Why are they nerfing dungeons?

karekiz · March 2019

The best way to up completion rates on vet DLC?

Require a DPS/Tank/Heal test to random into it. In which it teaches basic mechanics over again that players haven't used in <Well since the start tutorial most likely>. Require bashing a mechanic, blocking a HA, min DPS check, and evading AoE.

That way you know 100% that the player will at least have "X" basics down <and im not talking something stupid high DPS check, maybe 15-20K sustained while doing a mechanic>.

Once completed DLC dungeons are added to the random que list, if not you can only enter classic vet. Up the bonus XP for DLC if entered and remove the teleport exploit in DF.

Merlin13KAGL · March 2019

MikaHR wrote: »

"Why are they nerfing dungeons?"

DLC dungeons are waste of money. Unles they make them immensly popular....somehow, motifs, gear and all other rewards as "encouragement" failed miserably, no one wants to play them no matter what devs do and how much rewards they shower players with. And now shoving main STORY into them....is a big fail on ZOSs part.

"Just some stats from PS4 trophies.

4.5% of all ESO PS4 players have cleared all DC base game group dungeons, 4.4% for AD and EP group dungeons at least on normal.

2.6% have cleared Mazzatun and 2.4% have completed Cradle of Shadows at least on normal difficulty.

1.6% have completed Bloodroot Forge and the same number have completed Falkreath Hold on at least normal difficulty.

1.4% have cleared Scalecaller and the same number have cleared Fang Lair on at least normal difficulty.

0.7% have cleared March of Sacrifices on at least normal, and 0.6% have cleared MHK on at least normal difficulty.

When you start looking at the completion rates for both dungeons on veteran in each pack, you’re at 0.5% for Shadows of the Hist, 0.2% for Horns of the Reach and Dragon Bones, and 0.1% for Wolfhunter."

MikaHR wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

MikaHR wrote: »

The only semi meaninful information would be normal/vet completion, you cant possibly know how many people have access to it (everyone with ESO+ have access, yet small number actually accessed it).

But then again, that would assume that everyone that completed normal is interested in doing/completing vet.

Yes, normal/vet completion is the only meaningful information. But access is the context by which that information is viewed.

When the data says that 2.6% of people have completed nRoM, that's 2.6% of people who have ever touched the game on that platform. That includes people who quit the game long before Hist was even released. That's the default context. Which is pretty damn worthless. Access rate provides a better context.

No its not, and unless ZOS gives you access data, youre out of luck.

The meaninful data is latest DLC dungeon vs base game dungeons. The rate is ABBYSMAL and showing SHARP falloff, and keeping in mind that newer dungeons cost more and more to make and they are not paying off. And keep in mind we are comaring ALL base game dungeons against a single dungeon DLC, comparing individual base game dungeons would prove to be even worse bet for DLC dungeons. Or comparing all base game dungeons with ALL DLC dungeons combined (which would end up as 4.5% vs 0.1%)

Splattercat_83 wrote: »

Thevampirenight wrote: »

And allow Casuels a chance of getting the personalities and skins.

That right there is the problem. A skin is a sign of the players skill, thats what makes them worth anything. Some of them are straight up butt ugly and the only reason to wear them would be to show that Ive put in the work. Every Tom, ***, and Harry would be walking around with one on, whats so special in that?

How about we go back to the old days where if you wanted the skin, you had to "git good" Is that to much to ask?

How about ZOS stops wasting a lot of money on making something that barely anyone buys/plays....like DLC dungeons alltogether? Seems you prefer that. Then you can walk in your "special" ugly costume and cry about it all you want.

They have to sell motifs/outfit styles in cash shop, thats how badly these DLC dungeons are faring, so instead letting people play content they make,"special" rewards go straight to cash shop. How "special" do you feel now?

MikaHR wrote: »

I am curious too, but not keen on discussing pretty meningless data (and data you mention is pretty meningless, you can have all kinds of data and keep reaching to make it look meaningful, but it wont make it any less meaningless).

As i said, if you procure any more meaninful data from ZOS, you are welcome to present and discuss it.

[snip]
This is going to continue to be a problem so long as they only offer three tiers of difficulty at norm, vet, and HM.

The next jump after that is combo achievements (SR, ND, HM) which are the polar opposites of norm.

You're never going to cover progression and difficulty requirements for thousands of players with only three possible settings.

EDIT: And regarding Dungeon DLC being a 'waste of money,' that's one more stat you can't possibly know. If people purchase it makes money. If people keep ESO+ one month longer than they would have, it makes them money.

You cannot presume to know the production cost of dungeon DLC to begin to remotely know the break-even, and ultimately profit point of the same DLC.

[Edited for non-constructive commentary]

p00tx · March 2019

MikaHR wrote: »

"Why are they nerfing dungeons?"

DLC dungeons are waste of money. Unles they make them immensly popular....somehow, motifs, gear and all other rewards as "encouragement" failed miserably, no one wants to play them no matter what devs do and how much rewards they shower players with. And now shoving main STORY into them....is a big fail on ZOSs part.

If this is true, then why am I being asked nearly every day to carry someone through one of these dungeons? People want to complete them, but the people asking me are typically players who want the reward without putting in the time or the work. I say that as someone who knows them personally. They don't believe they should have to adjust their playstyle to the content, and so they prefer to have the content cater to them. Or they want the end game gear when they are a nearly brand new player with very low CP. While I'm certainly not obtuse to helping someone out by carrying them through content while teaching them proper mechanics at the same time, I'm not interested in being a monster helm or skin mule for entitled lazy people.

We live in the information age, where someone can literally find a web page that lists a build, champ point layouts, skill load outs, and which buttons to push at the right time and in the right order. There is absolutely no reason the rest of the [general] population can't do what I did and use this information to grow into the dungeons. People just need to stop being stubborn and insist on clinging to an inefficient build or playstyle, then complaining when they can't clear content. Other people have literally done the work for you to find the easiest and more efficient means of clearing the content, from the ground up. If someone refuses to use their available resources, then they're the problem, not the game.

KhajiitFelix · March 2019

MikaHR wrote: »

Or maybe stop making PvP players grind PvE for best PvP gear?

As i said before, monster sets should ONLY work in dungeons/trials (instanced content) and be like any other 2 piece bonus in anything that is NOT dungeon/trial (same as 3 piece trial sets....which should be extended to 5 pieces bonus as well)

How am I going to compare monster sets if they don't work at my house?

Dalsinthus · March 2019

I am pleased by these changes and am surprised by the amount of opposition in this thread. I've completed all the vet dungeons and most HMs, but it is not easy to find a good group for these. Even my best trials guild rarely wants to do dlc dungeons. So cleaning up some of the points where groups stall out seems like a very good move. I also appreciate Finn showing up to let us know the reason behind the changes.

IzzyStardust · March 2019

Please don’t equate new with clueless.

I doubt when you were learning to use a spoon, people called you clueless, and if they did - they were the ones with the issues.

There’s no need to take flyby potshots at people.

Every one of us were new once.

CP5 · March 2019

Let me preface what i'm about to say with a little story. When ZOS first introduced monster helms forever ago, I felt that as a player I would never get them, ever. They were cool, interesting looking, but I accepted that at my skill level I would never see them. My first few times in the v2 dungeons didn't help much but since then, after having switched from dps to tank, getting comfortable in vet dungeons, even making the step from vet dungeons to vet trials as a healer off a vFH HM pug, now I can comfortably complete that end game content on any role and enjoy it. I wouldn't have been able to if the difficulty of the content was pushed more and more into a wall, with incredibly easy normal mode, watered down vet, then the sudden spike.

I honestly feel a part of the problem is that most of the game is so easy that players are never put in the position to improve themselves, they see what they do is passable for overland content and believe there is nothing more they can learn or do to improve, and when facing a challenging boss that only requires proper kill order feel that is impossible to beat. To those of you who weren't here before the first fighters guild quest line boss, Doshia, at release she was a challenge. If you didn't know how to kill a harvester you weren't going to have a good time. But since the fight was long, and only really ended when you showed you had learned how to kill one, after beating her I haven't had issues with harvesters ever since.

The game lacks that now, and these nerfs simply remove chances for players to learn things and improve themselves. It's not that I feel entitled to my achievements, but that if players refuse to even try to learn, try to improve, future content will be watered down more and more, leaving people who actually enjoy engaging fights with nothing while vet mode is nerfed to be in line with normal.

Valagash · March 2019

ZOS_Finn wrote: »

Some of these changes also affected Normal modes. We continue to evaluate the Normal modes as well.

@Tyrion87 We have no plans to go back and retroactively make older content more difficult.

Do you plan to introduce a third difficulty like other MMO´s did? To keep your Veteran players busy and give them something challenging to work for?

luizpaulom17 · March 2019

CP5 wrote: »

Let me preface what i'm about to say with a little story. When ZOS first introduced monster helms forever ago, I felt that as a player I would never get them, ever. They were cool, interesting looking, but I accepted that at my skill level I would never see them. My first few times in the v2 dungeons didn't help much but since then, after having switched from dps to tank, getting comfortable in vet dungeons, even making the step from vet dungeons to vet trials as a healer off a vFH HM pug, now I can comfortably complete that end game content on any role and enjoy it. I wouldn't have been able to if the difficulty of the content was pushed more and more into a wall, with incredibly easy normal mode, watered down vet, then the sudden spike.

I honestly feel a part of the problem is that most of the game is so easy that players are never put in the position to improve themselves, they see what they do is passable for overland content and believe there is nothing more they can learn or do to improve, and when facing a challenging boss that only requires proper kill order feel that is impossible to beat. To those of you who weren't here before the first fighters guild quest line boss, Doshia, at release she was a challenge. If you didn't know how to kill a harvester you weren't going to have a good time. But since the fight was long, and only really ended when you showed you had learned how to kill one, after beating her I haven't had issues with harvesters ever since.

The game lacks that now, and these nerfs simply remove chances for players to learn things and improve themselves. It's not that I feel entitled to my achievements, but that if players refuse to even try to learn, try to improve, future content will be watered down more and more, leaving people who actually enjoy engaging fights with nothing while vet mode is nerfed to be in line with normal.

Agreed! I had a similar experience, first times I tried falkreath it was a disaster... Same with scalecaller Peak, couldnt kill the first boss and a guy remove me and told me to not come back there before I could acctually learn how to play or have 300CP. And U know what, He was right! I needed to learn how to play, cause not only I was not having fan but also I was spoiling the experience of other players!

That guy made me think how much I needed to improve and I did! People need to understand that those Dgs were never impossible to complete, but in order to have a good funny experience playing them U need to improve your skills! Also, making friends and meeting people to help you out, assembling a squad to beat arenas and HM Dgs! But sadly a lot of peole just want the easy path of nerfing so they can keep spamming skills, making hybrid builds that are no viable and not learning mechanics at all... And it is concerning how anti social some og those people are! Thats really sad! And Zos will learn that those are the ones that quit the game in less that a year..

ruikkarikun · March 2019

ZOS_MikaS wrote: »

We recently removed a handful of unnecessary and off topic comments from this thread. Please ensure that the discussion remains civil, constructive, and free of insults or personal attacks. Thank you for your understanding.

Thank you. Please listen less to 1-3% elitists who has static groups and perfect gear and 24/7 who can close any hard mode.

For the rest, try to close this veteran (not even HM) with dungeon finder or zone seeking. If you don't have static group you will feel how hard it is. I always wonder, just go and try it with pugs, because it's an a majority of the game, and you elitists are more more less.

p00tx · March 2019

ruikkarikun wrote: »

ZOS_MikaS wrote: »

We recently removed a handful of unnecessary and off topic comments from this thread. Please ensure that the discussion remains civil, constructive, and free of insults or personal attacks. Thank you for your understanding.

Thank you. Please listen less to 1-3% elitists who has static groups and perfect gear and 24/7 who can close any hard mode.

For the rest, try to close this veteran (not even HM) with dungeon finder or zone seeking. If you don't have static group you will feel how hard it is. I always wonder, just go and try it with pugs, because it's an a majority of the game, and you elitists are more more less.

I'm actually starting to see a pattern here, and it makes me wonder if the difference in group communication opportunities on the different platforms creates a different end game culture. Are you on PC @ruikkarikun ?

On Xbox, when you pug a dungeon, we have the option to use voice comms to communicate with one another (provided they're working that day...it definitely comes with its own challenges), and it not only makes it easier to get through unfamiliar content together, but also facilitates the growth of connections and resultant friendships/partnerships and potential guild invites. There are no "static groups" as you've put it, because we have a very wide and complex social network in place on console, and this network extends across both PvE and PvP, and even intertwines the two. On PC, you're stuck typing everything out, which isn't feasible mid battle. It's actually pretty lonely and isolating playing on PC, and I enjoy the culture there far less because of it.

On Xbox, I'm part of a trader guild, a PvP guild, a social guild that fosters new players and we teach them rotations and level appropriate raid mechanics, a PvE guild with a wide range of players mostly trending toward end game, and a super sweaty end game raid guild. This exposes me (and many others) to a really wide range of people at all levels and ensures the average player doesn't really get pigeon holed into only one portion of the game, unless they actively choose to keep themselves there. There seems to be far less intrinsic separation of skill level on console than on PC.

r34lian · March 2019

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Rikumaru wrote: »

Because of some entitled people who believe they should be able to complete every single piece of content in the game without actually working to improve at the game. Welcome to gaming in 2019.

You do realise that when you start to get a ping around the 400 mark, all those "easy to follow" mechanics become "you have to be exceptionally quick to avoid" mechanics, right?

I play from Asia with around 350+ ping with frequent lag and these elitist hardcore pros will never know our pain.

r34lian · March 2019

GarnetFire17 wrote: »

They are focusing on hard modes as the challenging content especially the newer ones. There have been players that have have tried for a year or more to do some of these vet DLC dungeons not even in HM and gave up. Now they might actually try again.

Oh wait is that you u gm of AHC NA o _O

Facefister · March 2019

D0PAMINE wrote: »

Soul19reaper wrote: »

Well this is a good step afterall it's not a souls game and those vet content were being completed only by a minority of playerbase like 2 or 3% which isn't good for playerbase nor the company , most of dlc dungeons were useless cause only high level elitist are able to complete but now it might be for the rest of audience as well!

Incorrect. Those high level elitest players write guides, make videos and run players through all the time.

Not only that, they provide third party websites and databases, and mods.

Tigerseye · March 2019

Tigerseye wrote: »

Skayaq wrote: »

Tigerseye wrote: »

Not to mention that there are major issues with bash (amongst other things...):

1. The game doesn't teach you how to do it.
2. You can't assign it to a single key (big mistake).
3. If you don't play with a mouse and/or you try to reassign its components to 2 keys, it doesn't seem to work properly.

These kind of fundamental issues need to be sorted out before you can expect PUGs to deal with non-standard mechanics, in dungeons.

1. You have to use bash to get through the tutorial.
2. you can bind bash to a single key.

I looked at keybindings and I didn't see Bash there?

Maybe I missed it - will look again when I can log back on.

...and it's been a while, but I don't think I had to use Bash to get through the tutorial?

Do you mean the new tutorial?

If so, I haven't done that.

OK, so I checked and Bash isn't assignable.

Block is and Interrupt is (I assigned them at least 19 months, if not 5 years, ago), but not Bash.

Tigerseye · March 2019

mcagatayg wrote: »

Tigerseye wrote: »

Skayaq wrote: »

Tigerseye wrote: »

Not to mention that there are major issues with bash (amongst other things...):

1. The game doesn't teach you how to do it.
2. You can't assign it to a single key (big mistake).
3. If you don't play with a mouse and/or you try to reassign its components to 2 keys, it doesn't seem to work properly.

These kind of fundamental issues need to be sorted out before you can expect PUGs to deal with non-standard mechanics, in dungeons.

1. You have to use bash to get through the tutorial.
2. you can bind bash to a single key.

I looked at keybindings and I didn't see Bash there?

Maybe I missed it - will look again when I can log back on.

...and it's been a while, but I don't think I had to use Bash to get through the tutorial?

Do you mean the new tutorial?

If so, I haven't done that.

It's under combat > interrupt

Oh, so it's just Interrupt?

Why don't people just call it that, then?

I've been Interrupting since day 1.

Actually, since birth, according to my mum.

GallantGuardian · March 2019

Which dungeons so far have all been nerfed ?

I don’t mind them making normal easy but not vet

Tigerseye · March 2019

Skayaq wrote: »

Tigerseye wrote: »

Skayaq wrote: »

Tigerseye wrote: »

Not to mention that there are major issues with bash (amongst other things...):

1. The game doesn't teach you how to do it.
2. You can't assign it to a single key (big mistake).
3. If you don't play with a mouse and/or you try to reassign its components to 2 keys, it doesn't seem to work properly.

These kind of fundamental issues need to be sorted out before you can expect PUGs to deal with non-standard mechanics, in dungeons.

1. You have to use bash to get through the tutorial.
2. you can bind bash to a single key.

I looked at keybindings and I didn't see Bash there?

Maybe I missed it - will look again when I can log back on.

...and it's been a while, but I don't think I had to use Bash to get through the tutorial?

Do you mean the new tutorial?

If so, I haven't done that.

while I guess technically you didn't have to in the original the first miniboss (the warden something) always had a fairly long cast and the game told you to interrupt it.

The keybinding for bash is called Interrupt, it's listed under the combat section after crouch

Thank you.

Well, I really think people need to call it by the name the game gives it, in Keybindings and tutorials, then.

Of course calling it "Bash" will confuse people, when they cant find anything called that in Settings.

ruikkarikun · March 2019

p00tx wrote: »

ruikkarikun wrote: »

ZOS_MikaS wrote: »

We recently removed a handful of unnecessary and off topic comments from this thread. Please ensure that the discussion remains civil, constructive, and free of insults or personal attacks. Thank you for your understanding.

Thank you. Please listen less to 1-3% elitists who has static groups and perfect gear and 24/7 who can close any hard mode.

For the rest, try to close this veteran (not even HM) with dungeon finder or zone seeking. If you don't have static group you will feel how hard it is. I always wonder, just go and try it with pugs, because it's an a majority of the game, and you elitists are more more less.

I'm actually starting to see a pattern here, and it makes me wonder if the difference in group communication opportunities on the different platforms creates a different end game culture. Are you on PC @ruikkarikun ?

On Xbox, when you pug a dungeon, we have the option to use voice comms to communicate with one another (provided they're working that day...it definitely comes with its own challenges), and it not only makes it easier to get through unfamiliar content together, but also facilitates the growth of connections and resultant friendships/partnerships and potential guild invites. There are no "static groups" as you've put it, because we have a very wide and complex social network in place on console, and this network extends across both PvE and PvP, and even intertwines the two. On PC, you're stuck typing everything out, which isn't feasible mid battle. It's actually pretty lonely and isolating playing on PC, and I enjoy the culture there far less because of it.

On Xbox, I'm part of a trader guild, a PvP guild, a social guild that fosters new players and we teach them rotations and level appropriate raid mechanics, a PvE guild with a wide range of players mostly trending toward end game, and a super sweaty end game raid guild. This exposes me (and many others) to a really wide range of people at all levels and ensures the average player doesn't really get pigeon holed into only one portion of the game, unless they actively choose to keep themselves there. There seems to be far less intrinsic separation of skill level on console than on PC.

Yes, PC, and we don't have voice in PC version ofc:)
And I'm a part of some guilds 480+ 5 guilds, but no close friends there/static. So when I'm asking for some pledges I rarely get answer, also trying it in zone chat with same result. Sure I can make tank and it will be a bit easier to find group via group finder, but hey my char is not tank, so what am I suppose to do?:) This is PC rules on EU. But it can be only my expirience, however I'm sure pugs have huge problems with veteran DLC dungeons (without HM). And still I think those. who feel current DLC as easy, they're not many. It's obvious things.

BennyButton · March 2019

The thing is, for all of you thinking you should be able to pug vDLC dungeons and be able to complete them. It's a team effort and that means you need to communicate. There are plenty of guilds that offer assistance and groups you just need to search for them.

Complaining that the guilds that you are in offer no assistance isn't anyones fault but yours.

By decreasing the overall dungeon's difficulty by taking away mechanics, you're basically widening the gap between trials and dungeons which is making it harder to train people on how to follow mechanics. vBRF was used by guilds as a testing ground to determine someone's ability to heal/tank/dps, and Galchobhar was the most difficult boss in BRF.

For those of you who complain, maybe start looking for groups to run harder content with. Pugging isn't meant to be endgame.

Tigerseye · March 2019

predareaper wrote: »

I'm honestly salty about this, if you don't put in the effort to achieve a win, why should you expect the content to be nerfed, most of these fights could be done with 20 to 30k dps without many wipes so that isnt the problem, people asking for these nerfs where just borderline incompetent and/or wanted to play "their way" (Aka no mecanics/good looking sets and skills, Ive met a few), please, if you read this and asked for these nerfs, consider finding help on why you are so bad at the game and improve.

Oh no, not people who wanted to "play their way"?

Everyone should want to play exactly the same way, like robots.

...or, a half decent developer could make all the possible variations equally viable.

luizpaulom17 · March 2019

ruikkarikun wrote: »

ZOS_MikaS wrote: »

We recently removed a handful of unnecessary and off topic comments from this thread. Please ensure that the discussion remains civil, constructive, and free of insults or personal attacks. Thank you for your understanding.

Thank you. Please listen less to 1-3% elitists who has static groups and perfect gear and 24/7 who can close any hard mode.

For the rest, try to close this veteran (not even HM) with dungeon finder or zone seeking. If you don't have static group you will feel how hard it is. I always wonder, just go and try it with pugs, because it's an a majority of the game, and you elitists are more more less.

No, we are not elitist, just people who actually learn how to play the game and are seeking a bit more difficulty, since Zos Broke the CP system and game was getting easier and easier every new patch... ESO doesnt have elitists... people will take to trials if U have more than 30k dps, which is a bit more than half of the max dps U can reach... U can reach 20k by spamming light attack today... want to know what real elitism is?? Play Wow and U will see!

[Edited for non-constructive commentary]

Urvoth · March 2019

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Raammzzaa wrote: »

Urvoth wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

To make them possible for PvPers because they complain that they are too hard.

Almost every PvPer I know considers vet dungeons to be pretty easy or at least quite doable. In fact, I’ve met more PVEers that are worse at PvE than PvPers.

On any given night in the PvP guild that I play with, we have members walking around in any number of skins, complete with Tic Toc Tormentor titles on, etc. They are also in some of the more “elite” trials guilds as well as our PvP guild. Some people are just good at the game.

That guy was trolling. The average pvper is a lot more skilled than the average pver. Simply due to the fact that pvp takes a lot more skill than pve, which is just scripted encounters.

I was trolling?

Tigerseye · March 2019

predareaper wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

this is just a failure of the model. The vet dlc dungeons are inaccessible because they are designed for players who have the following:

voice coms
guild backup to learn encounters
light weaving

many pugs wont have any of this and thus failure and avoidance will be the result in many cases.

its not so much a skill thing as an organization thing.

Guilds in this game are weak because of the traders
many players dont like or use light weaving
pc players need 3rd party voice coms

Stop telling people to L2P and figure out why they dont want to.

Light weaving is endorsed by the game if youre not doing it youre failing basic game mecanics, organization is skill, díscord is free to use(no real need to speak if youre being explained, text can do) and console has voice chat, again, failure to search to improve ones self is not the reason to nerf content

Mate, give it up - you've been massively outclassed.

Maybe you should learn to forum before trying this again?

Oreyn_Bearclaw · March 2019

MikaHR wrote: »

Or maybe stop making PvP players grind PvE for best PvP gear?

As i said before, monster sets should ONLY work in dungeons/trials (instanced content) and be like any other 2 piece bonus in anything that is NOT dungeon/trial (same as 3 piece trial sets....which should be extended to 5 pieces bonus as well)

I am so glad you are not in charge of the combat design in this game. That might be the worst idea I have ever heard especially since you can acquire them with PVP currency.

KhajiitFelix · March 2019

Urvoth wrote: »

MaxJrFTW wrote: »

Raammzzaa wrote: »

Urvoth wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

To make them possible for PvPers because they complain that they are too hard.

Almost every PvPer I know considers vet dungeons to be pretty easy or at least quite doable. In fact, I’ve met more PVEers that are worse at PvE than PvPers.

On any given night in the PvP guild that I play with, we have members walking around in any number of skins, complete with Tic Toc Tormentor titles on, etc. They are also in some of the more “elite” trials guilds as well as our PvP guild. Some people are just good at the game.

That guy was trolling. The average pvper is a lot more skilled than the average pver. Simply due to the fact that pvp takes a lot more skill than pve, which is just scripted encounters.

I was trolling?

No he was talking about me.

luizpaulom17 · March 2019

Tigerseye wrote: »

predareaper wrote: »

Rungar wrote: »

this is just a failure of the model. The vet dlc dungeons are inaccessible because they are designed for players who have the following:

voice coms
guild backup to learn encounters
light weaving

many pugs wont have any of this and thus failure and avoidance will be the result in many cases.

its not so much a skill thing as an organization thing.

Guilds in this game are weak because of the traders
many players dont like or use light weaving
pc players need 3rd party voice coms

Stop telling people to L2P and figure out why they dont want to.

Light weaving is endorsed by the game if youre not doing it youre failing basic game mecanics, organization is skill, díscord is free to use(no real need to speak if youre being explained, text can do) and console has voice chat, again, failure to search to improve ones self is not the reason to nerf content

Mate, give it up - you've been massively outclassed.

Maybe you should learn to forum before trying this again?

No he is not! He is being quite reasonable and a lot of people agree with him! If that was not the case this thread wouldnt have became one of the biggest in Forum...

BuddyAces · March 2019

ruikkarikun wrote: »

ZOS_MikaS wrote: »

We recently removed a handful of unnecessary and off topic comments from this thread. Please ensure that the discussion remains civil, constructive, and free of insults or personal attacks. Thank you for your understanding.

Thank you. Please listen less to 1-3% elitists who has static groups and perfect gear and 24/7 who can close any hard mode.

For the rest, try to close this veteran (not even HM) with dungeon finder or zone seeking. If you don't have static group you will feel how hard it is. I always wonder, just go and try it with pugs, because it's an a majority of the game, and you elitists are more more less.

Perfect gear? What gear is this that you talk about? See a lot of you folks crying about having perfect gear to do this stuff. What constitutes as perfect gear though to you? I clear DLC HMs in a combination, which differs from dungeon to dungeon and boss to boss, in TFS/VO/Hundings. I swap between 3 or 4 monster sets depending on what I feel like doing. You are uninformed and should maybe take some time to look into things differently before spewing a wrong opinion as fact if you think that's "meta" gear.

Static groups? I've seen many people clear these DLC HMs in a pug group before my static group (in non perfected gear, read above if your attention span has brought you here first) can do the HM. Up to MHK/MOS (which after the first run I hated em) I have successfully pugged every dlc in this game, most on HM.

You, simply put, need to get better by not standing in the stupid and PAYING ATTENTION to what the enemies are doing. Learn how to dodge roll and interrupt and you've literally cleared every DLC by doing that. Outside of certain HM fights you only need 30k dps to clear em. Sure, nobody likes to fight a boss for 25 minutes cuz they only have 30k dps, but it's not like the bosses suddenly gain new mechanics every 5 mins.

EDIT:
I can see why they nerfed what they did though. Can not argue that there are some mechanics that suck if you don't have voice coms. Wouldn't be a bad idea to have it implemented on PC even though most folks have discord these days.

Silurus · March 2019

Never mind, deleted....and.....about voice comms, that are so widespread now, as discord and such? What about a hearing impaired player? Even if reading some guides, etc, but he just reached a ceiling of his/her skill? How's that going to go?
I know my skill ceiling, and no matter how i tried to get up from it, i can't do it better......for various reasons....

priforce · March 2019

As a healer, I am a big fan of dungeons being dialed a bit after every dlc/update. It makes the content more accessible and the hard modes for the game vets/elites. It makes for a balanced system that makes everyone happy.