Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
Literally no one is happy with Altmer spell recharge atm, why are they so stubborn?
-
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭Sanguinor2 wrote: »dunmer more favored then altmer and with this patch Breton more favored then altmer. That argument is simplified to this.
Pre wrathstone dmg>sustain post wrathstone sustain>dmg nothing else has really changed besides racial passives. If dunmer is supposedly the more favored pre wrathstone becuz of dmg>sustain, besides racial passives what changed to make it post wrathstone, sustain>dmg.
Actually what changed compared to live is that Bretons Sustain Advantage is big enough to drop other Sustain Tools while Altmer Sustain Advantage was not big enough to do so, so its not as easy as you are making it out to be. Altmer was still running the same Sustain Tools outside of racials that Dunmer was running, while on pts Breton doesnt have to do so, that is what changed, you are just trying to simplify it and not looking at the complete picture.
Still doesn’t explain how dunmer is better than altmer on live sure dunmer gets 7% increase to fire and only 2% on the other elements so outside of magdk and running destro staff skills dunmer 7% isn’t as great as it’s made out to be.
Breton is sustain race
Altmer is damage race
Pick some kind of change that will not affect dps or sustain, be viable for both pve and pvp, and lore friendly.
I have a simple one but it may be over powered in pvp.
Spell recharge renamed to spell focus when casting a class skill restore lowest maximum resource by 645 and grant 5% damage mitigation for 6 seconds this effect can occur once every 6 seconds. Reduced chance of being interrupted when using a channeled or cast time skill.
Bash would not always interrupt but for balance sake crushing shock would still interrupt so this is about as fair and balanced of a change as anyone is gonna come up with
0 -
Sanguinor2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Still doesn’t explain how dunmer is better than altmer on live sure dunmer gets 7% increase to fire and only 2% on the other elements so outside of magdk and running destro staff skills dunmer 7% isn’t as great as it’s made out to be.
Breton is sustain race
Altmer is damage race
Pick some kind of change that will not affect dps or sustain, be viable for both pve and pvp, and lore friendly.
I have a simple one but it may be over powered in pvp.
Spell recharge renamed to spell focus when casting a class skill restore lowest maximum resource by 645 and grant 5% damage mitigation for 6 seconds this effect can occur once every 6 seconds. Reduced chance of being interrupted when using a channeled or cast time skill.
Bash would not always interrupt but for balance sake crushing shock would still interrupt so this is about as fair and balanced of a change as anyone is gonna come up with
Let me go into Detail with the dunmer altmer thing on live since it is very apparent that you will not understand if I dont. Before clockwork City most mag dps Players would run a maelstrom Lightning staff on the backbar to provide concussion/offbalance for the Group, this in turn would boost dps as a whole.
However come clockwork City offbalance got a rework, instead of being able to constantly apply it and thus getting a huge dps boost from the third cp passive in the ritual constelation (10% increased Damage with EVERYTHING against offbalanced Targets), bosses got an immunity to offbalance with a 5 second window where offbalance applies that has a cooldown of 20seconds.
Suddenly a Lightning staff on the backbar doesnt give this huge dps to the Group anymore and has thus become unnecessary. The minor vulnerability can instead be provided by a healer or a single dps utilizing the set Infallible Aether.
As you might have noticed when reading destro passive an Inferno staff gives you 8% more single target dps, in addition to Blockade of fire dealing 20% more Damage to Burning enemies.
With this increase in single target, dps Players swapped to double Inferno to increase single target dps since that is what really matters in most Trials.
Now that many classes (and the undisputed meta class nightblade) only had fire elemental Damage suddenly dunmer becomes a much more attractive choice, you are boosting your destro ultimate, Blockade, Burning, and Inferno light attacks on both of your bars, while also passively increasing your single target dps on both bars by 8%.
I hope this will help you understand why Dunmer were the superior choice over Altmer. If not then I really dont know what to do to be honest.
Politeness is respecting others.
Courage is doing what is fair.
Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
Honor is keeping ones word.2 -
Razorback174✭✭✭✭✭Pick some kind of change that will not affect dps or sustain, be viable for both pve and pvp, and lore friendly.
How about a small amount of health restore on cast with a few second cooldown?
It's lore-friendly (call it "vitality" or something, fits the long-lived lives of the Altmer)
It's useful in both PvE and PvP (This is the part that ticks me off the most, I could give a **** about being meta)
It has no affect on parses whatsoever
It's almost analogous to the current Orc "utility" passive (which ZoS CLAIMED they wanted to be the stamina copy of Altmer for, yet they failed incredibly hard at that)2 -
Sanguinor2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Breton is sustain race
Altmer is damage race
Pick some kind of change that will not affect dps or sustain, be viable for both pve and pvp, and lore friendly.
I have a simple one but it may be over powered in pvp.
Spell recharge renamed to spell focus when casting a class skill restore lowest maximum resource by 645 and grant 5% damage mitigation for 6 seconds this effect can occur once every 6 seconds. Reduced chance of being interrupted when using a channeled or cast time skill.
Bash would not always interrupt but for balance sake crushing shock would still interrupt so this is about as fair and balanced of a change as anyone is gonna come up with
Now for your second post, I have yet to see why Altmer cannot under any circumstance have main stat Sustain. If you look at 4.3.0 parses Altmer isnt far ahead if at all, sure you can adjust the value if it seems too high, but old spell recharge did in no way match Breton Sustain and wasnt a danger to Breton being the Sustain race, just as Breton retaining 50% of Altmers Damage passives endangers Altmer being the dps race.
Adjusting the old spell recharge to match the Breton 100 mag recovery passive would in no way make Altmers OP. It would not allow them to use berserk glyph or blue Food to set Breton further behind, it would even be weaker than having 100 mag regen since you Need to have a perfect uptime on it and it doesnt get affected by % modifiers from light armor passive and CP.Politeness is respecting others.
Courage is doing what is fair.
Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
Honor is keeping ones word.3 -
ZOS_JesCadminGreetings, we've removed a few baiting comments. This is a friendly reminder to keep comments constructive and on topic. Posts should adhere to our forum rules which can be found here. Thank you for your understanding.The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios
Forum Rules | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Home Page | Help Site0 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Point is altmer on live is considered a meta race above pretty much every other race on a mag dps and that’s fine.
It's not, and you need to stop parroting that.
Every time you say it, it reinfoces the fact that either:
1. You have no idea what you're talking about because you don't actually run endgame content
2. You're trolling
Please reread wut I said before you attack I said pretty much above every other race. Ik your gonna say dunmer is BiS on live which is funny I see more high elves then dunmer on live but ok I’m just a troll and I according to you don’t do endgame content. I’m parroting information need I copy and paste just about everyone of your replies on any of the threads about altmers. Talk about parroting
What you see more of (and there is no way to objectively quantify "what you see") doesn't determine BiS. BiS is determined through statistical analysis and testing.
Statistical analysis and testing on PTS show altmer ahead of Breton. So what is ur point?
On perfect sustain dummy parse, not in real situations
Wrong. They were sacrificing their dmg on altmer to make up for the lack of sustain
No. Do you have a source for that?
I mean this 'lack of sustain'.
I can't find a comparison between dps values and reg/drain values.
You do realise that the only way Bretons can compete with altmer is when altmers use absorb magic enchants or gold food right? Aka sacrificing their dmg to get sustain. Your source is literally everywhere in the PTS. But seriously u need a source for that? Its common sense by just looking at their passives. Breton isnt going to magically make up for the loss of spell dmg and become competitive unless altmers give up their dmg.
Yeah right. Altmers give up their dmg to parse close to breton.
The best case would be to trade the 258 SD for 258 reg.
And now you wanna tell me that an altmer with 2000 magicka and 258 reg will parse higher than a breton with 2000 magicka and 100 reg + 7% cost reduction, raid buffed on a 6M dummy where both have near infinite sustain.
Let just look at the passives.
Altmer:
258 reg (*1,8 => highest possible I think and in favor of altmer here) = 464 reg
Breton:
100 reg (*1,8) = 180 reg
7% cost reduction =>
average cost skill Elemental Weapon (2858 Magicka) *7/100 = 200.06 reg/sec = 400.12 reg
400.12*0.95 (bad weaving) = 380.114 reg
160 reg + 380 reg = 560 reg
I may believe much, but an altmer will never beat a breton in a 6M dummy solo parse.
You literally changed the altmer build in a biased way just for the sake of equalizing their spell dmg with breton but without actually looking the best possible way to get the required sustain in terms of performance and then compared their sustain and concluded that bretons are better on a 6M dummy parse because they have more regen. Dfq? Id say that this doesnt even make any sense but this is beyond not making sense.
Look mate, i dont want to tell you anything. I know that you dont believe and you'll just change the conditions for the test just to fit it in ur agenda. But honestly, what you believe is completely irrelevant with reality. Reality is, that on tests in 6M dummy parses to simulate real situations as close as possible, altmers were beating bretons.
Edited by pieratsos on February 24, 2019 8:50PM1 -
HuawaSepp✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Point is altmer on live is considered a meta race above pretty much every other race on a mag dps and that’s fine.
It's not, and you need to stop parroting that.
Every time you say it, it reinfoces the fact that either:
1. You have no idea what you're talking about because you don't actually run endgame content
2. You're trolling
Please reread wut I said before you attack I said pretty much above every other race. Ik your gonna say dunmer is BiS on live which is funny I see more high elves then dunmer on live but ok I’m just a troll and I according to you don’t do endgame content. I’m parroting information need I copy and paste just about everyone of your replies on any of the threads about altmers. Talk about parroting
What you see more of (and there is no way to objectively quantify "what you see") doesn't determine BiS. BiS is determined through statistical analysis and testing.
Statistical analysis and testing on PTS show altmer ahead of Breton. So what is ur point?
On perfect sustain dummy parse, not in real situations
Wrong. They were sacrificing their dmg on altmer to make up for the lack of sustain
No. Do you have a source for that?
I mean this 'lack of sustain'.
I can't find a comparison between dps values and reg/drain values.
You do realise that the only way Bretons can compete with altmer is when altmers use absorb magic enchants or gold food right? Aka sacrificing their dmg to get sustain. Your source is literally everywhere in the PTS. But seriously u need a source for that? Its common sense by just looking at their passives. Breton isnt going to magically make up for the loss of spell dmg and become competitive unless altmers give up their dmg.
Yeah right. Altmers give up their dmg to parse close to breton.
The best case would be to trade the 258 SD for 258 reg.
And now you wanna tell me that an altmer with 2000 magicka and 258 reg will parse higher than a breton with 2000 magicka and 100 reg + 7% cost reduction, raid buffed on a 6M dummy where both have near infinite sustain.
Let just look at the passives.
Altmer:
258 reg (*1,8 => highest possible I think and in favor of altmer here) = 464 reg
Breton:
100 reg (*1,8) = 180 reg
7% cost reduction =>
average cost skill Elemental Weapon (2858 Magicka) *7/100 = 200.06 reg/sec = 400.12 reg
400.12*0.95 (bad weaving) = 380.114 reg
160 reg + 380 reg = 560 reg
I may believe much, but an altmer will never beat a breton in a 6M dummy solo parse.
You literally changed the altmer build in a biased way just for the sake of equalizing their spell dmg with breton but without actually looking the best possible way to get the required sustain in terms of performance and then compared their sustain and concluded that bretons are better on a 6M dummy parse because they have more regen. Dfq? Id say that this doesnt even make any sense but this is beyond not making sense.
Look mate, i dont want to tell you anything. I know that you dont believe and you'll just change the conditions for the test just to fit it in ur agenda. But honestly, what you believe is completely irrelevant with reality. Reality is, that on tests in 6M dummy parses to simulate real situations as close as possible, altmers were beating bretons.
The real situation is that I am switching from altmer to dunmer tomorrow and only regulate my sustain with another 3 pieces of mothers sorrow jewelery.
The situation you call real is maybe real for the 2 best raid groups that are overall rank 1-12 at the day before a new patch (like today).
I always see myself only at overall rank 24-120 on the EU trials list.
Not because of people choosing the wrong race. Because of missing excercise, coordination, support, dps or sometimes even dead people.
I would rather trade my bouncing ~200 ping for a constant 50ms ping and pick imperial.PTS-EU0 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Point is altmer on live is considered a meta race above pretty much every other race on a mag dps and that’s fine.
It's not, and you need to stop parroting that.
Every time you say it, it reinfoces the fact that either:
1. You have no idea what you're talking about because you don't actually run endgame content
2. You're trolling
Please reread wut I said before you attack I said pretty much above every other race. Ik your gonna say dunmer is BiS on live which is funny I see more high elves then dunmer on live but ok I’m just a troll and I according to you don’t do endgame content. I’m parroting information need I copy and paste just about everyone of your replies on any of the threads about altmers. Talk about parroting
What you see more of (and there is no way to objectively quantify "what you see") doesn't determine BiS. BiS is determined through statistical analysis and testing.
Statistical analysis and testing on PTS show altmer ahead of Breton. So what is ur point?
On perfect sustain dummy parse, not in real situations
Wrong. They were sacrificing their dmg on altmer to make up for the lack of sustain
No. Do you have a source for that?
I mean this 'lack of sustain'.
I can't find a comparison between dps values and reg/drain values.
You do realise that the only way Bretons can compete with altmer is when altmers use absorb magic enchants or gold food right? Aka sacrificing their dmg to get sustain. Your source is literally everywhere in the PTS. But seriously u need a source for that? Its common sense by just looking at their passives. Breton isnt going to magically make up for the loss of spell dmg and become competitive unless altmers give up their dmg.
Yeah right. Altmers give up their dmg to parse close to breton.
The best case would be to trade the 258 SD for 258 reg.
And now you wanna tell me that an altmer with 2000 magicka and 258 reg will parse higher than a breton with 2000 magicka and 100 reg + 7% cost reduction, raid buffed on a 6M dummy where both have near infinite sustain.
Let just look at the passives.
Altmer:
258 reg (*1,8 => highest possible I think and in favor of altmer here) = 464 reg
Breton:
100 reg (*1,8) = 180 reg
7% cost reduction =>
average cost skill Elemental Weapon (2858 Magicka) *7/100 = 200.06 reg/sec = 400.12 reg
400.12*0.95 (bad weaving) = 380.114 reg
160 reg + 380 reg = 560 reg
I may believe much, but an altmer will never beat a breton in a 6M dummy solo parse.
You literally changed the altmer build in a biased way just for the sake of equalizing their spell dmg with breton but without actually looking the best possible way to get the required sustain in terms of performance and then compared their sustain and concluded that bretons are better on a 6M dummy parse because they have more regen. Dfq? Id say that this doesnt even make any sense but this is beyond not making sense.
Look mate, i dont want to tell you anything. I know that you dont believe and you'll just change the conditions for the test just to fit it in ur agenda. But honestly, what you believe is completely irrelevant with reality. Reality is, that on tests in 6M dummy parses to simulate real situations as close as possible, altmers were beating bretons.
The real situation is that I am switching from altmer to dunmer tomorrow and only regulate my sustain with another 3 pieces of mothers sorrow jewelery.
The situation you call real is maybe real for the 2 best raid groups that are overall rank 1-12 at the day before a new patch (like today).
I always see myself only at overall rank 24-120 on the EU trials list.
Not because of people choosing the wrong race. Because of missing excercise, coordination, support, dps or sometimes even dead people.
I would rather trade my bouncing ~200 ping for a constant 50ms ping and pick imperial.
The situation you brought up before is a hypothetical irrelevant biased scenario which doesnt simulates anything other than your agenda of showing how inferior altmers are. Unfortunately for you, actual facts prove the exact opposite which is why you are moving the goalpost now and saying things that are literally off topic.
The situation i call real is the most widely accepted situation for a DPS test that simulates end game scenarios. Sure its not perfect and real dynamic scenarios are completely different but comparing races in those situations makes no sense to begin with.
As far as what you are going to do tomorrow, its also off topic. Change ur altmer to a bosmer for all i care. It still wont change the fact that altmers beat breton on 6M dummy parses.
0 -
HuawaSepp✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Point is altmer on live is considered a meta race above pretty much every other race on a mag dps and that’s fine.
It's not, and you need to stop parroting that.
Every time you say it, it reinfoces the fact that either:
1. You have no idea what you're talking about because you don't actually run endgame content
2. You're trolling
Please reread wut I said before you attack I said pretty much above every other race. Ik your gonna say dunmer is BiS on live which is funny I see more high elves then dunmer on live but ok I’m just a troll and I according to you don’t do endgame content. I’m parroting information need I copy and paste just about everyone of your replies on any of the threads about altmers. Talk about parroting
What you see more of (and there is no way to objectively quantify "what you see") doesn't determine BiS. BiS is determined through statistical analysis and testing.
Statistical analysis and testing on PTS show altmer ahead of Breton. So what is ur point?
On perfect sustain dummy parse, not in real situations
Wrong. They were sacrificing their dmg on altmer to make up for the lack of sustain
No. Do you have a source for that?
I mean this 'lack of sustain'.
I can't find a comparison between dps values and reg/drain values.
You do realise that the only way Bretons can compete with altmer is when altmers use absorb magic enchants or gold food right? Aka sacrificing their dmg to get sustain. Your source is literally everywhere in the PTS. But seriously u need a source for that? Its common sense by just looking at their passives. Breton isnt going to magically make up for the loss of spell dmg and become competitive unless altmers give up their dmg.
Yeah right. Altmers give up their dmg to parse close to breton.
The best case would be to trade the 258 SD for 258 reg.
And now you wanna tell me that an altmer with 2000 magicka and 258 reg will parse higher than a breton with 2000 magicka and 100 reg + 7% cost reduction, raid buffed on a 6M dummy where both have near infinite sustain.
Let just look at the passives.
Altmer:
258 reg (*1,8 => highest possible I think and in favor of altmer here) = 464 reg
Breton:
100 reg (*1,8) = 180 reg
7% cost reduction =>
average cost skill Elemental Weapon (2858 Magicka) *7/100 = 200.06 reg/sec = 400.12 reg
400.12*0.95 (bad weaving) = 380.114 reg
160 reg + 380 reg = 560 reg
I may believe much, but an altmer will never beat a breton in a 6M dummy solo parse.
You literally changed the altmer build in a biased way just for the sake of equalizing their spell dmg with breton but without actually looking the best possible way to get the required sustain in terms of performance and then compared their sustain and concluded that bretons are better on a 6M dummy parse because they have more regen. Dfq? Id say that this doesnt even make any sense but this is beyond not making sense.
Look mate, i dont want to tell you anything. I know that you dont believe and you'll just change the conditions for the test just to fit it in ur agenda. But honestly, what you believe is completely irrelevant with reality. Reality is, that on tests in 6M dummy parses to simulate real situations as close as possible, altmers were beating bretons.
The real situation is that I am switching from altmer to dunmer tomorrow and only regulate my sustain with another 3 pieces of mothers sorrow jewelery.
The situation you call real is maybe real for the 2 best raid groups that are overall rank 1-12 at the day before a new patch (like today).
I always see myself only at overall rank 24-120 on the EU trials list.
Not because of people choosing the wrong race. Because of missing excercise, coordination, support, dps or sometimes even dead people.
I would rather trade my bouncing ~200 ping for a constant 50ms ping and pick imperial.
The situation you brought up before is a hypothetical irrelevant biased scenario which doesnt simulates anything other than your agenda of showing how inferior altmers are. Unfortunately for you, actual facts prove the exact opposite which is why you are moving the goalpost now and saying things that are literally off topic.
The situation i call real is the most widely accepted situation for a DPS test that simulates end game scenarios. Sure its not perfect and real dynamic scenarios are completely different but comparing races in those situations makes no sense to begin with.
As far as what you are going to do tomorrow, its also off topic. Change ur altmer to a bosmer for all i care. It still wont change the fact that altmers beat breton on 6M dummy parses.
I only said breton is not inferior to altmer in terms of dps because in an actual trial even the best groups have to focus minibosses (multitarget that favors the bretons weapon dmg enchant) and weaving a few heavy attacks (favors better sustain).
Additionaly to some other, not trial specific situations that favor breton.
So my point is that not in every single aspect of the game, altmer always gets these 0,5% more dps in average and that there are also situations where breton could get 0,5% more dps than altmer.
Therefore in my opinion both races have the same dps potential.
And exactly because I think so, I also think it is not fair to give altmer this useless third passive.
Only for magplars I would call both balanced.PTS-EU0 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Point is altmer on live is considered a meta race above pretty much every other race on a mag dps and that’s fine.
It's not, and you need to stop parroting that.
Every time you say it, it reinfoces the fact that either:
1. You have no idea what you're talking about because you don't actually run endgame content
2. You're trolling
Please reread wut I said before you attack I said pretty much above every other race. Ik your gonna say dunmer is BiS on live which is funny I see more high elves then dunmer on live but ok I’m just a troll and I according to you don’t do endgame content. I’m parroting information need I copy and paste just about everyone of your replies on any of the threads about altmers. Talk about parroting
What you see more of (and there is no way to objectively quantify "what you see") doesn't determine BiS. BiS is determined through statistical analysis and testing.
Statistical analysis and testing on PTS show altmer ahead of Breton. So what is ur point?
On perfect sustain dummy parse, not in real situations
Wrong. They were sacrificing their dmg on altmer to make up for the lack of sustain
No. Do you have a source for that?
I mean this 'lack of sustain'.
I can't find a comparison between dps values and reg/drain values.
You do realise that the only way Bretons can compete with altmer is when altmers use absorb magic enchants or gold food right? Aka sacrificing their dmg to get sustain. Your source is literally everywhere in the PTS. But seriously u need a source for that? Its common sense by just looking at their passives. Breton isnt going to magically make up for the loss of spell dmg and become competitive unless altmers give up their dmg.
Yeah right. Altmers give up their dmg to parse close to breton.
The best case would be to trade the 258 SD for 258 reg.
And now you wanna tell me that an altmer with 2000 magicka and 258 reg will parse higher than a breton with 2000 magicka and 100 reg + 7% cost reduction, raid buffed on a 6M dummy where both have near infinite sustain.
Let just look at the passives.
Altmer:
258 reg (*1,8 => highest possible I think and in favor of altmer here) = 464 reg
Breton:
100 reg (*1,8) = 180 reg
7% cost reduction =>
average cost skill Elemental Weapon (2858 Magicka) *7/100 = 200.06 reg/sec = 400.12 reg
400.12*0.95 (bad weaving) = 380.114 reg
160 reg + 380 reg = 560 reg
I may believe much, but an altmer will never beat a breton in a 6M dummy solo parse.
You literally changed the altmer build in a biased way just for the sake of equalizing their spell dmg with breton but without actually looking the best possible way to get the required sustain in terms of performance and then compared their sustain and concluded that bretons are better on a 6M dummy parse because they have more regen. Dfq? Id say that this doesnt even make any sense but this is beyond not making sense.
Look mate, i dont want to tell you anything. I know that you dont believe and you'll just change the conditions for the test just to fit it in ur agenda. But honestly, what you believe is completely irrelevant with reality. Reality is, that on tests in 6M dummy parses to simulate real situations as close as possible, altmers were beating bretons.
The real situation is that I am switching from altmer to dunmer tomorrow and only regulate my sustain with another 3 pieces of mothers sorrow jewelery.
The situation you call real is maybe real for the 2 best raid groups that are overall rank 1-12 at the day before a new patch (like today).
I always see myself only at overall rank 24-120 on the EU trials list.
Not because of people choosing the wrong race. Because of missing excercise, coordination, support, dps or sometimes even dead people.
I would rather trade my bouncing ~200 ping for a constant 50ms ping and pick imperial.
The situation you brought up before is a hypothetical irrelevant biased scenario which doesnt simulates anything other than your agenda of showing how inferior altmers are. Unfortunately for you, actual facts prove the exact opposite which is why you are moving the goalpost now and saying things that are literally off topic.
The situation i call real is the most widely accepted situation for a DPS test that simulates end game scenarios. Sure its not perfect and real dynamic scenarios are completely different but comparing races in those situations makes no sense to begin with.
As far as what you are going to do tomorrow, its also off topic. Change ur altmer to a bosmer for all i care. It still wont change the fact that altmers beat breton on 6M dummy parses.
I only said breton is not inferior to altmer in terms of dps because in an actual trial even the best groups have to focus minibosses (multitarget that favors the bretons weapon dmg enchant) and weaving a few heavy attacks (favors better sustain).
Additionaly to some other, not trial specific situations that favor breton.
So my point is that not in every single aspect of the game, altmer always gets these 0,5% more dps in average and that there are also situations where breton could get 0,5% more dps than altmer.
Therefore in my opinion both races have the same dps potential.
And exactly because I think so, I also think it is not fair to give altmer this useless third passive.
Only for magplars I would call both balanced.
I completely agree that in a dynamic environment its different. The issue is that in a dynamic environment there are so many variables to the point where race may not even matter so comparing them is pointless.
If you are going to compare them then it has to be done in a somewhat controlled environment and when it comes that, altmer simply has better DPS potential. Of course their DPS potential doesn't necessarily translate to actual DPS at any given fight but again, if you are going to bring all those variables in the comparison then it's pointless. You are creating an environment where racials become insignificant when you look at the bigger picture. Sort of like PVP. You want to call stamina regen useless. Be my guest. But at least do it in the situation that it's actually useless. Not in dynamic fights with variables that you can't control cause when it comes to that, a core mechanic of the game such as stamina sustain is most definitely not useless.0 -
Itzmichi✭✭✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »I mean all other passives have nays and yays but this one is nays. Not a single person says it good or useful or even makes sense. I can imagine the person who came up with this idea is so upset no one liked his idea he got even more stubborn and is keeping it just to spite those who criticized his idea. There is no other explanation for it to stay for live.
They could literally give Altmers anything that doesn't directly affect dps like a healing passive or a defensive passive, but what the heck is that?
Why are you so stubborn and demand changes? Let's see where it leads first, changes come and changes go.Here, have a chill pill 💊!0 -
martijnlv40✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »I mean all other passives have nays and yays but this one is nays. Not a single person says it good or useful or even makes sense. I can imagine the person who came up with this idea is so upset no one liked his idea he got even more stubborn and is keeping it just to spite those who criticized his idea. There is no other explanation for it to stay for live.
They could literally give Altmers anything that doesn't directly affect dps like a healing passive or a defensive passive, but what the heck is that?
Why are you so stubborn and demand changes? Let's see where it leads first, changes come and changes go.
Which is a problem for MMO's in general, since people have to spend money to keep up with the changes. It would be best for anyone but ZOS to get it right the first time. Unfortunately they'll probably tweak some racial passives with Elsweyr again (they'll have to) and a *** breaks loose again.0 -
Seraphayel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭martijnlv40 wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »I mean all other passives have nays and yays but this one is nays. Not a single person says it good or useful or even makes sense. I can imagine the person who came up with this idea is so upset no one liked his idea he got even more stubborn and is keeping it just to spite those who criticized his idea. There is no other explanation for it to stay for live.
They could literally give Altmers anything that doesn't directly affect dps like a healing passive or a defensive passive, but what the heck is that?
Why are you so stubborn and demand changes? Let's see where it leads first, changes come and changes go.
Which is a problem for MMO's in general, since people have to spend money to keep up with the changes. It would be best for anyone but ZOS to get it right the first time. Unfortunately they'll probably tweak some racial passives with Elsweyr again (they'll have to) and a *** breaks loose again.
The thing is, you actually have to invest $0 to get these changes because they're part of the base game update. Always were and most likely always will be. Base game adjustments like racial changes are free for all players that own the game.PS5EUAldmeri Dominion- Khajiit Arcanist -0 -
HuawaSepp✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »MLGProPlayer wrote: »Point is altmer on live is considered a meta race above pretty much every other race on a mag dps and that’s fine.
It's not, and you need to stop parroting that.
Every time you say it, it reinfoces the fact that either:
1. You have no idea what you're talking about because you don't actually run endgame content
2. You're trolling
Please reread wut I said before you attack I said pretty much above every other race. Ik your gonna say dunmer is BiS on live which is funny I see more high elves then dunmer on live but ok I’m just a troll and I according to you don’t do endgame content. I’m parroting information need I copy and paste just about everyone of your replies on any of the threads about altmers. Talk about parroting
What you see more of (and there is no way to objectively quantify "what you see") doesn't determine BiS. BiS is determined through statistical analysis and testing.
Statistical analysis and testing on PTS show altmer ahead of Breton. So what is ur point?
On perfect sustain dummy parse, not in real situations
Wrong. They were sacrificing their dmg on altmer to make up for the lack of sustain
No. Do you have a source for that?
I mean this 'lack of sustain'.
I can't find a comparison between dps values and reg/drain values.
You do realise that the only way Bretons can compete with altmer is when altmers use absorb magic enchants or gold food right? Aka sacrificing their dmg to get sustain. Your source is literally everywhere in the PTS. But seriously u need a source for that? Its common sense by just looking at their passives. Breton isnt going to magically make up for the loss of spell dmg and become competitive unless altmers give up their dmg.
Yeah right. Altmers give up their dmg to parse close to breton.
The best case would be to trade the 258 SD for 258 reg.
And now you wanna tell me that an altmer with 2000 magicka and 258 reg will parse higher than a breton with 2000 magicka and 100 reg + 7% cost reduction, raid buffed on a 6M dummy where both have near infinite sustain.
Let just look at the passives.
Altmer:
258 reg (*1,8 => highest possible I think and in favor of altmer here) = 464 reg
Breton:
100 reg (*1,8) = 180 reg
7% cost reduction =>
average cost skill Elemental Weapon (2858 Magicka) *7/100 = 200.06 reg/sec = 400.12 reg
400.12*0.95 (bad weaving) = 380.114 reg
160 reg + 380 reg = 560 reg
I may believe much, but an altmer will never beat a breton in a 6M dummy solo parse.
You literally changed the altmer build in a biased way just for the sake of equalizing their spell dmg with breton but without actually looking the best possible way to get the required sustain in terms of performance and then compared their sustain and concluded that bretons are better on a 6M dummy parse because they have more regen. Dfq? Id say that this doesnt even make any sense but this is beyond not making sense.
Look mate, i dont want to tell you anything. I know that you dont believe and you'll just change the conditions for the test just to fit it in ur agenda. But honestly, what you believe is completely irrelevant with reality. Reality is, that on tests in 6M dummy parses to simulate real situations as close as possible, altmers were beating bretons.
The real situation is that I am switching from altmer to dunmer tomorrow and only regulate my sustain with another 3 pieces of mothers sorrow jewelery.
The situation you call real is maybe real for the 2 best raid groups that are overall rank 1-12 at the day before a new patch (like today).
I always see myself only at overall rank 24-120 on the EU trials list.
Not because of people choosing the wrong race. Because of missing excercise, coordination, support, dps or sometimes even dead people.
I would rather trade my bouncing ~200 ping for a constant 50ms ping and pick imperial.
The situation you brought up before is a hypothetical irrelevant biased scenario which doesnt simulates anything other than your agenda of showing how inferior altmers are. Unfortunately for you, actual facts prove the exact opposite which is why you are moving the goalpost now and saying things that are literally off topic.
The situation i call real is the most widely accepted situation for a DPS test that simulates end game scenarios. Sure its not perfect and real dynamic scenarios are completely different but comparing races in those situations makes no sense to begin with.
As far as what you are going to do tomorrow, its also off topic. Change ur altmer to a bosmer for all i care. It still wont change the fact that altmers beat breton on 6M dummy parses.
I only said breton is not inferior to altmer in terms of dps because in an actual trial even the best groups have to focus minibosses (multitarget that favors the bretons weapon dmg enchant) and weaving a few heavy attacks (favors better sustain).
Additionaly to some other, not trial specific situations that favor breton.
So my point is that not in every single aspect of the game, altmer always gets these 0,5% more dps in average and that there are also situations where breton could get 0,5% more dps than altmer.
Therefore in my opinion both races have the same dps potential.
And exactly because I think so, I also think it is not fair to give altmer this useless third passive.
Only for magplars I would call both balanced.
I completely agree that in a dynamic environment its different. The issue is that in a dynamic environment there are so many variables to the point where race may not even matter so comparing them is pointless.
If you are going to compare them then it has to be done in a somewhat controlled environment and when it comes that, altmer simply has better DPS potential. Of course their DPS potential doesn't necessarily translate to actual DPS at any given fight but again, if you are going to bring all those variables in the comparison then it's pointless. You are creating an environment where racials become insignificant when you look at the bigger picture. Sort of like PVP. You want to call stamina regen useless. Be my guest. But at least do it in the situation that it's actually useless. Not in dynamic fights with variables that you can't control cause when it comes to that, a core mechanic of the game such as stamina sustain is most definitely not useless.
I can agree with that.
Anyways, altmers could be happy to not get completely bosmered
PTS-EU0 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Tbf it's hard to argue that Altmers are not balanced PvE and PvP wise.
For PVP it's a good pasive for every class but especially for MagSorcs, considering Dark Deal/Conversion is used to restore your max resource pool from your minimum. Spellcharge might be a nerf for PvE when seen in isolation, but when seen along with the buff to Elemental Talent and the changes done to the other races, Altmer's still as good as any other race.
As for the lore, you have to accept that a SPRPG is one thing and MMORPG is quite another. You can go as lore heavy as you want in an SPRPG but you have to build for balance above all in an MMO for your game to be playable by the masses. And sometimes the lore has to bend a little to make the game equally fun for everyone.
Edited by Maulkin on February 25, 2019 4:45PMEU | PC | AD0