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‘Dummy’ trading guilds - This system URGENTLY needs addressed.
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MikaHR✭✭✭✭✭Yeeeeeeeeeah, because 'back in teh day, everyone enjoyed wasting hours of their life ot spam "selling x" in the chat.
WoW splatted EQ...and has an AH.
What you have is called "rose colored glasses looking in the past". Running from trader ot trader, from city to city is even more dumbminded than PvE.2 -
Skwor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yeeeeeeeeeah, because 'back in teh day, everyone enjoyed wasting hours of their life ot spam "selling x" in the chat.
WoW splatted EQ...and has an AH.
What you have is called "rose colored glasses looking in the past". Running from trader ot trader, from city to city is even more dumbminded than PvE.
A bit of an oversimplification. As I recall most went to EC when they got burned out or just felt like chatting for the evening. It worked out well and was no where near the chore you try to make it out to be.
WoW had more players becuase it was easier to play and quests more accessible. AH had nothing to do with it, do you seriously think it did?
Hardly rose colored glasses, I have an understanding of how an AH sterilizes a gaming social community.Edited by Skwor on March 5, 2019 2:49PM1 -
Ecileh71✭✭✭[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.0 -
amiiegee✭✭✭✭✭[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.
What has been happening here is the people are using dummies in case their main guild loses there bid, then giving it to them self for nothing. Also some put multiple bids down with dummies for pennies on the off chance no else has bidder there, then the dummie will will the spot cheap and sell it to someone else.
I’m a GM I’m aware how expensive traders are but if these people weren’t able to do this the prices wouldn’t be near as high.
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FlopsyPrince✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
lol yes continue to champion this broken and frustrating system that requires a 3rd party add on to even make some sense of finding anything.DaveMoeDee wrote: »
Don't need auction house. Just need a universal search. Many people won't want to travel to get cheaper item in the boondocks, but console really deserves to have something like TTC, which we have on PC.
Wasting resources to corner the market in one city would not pay off if people could easily find better prices (due to not having to cover all that overhead) in lesser locations.
Now that dealing with inventories is so much better since the recent update, a universal search seems more plausible. And if it helps reduce the prevalence of these idiotic guild raffles and auctions, that would be even better.
It is truly abhorrent how it is and makes it tougher to buy and sell than it should be. No addons can even help on the PS4 and that makes it even worse!PC
PS4/PS51 -
FlopsyPrince✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It is not broken. This system adds a flavor to the game worth keeping.
I go way back and in EQ1 to sell an item everyone would go to the caves in EC (East Commons) to auction items in /say sometimes /zone. Was fun, social and made a great, interesting community.
When EQ1 added the AH it killed EC and all the social fun of that process. A very significant and interactivly fun element was lost forever to EQ1 and it was not a good thing.
It was a great loss to the game killing an organic social element that cuased many to look elsewhere for other games.
What flavor does the current system add? I just see the names above the traders change. The hassle of traveling around, never finding anything worthwhile, remains.
You might have a point if it really did make the game more enjoyable, but it only does that for a few guilds that can monopolize things. Most of us just get the sucky end.
A universal search would have merit, with a great improvement in the interface (PS4), but then it would just be a limited access AH.
PC
PS4/PS53 -
kathandira✭✭✭✭✭
✭I vote to remove Trading Vendors all together. No Auction House either.
Currently the way it works is that Trading Guilds will create multiple trading guilds, and inflate the value of items to sell for the highest price. I'd rather see competition cause the prices to go down, not have major trading guilds dictate the value of things and strong arm smaller guilds out of the market.
If trading was only done via Zone Chats, and within guilds, I think competition to sell items would be stronger, lower the cost of things since people will have an easier time finding better value, rather than settling for the convenience of settling for the Major Trading Guild Vendors.
Trading Guilds could still exist. But rather than the point being joining a guild for the best locations, and ability to sell at the highest value, Guilds would compete with having the best prices available for in guild trading.
Flip the whole system upside down! This is how I currently function. I rarely purchase from Guild Traders. I work mostly within guild and get way lower prices as exchanging items within our guild to make us all more powerful, which is a far greater benefit than supporting some strangers coffers.Edited by kathandira on March 5, 2019 5:43PMPS4-NA. Breton Templar Healer, Bosmer Stamplar, Breton Magplar, Orsimer StamDK, Dunmer MagDK, Khajiit StamNB, Dunmer MagNB, Argonian Warden Tank, Altmer Magsorc1 -
Sheezabeast✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Having player organized guilds be the avenue that ZOS chose for us to pursue inter player commerce is unique and engaging and gives the player control over where they sell their things. I would hate to lose it to a stupid AH. If you want item monopoly then you want AH. I like our system.
Dummy guilds need dealt with though, so frustrating.Grand Master Crafter, Beta baby who grew with the game. PC/NA. @Sheezabeast if you have crafting needs!2 -
As long pp use real money to bid for trader and use chinese rmt money or sell chinese stuff in guild so they can bid 15m each week dummy stay ,also GM should ban kick all those pp who buy from them 90% mournhold guild use rmt stuff no guild make 15m each week and stil they bid 15m each week on ps4 reported on ps4 and gm understand also but they wont fix it in most case,
Dummy guilds they know in early post they said they dont care because dummy cost gold to bid
They should fix guild aply on trader that save the spam in erea
Infact they should just make a action house
Im guildlead
I got life treath from other guild members
Pp give me bad names
I dont care but the way how this going it isnt good
Because some guild sell gold so its there income
Have fun enjoy gaming
Edited by danieldewoeste on March 5, 2019 6:20PM0 -
Ecileh71✭✭✭[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.
What has been happening here is the people are using dummies in case their main guild loses there bid, then giving it to them self for nothing. Also some put multiple bids down with dummies for pennies on the off chance no else has bidder there, then the dummie will will the spot cheap and sell it to someone else.
I’m a GM I’m aware how expensive traders are but if these people weren’t able to do this the prices wouldn’t be near as high.
So it's more of a backup plan than anything else? XXGuild#1 loses the bid, but XXGuild#2 got it, so they just swap?
The trader spot would be ghosted for a few minutes while the swap was happening, but then would be full of XXGuild#1's wares, right? So, at worst, buyers would have to wait a little while after the flip to have merchandise to choose from.
Annoying, but not the end of the proverbial world.0 -
amiiegee✭✭✭✭✭[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.
What has been happening here is the people are using dummies in case their main guild loses there bid, then giving it to them self for nothing. Also some put multiple bids down with dummies for pennies on the off chance no else has bidder there, then the dummie will will the spot cheap and sell it to someone else.
I’m a GM I’m aware how expensive traders are but if these people weren’t able to do this the prices wouldn’t be near as high.
So it's more of a backup plan than anything else? XXGuild#1 loses the bid, but XXGuild#2 got it, so they just swap?
The trader spot would be ghosted for a few minutes while the swap was happening, but then would be full of XXGuild#1's wares, right? So, at worst, buyers would have to wait a little while after the flip to have merchandise to choose from.
Annoying, but not the end of the proverbial world.
Buying gold with real money to have a ‘back up plan’ isn’t fair on legitimate guilds who work hard to earn enough for a bid each week. These people seriously outbid thus making trader prices higher than they need to be. If the main guild wins bid then the empty ghost trader is left there all week wasting a spot that another guild could have.1 -
DragonRacer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.
What has been happening here is the people are using dummies in case their main guild loses there bid, then giving it to them self for nothing. Also some put multiple bids down with dummies for pennies on the off chance no else has bidder there, then the dummie will will the spot cheap and sell it to someone else.
I’m a GM I’m aware how expensive traders are but if these people weren’t able to do this the prices wouldn’t be near as high.
So it's more of a backup plan than anything else? XXGuild#1 loses the bid, but XXGuild#2 got it, so they just swap?
The trader spot would be ghosted for a few minutes while the swap was happening, but then would be full of XXGuild#1's wares, right? So, at worst, buyers would have to wait a little while after the flip to have merchandise to choose from.
Annoying, but not the end of the proverbial world.
Buying gold with real money to have a ‘back up plan’ isn’t fair on legitimate guilds who work hard to earn enough for a bid each week. These people seriously outbid thus making trader prices higher than they need to be. If the main guild wins bid then the empty ghost trader is left there all week wasting a spot that another guild could have.
Or some of them, not naming names, go around after flip advertising in zone text chat that they have ghost guild traders for sale. So that all those guilds they outbid to ghost the spot can either sit out in the cold all week or pay whatever the ghost guild seller is asking for. Then the seller disbands the ghost so the buyer’s guild can hire it.
SMHPS5 NA. GM of The PTK's - a free trading guild (CP 500+). Also a werewolf, bites are free when they're available. PSN = DragonRacer132 -
amiiegee✭✭✭✭✭DragonRacer wrote: »[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.
What has been happening here is the people are using dummies in case their main guild loses there bid, then giving it to them self for nothing. Also some put multiple bids down with dummies for pennies on the off chance no else has bidder there, then the dummie will will the spot cheap and sell it to someone else.
I’m a GM I’m aware how expensive traders are but if these people weren’t able to do this the prices wouldn’t be near as high.
So it's more of a backup plan than anything else? XXGuild#1 loses the bid, but XXGuild#2 got it, so they just swap?
The trader spot would be ghosted for a few minutes while the swap was happening, but then would be full of XXGuild#1's wares, right? So, at worst, buyers would have to wait a little while after the flip to have merchandise to choose from.
Annoying, but not the end of the proverbial world.
Buying gold with real money to have a ‘back up plan’ isn’t fair on legitimate guilds who work hard to earn enough for a bid each week. These people seriously outbid thus making trader prices higher than they need to be. If the main guild wins bid then the empty ghost trader is left there all week wasting a spot that another guild could have.
Or some of them, not naming names, go around after flip advertising in zone text chat that they have ghost guild traders for sale. So that all those guilds they outbid to ghost the spot can either sit out in the cold all week or pay whatever the ghost guild seller is asking for. Then the seller disbands the ghost so the buyer’s guild can hire it.
SMH
Yeah it’s ridiculous:(
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AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Honestly I wouldn't complain if trading was removed in the way it stands and replaced with an overarching world trader. I hate how the system currently is. It's disjointed, hard to navigate and allows people to be exploited easily.
You wouldn't complain, but I would quit.The Moot Councillor0 -
Merlin13KAGL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The guild trader bid is lost either way, correct? I mean, it's not like they get a refund if they lose the trader or if they disband?
If a guild outbids another guild, a fail to see how this changes anything, as the money has already been spent, more money than the losing guild apparently put forth?
It's effectively no different than if a guild won the bid and posted nothing, which would be well within their right to do.
What am I missing here?Just because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...
Earn it.
IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS0 -
amiiegee✭✭✭✭✭Merlin13KAGL wrote: »The guild trader bid is lost either way, correct? I mean, it's not like they get a refund if they lose the trader or if they disband?
If a guild outbids another guild, a fail to see how this changes anything, as the money has already been spent, more money than the losing guild apparently put forth?
It's effectively no different than if a guild won the bid and posted nothing, which would be well within their right to do.
What am I missing here?
They sell the trader location for more than they paid.
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kathandira✭✭✭✭✭
✭I can understand bickering in regards to PvP. I can even understand it in Trials. But in bickering in a pretend digital market inside of a video game? smh, this is what gaming has come to I guess.PS4-NA. Breton Templar Healer, Bosmer Stamplar, Breton Magplar, Orsimer StamDK, Dunmer MagDK, Khajiit StamNB, Dunmer MagNB, Argonian Warden Tank, Altmer Magsorc0 -
Ecileh71✭✭✭[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.
What has been happening here is the people are using dummies in case their main guild loses there bid, then giving it to them self for nothing. Also some put multiple bids down with dummies for pennies on the off chance no else has bidder there, then the dummie will will the spot cheap and sell it to someone else.
I’m a GM I’m aware how expensive traders are but if these people weren’t able to do this the prices wouldn’t be near as high.
So it's more of a backup plan than anything else? XXGuild#1 loses the bid, but XXGuild#2 got it, so they just swap?
The trader spot would be ghosted for a few minutes while the swap was happening, but then would be full of XXGuild#1's wares, right? So, at worst, buyers would have to wait a little while after the flip to have merchandise to choose from.
Annoying, but not the end of the proverbial world.
Buying gold with real money to have a ‘back up plan’ isn’t fair on legitimate guilds who work hard to earn enough for a bid each week. These people seriously outbid thus making trader prices higher than they need to be. If the main guild wins bid then the empty ghost trader is left there all week wasting a spot that another guild could have.
Okay, now I am confused again. How does one buy gold with real money? Through the gold for crowns trade system?
Sorry--I'm not trying to be obtuse or confrontational...I really just don't know much about how the mechanics of trader bids work.0 -
Lissiexx✭✭✭kathandira wrote: »I can understand bickering in regards to PvP. I can even understand it in Trials. But in bickering in a pretend digital market inside of a video game? smh, this is what gaming has come to I guess.
if you could see some of the pathetically sad messages I have had from other GMs you would believe it. Trials, PVP are about competiveness and for some running a guild is no different. PS5 EU0 -
amiiegee✭✭✭✭✭[
I think you have missed the point entirely, the OP is talking about the big guilds on some platforms that buy all the traders in Mournhold with dummy traders, disband, then sell the slot cheap.
I've not seen this on Xbox but its been a regular complaint from PC guys on here before and it does sound suspect.
I'm confused. If my GM is to be believed (and I see no reason why he shouldn't be), top trader spots run in the millions. So, to corner the market in, say, Mournhold would be a tens of millions--or more-- prospect. How would selling them on the cheap benefit the dummy guild?
Generally, you want to buy low and sell high, not the other way around.
What has been happening here is the people are using dummies in case their main guild loses there bid, then giving it to them self for nothing. Also some put multiple bids down with dummies for pennies on the off chance no else has bidder there, then the dummie will will the spot cheap and sell it to someone else.
I’m a GM I’m aware how expensive traders are but if these people weren’t able to do this the prices wouldn’t be near as high.
So it's more of a backup plan than anything else? XXGuild#1 loses the bid, but XXGuild#2 got it, so they just swap?
The trader spot would be ghosted for a few minutes while the swap was happening, but then would be full of XXGuild#1's wares, right? So, at worst, buyers would have to wait a little while after the flip to have merchandise to choose from.
Annoying, but not the end of the proverbial world.
Buying gold with real money to have a ‘back up plan’ isn’t fair on legitimate guilds who work hard to earn enough for a bid each week. These people seriously outbid thus making trader prices higher than they need to be. If the main guild wins bid then the empty ghost trader is left there all week wasting a spot that another guild could have.
Okay, now I am confused again. How does one buy gold with real money? Through the gold for crowns trade system?
Sorry--I'm not trying to be obtuse or confrontational...I really just don't know much about how the mechanics of trader bids work.
There are websites in which you can purchase gold with real money. It’s against the terms of service but a lot of people do it, that’s the sad thing.
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Lissiexx✭✭✭Also to add that when people are selling gold for a real life income through these guilds - its very easy to see why it gets as cutthroat as it does. For some it is no game - they make a living this way.PS5 EU0
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Forum Rules | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Home Page | Help Site1 -
NoTimeToWait✭✭✭✭✭FlopsyPrince wrote: »It is not broken. This system adds a flavor to the game worth keeping.
I go way back and in EQ1 to sell an item everyone would go to the caves in EC (East Commons) to auction items in /say sometimes /zone. Was fun, social and made a great, interesting community.
When EQ1 added the AH it killed EC and all the social fun of that process. A very significant and interactivly fun element was lost forever to EQ1 and it was not a good thing.
It was a great loss to the game killing an organic social element that cuased many to look elsewhere for other games.
What flavor does the current system add? I just see the names above the traders change. The hassle of traveling around, never finding anything worthwhile, remains.
You might have a point if it really did make the game more enjoyable, but it only does that for a few guilds that can monopolize things. Most of us just get the sucky end.
A universal search would have merit, with a great improvement in the interface (PS4), but then it would just be a limited access AH.
It adds a lot of flavor to the traders. Many places have their unique specifics that dictate what sells better in those places.
For example. In Grahtwood, people often gather to find a party for the Undaunted Pledges or for different PVE themed tasks. This often results that while gathering, people also prepare for the dungeon run, buying the stuff they need there: food, potions, experience pots. So these things sell better in Grahtwood, than in many other places.
Morrowind has one of the best crafting spots, so mats in Vvardenfell sell even better, than in Mournhould.
Mournhould and Rawlkha due to their close proximity to wayshrine are good all around markets, therefore many common players go there during their buying sprees. Because of that, the items priced in 1-20k range sell the best there (especially furniture). As well as things that are usually sold in bulk (like furnishing mats).
Craglorn is the place that historically gets many of the most successful traders. Plus there are a lot of idle endgame PVE players looking for PUG trials that do not mind to scroll traders listings while waiting. These people often have good money in their pockets, so the stuff priced 50k and higher sells the best in Craglorn.
Many trading places have their unique flavor. Stormhaven and Eastmarch are basically Deshaan and Rawlkha analogues for poorer guilds\players. But as a buyer, I will visit them first of all places.
It is PITA to get to the Hew's Bane market, but often you find there very good deals, due to the zone being DLC exclusive and far away from wayshrine, flippers rarely visit it.
I can go on here, but I don't see why. Just find out these things for yourself. And don't be a spoilsport, if you don't see what people find interesting in current trading system1 -
Lissiexx✭✭✭There is no point - quick to remove posts but actually this could have been sorted months ago when I and others asked for guilds not to be allowed to disband when they are attached to a guild trader. Its a really simple fix. I don't understand I really don't.PS5 EU2
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Best fix all bid one npc and price of bid wil decide what spot so no big alliance or no price fix system give good bid always trader case closed,
Now a big guild bid 9m and lose
And no traderEdited by danieldewoeste on March 5, 2019 7:22PM0 -
XxCaLxX✭✭✭✭✭Simple fix: you must have atleast 100 members to hire a trader, also guild store must have atleast 1000 listings(10 pages) to hire a trader. This way anytime you go to buy from a trader there will be listings whether it’s a ghost guild or not. I’m not entirely against ghost guilds as they are an insurance plan for top trading guilds. Don’t blame them blame zos for their silly trade system. But a simple fix is to not let a guild master leave a guild. So if they wanted to leave they would have to promote someone else to GM this way there is always atleast one person in the guild and if that guild has a trader then it will have to stay there with that one GM til end of week. That way no one would even attempt to waste gold on hiring a burner that they couldn’t use.1 -
Simple fix: you must have atleast 100 members to hire a trader, also guild store must have atleast 1000 listings(10 pages) to hire a trader. This way anytime you go to buy from a trader there will be listings whether it’s a ghost guild or not. I’m not entirely against ghost guilds as they are an insurance plan for top trading guilds. Don’t blame them blame zos for their silly trade system. But a simple fix is to not let a guild master leave a guild. So if they wanted to leave they would have to promote someone else to GM this way there is always atleast one person in the guild and if that guild has a trader then it will have to stay there with that one GM til end of week. That way no one would even attempt to waste gold on hiring a burner that they couldn’t use.
Nice Idea i like
Specialy the 10 listing pages min
There allot of guilds whit one pages
To prevent big guilds get trader after loseEdited by danieldewoeste on March 6, 2019 1:16PM0