Possible solution to PVE Cyrodiil: just add a neutral mode?

Reistr_the_Unbroken · December 2018

preevious wrote: »

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

preevious wrote: »

It's a good idea IF
No alliances motifs in chests

No AP gained from quests

No PvP reward whatsoever

Isolated in a campain

With those condition, the PvP players get to keep something unique to them, and everyone could stroll in Cyrodiil without becoming game

Everything else can go, but I’d rather keep the TV stones. And for god sakes up the drop rate on the skin and pet Molag’s simulacrum drops.

Sure, tel var stones as well should be kept in true pvp zone, you are right. I'll edit.

Nope- PvP keeps useless AP, PvE gets Tel Val bc of the damn polymorphs for sale. And no, I’d rather not lose hard earned TV stones to a ganker who put in zero effort to get their own and decided it would be funny to attack low levels.

killimandrosb16_ESO · December 2018

Sure go ahead and make it an option, IF WE pvp players can just walk into vDSA watch the mobs and bosses, enjoy the walk all the way to the chest where the master weapons are.Call it vDSA PvP mode actually. Do the same with all dungeons and trials and Im certain we can arrange this.

Karmanorway · December 2018

No. PvPers would find a way to exploit this.
For example. Go as pvp group all ranged classes, and have maybe 50 Pve players surrounding this group.

Now this PVE zerg Vs a normal zerg, who wins? The one zerg that cant hit anything because the other is surrrounded by immortal Pve players, or the Pve zerg that can fire all the skills they want without concern of being hit by anything because they are shielded by pve players that cant be attacked?

This is just one example*

josiahva · December 2018

or...players that want to go to Cyrodiil can suck it up and deal with the PvP aspect like everyone else. Most of the fighting doesnt happen in the few PvE areas there are anyway.

Minyassa · December 2018

swippy wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

People keep saying they wish that all of Tamriel was open PvP, too. Honestly I don't see why PvPers and PvEers can't both have their wish...other games have PvP servers and PvE servers that are separate. It would save people having to respec, it would save inventory space and people having to save different gear sets. And I simply cannot believe that ZOS pays their staff so much that they can't afford another server.

This will never happen. It's not cost effective in this stage of the game's life cycle; moreover, there are not enough PvP'ers to justify it.

The forum posts here make it seem like this game is like 80% PvPers. Especially since things keep getting nerfed and adjusted for PvP. In the two years I've played I've seen one nerf that was mentioned that it was specifically for PvE...usually it's something to address PvP issues and PvE just has to suck it up. Or at least that is how the forum looks!

It's doubtful the forums are statistically representative. Casual players generally do not visit forums; whereas, meta chasers and PvP'ers are over-represented. Also, your claim that PvP drives the nerfs is simply untrue; i.e.: the shield nerf.

That shield nerf is the one example I mentioned that was stated to be PvE based.

@Minyassa
oh, i thought you were talking about the Morrowind "sustain nerf" that was another famously PvE-inspired decision. there are others, but it appears PvEers have succeeded at really leaning in to that narrative. good to know.

back on topic, i'm finding it hard to understand why this is requested so often. you can tell the people asking for this haven't put much effort into exploring Cyrodiil. if you're not there to fight, all there is is skyshards and fish, right? i mean, you can go pretty much anywhere to beat up a wolf.

i guess they want to see some spots from Oblivion, which i understand. i was pretty pumped to go check out Bruma, until I got there. really, the only spot that even tried to kick up any nostalgia was Weynon Priory, and that's not too hard to sneak to unless all your characters are reds and EP's getting walloped (which usually only lasts a few hours).

the delves are like all the ones in the rest of the base game: small and easy. and none of the PvE quests are of the caliber that questers appreciate this game for. they're all either: go over there and do this thing, or go over there and do this 3 times. i know it's hard to believe a stranger, but you're not missing much there.

seriously, without even the chance of finding worthwhile combat Cyrodiil would just be vast swaths of generally unremarkable land with periodic impassable barriers (that require lots of "undo time" to get back around). it's certainly not an explorer's paradise. that's why it's the war zone.

Yeah, but you have to creep around excruciatingly slowly if you're not a NB to get said skyshards and fish, which is a massive PITA and takes hours and hours, and you have to be alert for other players, and you have to stop in the middle of fishing and wait someone out or leave sometimes, and don't even think about doing the quests there which means missing out on achievements...a PvE Cyrodiil would allow some to continue to enjoy doing what they do in PvE areas and actually finish the achievements (like Master Angler and Skyshard Hunter) that require going to Cyrodiil without losing a couple weeks' worth of enjoyment through stressful play.

Aisle9 · December 2018

Minyassa wrote: »

swippy wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

People keep saying they wish that all of Tamriel was open PvP, too. Honestly I don't see why PvPers and PvEers can't both have their wish...other games have PvP servers and PvE servers that are separate. It would save people having to respec, it would save inventory space and people having to save different gear sets. And I simply cannot believe that ZOS pays their staff so much that they can't afford another server.

This will never happen. It's not cost effective in this stage of the game's life cycle; moreover, there are not enough PvP'ers to justify it.

The forum posts here make it seem like this game is like 80% PvPers. Especially since things keep getting nerfed and adjusted for PvP. In the two years I've played I've seen one nerf that was mentioned that it was specifically for PvE...usually it's something to address PvP issues and PvE just has to suck it up. Or at least that is how the forum looks!

It's doubtful the forums are statistically representative. Casual players generally do not visit forums; whereas, meta chasers and PvP'ers are over-represented. Also, your claim that PvP drives the nerfs is simply untrue; i.e.: the shield nerf.

That shield nerf is the one example I mentioned that was stated to be PvE based.

Minyassa
oh, i thought you were talking about the Morrowind "sustain nerf" that was another famously PvE-inspired decision. there are others, but it appears PvEers have succeeded at really leaning in to that narrative. good to know.

back on topic, i'm finding it hard to understand why this is requested so often. you can tell the people asking for this haven't put much effort into exploring Cyrodiil. if you're not there to fight, all there is is skyshards and fish, right? i mean, you can go pretty much anywhere to beat up a wolf.

i guess they want to see some spots from Oblivion, which i understand. i was pretty pumped to go check out Bruma, until I got there. really, the only spot that even tried to kick up any nostalgia was Weynon Priory, and that's not too hard to sneak to unless all your characters are reds and EP's getting walloped (which usually only lasts a few hours).

the delves are like all the ones in the rest of the base game: small and easy. and none of the PvE quests are of the caliber that questers appreciate this game for. they're all either: go over there and do this thing, or go over there and do this 3 times. i know it's hard to believe a stranger, but you're not missing much there.

seriously, without even the chance of finding worthwhile combat Cyrodiil would just be vast swaths of generally unremarkable land with periodic impassable barriers (that require lots of "undo time" to get back around). it's certainly not an explorer's paradise. that's why it's the war zone.

Yeah, but you have to creep around excruciatingly slowly if you're not a NB to get said skyshards and fish, which is a massive PITA and takes hours and hours, and you have to be alert for other players, and you have to stop in the middle of fishing and wait someone out or leave sometimes, and don't even think about doing the quests there which means missing out on achievements...a PvE Cyrodiil would allow some to continue to enjoy doing what they do in PvE areas and actually finish the achievements (like Master Angler and Skyshard Hunter) that require going to Cyrodiil without losing a couple weeks' worth of enjoyment through stressful play.

It was a PITA, for PvP players to farm an hour long arena to get a maelstrom 2H or a master bow, but we all did it...

Minyassa · December 2018

Aisle9 wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

swippy wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

People keep saying they wish that all of Tamriel was open PvP, too. Honestly I don't see why PvPers and PvEers can't both have their wish...other games have PvP servers and PvE servers that are separate. It would save people having to respec, it would save inventory space and people having to save different gear sets. And I simply cannot believe that ZOS pays their staff so much that they can't afford another server.

This will never happen. It's not cost effective in this stage of the game's life cycle; moreover, there are not enough PvP'ers to justify it.

The forum posts here make it seem like this game is like 80% PvPers. Especially since things keep getting nerfed and adjusted for PvP. In the two years I've played I've seen one nerf that was mentioned that it was specifically for PvE...usually it's something to address PvP issues and PvE just has to suck it up. Or at least that is how the forum looks!

It's doubtful the forums are statistically representative. Casual players generally do not visit forums; whereas, meta chasers and PvP'ers are over-represented. Also, your claim that PvP drives the nerfs is simply untrue; i.e.: the shield nerf.

That shield nerf is the one example I mentioned that was stated to be PvE based.

Minyassa
oh, i thought you were talking about the Morrowind "sustain nerf" that was another famously PvE-inspired decision. there are others, but it appears PvEers have succeeded at really leaning in to that narrative. good to know.

back on topic, i'm finding it hard to understand why this is requested so often. you can tell the people asking for this haven't put much effort into exploring Cyrodiil. if you're not there to fight, all there is is skyshards and fish, right? i mean, you can go pretty much anywhere to beat up a wolf.

i guess they want to see some spots from Oblivion, which i understand. i was pretty pumped to go check out Bruma, until I got there. really, the only spot that even tried to kick up any nostalgia was Weynon Priory, and that's not too hard to sneak to unless all your characters are reds and EP's getting walloped (which usually only lasts a few hours).

the delves are like all the ones in the rest of the base game: small and easy. and none of the PvE quests are of the caliber that questers appreciate this game for. they're all either: go over there and do this thing, or go over there and do this 3 times. i know it's hard to believe a stranger, but you're not missing much there.

seriously, without even the chance of finding worthwhile combat Cyrodiil would just be vast swaths of generally unremarkable land with periodic impassable barriers (that require lots of "undo time" to get back around). it's certainly not an explorer's paradise. that's why it's the war zone.

Yeah, but you have to creep around excruciatingly slowly if you're not a NB to get said skyshards and fish, which is a massive PITA and takes hours and hours, and you have to be alert for other players, and you have to stop in the middle of fishing and wait someone out or leave sometimes, and don't even think about doing the quests there which means missing out on achievements...a PvE Cyrodiil would allow some to continue to enjoy doing what they do in PvE areas and actually finish the achievements (like Master Angler and Skyshard Hunter) that require going to Cyrodiil without losing a couple weeks' worth of enjoyment through stressful play.

It was a PITA, for PvP players to farm an hour long arena to get a maelstrom 2H or a master bow, but we all did it...

See, if they made an all PvP version, you could have fought other players in that arena for that hour and not been forced to PvE. It would be so much better for everyone if they gave us both separate.

Merlin13KAGL · December 2018

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

First, and foremost. Zos designed Cyrodiil with clear intent. Threads like this seem not understand that or choose to ignore that the occasional thread on the subject is regularly ignored by Zos because none of them, including this one, gives Zos a compelling reason to rethink their design. Without that it is empty words.

Second. for the PvE aspect in Cyrodiil it so easy to complete and rarely experience PvP. It really adds a great element that one cannot find in PvE which is an air of possible danger due to the PvP chance. Between the two characters doing the quests I think I might have seen 3 PvP encounters. It is sad some are to scared to risk that very small bit of danger.

It is even more fun when doing Sky Shards and Delves with a group. Early in the game I often lead groups into Cyrodiil from the social guild I was in. Doing the delvs and shards with the group was fun. Yes we encountered PvP from time to time but all the above was back when there was a lot more PvP in Cyrodiil than there is now.

Again, without a reason that is compelling enough to get Zos to change their mind this thread is rather pointless. Zos clearly chose to put certain into Cyrodiil with the intent that players would have to engage in PvP or at least risk dealing with it to gain those items, skill points, sky shards, quests, titles and important skills for any serious healer, tank or stam DPS.

Edit: as pointed out, go to a campaign with low population for a lower chance at having to deal with PvP. Problem solved.

As I said I do pvp, but there's a large player base that constantly asks for pve Cyrodiil. That's the voice from customers and should give Zos something to think about. Maybe not compelling enough because not many players drop the game because of the lack of pve Cyrodiil, but at least there's the request that lasts for years.

And tbh, all these aggressive talks like "pointless", "deal with it" will just stop pve players from ever trying pvp.

You are making nothing more than an assumption. A pretty baseless assumption form a small number of voices.

In other words, you are not speaking for the voice of the customer. It is also baseless to suggest that a player would be dissuaded from trying PvP due to a forum conversation when they clearly do not want to PvP at all. That is a desperate grabbing at straws.

The entire idea is weak, and very sad. It is sad to think player do not want to deal with the challenge so they want things made easier for them. So yes, if you want the rewards you will have to work for it. It is absurd to think that you should not.

If you are so blind to even notice some discussion about pve Cyrodiil, I'll find one for you: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/447545/suggestion-create-a-pve-cyrodiil/p1

And it isn't the only one I've seen so far.

Under such threads I always encourage pve players to try pvp cuz it's fun, or persuade them that solo farming is perfectly safe and don't need to be afraid about it. If you cannot see the difference between a kind gesture and constantly spamming negative words like "pointless" "baseless" "weak" "sad", I feel "sad" for you.

Congrats, you found one other thread that inspired the (unnecessary) creation of this thread.

Did you read that thread? Did you see how well it's going over there?

Did you look at the poll results?

Most people end up making one of two choices, neither of which require game changing by the Devs:

They just never go to Cyrodiil.
They buck up and make it work, one of a dozen different ways, same as 1000's of non-PvP'ers have managed to do over the course of 5 years.

WIth the exception of a few chokepoints, most PvE objectives in Cyro are so off the beaten path you'd have to try to find an enemy player.

EDIT: Removed double negative.

Syy101 · December 2018

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

First, and foremost. Zos designed Cyrodiil with clear intent. Threads like this seem not understand that or choose to ignore that the occasional thread on the subject is regularly ignored by Zos because none of them, including this one, gives Zos a compelling reason to rethink their design. Without that it is empty words.

Second. for the PvE aspect in Cyrodiil it so easy to complete and rarely experience PvP. It really adds a great element that one cannot find in PvE which is an air of possible danger due to the PvP chance. Between the two characters doing the quests I think I might have seen 3 PvP encounters. It is sad some are to scared to risk that very small bit of danger.

It is even more fun when doing Sky Shards and Delves with a group. Early in the game I often lead groups into Cyrodiil from the social guild I was in. Doing the delvs and shards with the group was fun. Yes we encountered PvP from time to time but all the above was back when there was a lot more PvP in Cyrodiil than there is now.

Again, without a reason that is compelling enough to get Zos to change their mind this thread is rather pointless. Zos clearly chose to put certain into Cyrodiil with the intent that players would have to engage in PvP or at least risk dealing with it to gain those items, skill points, sky shards, quests, titles and important skills for any serious healer, tank or stam DPS.

Edit: as pointed out, go to a campaign with low population for a lower chance at having to deal with PvP. Problem solved.

As I said I do pvp, but there's a large player base that constantly asks for pve Cyrodiil. That's the voice from customers and should give Zos something to think about. Maybe not compelling enough because not many players drop the game because of the lack of pve Cyrodiil, but at least there's the request that lasts for years.

And tbh, all these aggressive talks like "pointless", "deal with it" will just stop pve players from ever trying pvp.

You are making nothing more than an assumption. A pretty baseless assumption form a small number of voices.

In other words, you are not speaking for the voice of the customer. It is also baseless to suggest that a player would be dissuaded from trying PvP due to a forum conversation when they clearly do not want to PvP at all. That is a desperate grabbing at straws.

The entire idea is weak, and very sad. It is sad to think player do not want to deal with the challenge so they want things made easier for them. So yes, if you want the rewards you will have to work for it. It is absurd to think that you should not.

If you are so blind to even notice some discussion about pve Cyrodiil, I'll find one for you: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/447545/suggestion-create-a-pve-cyrodiil/p1

And it isn't the only one I've seen so far.

Under such threads I always encourage pve players to try pvp cuz it's fun, or persuade them that solo farming is perfectly safe and don't need to be afraid about it. If you cannot see the difference between a kind gesture and constantly spamming negative words like "pointless" "baseless" "weak" "sad", I feel "sad" for you.

Congrats, you found one other thread that inspired the (unnecessary) creation of this thread.

Did you read that thread? Did you see how well it's going over there?

Did you look at the poll results?

Most people end up making one of two choices, neither of which require game changing by the Devs:
They just never go to Cyrodiil.

They buck up and make it work, one of a dozen different ways, same as 1000's of non-PvP'ers have managed to do over the course of 5 years.

WIth the exception of a few chokepoints, most PvE objectives in Cyro are so off the beaten path you'd have to try to find an enemy player.

EDIT: Removed double negative.

@Merlin13KAGL
Perhaps you didn’t see under that thread I voted “maybe not” and gave my thoughts why pve Cyrodiil wouldn’t work? I am writing this thread to share some thoughts on an alternative.

But I just don’t wanna discuss this anymore cuz I don’t understand why there’s always so much aggression towards even touching such pve vs pvp subject. Yeah Cyrodiil should remain what it is. It has zero impact on me anyway.

idk · December 2018

Syy101 wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

First, and foremost. Zos designed Cyrodiil with clear intent. Threads like this seem not understand that or choose to ignore that the occasional thread on the subject is regularly ignored by Zos because none of them, including this one, gives Zos a compelling reason to rethink their design. Without that it is empty words.

Second. for the PvE aspect in Cyrodiil it so easy to complete and rarely experience PvP. It really adds a great element that one cannot find in PvE which is an air of possible danger due to the PvP chance. Between the two characters doing the quests I think I might have seen 3 PvP encounters. It is sad some are to scared to risk that very small bit of danger.

It is even more fun when doing Sky Shards and Delves with a group. Early in the game I often lead groups into Cyrodiil from the social guild I was in. Doing the delvs and shards with the group was fun. Yes we encountered PvP from time to time but all the above was back when there was a lot more PvP in Cyrodiil than there is now.

Again, without a reason that is compelling enough to get Zos to change their mind this thread is rather pointless. Zos clearly chose to put certain into Cyrodiil with the intent that players would have to engage in PvP or at least risk dealing with it to gain those items, skill points, sky shards, quests, titles and important skills for any serious healer, tank or stam DPS.

Edit: as pointed out, go to a campaign with low population for a lower chance at having to deal with PvP. Problem solved.

As I said I do pvp, but there's a large player base that constantly asks for pve Cyrodiil. That's the voice from customers and should give Zos something to think about. Maybe not compelling enough because not many players drop the game because of the lack of pve Cyrodiil, but at least there's the request that lasts for years.

And tbh, all these aggressive talks like "pointless", "deal with it" will just stop pve players from ever trying pvp.

You are making nothing more than an assumption. A pretty baseless assumption form a small number of voices.

In other words, you are not speaking for the voice of the customer. It is also baseless to suggest that a player would be dissuaded from trying PvP due to a forum conversation when they clearly do not want to PvP at all. That is a desperate grabbing at straws.

The entire idea is weak, and very sad. It is sad to think player do not want to deal with the challenge so they want things made easier for them. So yes, if you want the rewards you will have to work for it. It is absurd to think that you should not.

If you are so blind to even notice some discussion about pve Cyrodiil, I'll find one for you: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/447545/suggestion-create-a-pve-cyrodiil/p1

And it isn't the only one I've seen so far.

Under such threads I always encourage pve players to try pvp cuz it's fun, or persuade them that solo farming is perfectly safe and don't need to be afraid about it. If you cannot see the difference between a kind gesture and constantly spamming negative words like "pointless" "baseless" "weak" "sad", I feel "sad" for you.

Congrats, you found one other thread that inspired the (unnecessary) creation of this thread.

Did you read that thread? Did you see how well it's going over there?

Did you look at the poll results?

Most people end up making one of two choices, neither of which require game changing by the Devs:
They just never go to Cyrodiil.

They buck up and make it work, one of a dozen different ways, same as 1000's of non-PvP'ers have managed to do over the course of 5 years.

WIth the exception of a few chokepoints, most PvE objectives in Cyro are so off the beaten path you'd have to try to find an enemy player.

EDIT: Removed double negative.

@Merlin13KAGL
Perhaps you didn’t see under that thread I voted “maybe not” and gave my thoughts why pve Cyrodiil wouldn’t work? I am writing this thread to share some thoughts on an alternative.

But I just don’t wanna discuss this anymore cuz I don’t understand why there’s always so much aggression towards even touching such pve vs pvp subject. Yeah Cyrodiil should remain what it is. It has zero impact on me anyway.

I have no aggression at all.

It is just a weak idea that is intended to make the game weaker, easier for players who do not want to bother with any challenge to get what they want.

The entire idea is absurd. Lets just start giving out participation medals instead of achievements for accomplishing something. That is the essence of these threads.

Tranquilizer · December 2018

Dear devs,

I don't like doing trials, but I'd like to have the Rewards. Please add a mode to trials where all bosses are removed. Just add a chest containing the rewards.

And please don't forget to give me the undaunted points for finishing the trials.

Thank you.

Bruccius · December 2018

Tranquilizer wrote: »

Dear devs,

I don't like doing trials, but I'd like to have the Rewards. Please add a mode to trials where all bosses are removed. Just add a chest containing the rewards.

And please don't forget to give me the undaunted points for finishing the trials.

Thank you.

I don't recall there being PvP rewards in this game....

Could be wrong, but last time I checked, every currency and such could be earned through doing PvE....

p00tx · December 2018

Syy101 wrote: »

First I want to clarify that I do both pve and pvp. I have no problem solo questing, farming skyshards, clearing delves/dolmens/bosses in both Cyrodiil and IC, but I see that there are many threads concerning a pve version of Cyrodiil on the forum. I totally understand the unwillingness some players have towards entering a pvp zone (I myself was too afraid to step foot in Cyrodiil until recently), but instead of making a new instance of Cyrodiil, I think simply adding a "neutral mode" is more easy, light-weighted and can achieve the same goal as well.

It's kind of like the "safe mode" in GTAOL. Players in this mode cannot attack or be attacked by other players and keep guards. They can only interact with npc and enemies in the wildness. In GTAOL players can send npc thugs to attack others in safe mode, but it isn't the case in ESO, so players in neutral mode can safely explore Cyrodiil as they will, farming skyshards, clearing stuffs, doing quests (they may even watch some great battles!).

Of course something should be done to avoid exploiting. E.g. players cannot enter/exit neutral mode when enemy players are around so that they can't use this to gank others. Neutral players cannot speak in zone chat or speak to a non-neutral player to avoid easy spying.

What's your thought?

Interesting idea, but here is the problem I have with it. On the server I play in, all three factions are generally pop-locked, meaning full. Sometimes there is a queue to get in, because there are a limited number of players who may queue for any faction. During double AP and TelVar events, the queue can jump up to 500 during prime time. That is insane.

Now, imagine the PvE crew, who normally avoids PvP areas because they're afraid of being killed by other players, suddenly decides to flood these areas to do some PvE during one of the mixed PvE/PvP events, all with "neutrality" immunity to death. That would mean Cyrodil would suddenly become completely overrun by people not even using it for what it was intended, and unplayable for those of us who inhabit Cyrodil almost exclusively. This is an extreme example, but the flood of neutral adventurers could easily overtake our space on even off-event days, which ruins the space for us. Whether or not you guys engage in the intended manner, you still count as part of the server population, which is no good for us.

Merlin13KAGL · December 2018

Syy101 wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

First, and foremost. Zos designed Cyrodiil with clear intent. Threads like this seem not understand that or choose to ignore that the occasional thread on the subject is regularly ignored by Zos because none of them, including this one, gives Zos a compelling reason to rethink their design. Without that it is empty words.

Second. for the PvE aspect in Cyrodiil it so easy to complete and rarely experience PvP. It really adds a great element that one cannot find in PvE which is an air of possible danger due to the PvP chance. Between the two characters doing the quests I think I might have seen 3 PvP encounters. It is sad some are to scared to risk that very small bit of danger.

It is even more fun when doing Sky Shards and Delves with a group. Early in the game I often lead groups into Cyrodiil from the social guild I was in. Doing the delvs and shards with the group was fun. Yes we encountered PvP from time to time but all the above was back when there was a lot more PvP in Cyrodiil than there is now.

Again, without a reason that is compelling enough to get Zos to change their mind this thread is rather pointless. Zos clearly chose to put certain into Cyrodiil with the intent that players would have to engage in PvP or at least risk dealing with it to gain those items, skill points, sky shards, quests, titles and important skills for any serious healer, tank or stam DPS.

Edit: as pointed out, go to a campaign with low population for a lower chance at having to deal with PvP. Problem solved.

As I said I do pvp, but there's a large player base that constantly asks for pve Cyrodiil. That's the voice from customers and should give Zos something to think about. Maybe not compelling enough because not many players drop the game because of the lack of pve Cyrodiil, but at least there's the request that lasts for years.

And tbh, all these aggressive talks like "pointless", "deal with it" will just stop pve players from ever trying pvp.

You are making nothing more than an assumption. A pretty baseless assumption form a small number of voices.

In other words, you are not speaking for the voice of the customer. It is also baseless to suggest that a player would be dissuaded from trying PvP due to a forum conversation when they clearly do not want to PvP at all. That is a desperate grabbing at straws.

The entire idea is weak, and very sad. It is sad to think player do not want to deal with the challenge so they want things made easier for them. So yes, if you want the rewards you will have to work for it. It is absurd to think that you should not.

If you are so blind to even notice some discussion about pve Cyrodiil, I'll find one for you: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/447545/suggestion-create-a-pve-cyrodiil/p1

And it isn't the only one I've seen so far.

Under such threads I always encourage pve players to try pvp cuz it's fun, or persuade them that solo farming is perfectly safe and don't need to be afraid about it. If you cannot see the difference between a kind gesture and constantly spamming negative words like "pointless" "baseless" "weak" "sad", I feel "sad" for you.

Congrats, you found one other thread that inspired the (unnecessary) creation of this thread.

Did you read that thread? Did you see how well it's going over there?

Did you look at the poll results?

Most people end up making one of two choices, neither of which require game changing by the Devs:
They just never go to Cyrodiil.

They buck up and make it work, one of a dozen different ways, same as 1000's of non-PvP'ers have managed to do over the course of 5 years.

WIth the exception of a few chokepoints, most PvE objectives in Cyro are so off the beaten path you'd have to try to find an enemy player.

EDIT: Removed double negative.

@Merlin13KAGL
Perhaps you didn’t see under that thread I voted “maybe not” and gave my thoughts why pve Cyrodiil wouldn’t work? I am writing this thread to share some thoughts on an alternative.

But I just don’t wanna discuss this anymore cuz I don’t understand why there’s always so much aggression towards even touching such pve vs pvp subject. Yeah Cyrodiil should remain what it is. It has zero impact on me anyway.

Of course you don't.

This is nerf request, That's why it irritates people. Not because it's about one thing or another.

It's a nerf request, and pretty typically, it's an unnecessary one.

If it was a issue of balance, if there was something so OP that it prevented reasonable access because of PvP, then there would be something to the request.

But it's not that. A handful of people have decided that it's just too darn hard and therefore want the nerf. The problem being, plenty of other have shown it's attainable. I've yet to see this silent majority show the need for this, only the want.

And if you want to cease discussion about the thread you started, you should probably request its closure.

Bruccius wrote: »

Tranquilizer wrote: »

Dear devs,

I don't like doing trials, but I'd like to have the Rewards. Please add a mode to trials where all bosses are removed. Just add a chest containing the rewards.

And please don't forget to give me the undaunted points for finishing the trials.

Thank you.

I don't recall there being PvP rewards in this game....

First, you'd probably have to actually PvP to have that answer. We know that's not happening.

There are no rewards for dying, no rewards for stubbornness (you've been shown the way), and no rewards for campaigning for this nerf in multiple threads.

Could be wrong

Gonna say the odds are pretty high.

, but last time I checked, every currency and such could be earned through doing PvE....

AP is very much a currency.
Every currency but writ vouchers can be 'earned' simply through login rewards, too. Guess that would be a PvN reward (player vs nothing).
It was already explained in the other thread why Telvar is essentially a PvP currency because of risk of loss. If anything it's at least equally a PvP/PvE* currency, so once again, your argument doesn't stand.

*Here's how this argument goes, so we skip it the second time.

You can earn Telvar from PvE mobs/only PvE'ing.
You can earn Telvar from PvP mobs/only PvP'ing.
Get a kill shot in a PvE mob, you get a chance of earning Telvar.
Get a kill shot in on a PvP mob, you're pretty much guaranteed Telvar.
You lose Telvar when you die to a PvE enemy.
You lose Telvar when you die to a PvP enemy.
If worth or value of Telvar is based on how much you keep, then maximum value would be attributed to not losing Telvar.
You lose more when die to a PvP enemy. (Kinda seems weighted more heavily towards PvP with this one.)
A PvP Telvar loss is therefore more expensive than a PvE Telvar loss. Not dying makes it worth more by avoiding a PvP death than a PvE death - making it biased towards being PvP currency.

Best case argument, it's equally a PvE/PvP currency. More realistically, it's weighted more towards being a PvP currency.

You can neither lose nor gain gold from engaging other players. You neither lose nor gain gear from engaging other players.

You can lose/gain Telvar from engaging other players.

Take your nerf request to the Devs, because it's not going anywhere here.

D0PAMINE · December 2018

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

First, and foremost. Zos designed Cyrodiil with clear intent. Threads like this seem not understand that or choose to ignore that the occasional thread on the subject is regularly ignored by Zos because none of them, including this one, gives Zos a compelling reason to rethink their design. Without that it is empty words.

Second. for the PvE aspect in Cyrodiil it so easy to complete and rarely experience PvP. It really adds a great element that one cannot find in PvE which is an air of possible danger due to the PvP chance. Between the two characters doing the quests I think I might have seen 3 PvP encounters. It is sad some are to scared to risk that very small bit of danger.

It is even more fun when doing Sky Shards and Delves with a group. Early in the game I often lead groups into Cyrodiil from the social guild I was in. Doing the delvs and shards with the group was fun. Yes we encountered PvP from time to time but all the above was back when there was a lot more PvP in Cyrodiil than there is now.

Again, without a reason that is compelling enough to get Zos to change their mind this thread is rather pointless. Zos clearly chose to put certain into Cyrodiil with the intent that players would have to engage in PvP or at least risk dealing with it to gain those items, skill points, sky shards, quests, titles and important skills for any serious healer, tank or stam DPS.

Edit: as pointed out, go to a campaign with low population for a lower chance at having to deal with PvP. Problem solved.

And tbh, all these aggressive talks like "pointless", "deal with it" will just stop pve players from ever trying pvp.

Why would that be the case? Midyear Meyham was filled with PvE players. They stuck together, rezzed eachother, and got stuff done, while a fair amount admitted to enjoying it.

Bruccius · December 2018

@Merlin13KAGL
Triggered?

Anyway,

''AP is very much a currency.
Every currency but writ vouchers can be 'earned' simply through login rewards, too. Guess that would be a PvN reward (player vs nothing).
It was already explained in the other thread why Telvar is essentially a PvP currency because of risk of loss. If anything it's at least equally a PvP/PvE* currency, so once again, your argument doesn't stand.''

AP is a PvE currency, as it can be earned through doing PvE.
Tel Var is a PvE currency, as it can be earned through doing PvE.

Stop being upset over these facts, just because you can also earn them through PvP doesn't mean they're a PvP currency. After all, if that were the case, quest rewards and NPC drops wouldn't work towards that goal eh?

Especially in the case of Tel Var, which can literally be found in chests...

Hoolielulu · December 2018

I'm not the only one going into Shor to do these things, am I? Because I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Low population = hardly ever seeing another person.

Unless you wander near a battle then that's on you.

Aisle9 · December 2018

Minyassa wrote: »

Aisle9 wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

swippy wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

Abigail wrote: »

Minyassa wrote: »

People keep saying they wish that all of Tamriel was open PvP, too. Honestly I don't see why PvPers and PvEers can't both have their wish...other games have PvP servers and PvE servers that are separate. It would save people having to respec, it would save inventory space and people having to save different gear sets. And I simply cannot believe that ZOS pays their staff so much that they can't afford another server.

This will never happen. It's not cost effective in this stage of the game's life cycle; moreover, there are not enough PvP'ers to justify it.

The forum posts here make it seem like this game is like 80% PvPers. Especially since things keep getting nerfed and adjusted for PvP. In the two years I've played I've seen one nerf that was mentioned that it was specifically for PvE...usually it's something to address PvP issues and PvE just has to suck it up. Or at least that is how the forum looks!

It's doubtful the forums are statistically representative. Casual players generally do not visit forums; whereas, meta chasers and PvP'ers are over-represented. Also, your claim that PvP drives the nerfs is simply untrue; i.e.: the shield nerf.

That shield nerf is the one example I mentioned that was stated to be PvE based.

Minyassa
oh, i thought you were talking about the Morrowind "sustain nerf" that was another famously PvE-inspired decision. there are others, but it appears PvEers have succeeded at really leaning in to that narrative. good to know.

back on topic, i'm finding it hard to understand why this is requested so often. you can tell the people asking for this haven't put much effort into exploring Cyrodiil. if you're not there to fight, all there is is skyshards and fish, right? i mean, you can go pretty much anywhere to beat up a wolf.

i guess they want to see some spots from Oblivion, which i understand. i was pretty pumped to go check out Bruma, until I got there. really, the only spot that even tried to kick up any nostalgia was Weynon Priory, and that's not too hard to sneak to unless all your characters are reds and EP's getting walloped (which usually only lasts a few hours).

the delves are like all the ones in the rest of the base game: small and easy. and none of the PvE quests are of the caliber that questers appreciate this game for. they're all either: go over there and do this thing, or go over there and do this 3 times. i know it's hard to believe a stranger, but you're not missing much there.

seriously, without even the chance of finding worthwhile combat Cyrodiil would just be vast swaths of generally unremarkable land with periodic impassable barriers (that require lots of "undo time" to get back around). it's certainly not an explorer's paradise. that's why it's the war zone.

Yeah, but you have to creep around excruciatingly slowly if you're not a NB to get said skyshards and fish, which is a massive PITA and takes hours and hours, and you have to be alert for other players, and you have to stop in the middle of fishing and wait someone out or leave sometimes, and don't even think about doing the quests there which means missing out on achievements...a PvE Cyrodiil would allow some to continue to enjoy doing what they do in PvE areas and actually finish the achievements (like Master Angler and Skyshard Hunter) that require going to Cyrodiil without losing a couple weeks' worth of enjoyment through stressful play.

It was a PITA, for PvP players to farm an hour long arena to get a maelstrom 2H or a master bow, but we all did it...

See, if they made an all PvP version, you could have fought other players in that arena for that hour and not been forced to PvE. It would be so much better for everyone if they gave us both separate.

It wasn't for me, I actually quite enjoy vDSA.

In fact, I'm quite content with the current situation where I can do both types of content I like.

Bruccius wrote: »

Tranquilizer wrote: »

Dear devs,

I don't like doing trials, but I'd like to have the Rewards. Please add a mode to trials where all bosses are removed. Just add a chest containing the rewards.

And please don't forget to give me the undaunted points for finishing the trials.

Thank you.

I don't recall there being PvP rewards in this game....

Could be wrong, but last time I checked, every currency and such could be earned through doing PvE....

You are correct.

PvP rewards you can find in chests are indeed obtainable through PvE only (bought with gold). Only rewards such as achievements, costumes and dyes are not.

PvE rewards you can find in chests are only obtainable through PvE, even the ones considered trash for PvE, but BiS for PvP:

Venomous serpent pretty much only work for PvP, it's trash in PvE, except maybe overland, but you can do overland naked, so...

Master Bow is still considered BiS for some backbars.

Asylum Bow is still BiS for snipe gank builds.

Asylum 2H is BiS for some builds.

PvP gear is Bound on Equip, which means you can trade it freely at any time, as long as you don't put it on. AP trading is also a thing, where you spend AP to buy items such as motifs and sell them for gold.

PvE gear is Bound on Pickup and can only be traded during a 2 hours window with people that actively participated to the content.

Bruccius wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL
Triggered?

Anyway,

''AP is very much a currency.
Every currency but writ vouchers can be 'earned' simply through login rewards, too. Guess that would be a PvN reward (player vs nothing).
It was already explained in the other thread why Telvar is essentially a PvP currency because of risk of loss. If anything it's at least equally a PvP/PvE* currency, so once again, your argument doesn't stand.''

AP is a PvE currency, as it can be earned through doing PvE.
Tel Var is a PvE currency, as it can be earned through doing PvE.

Stop being upset over these facts, just because you can also earn them through PvP doesn't mean they're a PvP currency. After all, if that were the case, quest rewards and NPC drops wouldn't work towards that goal eh?

Especially in the case of Tel Var, which can literally be found in chests...

AP cannot be earned through PvE.
Tel Var can be earned through PvE but only in an AvA zone (active PvP).

Daily rewards are not PvE, the same way ESO+ benefits are not PvE.

Hope this clarifies.

Claudman · December 2018

PvE'ers who need vigor or warhorn? Decrease the amount of AP required to get it. Done...Or generally make the Assault Tree easier to level? Or just give it at the tutorial?

However, the PvP isn't going to be removed from Cyrodiil nor will there be a PvP-Free Area. Not just because Zenimax isn't going to, but PvP'ers don't want it to be removed from Cyrodiil or 'neutral zones', et cetera to exist. Also a 'safe mode' (Unless it can't be disabled for the rest of your time in Cyrodiil or has a long cooldown before getting disabled) sounds like it could be exploited for large scale ganks...I'll have to say no to that idea.

Another option is just playing PvP. It really isn't that bad...Yeah, you'll get the usual person who'll pretty much destroy you, but that's just part of the experience...But, people who camp PvE quest givers are just PvP'ers who aren't good enough for keeps.

Aisle9 · December 2018

Claudman wrote: »

PvE'ers who need vigor or warhorn? Decrease the amount of AP required to get it. Done...Or generally make the Assault Tree easier to level? Or just give it at the tutorial?

Good news, they already did, it takes less time to grind vigor and caltrops than dawnbreaker ;D

Claudman wrote: »

However, the PvP isn't going to be removed from Cyrodiil nor will there be a PvP-Free Area. Not just because Zenimax isn't going to, but PvP'ers don't want it to be removed from Cyrodiil or 'neutral zones', et cetera to exist. Also a 'safe mode' (Unless it can't be disabled for the rest of your time in Cyrodiil or has a long cooldown before getting disabled) sounds like it could be exploited for large scale ganks...I'll have to say no to that idea.

Another option is just playing PvP. It really isn't that bad...Yeah, you'll get the usual person who'll pretty much destroy you, but that's just part of the experience...But, people who camp PvE quest givers are just PvP'ers who aren't good enough for keeps.

You are correct, here's a cookie

Merlin13KAGL · December 2018

Bruccius wrote: »

@Merlin13KAGL
Triggered?

Not at all.

I'm not the one scrambling with my tail between my legs trying to avoid playing the game as designed.
I'm not the one practically begging the Devs to change original design because I just can't make it work.

Anyway,

''AP is very much a currency.
Every currency but writ vouchers can be 'earned' simply through login rewards, too. Guess that would be a PvN reward (player vs nothing).
It was already explained in the other thread why Telvar is essentially a PvP currency because of risk of loss. If anything it's at least equally a PvP/PvE* currency, so once again, your argument doesn't stand.''

AP is a PvE currency, as it can be earned through doing PvE.
Tel Var is a PvE currency, as it can be earned through doing PvE.

For Tel Var, click the spoiler above. Read it slow, like RP slow. (No one will gank you while you do this.)

For AP (Those stand for Alliance Points, btw, the named currency of the Alliance War) perhaps you can enlighten me?

Rewards for the worthy, which contain PvP rewards, are based on....AP.
End of Campaign Rewards are based on Tier, which are based on...AP.
PvP kills reward...AP.
Offensive ticks reward...AP.
Defensive ticks reward...AP.
Emperor (The actual earned one, not the proposed one.) is based on ranking, which is based on...AP
Leaderboard Rewards, the PvP variety...based on A. P.

There are not enough broken walls, broken doors, and dailies (especially since you can't seem to get to them without getting PvP'd down so hard that you want it completely eliminated) for you to come remotely close to achieving at least two of those, if not three.

Please, daily and scouting quest your way to Emp. Heck, just break out the math about the possibility of it. Pretty sure it'll start to sink in how ridiculous your statements are. (And if you can daily your way to Emp, then guess what, you don't need PvP removed, as it's clearly a non-issue for you.)

The primary means to earn AP is through PvP.
The fastest way to both earn and lose Telvar is through PvP.

PvP currency

Come to think of it, I wonder why you don't even get to enter the zone before L10, no other PvE areas restrict that way?

Stop being upset over these facts, just because you can also earn them through PvP PvE doesn't mean they're a PvP PvE currency. After all, if that were the case, quest rewards and NPC drops wouldn't work towards that goal eh?

Especially in the case of Tel Var, which can literally be found in chests simply by logging in on the right day...

Fixed it for you. Funny how that works both ways.

Pretty sure logging in doesn't qualify as PvE or PvP, so using your logic, it's neither PvP or PvE currency, it's login currency. And chests? Let me ask you something, can you die to a player while getting that chest?

I told you, at best, it's 50/50 as to which type of currency it 'belongs to.' It's used primarily to purchase PvP gear from PvP vendors in a PvP/PvE zone. You know what? That part doesn't even matter.

Feel free to call it whatever you like. The points stands, you enter a PvP zone (fact), with risk of PvP (fact).

Picking and choosing the parts you like to try to support your argument makes you neither right nor clever.

Just like this 'need,' saying it does not make it so.

Syy101 · December 2018

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Syy101 wrote: »

idk wrote: »

First, and foremost. Zos designed Cyrodiil with clear intent. Threads like this seem not understand that or choose to ignore that the occasional thread on the subject is regularly ignored by Zos because none of them, including this one, gives Zos a compelling reason to rethink their design. Without that it is empty words.

Second. for the PvE aspect in Cyrodiil it so easy to complete and rarely experience PvP. It really adds a great element that one cannot find in PvE which is an air of possible danger due to the PvP chance. Between the two characters doing the quests I think I might have seen 3 PvP encounters. It is sad some are to scared to risk that very small bit of danger.

It is even more fun when doing Sky Shards and Delves with a group. Early in the game I often lead groups into Cyrodiil from the social guild I was in. Doing the delvs and shards with the group was fun. Yes we encountered PvP from time to time but all the above was back when there was a lot more PvP in Cyrodiil than there is now.

Again, without a reason that is compelling enough to get Zos to change their mind this thread is rather pointless. Zos clearly chose to put certain into Cyrodiil with the intent that players would have to engage in PvP or at least risk dealing with it to gain those items, skill points, sky shards, quests, titles and important skills for any serious healer, tank or stam DPS.

Edit: as pointed out, go to a campaign with low population for a lower chance at having to deal with PvP. Problem solved.

As I said I do pvp, but there's a large player base that constantly asks for pve Cyrodiil. That's the voice from customers and should give Zos something to think about. Maybe not compelling enough because not many players drop the game because of the lack of pve Cyrodiil, but at least there's the request that lasts for years.

And tbh, all these aggressive talks like "pointless", "deal with it" will just stop pve players from ever trying pvp.

You are making nothing more than an assumption. A pretty baseless assumption form a small number of voices.

In other words, you are not speaking for the voice of the customer. It is also baseless to suggest that a player would be dissuaded from trying PvP due to a forum conversation when they clearly do not want to PvP at all. That is a desperate grabbing at straws.

The entire idea is weak, and very sad. It is sad to think player do not want to deal with the challenge so they want things made easier for them. So yes, if you want the rewards you will have to work for it. It is absurd to think that you should not.

If you are so blind to even notice some discussion about pve Cyrodiil, I'll find one for you: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/447545/suggestion-create-a-pve-cyrodiil/p1

And it isn't the only one I've seen so far.

Under such threads I always encourage pve players to try pvp cuz it's fun, or persuade them that solo farming is perfectly safe and don't need to be afraid about it. If you cannot see the difference between a kind gesture and constantly spamming negative words like "pointless" "baseless" "weak" "sad", I feel "sad" for you.

Congrats, you found one other thread that inspired the (unnecessary) creation of this thread.

Did you read that thread? Did you see how well it's going over there?

Did you look at the poll results?

Most people end up making one of two choices, neither of which require game changing by the Devs:
They just never go to Cyrodiil.

They buck up and make it work, one of a dozen different ways, same as 1000's of non-PvP'ers have managed to do over the course of 5 years.

WIth the exception of a few chokepoints, most PvE objectives in Cyro are so off the beaten path you'd have to try to find an enemy player.

EDIT: Removed double negative.

@Merlin13KAGL
Perhaps you didn’t see under that thread I voted “maybe not” and gave my thoughts why pve Cyrodiil wouldn’t work? I am writing this thread to share some thoughts on an alternative.

But I just don’t wanna discuss this anymore cuz I don’t understand why there’s always so much aggression towards even touching such pve vs pvp subject. Yeah Cyrodiil should remain what it is. It has zero impact on me anyway.

Of course you don't.

This is nerf request, That's why it irritates people. Not because it's about one thing or another.

It's a nerf request, and pretty typically, it's an unnecessary one.

If it was a issue of balance, if there was something so OP that it prevented reasonable access because of PvP, then there would be something to the request.

But it's not that. A handful of people have decided that it's just too darn hard and therefore want the nerf. The problem being, plenty of other have shown it's attainable. I've yet to see this silent majority show the need for this, only the want.

And if you want to cease discussion about the thread you started, you should probably request its closure.

Bruccius wrote: »

Tranquilizer wrote: »

Dear devs,

I don't like doing trials, but I'd like to have the Rewards. Please add a mode to trials where all bosses are removed. Just add a chest containing the rewards.

And please don't forget to give me the undaunted points for finishing the trials.

Thank you.

I don't recall there being PvP rewards in this game....

First, you'd probably have to actually PvP to have that answer. We know that's not happening.

There are no rewards for dying, no rewards for stubbornness (you've been shown the way), and no rewards for campaigning for this nerf in multiple threads.

Could be wrong

Gonna say the odds are pretty high.

, but last time I checked, every currency and such could be earned through doing PvE....

AP is very much a currency.

Every currency but writ vouchers can be 'earned' simply through login rewards, too. Guess that would be a PvN reward (player vs nothing).

It was already explained in the other thread why Telvar is essentially a PvP currency because of risk of loss. If anything it's at least equally a PvP/PvE* currency, so once again, your argument doesn't stand.

*Here's how this argument goes, so we skip it the second time.

You can earn Telvar from PvE mobs/only PvE'ing.

You can earn Telvar from PvP mobs/only PvP'ing.

Get a kill shot in a PvE mob, you get a chance of earning Telvar.

Get a kill shot in on a PvP mob, you're pretty much guaranteed Telvar.

You lose Telvar when you die to a PvE enemy.

You lose Telvar when you die to a PvP enemy.

If worth or value of Telvar is based on how much you keep, then maximum value would be attributed to not losing Telvar.

You lose more when die to a PvP enemy. (Kinda seems weighted more heavily towards PvP with this one.)

A PvP Telvar loss is therefore more expensive than a PvE Telvar loss. Not dying makes it worth more by avoiding a PvP death than a PvE death - making it biased towards being PvP currency.

Best case argument, it's equally a PvE/PvP currency. More realistically, it's weighted more towards being a PvP currency.
You can neither lose nor gain gold from engaging other players. You neither lose nor gain gear from engaging other players.

You can lose/gain Telvar from engaging other players.

Take your nerf request to the Devs, because it's not going anywhere here.

Actually, I never actually intended any "PvP rewards" for the neutral mode I suggested. I just wanted to propose a safe way for PVE folks to farm skyshards, do quests, RP, explore or do whatever they want from a PVE aspect. I never say they should earn AP, earn TV stones, be crowned Emperor or whatever. Perhaps I didn't cover everything at the beginning. How does this trigger PVP folks is beyond me. Did you work very hard to get to the Skyshards or have fought over 100 players to do a quest so you think those are PvP rewards? From my PVP experience most ppl in the campaign just worry about keeps, resources, emp and APs and I don't think those things conflict with someone doing a quest safely.

So the key point is: are things like skyshards and quests, which are pure pve things in other zones, worth adding the risk of dying in pvp? For quests maybe, because they reward AP and the only challenge in Cyrodiil quests is to make it to other side of map alive, but the AP rewards can just be taken away in neutral mode. For skyshards, I don't think so. Perhaps some folks think that skyshards give you more power and thus shouldn't be easy to get. I can respect such idea.

If you think the suggestion is exploitable, that's another discussion.

Tranquilizer wrote: »

Dear devs,

I don't like doing trials, but I'd like to have the Rewards. Please add a mode to trials where all bosses are removed. Just add a chest containing the rewards.

And please don't forget to give me the undaunted points for finishing the trials.

Thank you.

Sorry we're talking about completely different things. If PVE players can just walk into a keep and be crowned Emperor in neutral mode then I support your idea.

Edited: add more thoughts.

zyk · December 2018

Ugh. 1000x Ugh. Ugh ugh ugh ugh.

Syy101 · December 2018

Hoolielulu wrote: »

I'm not the only one going into Shor to do these things, am I? Because I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Low population = hardly ever seeing another person.

Unless you wander near a battle then that's on you.

Personally I just go to Vivec, cuz it's my home campaign and I can jump to battle at any time. And I love the thrill it gives me when I have to cross front lines, go deep into enemy territories and avoid large armies of enemy players to deliver a simple message.

Merlin13KAGL · December 2018

Syy101 wrote: »

Actually, I never actually intended any "PvP rewards" for the neutral mode I suggested. I just wanted to propose a safe way for PVE folks to farm skyshards, do quests, RP, explore or do whatever they want from a PVE aspect. I never say they should earn AP, earn TV stones, be crowned Emperor or whatever. Perhaps I didn't cover everything at the beginning.

The first half of my reply was for you. I simply didn't break them up into two separate replies.

How does this trigger PVP folks is beyond me. Did you work very hard to get to the Skyshards or have fought over 100 players to do a quest so you think those are PvP rewards?

Triggering is generally reserved for entitled snowflakes, in my understanding. Using logical argument to counter unnecessary changes that are based entirely on perception can often be mistaken for being triggered. Logic doesn't care how anyone feels, that's the great thing about it. I'm also not interested in classifying a reward's "content ownership," for two reasons. First, it matters not in a mixed zone. Second, there is still no valid argument or actual data showing it's unobtainable by either group.

From my PVP experience most ppl in the campaign just worry about keeps, resources, emp and APs and I don't think those things conflict with someone doing a quest safely.

This is exactly why it's a non-issue. Aside from maybe the Dolmen at Bruma and passing through mile-gates, most objectives are well out of the way. Simply maintaining some awareness is usually sufficient to avoid PvP entirely while collecting these things, and on the grand occasion you do run into an enemy player, they're probably there for the same reasons. So long as you don't engage, you're usually fine.

Imperials are specifically intended to be a threat to everyone, yet I see no requests to have them removed from game.

So the key point is: are things like skyshards and quests, which are pure pve things in other zones, worth adding the risk of dying in pvp?

Apparently they are, as the Dev's put them there. It could be said the added risk is what gives them additional value compared to 'pure PvE' versions. That may even be why the Dev's put them there. Also, as has been pointed out, it was probably a method to entice people to join. People come in PvE'ing and end up helping/joining a PvP group they happen across.

For quests maybe, because they reward AP and the only challenge in Cyrodiil quests is to make it to other side of map alive, but the AP rewards can just be taken away in neutral mode. For skyshards, I don't think so. Perhaps some folks think that skyshards give you more power and thus shouldn't be easy to get. I can respect such idea.

All that requires is some patience and awareness. Neither of those are bad things. You're not obligated to go full Rambo and become some PvP killing machine to do any of these things.

It comes down to a question of "Is it worth it for you?" Plenty of non-PvP'ers decided it was and have managed with no long term side effects. There are dozens of suggestions how to make this happen, and aside from the grand occasional death (which is usually learned from, it's not nearly as troublesome as some are making it out to be. Where is the data showing this can't be done? Most of what I see are personal accounts of how it has been.

Again, it's a nerf request, however you want to spin it. Not everything has to be danger free and practically hand itself over. Most PvP'ers pay zero mind to questers. They know the AP is minimal, and the threat to them is nonexistent.

Everyone does not have to be able to do every thing within the game. Of all the remotely difficult aspects of this game, the threat of PvP while PvE'ing is remarkably far down on the list.

I'd rather someone complete these things, having been a little nervous at the potential threat while never even seeing another enemy player than to have that already minimal threat completely eliminated.

One way it's gifted to you, the other way it can at least be considered an accomplishment. It's not always a bad thing for people to come out of their comfort zone on grand occasion, especially when the consequences are as minimal as they are in Cyro and IC. The awareness gained is worth far more than the time, distance, and possibly Telvar lost. If it's worth it to you, you can overcome your fear. And if it's not, don't. It's won't be remotely gamebreaking.

At least once a year, 1000's of PvE'ers enter both zones and do things they never otherwise thought they'd do. Every single one of them makes it out in one piece. It's never taken a top 1% player to collect skyshards, WB's, and delve clears in Cyrodiil or IC, either one.

I would love to see it the internal data available showing the success/completion rate of the items in question. I suspect it would only strengthen the argument that no change is required. It falls into the category of dozens of other proposed nerfs that people may want, but are going to be very difficult to justify.

It's not a PvP thing. It's not a PvE thing. People are tired of hearing "We (group of players) have decided it's too hard, therefore it's too hard." It matters little what 'it' actually is.

As I've stated in other threads, convince the Dev's and get your wish, but call it the nerf that it is.