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So what races you think will be meta now?
Bigevilpeter
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My thoughts:
Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them
Stam DD: Was only redguards now I think Orcs, Khajits and Redguards work, Redguards now completely outclass Bosmer.
Tank: Was only Argonian, now Argonian and Nord
Healer: Was Argonian and Altmer or Breton and will still be the same.
Outclassed races : Dunmer, Bosmer, Imperial.
Edit: I also just realized that Magicka DD Khajits will be really good as well, possibly even tying with altmer since 8% crit chance> 258 spell damage.
Edited by Bigevilpeter on January 17, 2019 11:26AM Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them
Stam DD: Was only redguards now I think Orcs, Khajits and Redguards work, Redguards now completely outclass Bosmer.
Tank: Was only Argonian, now Argonian and Nord
Healer: Was Argonian and Altmer or Breton and will still be the same.
Outclassed races : Dunmer, Bosmer, Imperial.
Edit: I also just realized that Magicka DD Khajits will be really good as well, possibly even tying with altmer since 8% crit chance> 258 spell damage.
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Carbonised✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them.
From 2 race choices for mag specs to 1 obvious choice outclassing any other race. Im sure glad their goal of more diversity proved successful!
/s /s /s
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xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »My thoughts:
Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them
Stam DD: Was only redguards now I think Orcs, Khajits and Redguards work, Redguards now completely outclass Bosmer.
Tank: Was only Argonian, now Argonian and Nord
Healer: Was Argonian and Altmer or Breton and will still be the same.
Outclassed races : Dunmer, Bosmer, Imperial.
I wouldn't overlook Imperial for tanking.
Not seeing Argonian being far above anything now for tanking and waaaaay at the bottom for any DPS use.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »My thoughts:
Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them
Stam DD: Was only redguards now I think Orcs, Khajits and Redguards work, Redguards now completely outclass Bosmer.
Tank: Was only Argonian, now Argonian and Nord
Healer: Was Argonian and Altmer or Breton and will still be the same.
Outclassed races : Dunmer, Bosmer, Imperial.
I wouldn't overlook Imperial for tanking.
Not seeing Argonian being far above anything now for tanking and waaaaay at the bottom for any DPS use.
Argonians still work exactly the same for tanking, just a slight reduction to their sustain numbers, they will still have better sustain than other tanking races.
Imperials are fine, but Id rather take better resource sustain or better ulti generation over 5% block or bash cost reductionEdited by Bigevilpeter on January 17, 2019 8:58AM3 -
CipherNine✭✭✭✭✭Carbonised wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them.
From 2 race choices for mag specs to 1 obvious choice outclassing any other race. Im sure glad their goal of more diversity proved successful!
/s /s /s
Like that was there actual goal anyway. Their real goal is just an obvious cash grab, which is what these racial changes are.
If they actually cared about creating diversity with races they would just remove racial passives completely. It's really about digging into the wallets of the players as much as they can.PC-NA
Khajiit Templar - Healer
Argonian Necromancer - Healer
Breton Warden - Healer
Nord Necromancer - Tank
Argonian Templar - Tank
Nord Warden - Tank5 -
PIEGOD✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »My thoughts:
Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them
Stam DD: Was only redguards now I think Orcs, Khajits and Redguards work, Redguards now completely outclass Bosmer.
Tank: Was only Argonian, now Argonian and Nord
Healer: Was Argonian and Altmer or Breton and will still be the same.
Outclassed races : Dunmer, Bosmer, Imperial.
I wouldn't overlook Imperial for tanking.
Not seeing Argonian being far above anything now for tanking and waaaaay at the bottom for any DPS use.
Argonians still work exactly the same for tanking, just a slight reduction to their sustain numbers, they will still have better sustain than other tanking races.
Imperials are fine, but Id rather take better resource sustain or better ulti generation over 5% block or bash cost reduction
MAKE ARGONIANS GREAT AGAIN3 -
HappyLittleTree✭✭✭✭✭
✭ArgoniansThuu chakkuth lod Hajhiit c’oo? Hajhiit gortsuquth gorihuth thuu gooluthduj thdeitoluu!
XBox-EU2 -
WuffyCerulei✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Literally anything that people want it to be."Buzz Lightyear toy isle shot" Stormcalling/Animal Companions/Assassination PVP build hater
Bring Back Pure Class Build Power0 -
mairwen85✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Carbonised wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them.
From 2 race choices for mag specs to 1 obvious choice outclassing any other race. Im sure glad their goal of more diversity proved successful!
/s /s /s
Bretons are now (and still will be) a good choice for mag. Hardy with good sustain (magicka efficiency) has always been their major benefits, but they're actually closer to Altmer if the racial changes goes through, lower starting spell damage but much higher sustain. They currently make good magplars and decent magsorcs -- after U21, they'll be better sorcs.0 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Carbonised wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them.
From 2 race choices for mag specs to 1 obvious choice outclassing any other race. Im sure glad their goal of more diversity proved successful!
/s /s /s
Bretons are now (and still will be) a good choice for mag. Hardy with good sustain (magicka efficiency) has always been their major benefits, but they're actually closer to Altmer if the racial changes goes through, lower starting spell damage but much higher sustain. They currently make good magplars and decent magsorcs -- after U21, they'll be better sorcs.
Altemers still have a Magicka version of adrenline rush, gonnq provide some good sustain plus much more damage, ofc bretons have better sustain but altmers will still outclass them as magicka DDs1 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think nord tank will be BiS now, cause you not only receive extra 0.5 ulti generation but also have extra 4k resistance, which means you can easily rich cap with bloodspawn and have even more ulti. Horn uptime will be far better then argonian.0 -
f047ys3v3n✭✭✭✭✭
✭Mag DD, Altmer though it was nerfed, Dunmer was nerfed more. Mageblades trying more sustain for their proc might try Breton but sustain is always so group dependent it is hard to build tword any specific target.
Stam DD, Redgaurd which was inexplicably buffed.
Heals, Argonian or Breton, both will be good depending on how much of a pot head you are.
Tanks, Nord
PVP roll dodge LOS build so OP that it will be nerfed next patch, Bosmer
Edited by f047ys3v3n on January 17, 2019 9:08AMI am currently worried for the future of ESO. Population seems like it is in free fall and the cancellation of the North America in-person gathering feels very much like pulling the plug. Kudos on fixing the in-game economy though. Clearly whatever gold shenanigans were happening the last couple years are fixed.3 -
gepe87✭✭✭✭✭
✭The same. Altmer, Redguard and Argonian. Too much talk and nerfed other options we had.Gepe, Dunmer MagSorc Pact Grand Overlord | Gaepe, Bosmer MagSorc Dominion General
If you see edits on my replies: typos. English isn't my main language0 -
Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Honestly the ONLY people who need to really worry about truely BiS races are endgame progression PvE trials guilds, everyone else is fine. Look if you wanna play a magic race as a stamina based DD the yes you are gimping yourself by ZOS is never going to homogenize race that much. And for PvP it is pretty open ended as you can make a unique build if you want, there’s lots of options out there and people come up with surprising stuff all the time. So basically don’t worry about it, life goes on, and this is probably the least radical balance pass we have seen in this game to date. A lot of people have been asking for less upheaval when it comes to changes and this is pretty mindful of that. There will ALWAYS be one race that parses a few hundred more DPS, *** live with it. It’s not going to change. No one NEEDS a race change and the BiS races are likely to stay about the same with perhaps a bit of room for variation.Edited by Vapirko on January 17, 2019 9:10AM2 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Tank: Dunmer
Healer :Dunmer
Mag DD: Dunmer
Stam DD: Dunmer
Dunmer BiS always.
LOL
But seriously, what Gil posted is very much subject to change. It is an exercise in futility to discuss what might be meta, not to mention most would base their post on emotions.
Once we have the PTS up players will be testing and getting actual numbers to provide real feedback to Zos. Oddly, this is something Gil would have been doing but now he is on the other side of the picture.2 -
mairwen85✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »Carbonised wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them.
From 2 race choices for mag specs to 1 obvious choice outclassing any other race. Im sure glad their goal of more diversity proved successful!
/s /s /s
Bretons are now (and still will be) a good choice for mag. Hardy with good sustain (magicka efficiency) has always been their major benefits, but they're actually closer to Altmer if the racial changes goes through, lower starting spell damage but much higher sustain. They currently make good magplars and decent magsorcs -- after U21, they'll be better sorcs.
Altemers still have a Magicka version of adrenline rush, gonnq provide some good sustain plus much more damage, ofc bretons have better sustain but altmers will still outclass them as magicka DDs
Of course... but I was responding to the assertion that we've gone from 2 to 1 for mag spec, the reality being that we've gone from 3 to 2.
If we're talking specifically magicka dps, then yes, there is one race to rule them all after U21 with these changes.Edited by mairwen85 on January 17, 2019 9:11AM1 -
Tasear✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think we see more options for players overall.
I can pick bosmer/orc for speed .. actually buff bosmer
Nord has ultimate
Breton sustain and tanky self
Lizards with potions
Altmer still a fair option
*Talking about healersEdited by Tasear on January 17, 2019 9:12AM0 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »Bigevilpeter wrote: »My thoughts:
Magicka DD: was Altmer and Dunmer now gonna be Just Altmer, not because dunmers are bad but because Altmer completely outclass them
Stam DD: Was only redguards now I think Orcs, Khajits and Redguards work, Redguards now completely outclass Bosmer.
Tank: Was only Argonian, now Argonian and Nord
Healer: Was Argonian and Altmer or Breton and will still be the same.
Outclassed races : Dunmer, Bosmer, Imperial.
I wouldn't overlook Imperial for tanking.
Not seeing Argonian being far above anything now for tanking and waaaaay at the bottom for any DPS use.
Argonians still work exactly the same for tanking, just a slight reduction to their sustain numbers, they will still have better sustain than other tanking races.
Imperials are fine, but Id rather take better resource sustain or better ulti generation over 5% block or bash cost reduction
Argonians are just not ruined for tanking, but they are definitely not the go-to. Which is fine, I was expecting some nerfs, but hoped to see something DPS wise offered up to help their builds for DD roles, even if it wasn't as strong as what others get. Tell a DK tank that gets stats back when they cast an ultimate that they won't have better resource sustain now.
But it's nowhere near as useful as ulti gain for taking damage and almost 4k resists. I mean, 4% healing done and no bonus to healing taken - that's a huge nerf to a tank build. The bonus health is meh (but all races got huge nerfs to max stat bonuses) They are literally only a build focused around the fact they get extra resources when they drink a potion.
I pretty much see people making build vids now just saying "Nord best, then Argonian or Imperial are ok" instead of before when they said "argonian best, Imperial ok, Nord not horrible". THAT isn't how you balance classes - that's just moving the imbalance around.
And as you can see, I'm not just about Argonians being meta at tanking, I was actually hoping them to just be a little more useful elsewhere for the nerfs I expected for their support roles.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC4 -
RaptorRodeoGod✭✭✭✭✭Yeah I was hoping Argoinians would get something to help DDs, but no luckAdd a Scribing skill that works like Arcanist beam.
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Veteran players have been alienated and disengaged from Overland since One Tamriel, due to the lack of difficulty, and pushed into dungeons and trials; the minority of content in the Elder Scrolls Online. We can't take the repetition anymore, fix Overland engagement for Vet players. I don't even care if it's not combat related anymore, just make Overland engaging again.
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Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 10 years. 6 paid expansions. 25 DLCs. 41 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. Make a self debuff mythic. Literally anything at this point.0 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭All races are still viable as long as you dont pick a Magicka race for a stamina role, yeah some will be better than others, these changes just shifted the meta and made things more fresh, but I think we are still in the same spot on having some races being meta and the others inferior1 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Cash Grab!
Altmer passive is not even close to adrenaline rush 575/6=96/s while Redguard 950/5=190/s, while with around 2,2k recovery currently my Altmer gets almost 200 mag recovery from its passives, it's a nerf especially for PvP.I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.1 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Cash Grab!
Altmer passive is not even close to adrenaline rush 575/6=96/s while Redguard 950/5=190/s, while with around 2,2k recovery currently my Altmer gets almost 200 mag recovery from its passives, it's a nerf especially for PvP.
96/s is almost 200 magickq recovery which is almost the same for you case and mucj better for pveEdited by Bigevilpeter on January 17, 2019 11:02AM3 -
Aluneth✭✭✭✭You'll notice something most lists have in common, the lack of Imperial. The only thing they had going for them was the resources, and with the nerf to that, they have nothing. Imperials might not have been the BEST at something before, but they could be found on second or third place. Now you'll have a hard time finding them even in third place.
Mag DPS : Useless
Stam DPS : Khajiit, Redguard and Orc are better
Healer: Useless
Tank: Argonian and Nord are both better3 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You'll notice something most lists have in common, the lack of Imperial. The only thing they had going for them was the resources, and with the nerf to that, they have nothing. Imperials might not have been the BEST at something before, but they could be found on second or third place. Now you'll have a hard time finding them even in third place.
Mag DPS : Useless
Stam DPS : Khajiit, Redguard and Orc are better
Healer: Useless
Tank: Argonian and Nord are both better
They are actually 3rd for tanking0 -
Aluneth✭✭✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »You'll notice something most lists have in common, the lack of Imperial. The only thing they had going for them was the resources, and with the nerf to that, they have nothing. Imperials might not have been the BEST at something before, but they could be found on second or third place. Now you'll have a hard time finding them even in third place.
Mag DPS : Useless
Stam DPS : Khajiit, Redguard and Orc are better
Healer: Useless
Tank: Argonian and Nord are both better
They are actually 3rd for tanking
Which is what I pointed out above. When the best placing you get is THIRD in TANKING, which is supposed to be your races strong suit, then something is wrong.3 -
Bigevilpeter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Bigevilpeter wrote: »You'll notice something most lists have in common, the lack of Imperial. The only thing they had going for them was the resources, and with the nerf to that, they have nothing. Imperials might not have been the BEST at something before, but they could be found on second or third place. Now you'll have a hard time finding them even in third place.
Mag DPS : Useless
Stam DPS : Khajiit, Redguard and Orc are better
Healer: Useless
Tank: Argonian and Nord are both better
They are actually 3rd for tanking
Which is what I pointed out above. When the best placing you get is THIRD in TANKING, which is supposed to be your races strong suit, then something is wrong.
TBH I already kinda forgot that imperials exist and now they are even more forgettable, not bad but yeah as you as you said no place where they shine, they still have the highest max stats with 2k health and stamina0 -
The_Saint✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭f047ys3v3n wrote: »Mag DD, Altmer though it was nerfed, Dunmer was nerfed more. Mageblades trying more sustain for their proc might try Breton but sustain is always so group dependent it is hard to build tword any specific target.
Dont forget Khajiit for mageblades;-)
750 max magicka, 75 reg and 8% more crit
Sounds crazy but... ;-)
Edited by The_Saint on January 17, 2019 11:20AM1
