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Make skins available from normal dungeons, since ZOS locked the other thread to avoid this issue.

  • xxthir13enxx
    xxthir13enxx
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    I think this boils down too...

    a Long story short: people want to be paid to much for carries! Make it easier to get so I don’t have to pay so much!
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    Wolfkeks wrote: »
    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    I'm not assuming anything, so let me ask you your opinion to hear it from you.

    Why do you think it is wrong that people sell skin runs?

    Because I've been in random dungeons with people who have obviously gotten these "skins" from being carried and they don't know JACK *** what they are doing and the problem here is that they think they are actually good at the game.

    tbh stopping carries (so one one who didn't work for it gets the skin) or putting skins in the crown store (so everyone has this shiny skin) it's not gonna stop bad random dungeon experiences. :tongue:

    Also depending if you got the achievement on your healer but play a tank later on with your skin on for the first time can make a difference :tongue: I have an awesome healer friend who makes sure everyone is alive in vHoF but can't tank to save his life :tongue:

    Anyways, hope you have better luck next time and a better dungeon experience in general.

    It will stop the zone chat chatter for blatantly asking for carries with "paying", which we all know is routed through real money transactions.
    What problem, OP? I guess you just have neither the skill, nor the gold to get the titles and skins...

    weakness.jpg


    Wow a board warrior who probably doesn't have the faintest clue what this issue is really about.

    It seems the only issue is your own ego.

    Also, inb4 another one of your threads is locked.

    lol at least I highlight an issue in the game THAT IS SPIRALING OUT OF CONTROL.

    You hear that ZOS? This issue is driving your playerbase to QUIT because it demoralizes the people playing.

    You need to bite this in the butt now or it's gonna be your death nail.

    Ham is spiraling out of control.

    Most players are quitting because of server performance, not skins.

    OMG lol shows me how much you don't play this game.

    Like wow!

    If you know of people paying outside the game for carries, please report them via a ticket and provide evidence of such. If you dont have any, crawl back under your bridge. I play the game every day. Whether or not someone has something shiny doesnt bother me. How they get it bothers me even less.

    Oh good for you but most of the population in ESO doesn't think like you. I wish they would and then zone chat wouldn't be cluttered with people advertising for skin carries.
  • Druid40
    Druid40
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    It seems clear this is just outrage for the sake of outrage. Can we get another lock?
  • Ogou
    Ogou
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    Ogou wrote: »
    What is the point of Vet if there aren't rewards only available from Vet?

    Like it or not, players with more skill get more rewards.

    Else there'd be no point in playing higher difficulty.

    Get good.


    Er did you not get the point? THIS is the point right but people are PAYING for end game content that they are not getting by their own merits.

    Has nothing to do with "get good". Rather for yourself, "get smart".

    I mean, it is a group achievement, not an individual one. However a particular got in the group is irrelevant if they were still able to complete the trial/dungeon.

    Dude most of the guilds selling these skins can finish the dungeons with 10 man can easily carry 1 or 2 people with them having to do ANYTHING AT ALL.

    Do you even play this game?

    So? They were still part of the group and they earned the skin, even if their only contribution to the group was monetary. I don't why that is a problem.
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    I think this boils down too...

    a Long story short: people want to be paid to much for carries! Make it easier to get so I don’t have to pay so much!

    I have millions in my bank account. I don't need it to be cheaper because I'd never pay for something stupid like that in the first place.

    What does offend me is seeing zone chat cluttered up people blatantly asking to PAY for carries, which highlights to me an increasing problem in this game.
  • tmbrinks
    tmbrinks
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    Billdor wrote: »
    tmbrinks wrote: »
    Yikes. Skins convey absolutely no competitive advantage, thus cannot be P2W.

    Its quite simple, OP can't do the content or afford a boost so here he is whining.

    Oh, I know. Entitlement at its finest.
    The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Xalvakka's Scourge - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer
    The Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger
    71,345 achievement points
  • moses1763
    moses1763
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    Druid40 wrote: »
    It seems clear this is just outrage for the sake of outrage. Can we get another lock?

    I second that!
    Live, Laugh, and Hope!
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    Druid40 wrote: »
    It seems clear this is just outrage for the sake of outrage. Can we get another lock?

    It seems clear to me that people like you want to shut this issue up because you've already paid for a skin and don't want to feel ashamed of it or you are in those guilds benefitting financially from doing carries.

    What is the reason why you want a lock on this thread if it doesn't matter?
  • reoskit
    reoskit
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    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    For that matter most of you have stated you don't care about these skins right?

    So why not ask ZOS to make it available to everyone in the game by changing it so that they can get it through NORMAL dungeons?

    I mean its only COSMETIC right?

    So what exactly is the issue now then?

    HMM?
  • Kalgert
    Kalgert
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    What is the point of Vet if there aren't rewards only available from Vet?

    To challenge one's self. Bragging rights that you completed a dungeon on a harder difficulty (Though if you really need this in your life, then you must have nothing better going on in your life). Better loot drops.

    Need I go on?
    Edited by Kalgert on May 3, 2019 4:17PM
  • tmbrinks
    tmbrinks
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    Druid40 wrote: »
    It seems clear this is just outrage for the sake of outrage. Can we get another lock?

    It seems clear to me that people like you want to shut this issue up because you've already paid for a skin and don't want to feel ashamed of it or you are in those guilds benefitting financially from doing carries.

    What is the reason why you want a lock on this thread if it doesn't matter?

    I would like to shut this issue down, and I've never, ever, ever paid for a skin, yet I have them all... I want it shut down because it's a complete non-issue.
    The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Xalvakka's Scourge - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer
    The Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger
    71,345 achievement points
  • idk
    idk
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    What problem, OP? I guess you just have neither the skill, nor the gold to get the titles and skins...

    weakness.jpg


    Wow a board warrior who probably doesn't have the faintest clue what this issue is really about.

    It seems the only issue is your own ego.

    Also, inb4 another one of your threads is locked.

    lol at least I highlight an issue in the game THAT IS SPIRALING OUT OF CONTROL.

    You hear that ZOS? This issue is driving your playerbase to QUIT because it demoralizes the people playing.

    You need to bite this in the butt now or it's gonna be your death nail.

    The person you quoted was responding to a condescending post you made, not about the skins. Yes, Zos should take your advice and bit this in the butt, but I am not talking about the skins.
  • Kiralyn2000
    Kiralyn2000
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    What does offend me is seeing zone chat cluttered up people blatantly asking to PAY for carries, which highlights to me an increasing problem in this game.

    To me, that's no different than someone asking in chat to pay a 9-trait crafter for their expertise. After all, they're using gold to get something (9-trait crafted gear) that they didn't "earn" themselves.

    If the craftsman is skilled enough to provide the service (getting through a trial with dead weight along for the ride), shouldn't they be able to gain compensation for it?

    edit: and hey! How "traditional fantasy" is it, for a rich dude to hire mercenaries to get him through danger/adventure! :D

    edit2: damn, Aragorn & Co totally carried those Hobbits all the way to Gondor.
    Edited by Kiralyn2000 on May 3, 2019 4:19PM
  • ManwithBeard9
    ManwithBeard9
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    Druid40 wrote: »
    It seems clear this is just outrage for the sake of outrage. Can we get another lock?

    It seems clear to me that people like you want to shut this issue up because you've already paid for a skin and don't want to feel ashamed of it or you are in those guilds benefitting financially from doing carries.

    What is the reason why you want a lock on this thread if it doesn't matter?

    Because you're filling up the forum with constant toxicity. You've already had, what, 4? 5? threads locked because of keyboard raging over the same issue? How many more locked threads until you get a ban from the forums?
  • tmbrinks
    tmbrinks
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    reoskit wrote: »
    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.

    I'd counter that research scrolls and horse training lessons fall into a similar category. But none as P2W as you can obtain all in-game.
    The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Xalvakka's Scourge - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer
    The Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger
    71,345 achievement points
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    reoskit wrote: »
    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.

    I am becoming increasingly aware of people like you on these forums who mostly have a mouth and no real presence in the game.

    If you were an active player you'd understand the issue in zone chat daily.

    But it really makes me question the quality of people who are giving feedback on forums like this because it really shows that most of you have simply no clue what really happens in the game nor the issues that are present in this game.
  • DeadlyRecluse
    DeadlyRecluse
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    I got carried (for free, but still) for a VMoL skin. AMA.
    Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub
  • tmbrinks
    tmbrinks
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    Kalgert wrote: »
    What is the point of Vet if there aren't rewards only available from Vet?

    To challenge one's self. Bragging rights that you completed a dungeon on a harder difficulty (Though if you really need this in your life, then you must have nothing better going on in your life). Better loot drops.

    Need I go on?

    Can I counter with the thread from a few weeks ago that said "Perfected gear shouldn't drop in Veteran modes?"

    You can't have both... lol
    The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Xalvakka's Scourge - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer
    The Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger
    71,345 achievement points
  • DocFrost72
    DocFrost72
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    For that matter most of you have stated you don't care about these skins right?

    So why not ask ZOS to make it available to everyone in the game by changing it so that they can get it through NORMAL dungeons?

    I mean its only COSMETIC right?

    So what exactly is the issue now then?

    HMM?

    I am afraid it will not solve the issue you shared with me, but I am for normal dropping a different skin! Like perfected and non perfected.
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    Druid40 wrote: »
    It seems clear this is just outrage for the sake of outrage. Can we get another lock?

    It seems clear to me that people like you want to shut this issue up because you've already paid for a skin and don't want to feel ashamed of it or you are in those guilds benefitting financially from doing carries.

    What is the reason why you want a lock on this thread if it doesn't matter?

    Because you're filling up the forum with constant toxicity. You've already had, what, 4? 5? threads locked because of keyboard raging over the same issue? How many more locked threads until you get a ban from the forums?

    Actually no this is only my send time on this topic. So its obviously affecting others as well who actually play the game and are not board warriors.
  • tmbrinks
    tmbrinks
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    reoskit wrote: »
    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.

    I am becoming increasingly aware of people like you on these forums who mostly have a mouth and no real presence in the game.

    If you were an active player you'd understand the issue in zone chat daily.

    But it really makes me question the quality of people who are giving feedback on forums like this because it really shows that most of you have simply no clue what really happens in the game nor the issues that are present in this game.

    How's it an issue? Ignore the text and move on.
    The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Xalvakka's Scourge - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer
    The Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger
    71,345 achievement points
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    For that matter most of you have stated you don't care about these skins right?

    So why not ask ZOS to make it available to everyone in the game by changing it so that they can get it through NORMAL dungeons?

    I mean its only COSMETIC right?

    So what exactly is the issue now then?

    HMM?

    I am afraid it will not solve the issue you shared with me, but I am for normal dropping a different skin! Like perfected and non perfected.

    Why? just make it the same skin. I don't understand this reasoning. People are already paying for the cosmetic and they are going to continue to do so anyway.

  • reoskit
    reoskit
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    reoskit wrote: »
    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.

    I am becoming increasingly aware of people like you on these forums who mostly have a mouth and no real presence in the game.

    If you were an active player you'd understand the issue in zone chat daily.

    But it really makes me question the quality of people who are giving feedback on forums like this because it really shows that most of you have simply no clue what really happens in the game nor the issues that are present in this game.

    LOLOL. I'm the GM of one of the top trade guilds on PCNA, I've played since beta, and obviously play daily. Try again.
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    tmbrinks wrote: »
    reoskit wrote: »
    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.

    I am becoming increasingly aware of people like you on these forums who mostly have a mouth and no real presence in the game.

    If you were an active player you'd understand the issue in zone chat daily.

    But it really makes me question the quality of people who are giving feedback on forums like this because it really shows that most of you have simply no clue what really happens in the game nor the issues that are present in this game.

    How's it an issue? Ignore the text and move on.

    It's an issue for people who actually play the game and not live on the forums like most of you do.
  • LightMaster7
    LightMaster7
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    reoskit wrote: »
    reoskit wrote: »
    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.

    I am becoming increasingly aware of people like you on these forums who mostly have a mouth and no real presence in the game.

    If you were an active player you'd understand the issue in zone chat daily.

    But it really makes me question the quality of people who are giving feedback on forums like this because it really shows that most of you have simply no clue what really happens in the game nor the issues that are present in this game.

    LOLOL. I'm the GM of one of the top trade guilds on PCNA, I've played since beta, and obviously play daily. Try again.

    LOL trade guld LOL

    WTF? TRADE GUILD? LOL
  • Billdor
    Billdor
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    Billdor wrote: »
    Why doesn't ZOS change it so that MOST of the playerbase can just get the skins from NORMAL dungeons?

    This would solve the problem ingame currently of people "PAYING" for the skin carries.

    I do not understand why ZOS is locking this subject when this is RAMPANT in their own game and will not come out with an official position on where they stand on the issue?
    DID YOU HEAR THAT ZOS? What is YOUR thinking on this. Please tell me now so that if you agree this is ok to do, I will quit this game the next day and find another game to play. STOP locking thread and avoiding the issue, put it to rest by stating a position so it is clear WHERE YOU STAND ON IT.

    So all those people who were against the idea of putting skins in the store can now agree right that it should be ok to make the change so that MOST people can access these skins from normal versions of those dungeons since to YOU it doesn't really mean anything or it is not PAY2WIN?

    Bold of you to assume that there is a "problem ingme currently of people "PAYING" for the skin carries". You do the hardest content and you get the most appealing rewards, until then jog on and stop whining.

    Every god damn game there is somebody whining about the hardest content, if it isn't WoW its ESO..

    Dude read the thread. I'm not complaining about hard content. I'm complaining that people are PAYING to get through hard content to get a "skin".

    Do you understand or do you need someone to interpret english for you?

    I'm not reading a thread. You put little effort into a thread and I'll put little effort into a response.

    I brought a vMoL boost, whatcha gonna do? Nothing
  • moses1763
    moses1763
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    reoskit wrote: »
    A couple points:
    • All the caps make you sound a bit maniacal.
    • ZOS closed your other thread; recreating it and jumbling the words a bit doesn't actually mean you've created something new. This one will prob get locked too.
    • When the thread gets locked, it's not some coverup conspiracy. It just means these threads are completely going off the rails and are not constructive.

    FWIW, the only toe we've stepped into P2W is the skyshard unlock, and that's more pay to advance quickly, as those are achievable in game. And while skyshards are admittedly a concerning step in the wrong direction, skins do not make you more powerful. Buying a dungeon carry does not even approach P2W.

    Take a breath, take a walk, take a break. There are so many worthwhile things to get worked up over; this is not one of them.

    I am becoming increasingly aware of people like you on these forums who mostly have a mouth and no real presence in the game.

    If you were an active player you'd understand the issue in zone chat daily.

    But it really makes me question the quality of people who are giving feedback on forums like this because it really shows that most of you have simply no clue what really happens in the game nor the issues that are present in this game.

    ok You got me insults really pushed me over the edge "how much crowns gold etc do you need m8? no worries I gots plenty but fair warning you will not like the interest rates m8!"

    Live, Laugh, and Hope!
  • Starlock
    Starlock
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    I am becoming increasingly aware of people like you on these forums who mostly have a mouth and no real presence in the game.

    If you were an active player you'd understand the issue in zone chat daily.

    What platform do you play on? Which zones do you frequent?

    I ask because I am an active player and I'm not seeing a plague of people depending upon Tamriel to advertise these services. I've seen it a few times, which is a few times more than I recall in the past, but it doesn't seem like it has a big presence by any means. It is far more often that I see some scammer posting they are buying various materials at well below market rates.
  • DocFrost72
    DocFrost72
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    DocFrost72 wrote: »
    For that matter most of you have stated you don't care about these skins right?

    So why not ask ZOS to make it available to everyone in the game by changing it so that they can get it through NORMAL dungeons?

    I mean its only COSMETIC right?

    So what exactly is the issue now then?

    HMM?

    I am afraid it will not solve the issue you shared with me, but I am for normal dropping a different skin! Like perfected and non perfected.

    Why? just make it the same skin. I don't understand this reasoning. People are already paying for the cosmetic and they are going to continue to do so anyway.

    I don't have an opinion on normals giving the current skins. If you want I can think on it and try to articulate an opinion on that.

    My comment is just that is do not think this will help your random group experience, and I do genuinely want to help there.
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