SnB Shield enchant changes?

Madcap_Symphony · February 2019

I'm looking to see if there can be work done on adding new enchants for shields. With the upcoming changes to 1-hander enchants forcing tanks who were not already back-baring a 2-hander to swap over to that setup in order to keep up a high Crusher proc, I'm seeing a bit of an issue. The constant bar swapping between SnB and 2-Hander makes the enchant on your shield useless, since every time you swap you lose the shield enchants resources because all you can enchant at this moment are Health, Mana, and Stam. Now I understand throwing in proc on block enchants would be hard to implement right away, but could we see about using some of the Jewel-crafting enchants on shields, like the Magica or Health recovery ones. Some of the old quest reward shields used to come with these enchants on them like the Grevious Leeching Ward so it shouldn't be to hard to implement I would think. Any thoughts?

Madcap_Symphony · February 2019

Note; Not saying I don't like the changes. Ive been testing out using an Ice staff and Blockade on my back-bar and I like that how it keeps Crusher up on a regular cycle. I just don't like seeing my resources change every time I bar swap. I would love to put a Magica recovery enchant on the shield instead to help recover my MP for the new spell thrown into the rotation.

twing1_ · February 2019

Or what if shields were given 2h weapon enchants that would only proc on successfully blocked attacks/bashes. This would make it so that tanks still get the full effect of a 2h weapon enchant, without it being super overpowered on dual wield builds.

simeion · February 2019

There is an easy fix....add a passive to SnB skill line doubling the effectiveness of the weapon enchant. I already run an ice staff back bar on my tank. If this change goes live the way it is on the PTS i will keep my infused back bar crusher on my ice staff and run blockade. On the front bar the transmute my sword to decisive or defending (only if i am not a Nord).

twing1_ · February 2019

simeion wrote: »

There is an easy fix....add a passive to SnB skill line doubling the effectiveness of the weapon enchant. I already run an ice staff back bar on my tank. If this change goes live the way it is on the PTS i will keep my infused back bar crusher on my ice staff and run blockade. On the front bar the transmute my sword to decisive or defending (only if i am not a Nord).

This would also work

Madcap_Symphony · February 2019

That helps the swords enchant, but I’m talking about the Tri-stat enchant on the shield. How each time you bar-swap you lose the resources from it. Having non-resource enchants to also put on shields would be much better for people’s different play styles.

Veinblood1965 · February 2019

I need to read up on this change. Just leveled my new tank to 50 and using S&B. Apparently I need to level up two handers?

simeion · February 2019

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

I need to read up on this change. Just leveled my new tank to 50 and using S&B. Apparently I need to level up two handers?

As a tank you want a destro staff when you get used to tanking. Best to go 2x SnB until you are comfortable. The 2h does not have a ground based DoT to keep crusher up. So you should look into a shock staff or a ice staff with blockade to trigger your crusher. Ice staff will allow you to block with magic on you back bar. I dont use this passive. The shock staff will help with minor vulnerability and off balance up time. I prefer ice staff for block cost reduction.

Staff back bar is a more advanced tanking style, move into it slowly. It is not for beginning tanks. Also the advantage is heavy attacks fb restore stam and back bar restore magic.

paulychan · February 2019

Madcap_Symphony wrote: »

That helps the swords enchant, but I’m talking about the Tri-stat enchant on the shield. How each time you bar-swap you lose the resources from it. Having non-resource enchants to also put on shields would be much better for people’s different play styles.

It's a valid concern. I back bar a staff and have full stamina on shield rather than tri. I also played with nirn, not worth it due to low numbers

Ragnarock41 · February 2019

SnB took an unneccessary nerf with these enchant changes. Some form of compensation would be nice.

Madcap_Symphony · February 2019

simeion wrote: »

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

I need to read up on this change. Just leveled my new tank to 50 and using S&B. Apparently I need to level up two handers?

The 2h does not have a ground based DoT to keep crusher up. So you should look into a shock staff or a ice staff with blockade to trigger your crusher.

Partly my bad there, I meant 2-Hander as in any two handed weapon including staffs, not just the skill line. Thanks for clearing that up Simeion

MartiniDaniels · February 2019

I think they need to make shield enchantments use jewelry glyphs but with reduced value. So you may enchant it with magicka recovery or block cost reduction and be done with it.

Olupajmibanan · February 2019

Madcap_Symphony wrote: »

simeion wrote: »

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

I need to read up on this change. Just leveled my new tank to 50 and using S&B. Apparently I need to level up two handers?

The 2h does not have a ground based DoT to keep crusher up. So you should look into a shock staff or a ice staff with blockade to trigger your crusher.

Partly my bad there, I meant 2-Hander as in any two handed weapon including staffs, not just the skill line. Thanks for clearing that up Simeion

Bow is suitable as well but subpar to staves. The advantage of bow is that the AoE is smaller than blockade and you can use it more precisely to keep Crusher on the boss and not on adds nearby.

MartiniDaniels · February 2019

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Madcap_Symphony wrote: »

simeion wrote: »

Veinblood1965 wrote: »

I need to read up on this change. Just leveled my new tank to 50 and using S&B. Apparently I need to level up two handers?

The 2h does not have a ground based DoT to keep crusher up. So you should look into a shock staff or a ice staff with blockade to trigger your crusher.

Partly my bad there, I meant 2-Hander as in any two handed weapon including staffs, not just the skill line. Thanks for clearing that up Simeion

Bow is suitable as well but subpar to staves. The advantage of bow is that the AoE is smaller than blockade and you can use it more precisely to keep Crusher on the boss and not on adds nearby.

And you may use bombard as aoe roots for classes which lack one. But if you ever occasional try to block hard HA with bow you need a high-HP build, 33k tank may be one shot through bow block.

Madcap_Symphony · February 2019

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

I think they need to make shield enchantments use jewelry glyphs but with reduced value. So you may enchant it with magicka recovery or block cost reduction and be done with it.

Why half value, when it’s already so low as it is?

Stx · February 2019

I would enjoy being able to enchant shields with jewelry enchants. It honestly makes more sense.

Iskiab · February 2019

Why do anything? All I could see them doing is instead of shields giving double stats like a chest piece giving the normal stat amount like gloves. It’s more likely to get reduced then buffed.

MartiniDaniels · February 2019

Madcap_Symphony wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

I think they need to make shield enchantments use jewelry glyphs but with reduced value. So you may enchant it with magicka recovery or block cost reduction and be done with it.

Why half value, when it’s already so low as it is?

Well, of course it's better if it is full enchant

but then in PVP you'll be able to place another 174 WD on a shield and it will be massive boost.

Madcap_Symphony · February 2019

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Madcap_Symphony wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

I think they need to make shield enchantments use jewelry glyphs but with reduced value. So you may enchant it with magicka recovery or block cost reduction and be done with it.

Why half value, when it’s already so low as it is?

Well, of course it's better if it is full enchant but then in PVP you'll be able to place another 174 WD on a shield and it will be massive boost.

And 174 WD on any SnB ability isn’t going to amount to much. And they don’t have to allow them all if that’s the case, just the regen ones would be a great help.

DarkPicture · February 2019

They should just add to the last passiv 1h+shield a bonus passiv which increase value of enchant from 50% to 100% and problem is gone, but generally dw deserve on this change because it is OP and it should works like with traits:
u can combine 2 differents traits and have 50% value of them or just connect and have 1 full trait like with 2h weapons.

Solariken · February 2019

I've lobbied for changes to resource enchants too. My OCD gets triggered like crazy by max stats changing constantly and resources on shield enchants and back-bar item sets being useless as a pool value. IMO all max stat modifiers should be active 100% even when not on that bar.

Ragnarock41 · February 2019

@ZOS_Gilliam , I'm guessing you are probably too busy at the moment, but can you please take a look at this? People are already sick of gear swapping every patch and I think its common sense to say that SnB builds aren't overperforming anymore.

Otherwise I will be a very , very sad Dk that needs about 1000+ transmute stones and a lot of weapon glyphs to adapt this change.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · February 2019

I slot a health glyph on may shield, so I get more ward with igneous sheild and more health with polar wind. Also will proc healing based sets more, like bogdans and sentinel of rkugams.

Sleep724 · February 2019

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

@ZOS_Gilliam , I'm guessing you are probably too busy at the moment, but can you please take a look at this? People are already sick of gear swapping every patch and I think its common sense to say that SnB builds aren't overperforming anymore.

Otherwise I will be a very , very sad Dk that needs about 1000+ transmute stones and a lot of weapon glyphs to adapt this change.

Agreed. Guess I'll need to make all my 1h weapons nirnhoned now. Maybe should of done that already on a stam dk.

HankTwo · February 2019

Unnecessary nerf to PvE tanks as well as the offense of PvP SnB users if you ask me. I guess after this change goes live I will use nirnhoned + alchemical poison instead of infused + weapon damage glyph on my PvP stam DK.

To me it looks like ZOS wanted this change to balance dual wield while just ignoring the implications on SnB. Armor enchants and traits are much weaker than weapon enchants and traits, so the justification that you get two enchants/traits instead of one doesn't work for SnB as it works for dual wield.

Lord_Eomer · February 2019

simeion wrote: »

There is an easy fix....add a passive to SnB skill line doubling the effectiveness of the weapon enchant. I already run an ice staff back bar on my tank. If this change goes live the way it is on the PTS i will keep my infused back bar crusher on my ice staff and run blockade. On the front bar the transmute my sword to decisive or defending (only if i am not a Nord).

Why doubling enchantment? Will there be any balance left?

HankTwo · February 2019

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

simeion wrote: »

There is an easy fix....add a passive to SnB skill line doubling the effectiveness of the weapon enchant. I already run an ice staff back bar on my tank. If this change goes live the way it is on the PTS i will keep my infused back bar crusher on my ice staff and run blockade. On the front bar the transmute my sword to decisive or defending (only if i am not a Nord).

Why doubling enchantment? Will there be any balance left?

Because one handed enchants will be halved next patch? So this new passive and the enchantment nerf would just cancel each other out. I like the proposal.

BattleAxe · February 2019

I get the concern for pve but I think people are forgetting to balance this game around all aspects you give snb a passive to keep 2h lvl enchant will make snb op in pvp just to make pve happy. A good idea would be doing something with the shield bcuz yes it is a nuisance losing the stat bonuses when switching bars unless using snb both bars. To make players happy on both sides I think a possible suggestion would be is take away the armor given by shield and allow the enchanting of a weapon enchant that way you get something but you also lose something. My reasoning is sure for some a shield is a piece of armor irl but for others a shield is viewed as a weapon also irl. That is just one suggestion another is remove enchants from shields and just allow a second trait instead. Ik this would make infused undesirable on a shield but it would allow snb users something unique to make up for losing enchant potency on the 1h

SirSchmoopy1535 · February 2019

Just make shields enchantable with Armor OR Weapon Glyphs, keep the 1/2 potency, if it has the same enchant as the 1h it's paired with make it so the procs don't over lap so essentially the uptime is doubled. If it's enchanted with a Weapon Glyph instead of proc-ing off of a hit it procs off a block, with an appropriate CD.

SirSchmoopy1535 · February 2019

SirSchmoopy1535 wrote: »

Just make shields enchantable with Armor OR Weapon Glyphs, keep the 1/2 potency, if it has the same enchant as the 1h it's paired with make it so the procs don't over lap so essentially the uptime is doubled. If it's enchanted with a Weapon Glyph instead of proc-ing off of a hit it procs off a block, with an appropriate CD.

Or better yet since Shields stand alone as the only Woodworking based Armor, why not just given them their own set of Enchants for Shields only that include base stats enchants from Armor, the block/bash cost from jewelry, and new enchants to fill the rest that include effects to proc on Blocking and/Bashing.