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Faction Lock (on main campaigns) is wrong & a bad decision
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Merlight✭✭✭✭✭The group that's not being considered here are casual pvp'ers who primarily want to get tier 1 rewards so they get the geode with 50 transmute crystals at the end of the campaign. If you did a poll, I think you'd find a significant portion of your pvp base fits in that later group.
Right. Someone who gets tier 1 over the course of a 30-day campaign is not a member of pvp base, not even casual.
How about removing geodes from end-of-campaign REWARD? That'd show who's there for pvp, and who's only interested in harvesting REWARDs with multiple characters.
You can actually be there for both though. Playing 15 characters for the time to get tier 1 on each is absolutely no different pvp wise than playing 1 character for that same amount of time. In both instances you are pvping for x amount of time.
Mathematically, that makes sense. Although I find it hard to believe that you absolutely need to play all 15 characters in every 30-day campaign period. Why can't you choose a faction for the month, and play those 5, each for 3x the amount of time?Just 1 way you get transmute stones as well. I run 15 characters. Having access to a ton of stones is the only affordable and time efficient method of gearing them up or trying new builds.
And here we are back at REWARDs. If you have a problem with how the new rules affect REWARDs, then request changes to how they do REWARDs. Just please keep the REWARDs argument out of the discussion about whether faction lock is good or bad for pvp.
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jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The group that's not being considered here are casual pvp'ers who primarily want to get tier 1 rewards so they get the geode with 50 transmute crystals at the end of the campaign. If you did a poll, I think you'd find a significant portion of your pvp base fits in that later group.
Right. Someone who gets tier 1 over the course of a 30-day campaign is not a member of pvp base, not even casual.
How about removing geodes from end-of-campaign REWARD? That'd show who's there for pvp, and who's only interested in harvesting REWARDs with multiple characters.
You can actually be there for both though. Playing 15 characters for the time to get tier 1 on each is absolutely no different pvp wise than playing 1 character for that same amount of time. In both instances you are pvping for x amount of time.
Mathematically, that makes sense. Although I find it hard to believe that you absolutely need to play all 15 characters in every 30-day campaign period. Why can't you choose a faction for the month, and play those 5, each for 3x the amount of time?Just 1 way you get transmute stones as well. I run 15 characters. Having access to a ton of stones is the only affordable and time efficient method of gearing them up or trying new builds.
And here we are back at REWARDs. If you have a problem with how the new rules affect REWARDs, then request changes to how they do REWARDs. Just please keep the REWARDs argument out of the discussion about whether faction lock is good or bad for pvp.
The two are intertwined. You can't just throw out one aspect of the argument because it doesn't support your claims. And again I'll ask, what is the difference between a player spending 20 hours on 1 character or 20 hours across 15 characters, other than your made up faction loyalty? Faction loyalty, that made up thing that Zos has deliberately allowed the entire playerbase to ignore for 3+ years now.
For what it is worth, I only have EP characters. I hate the faction lock, and will not be going anywhere near it. Why? Because it promotes dominating the map with one faction. Which is the least healthy pvp there is in this game. Having a campaign that is completely dominated by a faction that is basically just gate camping everyone is awful gameplay. And I refuse to support it. And anyone who thinks this isn't going to happen are deluding themselves.
Most of the complaints about faction swapping revolve around empty, unhealthy campaigns. If players were actually playing in Vivec (Xbox NA) on an actual pop-locked campaign, the problems that are repeatedly mentioned are nearly impossible because the factions are all at the population cap. You can't just switch back and forth at will without waiting in queues during primetime.3 -
Kikke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Faction locks are a good thing, and I can still get all my characters in on same campaign. Sweet. Faction loyal for the win!Cleared Trials:
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JykJax✭✭Mathematically, that makes sense. Although I find it hard to believe that you absolutely need to play all 15 characters in every 30-day campaign period. Why can't you choose a faction for the month, and play those 5, each for 3x the amount of time?
Why i should? It takes time to level and gear up 15 [b]different characters, each one with different playstyle.
To keep everybody happy, i think that would be enough to add 2 servers(CP and no CP) without faction locks. So everyone could play the way he would prefere1 -
DivineFirstYOLO✭✭✭✭DisgracefulMind wrote: »MrSinister213 wrote: »DisgracefulMind wrote: »
Why not reduce the otick AP? And if people are grinding to AR50...they're doing it on one alliance.
That could work or add something like a 3k base to defense ticks to reward and encourage defenders, encourage pvp. I spend 80% of my time on AD PC NA lately, and from my perspective majority want to pvdoor not just because it offers them their best chance at the most ap/hr but also because it usually doesnt involve pvp. Lowering the Otick to 3k would probably still be this type of players best way to make the most ap xD
We shouldn't even be taking people who want to avoid PvP into consideration; they should have to PvP to make AP, end of story.
That being said, I think removing base oTick AP and only rewarding it if there are enemies killed on keep grounds would actually have a lot more of a positive impact to PvP than hard faction locks.
You are so damn right! This 6-7 base tick for not doing anything but zerging an (almost) empty keep is only rewarding people that don't want to PvP.
..and by the way.. stealth (perma sneak) also allows people to avoid PvP, too many try to avoid PvP until they can Xv1 you...Zerg Squad
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Miswar✭✭✭✭✭Alienoutlaw wrote: »best thing to happen to PVP for a long time
This absolutely. What took ZoS so long to do it is mind boggling.
All these glory hunters, alliance hoppers can still swap their characters at the other campaign so no need to cry about it.7 -
Gnozo✭✭✭✭✭
✭It just hurst pvp thats all.
We mainly play DC and we found a really good player in EP side who created and DC character just to play with us in Vivec. Why Vivec? Other campaigns are simply dead....
So what will this so? Force him to pick a side and force him with wich friends He can play pvp for 30 days.
If He picks DC to come with us, He wont be able to play his EP chars on the popular campaign. Shor is simply not populated enough to play there on a regular Basis. Thats basicly RIP for him.
Also what if your faction is dominating cyro. Having all keeps and Scrolls and just farming the game other alliances on their gates. Do you consider this fun? We normally switched to the Underdog to get decents fight and restore the Balance. Not possible anymore.
PvP will just become more zergy then ever before and a dominant alliance will be even stronger cause players wont be able to switch to restore the Balance.
Do you guys think it will prevent spies or AP farming? No. It wont.
Spies will simply home Sotha and guest on Vivec to freely swap around alliances.
Ap farm doesnt require to switch sides tbh.3 -
Miswar✭✭✭✭✭Really nothing personal... do you guys even READ the notes.
Nothing has changed to you.. you can still swap your toons like socks at non locked campaign with your friends also you can farm your geodes etc just as you have.
...people really should learn to comprehend what they read. Despite that everyone have a nice day...4 -
iaminc✭✭✭✭Best thing to happen on EUPS.
Now DC and EP might actually fight against each other instead of double zerging together vs AD and DC may also stop giving EP keeps 😂2 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Really nothing personal... do you guys even READ the notes.
Nothing has changed to you.. you can still swap your toons like socks at non locked campaign with your friends also you can farm your geodes etc just as you have.
...people really should learn to comprehend what they read. Despite that everyone have a nice day...
Apparently you are the one who cannot comprehend. Nothing changed would mean a 30-day unlocked campaign. Instead we get a 7-day unlocked campaign. So everything has changed.7 -
vamp_emily✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The only problem I see is maybe they should add a 7 Day No CP campaign. Other than that the players can choose which campaign to play in. If you are a "I want to play with my friends" player then play the 7 day CP enabled campaign.
To me it isn't a big issue. You play in alliance locked campaign, then you and your friends can agree to play in one of the unlocked campaigns when you want to play with each other.
If you want a friend, get a dog.
AW Rank: Grand Warlord 1 ( level 49)4 -
Miswar✭✭✭✭✭Really nothing personal... do you guys even READ the notes.
Nothing has changed to you.. you can still swap your toons like socks at non locked campaign with your friends also you can farm your geodes etc just as you have.
...people really should learn to comprehend what they read. Despite that everyone have a nice day...
Apparently you are the one who cannot comprehend. Nothing changed would mean a 30-day unlocked campaign. Instead we get a 7-day unlocked campaign. So everything has changed.
...than go play 7-day campaign and stop nonsense posting. You can still swap aliance there every 5min so nothing has changed.
If that is so popular as the people who cry here than 7-day campaign should show the most players in the next patch.3 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Really nothing personal... do you guys even READ the notes.
Nothing has changed to you.. you can still swap your toons like socks at non locked campaign with your friends also you can farm your geodes etc just as you have.
...people really should learn to comprehend what they read. Despite that everyone have a nice day...
Apparently you are the one who cannot comprehend. Nothing changed would mean a 30-day unlocked campaign. Instead we get a 7-day unlocked campaign. So everything has changed.
...than go play 7-day campaign and stop nonsense posting. You can still swap aliance there every 5min so nothing has changed.
If that is so popular as the people who cry here than 7-day campaign should show the most players in the next patch.
7 days does not equal 30 days.
And please, show me how in the current pop-locked campaign, during primetime, a player can swap faction every 5 minutes. I would love to see it. Especially when they have to sit in a 30 minute queue just to get into Cyrodil most nights. The "problems" people are ascribing to faction swapping only happen in dead campaigns. Stop playing in dead campaigns and this isn't a problem.3 -
Moonsorrow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Spies will simply home Sotha and guest on Vivec to freely swap around alliances.
They will be taking out "guest" campaigning. All this makes the trolling, ap flip flopping and spying not gonna be that fast easy and convenient as before, so Alliance war will be played more like it was intended.
And for that friend of yours you found, yes.. picking a side in ALLIANCE war should happen, or you all can go play at Shor. It will have all the trolls and flipfloppers there so it will have its own population full enough for sure.
There are also bgs for ffa. I know change is hard to accept after all this time of just using Cyrodiil for whatever that is "fun" for people who switch sides all the time.. this game mode just not been fun when so many been using the ability to switch to make it all about trolling, cheating and going to the side with biggest zerg to make it even bigger. Fact is, most not go join the underdog. You know this and you know the people. It is what it is.3 -
Miswar✭✭✭✭✭Really nothing personal... do you guys even READ the notes.
Nothing has changed to you.. you can still swap your toons like socks at non locked campaign with your friends also you can farm your geodes etc just as you have.
...people really should learn to comprehend what they read. Despite that everyone have a nice day...
Apparently you are the one who cannot comprehend. Nothing changed would mean a 30-day unlocked campaign. Instead we get a 7-day unlocked campaign. So everything has changed.
...than go play 7-day campaign and stop nonsense posting. You can still swap aliance there every 5min so nothing has changed.
If that is so popular as the people who cry here than 7-day campaign should show the most players in the next patch.
7 days does not equal 30 days.
And please, show me how in the current pop-locked campaign, during primetime, a player can swap faction every 5 minutes. I would love to see it. Especially when they have to sit in a 30 minute queue just to get into Cyrodil most nights. The "problems" people are ascribing to faction swapping only happen in dead campaigns. Stop playing in dead campaigns and this isn't a problem.
The alliance swapping is bad joke on main the main campaigns and you know it as well.
This was best thing to hit pvp for longtime and I'am staying put on the locked campaign.
..by your logic it will a campaign with no people on it. (I have an feeling that it will not)
...well wasted enough time with this nonsense thread. Go out and enjoy the spring sun... have a good day.3 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So many faction-flippers crying. It really is a beautiful day - have wanted to see faction-locking introduced for a long time.
I literally have 15 EP characters. Faction locking is the least healthy thing that can be done. If you like being gate camped for an entire campaign, or gate camping an entire campaign, I guess you will have fun. Hey, at least your faction is winning right...2 -
mb10✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Youre not taking into consideration the new weapon that could be abused.
Faction lock is an absolute must now and I think its a great idea6 -
Bam_Bam✭✭✭✭✭
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No it doesn't.It just hurst pvp thats all.We normally switched to the Underdog to get decents fight and restore the Balance. Not possible anymore.
THAT is what hurts PvP.
Faction flipping utterly destroys PvP and leaves it completely unbalanced as proven by the perma-AD campaign wins (EU PC Vivec). It's an Alliance War - pick a side and fight for it for a campaign. Now there's no "get out of jail free" option if things aren't going your way and no option to swap factions to purposely give in and give up territory. If you want to play a different Alliance then just change over when the new campaign startsEdited by Bam_Bam on April 16, 2019 2:14PMJoined January 2014
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efster✭✭✭✭✭I support a faction locked campaign in principle because from my perspective, the unlocking turned Vivec into a farm fest with way more trolling (scroll shenanigans, chat spying, etc) than before, and I really don't like it. But I think ZOS could do with trying a lock on only one campaign, leaving the other 30 day campaign without a lock. If they monitor the populations over a few campaign cycles (and eliminate the rank 1 transmute farmers, who will spend just 1-3 hours per month in the campaign and earn no more than 30ish K AP) they could see what it is that the player population actually wants, aside from endless forum arguments for and against.
There's no in-game barrier to being faction loyal if that's what you want, lock or no lock. For example, most of my toons are AD, and they're homed in Vivec/soon to be RandomDragonNameICantRemember. My few EP and DC characters will never set foot in Vivec/RDNICR for that reason, because I am not interested in working against my main faction/the people I usually play with, even though I'm not even in any PVP guilds and these days I mostly just sit on a rock at Nikel and mark target passing enemy players from stealth. I think faction loyalty is primarily a feeling/intention; it's really not something that can be enforced with a faction lock.AD is the best looking faction. I don't make the rules, I just enforce them.1 -
Barbaran✭✭✭✭Not sure what platform the OP plays, but on console there are issues with non alliance lock.
A blue will jump on his yellow and go to a keep to let his blue buddy ambush glitch through the doors to take a scroll. (There was a similar issue on PS4 circulating the fourms not long ago, with a video).
A yellow will hop on his red and snag a scroll on a scroll run, and run it back down to yellow territory so the yellow zerg can run them down and get a free scroll.
How does ZoS punish these players? 24hr to 3 day ban, even after multiple offences.
The alliance lock is due to players like this. Can't really blame ZoS, blame the community on this one.
On that note, all the nerfs this patch are garbage tho7 -
dazee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TequilaFire wrote: »This will hopefully force some players who insist on playing on all three factions to spread out to other campaigns evening out the population more.
Not gonna force anyone. people will simply do things other than pvp and campaigns will become ghost towns.Playing your character the way your character should play is all that matters. Play as well as you can but never betray the character. Doing so would make playing an mmoRPG pointless.4 -
Ermiq✭✭✭✭✭
✭It makes me laugh. People complain about alliances in alliance-based PvP.
Devs are preventing abusing and exploiting in PvP. And people complain about that.
This community is the most irrational community I've ever seen.One of the two of us definitely has gone mad. It only remains to define whether this one is the whole world or just me.
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dazee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It makes me laugh. People complain about alliances in alliance-based PvP.
Devs are preventing abusing and exploiting in PvP. And people complain about that.
This community is the most irrational community I've ever seen.
Your alliance is different depending which character you're on. no matter what alliance you fight for you fight for your alliance. even if that alliance is different sometimes. why is this so hard for you people who only play one character or alliance to understand?
You insist that others be forced to play the way you do, and you finally got your way. now its time to discover you cant force people to play the way you do becuase they'll simply choose not to play at all if they cant play in the way thats fun for them. Enjoy your empty campaigns.Playing your character the way your character should play is all that matters. Play as well as you can but never betray the character. Doing so would make playing an mmoRPG pointless.1 -
dazee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I absolutely support this change and it couldn't come soon enough
mmhmmm wait till you see what it actually looks like.Playing your character the way your character should play is all that matters. Play as well as you can but never betray the character. Doing so would make playing an mmoRPG pointless.2 -
Rex-Umbra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I disagree. Most people I talk to in game want faction lock.Xbox GT: Rex Umbrah
GM of IMPERIUM since 2015.12 -
DarkerDreams✭✭✭I'm not opposed to faction locks in particular. I'm opposed to it being implemented with no way to switch factions. When I made a lot of my characters, I couldn't afford the any race , any alliance token (Some of us have very tight budgets ZOS) so my characters are whatever alliance they were forced into. My breton healer is DC, my multiple bosmers are all AD, ... you get the picture. While I don't faction hop just to hop, I do play based on what type of character I'm in the mood to play. Now 2/3rds of my chars will be locked out of content and rewards which is wrong in my opinion since they were not locked out when I created them. They should at least give us a way to change Alliances if they want to implement something like this.
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