Sorc isn't as dead as I thought

Sevn · November 2018

pieratsos wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

My magsorc is dominating BG's. Switched out necro for bright throat sitting at, depending on what drink, 36k-40k mag, 21k health unbuffed(+5k battle spirit), 14k-16k stam. It's the only class that I have that I don't even have to slot a heal/impen for pvp/pve combat. I'm lost at why others who have mained a magsorc for the longest aren't doing even better than me.

Of course I do run my own builds and follow no meta, nerfs don't affect my builds as such.

They do much better than you. The difference between you and them however is the definition of dominating. What seems like dominating for you, for them is random pug smashing that can be done on any class regardless of build. Thats not the definition of dominating for competitive players. Thats not even worth mentioning for them.

And no offence but ur build doesnt sound being able to dominate. Any semi competitive player on any semi competitive build regardless of class, will chew down ur full divines hybrid no heal setup before u realise what happened.

No worries, no offense taken, but it hasn't happened yet. Guess all the good pvpers are avoiding BG's all day every day all week. Shrugs.

Edit. Also funny you mention they can do it on any build, but many have claimed to only play one class? Post your vid of your dominant performance please. My performance is trash so no need to compare, but I'd like to see a good pvper in action. That is you correct?

It doesnt matter how many classes someone plays. A competitive player will adapt to any class and a fight against a build like urs wont pose much of a threat because simply ur build isnt viable for competitive PVP. Again, i said no offence, i have nothing against you and i didnt say u are trash so no need to go on the defensive. You are free to play and enjoy whatever u want. But it is what it is. Your build has no heals, small shields, no survivability, no sustain and is melee. Hybrid builds are underwhelming in general and ur build is underwhelming even for the low standards of hybrid builds. Im sorry but thats not competitive.

Showing you a clip of a competitive player wont make you understand what competitive means if you simply cant even understand why ur build isnt viable for competitive PVP. A better way to help you understand is to actually post ur whole build and gameplay footage so people can actually explain you why ur build isnt that good and why ur gameplay (most likely) isnt impressive to the eyes of good players.

Again, I'm not offended, I'm curious as to how you have come to your assessment. I play BG's all week, 3 to 4 hours a day alone. In all that time I have yet to get destroyed using my magsorc. Where are all these good players that should wreck my setup?

In higher MMR matches mostly.

Sevn wrote: »

What's even crazier is you are 100% right. My setup isn't even OPTIMIZED for BG's, I'm mainly using one bar and I'm still outperforming the competition. I have yet to have a negative match in BG's. Not once while using my poor setup by these unseen good players I haven't ran into yet.

And if you actually believe that a one bar, hybrid, divines, no heal melee sorc build is dominating PVP then prepare for a rude awakening when you go up against good players with good builds.

Sevn wrote: »

Have you played a hybrid in pvp? Of course not, that isn't what they are promoting on YouTube builds are they?

Dont need to. Speaking of YT however Ive seen an exceptionally good player on very good and very smart and impressive hybrid builds. Unfortunately the only thing ive seen is the builds holding the player back. He is the only reason i call them underwhelming and not outright bad. But if you think they are competitive then by all means show us ur footage. You are the one trying to change the common belief about hybrids being competitive. Not me.

Sevn wrote: »

Bet you only play cp pvp as well talking competitive while using cp's as a crutch lol. What server you play on? Hopefully we can meet up and you can show me how it's done.

For someone who says "im not offended" you seem to be prety aggressive towards me trying to attack me or belittle me or whatever this is. Ill just ignore it cause i dont feel the need to get into this kind of conversation. I dont play on PS4 to "show you how its done".

But again, feel free to post ur whole build and actual gameplay footage of dominating and outperforming everyone so we can engage in a more meaningful conversation.

P.S. Honest questions. Watch the BG score that jabrone posted in this thread and tell me if you are impressed by it. Also if you have the time watch the PC EU duelling tournament that took place a few days ago. Its in the PVP section and someone posted in the thread a link for the tourn. Watch the sorc and tell me what exactly do you make out of those fights.

You responded to me and me alone because you were looking for confrontation. Why deny it? As I do enjoy confrontation I'm giving you what you seek. To be clear I am not promoting hybrids and we have established that my build is trash and I'm beating mediocre players.

In higher mmr you say? You don't even know my pvp rank on this character, how could you possibly know what bracket I fall in? Correction, I said dominating BG's. I have no idea how it would hold up in cyro, but since I have zero interest in cyro anymore, it doesn't matter now does it?

Never played one huh? So you are one of those people that speaks on something they know very little about? Welp, no need to discuss why someone who has zero firsthand knowledge is down talking something they don't understand.

I see no need to post a vid of my trashy play, however I would like to compete directly with your dominant magsorc build. I'm expecting you to win, but man the salt that would develop if you were to lose to such a trashy build? Epic. Too bad you're on PC. You a miat user too?

Feanor · November 2018

You don't even know my pvp rank on this character, how could you possibly know what bracket I fall in?

One reason I don’t buy what you post. You just don’t seem to know what you talk about. Obviously Alliance Rank has nothing to do with MMR brackets at all.

Also:

Too bad you're on PC. You a miat user too?

It’s just hot steam.

CrimsonGTX · November 2018

Yeah Sorcs aren't dead, that talk was a overreaction. The shield changes and major expedition nerfs across the board was poorly thought-out and excessive tho.

D0PAMINE · November 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

I have yet to see any posts similar referring to no CP.

Your damage is reduced by a ton in no CP (5k less mag - more like 6 after modifiers, 20-30% less damage, far less crit resistance and damage mitigation from CP)

You sacrifice a lot in no CP giving up 1 or 2 sets for defensive stats.

I am not a fan of the changes in no CP. All of my other classes perform better in BGs, I made a sorc set up and decided to put it on my warden and it performed better, especially 1vX.

If sorc had a decent burst heal or HoT, then I'd change my tune

A non pet HoT would be fair imo, how is the new dark exchange?

Feanor · November 2018

@D0PAMINE

Mostly not really useful as an emergency burst heal because it still has that 1.2 seconds cast time. You’re better off with Combat Prayer in that regard.

Tannus15 · November 2018

@Sevn Different styles of PvP require different builds

MagSorc has always done well in BG's and will continues to do well in solo Q BG's. If you Q with pre-mades vs pre-mades you'll start facing tougher opposition. Their builds will balance each other's weakness and they will coordinate as a group. I do ok in BG's until I actually group with my friends and then I die constantly because solo BG is a completely different thing.

Cyro even more so, and CP Cyro the most.

BG's you can read the map and the match and work out the right way and place to fight to minimise getting out numbered and having a line of retreat etc. Cyro you're more likely to run into harder odds and there is less cover etc.

I'm not saying 1 is better or worse than the other, just that when you say "this is a killer pvp build!" other people, who play a different type of PvP will say "that's a crap build and you'll get wrecked" and they are not necessarily wrong, in the same way that you're not wrong either.

The build obviously works great in the circumstances which you use it.

You also spend a LOT of time in BG's. I would bet money you could take any rando sorc build and do well in BG's because you spend over 20 hours a week doing BG's and a lot of the people you are facing do not.

A mate of mine spent 32 hours straight in Cyro for his emp push and I can tell you right now he would destroy you in Vivec. You would probably do better than him in BG's.

Something people don't seem to accept is that ESO is very skill based. A good player with an average build will crush an average player with a BiS build in any aspect of the game.

Drummerx04 · November 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I've been running necro/Green pact (body..all impen) with Grothdarr on my sorc, and putting the matriarch on my bar for the heal.

30k health, 42k magicka, burst isn't what it used to be, but still really good, and....a 12k shield.

I fully agree, it isn't nearly as bad as players made it out to be. It comes down to not wanting to change.

You’re running a dedicated tank set and a melee damage set. Of course you’re going to be harder to kill while obviously also benefiting from all the defensive CP. It’s a play style most people don’t enjoy who picked a Sorc - I guess most want to play a ranged caster.

You can label it whatever you like, I label it as effective....yes, as a caster.

https://imgur.com/a/59cOFrl

No cp battlegrounds, btw...
Yes, that's a 27-0 score and almost a million damage done.

I fully realize sorc isn't what it once was. Still. Doesn't change the fact my set up gets me kills and wins. Sneer at it and dismiss all you like, I'll just be over here killing it...sorry you can't make sorc work for you.

A 27-0 score against one of the full 4 man teams not scoring a single kill and only 5 assists? Truly impressive. I'm in awe.

Sevn · November 2018

Feanor wrote: »

@Sevn

Let’s just leave it at the following: I don’t buy that your no impen no heal one bar hybrid Sorc is going up against decent opposition when you feel like you are “dominating”. It’s great you have fun, and let’s just agree to disagree.

And no, I don’t play CP PvP at all.

The thing is, no one is asking you to? The opposition I face routinely goes 24-3 or some other big numbers. I never said I'm winning these matches just dominating my individual match ups when faced with one on one or maybe two at a time. It's cool, the players you guys are
fighting are top notch and everyone else who is finding success is just facing potatoes.

Irritating being told you are playing incorrectly, but since you are having fun you can get away with it, but the big boys will eat you up, all the while the big boys are the ones having trouble being successful with their cookie cutter builds.

What is there to agree or disagree with? Unless you are saying there is only one way to play a magsorc and that's your way, excuse me, the traditional way of hiding in the back casting spells.

Sevn · November 2018

Feanor wrote: »

You don't even know my pvp rank on this character, how could you possibly know what bracket I fall in?

One reason I don’t buy what you post. You just don’t seem to know what you talk about. Obviously Alliance Rank has nothing to do with MMR brackets at all.

Also:

Too bad you're on PC. You a miat user too?

It’s just hot steam.

And again, I don't care if you buy it or not lol. Let me guess you are on PC as well? Funny how you guys aren't available to show me how to properly magsorc, all while complaining about how terrible your build is now.

Sevn · November 2018

Tannus15 wrote: »

@Sevn Different styles of PvP require different builds

MagSorc has always done well in BG's and will continues to do well in solo Q BG's. If you Q with pre-mades vs pre-mades you'll start facing tougher opposition. Their builds will balance each other's weakness and they will coordinate as a group. I do ok in BG's until I actually group with my friends and then I die constantly because solo BG is a completely different thing.

Cyro even more so, and CP Cyro the most.

BG's you can read the map and the match and work out the right way and place to fight to minimise getting out numbered and having a line of retreat etc. Cyro you're more likely to run into harder odds and there is less cover etc.

I'm not saying 1 is better or worse than the other, just that when you say "this is a killer pvp build!" other people, who play a different type of PvP will say "that's a crap build and you'll get wrecked" and they are not necessarily wrong, in the same way that you're not wrong either.

The build obviously works great in the circumstances which you use it.

You also spend a LOT of time in BG's. I would bet money you could take any rando sorc build and do well in BG's because you spend over 20 hours a week doing BG's and a lot of the people you are facing do not.

A mate of mine spent 32 hours straight in Cyro for his emp push and I can tell you right now he would destroy you in Vivec. You would probably do better than him in BG's.

Something people don't seem to accept is that ESO is very skill based. A good player with an average build will crush an average player with a BiS build in any aspect of the game.

The thing is, I have not once claimed my sorc or my build is dominating "all pvp". I clearly said BG's. Clearly. I don't get the pre made insertion either? Of course the competition ramps up fighting against organized groups, no different than fighting a bunch of potatoes zerged up in cyro vs fighting a well organized group. That still doesn't mean everyone who pugs is terrible like some are claiming.

Unlike some here, I have multiple characters for all activities. This is my no cp BG's toon. I have a toon built just for the sewers and another just for no cp cyro. Without even seeing how I play, you assume much about how I would fare against your friend.

Please don't refer to cp cyro as good competition, where cps are carrying a bunch of bad players who are exposed once their safety blanket has been snatched away. Where "good" players chase after one dude, most run around in a big ball and the ones looking for small scale are really just looking to mostly gank potatoes for a cool 1vX vid.

I'm just a mercenary and I'll let the faction loyalists have crappy cyro. I'm just here for blood and that sweet ap. To be clear I'm not claiming to be good.

Many posts ago I even stated so. I posted my experience to showcase just how dominant magsorc is still currently in BG's, because you are right, I was dominating BG's with a pet build before bright, and apparently I'm not even playing the class correctly. If those who want to cry woe is me my class is dead are just venting, understandable, but make no mistake, it is just your preferred playstyle which is "dead", there is a difference.

Unless they are arrogant enough to believe there is only one way magsorc should be played.

Aurielle · November 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I've been running necro/Green pact (body..all impen) with Grothdarr on my sorc, and putting the matriarch on my bar for the heal.

30k health, 42k magicka, burst isn't what it used to be, but still really good, and....a 12k shield.

I fully agree, it isn't nearly as bad as players made it out to be. It comes down to not wanting to change.

You’re running a dedicated tank set and a melee damage set. Of course you’re going to be harder to kill while obviously also benefiting from all the defensive CP. It’s a play style most people don’t enjoy who picked a Sorc - I guess most want to play a ranged caster.

You can label it whatever you like, I label it as effective....yes, as a caster.

https://imgur.com/a/59cOFrl

No cp battlegrounds, btw...
Yes, that's a 27-0 score and almost a million damage done.

I fully realize sorc isn't what it once was. Still. Doesn't change the fact my set up gets me kills and wins. Sneer at it and dismiss all you like, I'll just be over here killing it...sorry you can't make sorc work for you.

I don’t recognize any names there besides yours and henry’s. TBH, non-DM modes aren’t really a good benchmark for a sorc’s offensive capabilities in BGs. I’ve noticed on PS4 that if I queue specifically for DMs, I face a higher calibre of opponent than I do when I play land capture modes. Most people who specifically play land capture modes (on PS4, at least) are either on low damage heal/tank builds purpose-built for land capture, or they’re in PVE gear (presumably because they are just in it for the motifs/AP and get slaughtered in DM).

I’m still wearing light armour on my sorc, but I’ve had to go with five impen two divines, and ended up taking Healing Ward off my back bar because it’s useless in BGs now. I still rack up lots of kills, but I’m definitely a lot squishier.

Edit: Also, it’s easy to hit the million damage mark when you’re playing against groups with healers. Damage done is seldom a reliable indicator of performance. You can deal a million damage with lots of AOEs and fail to kill a single player in BGs.

D0PAMINE · November 2018

Feanor wrote: »

@D0PAMINE

Mostly not really useful as an emergency burst heal because it still has that 1.2 seconds cast time. You’re better off with Combat Prayer in that regard.

Thats a shame

Vapirko · November 2018

Most shields are okay, healing ward feels a bit worthless though. Even with 41k magicka and 25k health, my healing ward is now like 3k even with CP on my magblade. The healing ward change was unnecessary, and I’m still on the fence about whether shields need to be critable. Against a competent player, shields aren’t much of a defense as they can disappear too fast for you to go offensive. Particularly difficult vs jabs and anything following it.

ZeroXFF · November 2018

I don't do PvP, but in PvE all it resulted in was me swapping out my shield on both bars with the twilight matriarch and putting 12 attribute points in health (to get to 20k). I still die a bit more often than before, but others in my groups die less...

Micah_Bayer · November 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I've been running necro/Green pact (body..all impen) with Grothdarr on my sorc, and putting the matriarch on my bar for the heal.

30k health, 42k magicka, burst isn't what it used to be, but still really good, and....a 12k shield.

I fully agree, it isn't nearly as bad as players made it out to be. It comes down to not wanting to change.

You’re running a dedicated tank set and a melee damage set. Of course you’re going to be harder to kill while obviously also benefiting from all the defensive CP. It’s a play style most people don’t enjoy who picked a Sorc - I guess most want to play a ranged caster.

You can label it whatever you like, I label it as effective....yes, as a caster.

https://imgur.com/a/59cOFrl

No cp battlegrounds, btw...
Yes, that's a 27-0 score and almost a million damage done.

I fully realize sorc isn't what it once was. Still. Doesn't change the fact my set up gets me kills and wins. Sneer at it and dismiss all you like, I'll just be over here killing it...sorry you can't make sorc work for you.

Probably all kill steals

Waffennacht · November 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I've been running necro/Green pact (body..all impen) with Grothdarr on my sorc, and putting the matriarch on my bar for the heal.

30k health, 42k magicka, burst isn't what it used to be, but still really good, and....a 12k shield.

I fully agree, it isn't nearly as bad as players made it out to be. It comes down to not wanting to change.

You’re running a dedicated tank set and a melee damage set. Of course you’re going to be harder to kill while obviously also benefiting from all the defensive CP. It’s a play style most people don’t enjoy who picked a Sorc - I guess most want to play a ranged caster.

You can label it whatever you like, I label it as effective....yes, as a caster.

https://imgur.com/a/59cOFrl

No cp battlegrounds, btw...
Yes, that's a 27-0 score and almost a million damage done.

I fully realize sorc isn't what it once was. Still. Doesn't change the fact my set up gets me kills and wins. Sneer at it and dismiss all you like, I'll just be over here killing it...sorry you can't make sorc work for you.

Would be cool if it was a Deathmatch

A random comparison to my Transmutation wearing Stamplar:

But that's Deathmatch, /shrug

Kel · November 2018

Here's your deathmatch.

https://imgur.com/kwh4YTp

Still not good enough? Will anything be, or is everyone just content being ***?
What I'm using has worked as well, if not better, than what I used before. Sorry your experiences haven't been the same, but what I'm not going to apologize for is playing something fun and effective.
Sorc is different, but it's demise has been greatly exaggerated. Maybe on a personal level, sure, but not for all.

Tannus15 · November 2018

I'm waiting for someone to post a *** score.

"Look how much I suck, but it's not me, it's sorc nerf!"

Waffennacht · November 2018

Tannus15 wrote: »

I'm waiting for someone to post a *** score.

"Look how much I suck, but it's not me, it's sorc nerf!"

Give me a moment! Lol

Facefister · November 2018

gamerguy757 wrote: »

So after re speccing my Sorc from Overload Build to pure burst, and changing Divines to Impen, my sorc does seem to survive better, but the shield nerf i do feel is still a bit excessive.
I don't use Rune Cage anymore, instead I replaced it with Encase...pretty funny watching someone bash nonstop trying to break free XD.

good ol' adaphtashion

SHADOW2KK · November 2018

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

I've been running necro/Green pact (body..all impen) with Grothdarr on my sorc, and putting the matriarch on my bar for the heal.

30k health, 42k magicka, burst isn't what it used to be, but still really good, and....a 12k shield.

I fully agree, it isn't nearly as bad as players made it out to be. It comes down to not wanting to change.

You’re running a dedicated tank set and a melee damage set. Of course you’re going to be harder to kill while obviously also benefiting from all the defensive CP. It’s a play style most people don’t enjoy who picked a Sorc - I guess most want to play a ranged caster.

You can label it whatever you like, I label it as effective....

https://imgur.com/a/59cOFrl

No cp battlegrounds, btw...
Yes, that's a 27-0 score and almost a million damage done.

I fully realize sorc isn't what it once was. Still. Doesn't change the fact my set up gets me kills and wins. Sneer at it and dismiss all you like, I'll just be over here killing it...sorry you can't make sorc work for you.

I thought all the forum people unsubbed and quit because Sorcerers were suddenly “unplayable”.

Only the weak who could not adapt

No loss

Beardimus · November 2018

Tandor wrote: »

Such changes are rarely as bad as people make them out to be before they've had time to work them out.

I don't think that's quite true. The OP is talking about survivability, and i don't think any good player ever moaned about that (after they took the delay away)

General vibe from the majority of Sorcs has been Sorcs were going to be MORE tanky but its at the cost of sustain or damage or other mitigation (no well fitted) and bar slot issues (boundless)

I've said before I'm way harder to kill now, and knew i would be. Before i was glass cannon, no impen. Wards down and pop dead. Now I'm way harder to kill, but I've lost in order to raise resistances / Crit protection and a bit of health.

So the irony is the moaning about sorcs being hard to kill is very far from over...

Pastas · November 2018

Waffennacht wrote: »

I have yet to see any posts similar referring to no CP.

Your damage is reduced by a ton in no CP (5k less mag - more like 6 after modifiers, 20-30% less damage, far less crit resistance and damage mitigation from CP)

You sacrifice a lot in no CP giving up 1 or 2 sets for defensive stats.

I am not a fan of the changes in no CP. All of my other classes perform better in BGs, I made a sorc set up and decided to put it on my warden and it performed better, especially 1vX.

If sorc had a decent burst heal or HoT, then I'd change my tune

Mmmm, sorc already have Matriarch and Surge.

Aurielle · November 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

Here's your deathmatch.

https://imgur.com/kwh4YTp

Still not good enough? Will anything be, or is everyone just content being ***?
What I'm using has worked as well, if not better, than what I used before. Sorry your experiences haven't been the same, but what I'm not going to apologize for is playing something fun and effective.
Sorc is different, but it's demise has been greatly exaggerated. Maybe on a personal level, sure, but not for all.

Yes, that’s a more accurate representation of the build’s offensive capabilities. All I was saying is that K/D ratios and damage done in land grab modes (where most people are on healers or potato builds) do not necessarily represent how well a build will perform in deathmatch. No need to get aggressive about it.

Trancestor · November 2018

Sevn wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@jabrone77

It’s not about making it work. It’s not rocket science. It’s about whether the play style is fun or not. If it’s for you, good for you.

@Sevn

BGs are a terrible benchmark for assessing a class, especially when you only count Deathmatch. Besides, in low MMR BGs the majority of opponents are outright terrible. But again, if it’s fun, for you, all the better. I just don’t think anyone is going to be successful vs decent opponents using “just one bar” and a hybrid setup.

what is the proper place go make a pvp assessment? Cp cyro? Why? Why would I make an assessment using a crutch like cp? Bg's puts a real strain on your sustain, it limits your overall damage and it's way more evenly matched without cps carrying folks. I'm also not wearing any proc sets to carry me, all kills are from me.

What better place to test a pvp build? Who mentioned anything about only deathmatch? That was just the last match type. My sorc chews up the other modes even harder. 24-3, 19-4, etc all while capturing or defending said objective. The only mode I suck at is chaosball, maybe crazyking.

Why is it that the opposition I face is mediocre, but you guys are fighting "skilled" pvpers? If I beat them they were subpar but if you guys win it's all skill? That's what is irritating about discussing this with some. Of course I can't beat everyone with just one bar, but the total hybrid build is extremely successful.

I'll ask you the same, have you pvped using a hybrid before? If so and didn't find success does that mean no one else has? If not how can you speak on what works when you've never even tried it? What build are you using, please don't say some standard cookie cutter meta crap all while downing something you've never even tried.

Dueling good players and solo play in Cyro and to a lesser extent 2vx/3vx is the true measure of a build and skill, BG's not so much because you're relying a lot on 3 other players on your team plus 4 other players on the 3rd team, thats 7 players that affect the outcome of your fights and scores. Your build won't do much in a duel vs a good player or in solo play in Cyro even if you might be a really great player.

profundidob16_ESO · November 2018

gamerguy757 wrote: »

So after re speccing my Sorc from Overload Build to pure burst, and changing Divines to Impen, my sorc does seem to survive better, but the shield nerf i do feel is still a bit excessive.
I don't use Rune Cage anymore, instead I replaced it with Encase...pretty funny watching someone bash nonstop trying to break free XD.

it's called balance. You know, that thing that everyone has been asking for for years now...well it's finally here but people's brain are still adapting . It will take a whlie before they understand and accept it

Thogard · November 2018

I switched from maining stamplar last patch to mag sorc this patch.

So far it’s a great change. In duels sorcs May be weaker but the speed nerf across the board was a huge boost to streak. Mobility is still king and mag sorcs are still mobile.

Kel · November 2018

Aurielle wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

Here's your deathmatch.

https://imgur.com/kwh4YTp

Still not good enough? Will anything be, or is everyone just content being ***?
What I'm using has worked as well, if not better, than what I used before. Sorry your experiences haven't been the same, but what I'm not going to apologize for is playing something fun and effective.
Sorc is different, but it's demise has been greatly exaggerated. Maybe on a personal level, sure, but not for all.

Yes, that’s a more accurate representation of the build’s offensive capabilities. All I was saying is that K/D ratios and damage done in land grab modes (where most people are on healers or potato builds) do not necessarily represent how well a build will perform in deathmatch. No need to get aggressive about it.

Sure there is...when you're talking about the changes and adaptations you've made to your favorite class and show proof it works, just to have everyone pick it apart and cry & moan about how it's really trash, all because you can't go balls to the wall damage anymore, it gets annoying.

I get it. Some have to pretend the class is absolutely garbage because the warped agenda is to whine enough so the devs revert the changes or to buff other aspects of the class. Anything showing good performance is shouted down. Instead of coming up with thier own ideas or trying to better ones shown, players here rather put thier heads in the sand or just cry about what used to be. Why? It ruins the narrative to admit you can change some things and still do good to great.

So yeah, there's a lot of reason to be "aggressive" about it. Didn't see that same reaction to those picking apart my build aggressively...somehow that's fine.

Honestly don't know why I participate in these threads...
https://imgur.com/3HBTsf9

Aurielle · November 2018

jabrone77 wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

Here's your deathmatch.

https://imgur.com/kwh4YTp

Still not good enough? Will anything be, or is everyone just content being ***?
What I'm using has worked as well, if not better, than what I used before. Sorry your experiences haven't been the same, but what I'm not going to apologize for is playing something fun and effective.
Sorc is different, but it's demise has been greatly exaggerated. Maybe on a personal level, sure, but not for all.

Yes, that’s a more accurate representation of the build’s offensive capabilities. All I was saying is that K/D ratios and damage done in land grab modes (where most people are on healers or potato builds) do not necessarily represent how well a build will perform in deathmatch. No need to get aggressive about it.

Sure there is...when you're talking about the changes and adaptations you've made to your favorite class and show proof it works, just to have everyone pick it apart and cry & moan about how it's really trash, all because you can't go balls to the wall damage anymore, it gets annoying.

I get it. Some have to pretend the class is absolutely garbage because the warped agenda is to whine enough so the devs revert the changes or to buff other aspects of the class. Anything showing good performance is shouted down. Instead of coming up with thier own ideas or trying to better ones shown, players here rather put thier heads in the sand or just cry about what used to be. Why? It ruins the narrative to admit you can change some things and still do good to great.

So yeah, there's a lot of reason to be "aggressive" about it. Didn't see that same reaction to those picking apart my build aggressively...somehow that's fine.

Honestly don't know why I participate in these threads...
https://imgur.com/3HBTsf9

LOL. I was just saying. If you want people to take a build seriously, you need to post deathmatch stats/videos. That’s all. Calm down.

Kel · November 2018

Aurielle wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

jabrone77 wrote: »

Here's your deathmatch.

https://imgur.com/kwh4YTp

Still not good enough? Will anything be, or is everyone just content being ***?
What I'm using has worked as well, if not better, than what I used before. Sorry your experiences haven't been the same, but what I'm not going to apologize for is playing something fun and effective.
Sorc is different, but it's demise has been greatly exaggerated. Maybe on a personal level, sure, but not for all.

Yes, that’s a more accurate representation of the build’s offensive capabilities. All I was saying is that K/D ratios and damage done in land grab modes (where most people are on healers or potato builds) do not necessarily represent how well a build will perform in deathmatch. No need to get aggressive about it.

Sure there is...when you're talking about the changes and adaptations you've made to your favorite class and show proof it works, just to have everyone pick it apart and cry & moan about how it's really trash, all because you can't go balls to the wall damage anymore, it gets annoying.

I get it. Some have to pretend the class is absolutely garbage because the warped agenda is to whine enough so the devs revert the changes or to buff other aspects of the class. Anything showing good performance is shouted down. Instead of coming up with thier own ideas or trying to better ones shown, players here rather put thier heads in the sand or just cry about what used to be. Why? It ruins the narrative to admit you can change some things and still do good to great.

So yeah, there's a lot of reason to be "aggressive" about it. Didn't see that same reaction to those picking apart my build aggressively...somehow that's fine.

Honestly don't know why I participate in these threads...
https://imgur.com/3HBTsf9

LOL. I was just saying. If you want people to take a build seriously, you need to post deathmatch stats/videos. That’s all. Calm down.

You honestly think it would matter?
I've posted videos before to the same results. Someone asked for sorc winning duels. Posted a video. Person said show him a sorc winning a dueling tournament. Posted one. Still said sorc is trash.

It's frustrating. It's annoying. It's an attempt to deny the reality of what the class is now. Instead of trying to work with what we have, players are content to wallow in tears and tear down those trying to make it work, instead of embracing or bettering new attempts because it's not like it was...

Eh....whatever. Happy thanksgiving.
I'm going to bury this conversation under a mountain of turkey and pumpkin pie.