Sorcerer : My Proposition

Destary · January 2019

Hello there,

Today and after 1 week on PTS i want to share my impression. This post is only my ideas for PVP, no PVE.

Magicka Sorcerer

- Like warden, i think that can be a good idea to up Expert Mage passive, now that give 2% for 1 skill in your bar, 3% will be better, that don't change a lot but give help on DPS.
- Change Amplitude, cause now that give 10% when target is 100% health, but just with a light attack we loose 1%. So, i have 2 ideas :
- Now that increase your damage against target by 1% all 10%, so if the target is between 100% and 90%, he take 10% more damage. That more logic.
- Now that increase your damage against target by 2% all 20%, that more constant.
- Add a Nerf Heal ability. This new meta is really tanky and heals are really powerfull. All stamina players can debuff heal with Reverberating bash, so if we want Stamina and Magicka get same chance, add a magicka ability that debuff heal.
- Add a instant ultimate. In sorcerer we only have "support" ultimate, negate is cool in group but not for instant damage, same for atronach, that work good but better in group with synergy and overload.... Sorry but that isn't a real ultimate ^^. In magicka we have soul assault and meteore, but the first work on Dots and the second is REALLY REALLY NOT discreet

So, i propose to change meteore for that hit instant like dawnbreaker OR a magicka morph of Dawnbreaker.
-Add priority on shields, that make sense. Heal have priority on damages but shields not. I think that not difficult to do it and it's not "OP", that just normal.
-Like Nbs, make pets on one bar. On of biggest prob with Pet sorc is... his pets, cause that take 2 slots for only 1 pet.

Stamina Sorcerer

-The change on Implosion afect a lot stamsorc, cause in stamina this passive proc a lot.
- Add a stamina ultimate, like air attronach, that can help a lot.
- Add more stamina morph. Stamsorc have 4 stamina ability : Bound Armaments (A buff), Dark Deal (now it's more like a buff too), Hirricane (The BEEESSSSTT skill of sorc) and Critical Surge, but that cost magicka, so that not really a stamina ability (but that buff weapon damage). So, for me, a Stamina Morph of Curse or Frag, can be a good idea and change a little bit the gameplay.
- My last idea is a little bit abused, a lot of players will insult me for that, but, why not idc

I think to add minor protection on Sorcerer can balance sorc with others classes.

If i read it, thank you, i know i have a really poor english so that not easy for me to explain all my idea but i hope my proposition will be see and maybe accepeted.

So, thank you for reading.

SaintSubwayy · January 2019

Destary wrote: »

Change Amplitude, cause now that give 10% when target is 100% health, but just with a light attack we loose 1%. So, i have 2 ideas :
- Now that increase your damage against target by 1% all 10%, so if the target is between 100% and 90%, he take 10% more damage. That more logic.
- Now that increase your damage against target by 2% all 20%, that more constant.

First part Yes, the 20% Idea no.

I agree that the 10% only counting for the first hit is badly designed, but the 20% idea is in fact a buff to the already made change by 50%, which in my eyes would be too much.

Destary · January 2019

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

I agree that the 10% only counting for the first hit is badly designed, but the 20% idea is in fact a buff to the already made change by 50%, which in my eyes would be too much.

My idea was :

100% - 80% = 10%
80% - 60% = 8%
60% - 40% = 6%
40% - 20% = 4%
20% - 0% = 2%

That strong yes, that just an idea

Destary · January 2019

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_KaiSchober @ZOS_BillE @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GaryA

What do you think about it ?

Dracane · January 2019

I agree with Expert Mage being increased from 2% to 3%.
I don't know what it's like for others. But I never can put more than 3 sorcerer abilities on each bar in a useful manner. And 6% spell damage or even 8% is vastly inferior to 3% damage done per ability or 8% max magicka for one ability.

Destary · January 2019

Dracane wrote: »

I agree with Expert Mage being increased from 2% to 3%.
I don't know what it's like for others. But I never can put more than 3 sorcerer abilities on each bar in a useful manner. And 6% spell damage or even 8% is vastly inferior to 3% damage done per ability or 8% max magicka for one ability.

I agree, that a good idea. Magicka sorcerer work on max magicka (with shields).
The only prob is in stamina, 8% max magicka isn't necessary

Dracane · January 2019

Destary wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I agree with Expert Mage being increased from 2% to 3%.
I don't know what it's like for others. But I never can put more than 3 sorcerer abilities on each bar in a useful manner. And 6% spell damage or even 8% is vastly inferior to 3% damage done per ability or 8% max magicka for one ability.

I agree, that a good idea. Magicka sorcerer work on max magicka (with shields).
The only prob is in stamina, 8% max magicka isn't necessary

I suppose you are talking about stamina Nightblades. Well, the magicka does not help them offensively. But it gives them more ressources for cloak and shade.

So it's not entirely useless.

Anyway. Nightblades also gain crit damage and crit chance for slotting abilities.
Your comparison to Wardens was good. 3% damage per animal ability is gigantic. Reaching 9% damage or more is easily doable. you would need 5 sorcerer abilities to reach 10% spell damage. And 10% spell damage is not even compareable to 9% damage done.

visionality · January 2019

I have to admit I was dissappointed when I read the incoming patchnotes concerning sorcs. Didn't ZOS claim on working to give sorcs an attractive skillset again that would enable a competitive and variable playstyle?

I cannot see anything that would close the gap to high-performance classes even a tiny bit.

SaintSubwayy · January 2019

Destary wrote: »

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

I agree that the 10% only counting for the first hit is badly designed, but the 20% idea is in fact a buff to the already made change by 50%, which in my eyes would be too much.

My idea was :

100% - 80% = 10%
80% - 60% = 8%
60% - 40% = 6%
40% - 20% = 4%
20% - 0% = 2%

That strong yes, that just an idea

Jeah thats what I figured....

Personally I'd like to see the passive like this:
100 - 90% -> 10%
90 - 80% -> 9%
80 - 70% -> 8%
70 - 60% -> 7%
60 - 50% -> 6%
50 - 40% -> 5%
40 - 30% -> 4%
30 - 0% -> 3%

This wouldnt in my eyes seem a litle bite more viable, keeping some parts of old Passive, while merging it with the new one, while beeing on a better lvl than the actually implemented one on PTS, which is kinda silly only granting the 10% to the first hit.

Lord-Otto · January 2019

visionality wrote: »

I have to admit I was dissappointed when I read the incoming patchnotes concerning sorcs. Didn't ZOS claim on working to give sorcs an attractive skillset again that would enable a competitive and variable playstyle?

I cannot see anything that would close the gap to high-performance classes even a tiny bit.

They said it wouldn't be finished in this DLC. So earliest point would be Elsweyr. But don't bet on that.

Aedaryl · January 2019

@pugstary

Magsorc have few problem :

First of all is sustain :

There is no class that need to invest that much into sustain. Sorc have the most sustain investment + using harness magicka + using dark conversion.

Why a class that slot 2 sustain skill minimum (ele drain is also play) also need to invest the most stats into sustain?

Second problem is pressure :

Only noobs or very squishy builds die to curse + frag + reach combo.

People build with tankiness especially stamina : fury + 7th legion + bloodspawn kind of build is the standard and the healing they can stack is just too much for sorc burst window.

When you successfully hit your burst, tanky damage Stam build just are full HP when the next sorc combo hit, and this is even more a problem with the sorc defense, aka using 2 to 3 GCD for stacking shield.

You need 3 global cooldown to set up your burst and 2 to 3 to stack shields for having the Window to set up the burst. This just mean one thing : HoT tanky build have easely the time to recover from the burst.

To kill good people, sorc need to apply pressure on a build where both offense and defense gameplay remove it.

The only pressure sorc have is LA and it's not enough anymore to compete.

That's why a healing debuff is necessary. It's add pressure to the enemy.

Rune cage should take this role : make it a stun that make damage overtime (DOT) and applying minor defile for 6s.

NB : true pet sorc have pressure from pets, so making rune cage a dot with minor defile is a good way to not make pet sorc op

Third problem is that sorc have no burst good burst ultimate :

Meteor is one of the worst ultimate in the game and only new player don't counter it.

PS : A stamina curse is not an option, haunting curse is necessary for the PvP meta magsorc and deadric pray is the skill that make the all deadric summoning line relèvent.

However, a stamina frag is a good idea, as well as a air atronach.

Destary · January 2019

So, @Dracane i agree, Expert Mage add spell damage, and we don't have a lot of spell damage for that be really competitve.
8% Max magicka can be a good option, cause that increase DPS in PVP and PVE, so that viable for both, and that increase shields, so yeah i think that the best way.

@visionality , this patch is pretty good for magsorc, (less for stamsorc) cause that inscrease the DPS of Magsorc. Now in PVE Magsorc isn't DPS, it's more a healer/buffer (for minor prophecy), so with Amplitude that good, but not sufficient. A friend tried and Sorc have 8k DPS less than Nbs. For PVP that viable but hard, now on EU serv a lot of players are Magplar heavy argonian so a lot of heal. That why a heal nerf ability can be strong

validifyedneb18_ESO · January 2019

Aedaryl wrote: »

@pugstary

Magsorc have few problem :

First of all is sustain :

Just make Dark Exchange give critchance and sustain problems solved lel

visionality · January 2019

@Destary In advanced PVE, magsorc is no healer/buffer but dead, at best one is desired in any advanced trial. I play this game long enough to remember the not-so-long-ago-times when sorcs were valuable group members, and my understanding of making the class attractive again is bringing them back to the 'interesting to play' level. Ofc your opinion can differ and you may be happy with playing a healer/buffer in 4-man-dungeons or nTrials.

When it comes to PVP, a few excellent players still do play good magsorcs, but give them an opponent of similar quality on another class (except magwarden) and they are dead. Most players have stopped playing magsorcs completely or they ride the zergs and hope to hit some low-health targets with their execute. Finishing the killquest for 20 sorcs nowadays takes longer than finishing the killquest for 20 wardens, and not because sorcs wouldnt be a lot easier to kill.

Destary · January 2019

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Just make Dark Exchange give critchance and sustain problems solved lel

lol ^^ Maybe a little bit strong, but if they change Unholy Knowledge, that can solve the prob. Why ? Cause now that reduce the cost of your magicka and stamina abilities by 5%. If they increase to 8% i think with race changes, that sufficient

Destary · January 2019

visionality wrote: »

@Destary In advanced PVE, magsorc is no healer/buffer but dead, at best one is desired in any advanced trial.

We use Magsorc in trials (vAS +2, vCR +3) for minor prophecy. Sorc is dead, i agree, but its used for buff. I think all group don't do the same