So ...like gap closers are now useless for gap closing

Xsorus · April 2019

You pretty much are required to have some form of CC to make them somewhat useful...because the change to the removal of that small snare window means by the time you land on the target they will have already moved away from that position.

Its basically the reason I didn't bother using the Dragon Knight "Pull" ...because by the time I landed at the target they had already moved away.

Elhan · April 2019

well, they also said:

"Drastically increased the speed of all of these abilities, and increased their auxiliary effects’ (damage, debuffs, etc.) range to ensure they always apply to their target."

did you test it before crying?

Rikumaru · April 2019

Sorry, the only purpose that snare had was for zerging some poor player down with uncounterable snares. This patch is looking incredible with ZOS undoing / fixing many of the past mistakes. First time in so long I've been excited for a patch.

CatchMeTrolling · April 2019

Think it’s a good change , so many times where multiple people just spam gap close on you just to snare you down. I mean I could be right in front of them and they’re spamming it to lock me down.

Sheuib · April 2019

Yeah I am thinking that the changes to gap closers are going to make everyone happy. No snares but hopefully everything hits. And, the bonus I am thinking that a faster gap closer is going to be fun to play.

MashmalloMan · April 2019

Xsorus wrote: »

You pretty much are required to have some form of CC to make them somewhat useful...because the change to the removal of that small snare window means by the time you land on the target they will have already moved away from that position.

Its basically the reason I didn't bother using the Dragon Knight "Pull" ...because by the time I landed at the target they had already moved away.

So it sounds like you tested it right?

Sleep724 · April 2019

Crit rush new spammable?

robpr · April 2019

Sleep724 wrote: »

Crit rush new spammable?

Empowering Chains

Sleep724 · April 2019

robpr wrote: »

Sleep724 wrote: »

Crit rush new spammable?

Empowering Chains

Oh lawd, nooo. There is already enough pug DK players spamming chains in cyrodill

e-rwan · April 2019

Sleep724 wrote: »

Crit rush new spammable?

If I understand the patch correctly, only gap closer ability that used to have a snare attached will recieve a buff, so crit rush will not be affected by the change, stampede will.

correct me if i'm wrong.

katorga · April 2019

e-rwan wrote: »

Sleep724 wrote: »

Crit rush new spammable?

If I understand the patch correctly, only gap closer ability that used to have a snare attached will recieve a buff, so crit rush will not be affected by the change, stampede will.

correct me if i'm wrong.

Different kind of snare. gap closers have a hidden snare to freeze the target enough to allow them to land, other wise you landed where the target was. It is not affected by snare immunity. Stampede has a normal snare debuff applied after it lands. That one is affected by snare immunity.

wheem_ESO · April 2019

On the PTS I'm showing Stampede as having a 60% snare for 4 seconds now, instead of 8 seconds as before, despite there not being anything in the patch notes about this change. Regardless, I welcome the duration nerf wholeheartedly; I see no reason for a spammable gap closer to have the highest % snare in the game attached to it (what with 70% snares not being a thing anymore, and the 60% snare on Wall of Frost being nerfed down to 40%). And especially not for a duration that is superior to all other snares that don't require you to stand in a specific place...

Xsorus · April 2019

Elhan wrote: »

well, they also said:

"Drastically increased the speed of all of these abilities, and increased their auxiliary effects’ (damage, debuffs, etc.) range to ensure they always apply to their target."

did you test it before crying?

Yea that doesn't matter, it makes me think you did not actually use a gap closer before.

Unless you're instantly put next to the target, the target will always be outside your range when you arrive.

Xsorus · April 2019

wheem_ESO wrote: »

On the PTS I'm showing Stampede as having a 60% snare for 4 seconds now, instead of 8 seconds as before, despite there not being anything in the patch notes about this change. Regardless, I welcome the duration nerf wholeheartedly; I see no reason for a spammable gap closer to have the highest % snare in the game attached to it (what with 70% snares not being a thing anymore, and the 60% snare on Wall of Frost being nerfed down to 40%). And especially not for a duration that is superior to all other snares that don't require you to stand in a specific place...

Stampede i believe was changed a patch or two ago to just be 4 seconds long.

evoniee · April 2019

i like the change. nobody like to get perma snared and need to use snare removal every 4/ 2 sec because zerg pleb spam a stampede over and over.

zyk · April 2019

Didn't ZOS nerf gap closers within the last year? It wasn't that long ago.

The circus continues. There is no vision or long game. This is a studio that earns its income from cosmetics and the TES brand, so their game designers can get away with being completely whimsical.

I'm not for or against this particular change, though I don't prefer gap closers and liked that they were disincentivized previously. But the constant yoyo is annoying.

It's like Siege in AvA. Five years in and ZOS still doesn't know how strong it should be.

wheem_ESO · April 2019

Xsorus wrote: »

wheem_ESO wrote: »

On the PTS I'm showing Stampede as having a 60% snare for 4 seconds now, instead of 8 seconds as before, despite there not being anything in the patch notes about this change. Regardless, I welcome the duration nerf wholeheartedly; I see no reason for a spammable gap closer to have the highest % snare in the game attached to it (what with 70% snares not being a thing anymore, and the 60% snare on Wall of Frost being nerfed down to 40%). And especially not for a duration that is superior to all other snares that don't require you to stand in a specific place...

Stampede i believe was changed a patch or two ago to just be 4 seconds long.

Huh, I could have sworn it was still 8 seconds on live, but just double checked and it's listed as 4 now. Still, good change whenever it happened.

Tannus15 · April 2019

And most importantly you can now use tormentor to tank

Xsorus · April 2019

Tannus15 wrote: »

And most importantly you can now use tormentor to tank

There is quite a few things you can do with it now with no min range (VMA two hander now is easier to use *shrug*)

But it makes gap closers not really gap closers anymore..but just another button to push..

Crit Rush probably will be used as something to proc crit based proc sets for example.

Heimpai · April 2019

https://youtu.be/XuMULsPy0hs

Yep absolutely useless

zyk · April 2019

Xsorus wrote: »

But it makes gap closers not really gap closers anymore..but just another button to push..

Crit Rush probably will be used as something to proc crit based proc sets for example.

I'm not looking forward to feeling compelled to use gap closers as part of standard rotations when an opponent is already close to me. This will be the case with Teleport Strike, at least, and probably others.

I don't know what ZOS is thinking. Maybe after nerfing mobility, they are buffing gap closers to deal with streaking sorcs? Who knows.

Joy_Division · April 2019

zyk wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

But it makes gap closers not really gap closers anymore..but just another button to push..

Crit Rush probably will be used as something to proc crit based proc sets for example.

I'm not looking forward to feeling compelled to use gap closers as part of standard rotations when an opponent is already close to me. This will be the case with Teleport Strike, at least, and probably others.

I don't know what ZOS is thinking. Maybe after nerfing mobility, they are buffing gap closers to deal with streaking sorcs? Who knows.

Someone on the combat team probably (finally) played a templar and realized Toppling Charge is a joke of a skill that's too slow to hit anything that's moving. Maybe this person was around at launch and remembered this same useless skill was once fast enough to hit everything and anything (and thus wasn't useless) and asked, "Why did we slow these down and implement the miserable auto-snare to fix the very problem we created by slowing them down in the first place?"

People with gap closers should have zero effect on my movement just for pressing a button. Period. And the people using gap-closer should have a reasonable expectation that those skills will hit their targets and be useful. It's a win-win, one of the few decisions ZOS has made where my support is 1000%.

zyk · April 2019

Joy_Division wrote: »

Someone on the combat team probably (finally) played a templar and realized Toppling Charge is a joke of a skill that's too slow to hit anything that's moving. Maybe this person was around at launch and remembered this same useless skill was once fast enough to hit everything and anything (and thus wasn't useless) and asked, "Why did we slow these down and implement the miserable auto-snare to fix the very problem we created by slowing them down in the first place?"

People with gap closers should have zero effect on my movement just for pressing a button. Period. And the people using gap-closer should have a reasonable expectation that those skills will hit their targets and be useful. It's a win-win, one of the few decisions ZOS has made where my support is 1000%.

I remember gap closers when they had no extra snare or immobilization. They were highly unreliable at times, so it will be interesting to see how useful they are in the upcoming update.

But I meant in terms of philosophy. Gap closers were pretty common before ZOS nerfed them last year. I don't play Templar, but other gap closers generally worked well previously. They were deemed to be too powerful because they did high damage and eliminated hard earned space between opponents. They are uncommon now because they had their damage reduced across the board. Now we seem to be going back to square one.

Personally, I prefer gameplay without gap closers. When they were common, it gave melee builds too great an advantage against ranged builds IMO. I think there is good balance between ranged and melee now. This will soon be upset when soft CCs are further nerfed and gap closers are buffed.

Olupajmibanan · April 2019

zyk wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Someone on the combat team probably (finally) played a templar and realized Toppling Charge is a joke of a skill that's too slow to hit anything that's moving. Maybe this person was around at launch and remembered this same useless skill was once fast enough to hit everything and anything (and thus wasn't useless) and asked, "Why did we slow these down and implement the miserable auto-snare to fix the very problem we created by slowing them down in the first place?"

People with gap closers should have zero effect on my movement just for pressing a button. Period. And the people using gap-closer should have a reasonable expectation that those skills will hit their targets and be useful. It's a win-win, one of the few decisions ZOS has made where my support is 1000%.

I remember gap closers when they had no extra snare or immobilization. They were highly unreliable at times, so it will be interesting to see how useful they are in the upcoming update.

But I meant in terms of philosophy. Gap closers were pretty common before ZOS nerfed them last year. I don't play Templar, but other gap closers generally worked well previously. They were deemed to be too powerful because they did high damage and eliminated hard earned space between opponents. They are uncommon now because they had their damage reduced across the board. Now we seem to be going back to square one.

Personally, I prefer gameplay without gap closers. When they were common, it gave melee builds too great an advantage against ranged builds IMO. I think there is good balance between ranged and melee now. This will soon be upset when soft CCs are further nerfed and gap closers are buffed.

Seeing a bigger picture, I don't think that ranged will complain about melee and their gap closers. Uh ehm um Race Against Time uhm ehm.

Amorpho · April 2019

I'm actually quite happy with this change and I feel its long overdue. It also makes my templar so much stronger. Toppling charge now finally gap closes without minimum distance, and also provides CC and off-balance! With regards to crit charge, I can easily see it coupled with Night Mother's Gaze to proc major breach (Nightblades, can you hear me 😉)

GeorgeBlack · April 2019

Dragon Knight does not have a real gap closer. It's a joke

Magplar has
Nightblade has
MagSorc
2h has
SnB has

And they are not useless. You can catch up to any target using them again.

josh.lackey_ESO · April 2019

Joy_Division wrote: »

Someone on the combat team probably (finally) played a templar and realized Toppling Charge is a joke of a skill that's too slow to hit anything that's moving.

And with the minimum range gone, it's actually really useful. You can use it as a stun and as a gap closer. No more knocking someone out of sweeps range with a javelin!

Aedaryl · April 2019

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

Dragon Knight does not have a real gap closer. It's a joke

Magplar has
Nightblade has
MagSorc
2h has
SnB has

And they are not useless. You can catch up to any target using them again.

Mag sorc doesn't have a gap closer.

And magdk has one of the best gap closer, called chains.

DK gap closer is not the joke here.

Anethum · April 2019

Xsorus wrote: »

Elhan wrote: »

well, they also said:

"Drastically increased the speed of all of these abilities, and increased their auxiliary effects’ (damage, debuffs, etc.) range to ensure they always apply to their target."

did you test it before crying?

Yea that doesn't matter, it makes me think you did not actually use a gap closer before.

Unless you're instantly put next to the target, the target will always be outside your range when you arrive.

Gilliam and Brian told about this change much at last ESO LIve. They've made bigger distance for gap closers to make them always landing on target. U can watch it yourself at Bethesda twitch

Chilly-McFreeze · April 2019

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

Dragon Knight does not have a real gap closer. It's a joke

Magplar has
Nightblade has
MagSorc
2h has
SnB has

And they are not useless. You can catch up to any target using them again.

Did you just put Streak into this whole gap closer affair?

Tommy_The_Gun · April 2019

Elhan wrote: »

well, they also said:

"Drastically increased the speed of all of these abilities, and increased their auxiliary effects’ (damage, debuffs, etc.) range to ensure they always apply to their target."

did you test it before crying?

LOL I remeber them reducing the speed on all gap closers simply because they were unable to find a fix for the situations were ppl by using gap closer on someone entering the keep were able to "enter" the with them (accidentally or not).