 120 ultimate. This also makes the damage difference between the 2 moot since Reverb can be applied much more consistently than Incap within the time it takes to get the ultimate required to get another Incap ready to burst again.

You argue "SnB is sustained pressure" and I question what exactly you mean by this in comparison to NB. Heroic/Ransack as spammables can only get you so far on their own, much like SA on a NB only gets you so far on its own. There's no DoT available to either SnB or NB, meaning you have to keep pressure on your target in some way. DK has DoTs to keep pressure going while Warden, Templar and Sorcs have delayed burst combos for their damage but NB has literally nothing but burst attacks to kill their targets with, meaning they need the Defile in order to keep the pressure going to allow their burst to actually succeed so what's the difference? Any skilled player can heal thru burst easily enough since burst can only do so much damage on its own without something to supplement it with meaning you need to rely on an alternative method of keeping pressure on a Target, which was the defile/stun from Incap for NB in the same way that Reverb is used with SnB builds.

Now, before you try bring up Rendering Slashes or some other non NB related skill, let me remind you that "you are bound to a specific weapon line" in order to get those skills in much the same way that you are bound to SnB in order to use Reverb. Being that is the case, how can you argue that Incap was overtuned but Reverb is not, when NB is devoid of any reliable means of applying pressure outside of just bursting harder?

Wuuffyy · May 2019

Ozazz wrote: »

if your not killing in pvp and cant be killed or better yet have 30k health sword and board and over shadow my glass cannon build, or medium armor high damage nb or light armor sorc im sorry the game is busted. there should be more incentive to wear light armor and medium armor then wearing heavy and still out performing these dps rolls, and on top of that pair heavy with sword and board it breaks pvp , also pvp is over saturated with snares and aoe damage wonder whos fault that is

Cept LA armor and medium armor tanks r the problem now

glavius · May 2019

Reverb: only 4 second defile, costly and low damage.
Ransack: cheap and has major fracture, but low damage for a spammable.
Heroic slash: ok damage and snare, but very costly

If you Bash weave you do gain some damage, but it costs a ton. (Heroic Bash weave costs almost 4k stam per weave)

Also while the line offers great debuff, it's not like you can fit them all in one build generally.

Iskiab · May 2019

glavius wrote: »

Reverb: only 4 second defile, costly and low damage.
Ransack: cheap and has major fracture, but low damage for a spammable.
Heroic slash: ok damage and snare, but very costly

If you Bash weave you do gain some damage, but it costs a ton. (Heroic Bash weave costs almost 4k stam per weave)

Also while the line offers great debuff, it's not like you can fit them all in one build generally.

I don’t think anyone’s talking about S&B/S&B builds. It’s moreso that combining sword and board with another weapon skill line allows being tanky with great cc/abilities, then being able to swop to another skill line for burst.

It’s the ultimate generation, Major defile plus stun switching to the other bar and doing high damage combination that is powerful.