Total Dark bubble preventing any hard cc since Murkmire, resulting 10sec + cc immunity
Soris
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And is not mentioned in natch potes. Is this intended or not?
Im talking about cc'ing while the bubble is active. Normally the cc immunity wasnt kicking in until the bubble disappears or breaked free and there used to be various combos such as dawnbreaker into total dark or javelin to total dark. These are not possible anymore.
The worse is, the enemy can not be cced for a full 10 seconds if he/she decides not to break free that bubble. (Bubble duration + cc immunity timer) So they usually stop attacking you and play defensive until the bubble worns off and when it disappear it automaticly gives cc immunity (by design). Resulting long de facto cc immunity.
This has to be looked at! Return to the old mechanic please, let us cc while the bubble is active.
@ZOS_Wrobel @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom
Edited by Soris on November 21, 2018 1:11PM Im talking about cc'ing while the bubble is active. Normally the cc immunity wasnt kicking in until the bubble disappears or breaked free and there used to be various combos such as dawnbreaker into total dark or javelin to total dark. These are not possible anymore.
The worse is, the enemy can not be cced for a full 10 seconds if he/she decides not to break free that bubble. (Bubble duration + cc immunity timer) So they usually stop attacking you and play defensive until the bubble worns off and when it disappear it automaticly gives cc immunity (by design). Resulting long de facto cc immunity.
This has to be looked at! Return to the old mechanic please, let us cc while the bubble is active.
@ZOS_Wrobel @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom
Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]
6
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Sotha_Sil✭✭✭✭✭
✭Gina already answered on thatZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »This is intended. Eclipse and its morphs are considered crowd control abilities; when you are hit by a crowd control ability, you can't be crowd controlled by another crowd control effect.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5612565#Comment_5612565Edited by Sotha_Sil on November 21, 2018 1:35PMRestoration is a perfectly valid school of magic, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise! - Spells and incantations for those with the talent to cast them!2 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oh... I hope they are aware of the cc immunity issue i'm trying to point out.. This sounds not so reasonable to me becasue templars now officially and effectively giving out longer cc immunity to targets. /sigh
Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]0 -
AAbrigo✭✭✭Freaking love this..
And yes, I am a total dark hater..
#GoDefensiveWhenTheBubbleIsOnYou....CHECK!9 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Freaking love this..
And yes, I am a total dark hater..
#GoDefensiveWhenTheBubbleIsOnYou....CHECK!
you'd rather templars go back to timestop spam or unavoidable burst from unstable core that pulls you out of stealth? lol
Timestop, unstable core, and destro cc will be more used once more templars catch wind with destro cc already being used heavily.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I'm glad for this. I really hate the current iteration of this skill.
I'd love it if they cut the proc values in half and removed the CC interaction entirely. Then it would be a good DOT and/or HOT. They could also increase the Unstable Core bomb damage, it's pitifully weak.Edited by Solariken on November 21, 2018 2:57PM2 -
Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.Because I can!1 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.1 -
Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.Because I can!2 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
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Sometimes the bubble animation delay behind the actual cast and you end up taking damage from it without even knowing. Similar to the reveb bash stun animation.I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
And sometimes if you are channeling heavy attacks or casting a skill when the bubble applied to you, breaking free from it can be buggy.
Might be lag related issues though.Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm glad for this. I really hate the current iteration of this skill.
I'd love it if they cut the proc values in half and removed the CC interaction entirely. Then it would be a good DOT and/or HOT. They could also increase the Unstable Core bomb damage, it's pitifully weak.
Id accept a version of TD/UC that debuffs (maim/vulnerability) and deals damage/healing instead of the CC mechanic we have. While it is an interesting cc mechanic, most templars are finding hard cc's more reliable in most fights which speaks volumes for the ability.
Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
"I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo...Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds" is what I read. If you continue with the light attacks and Ransacks you will be punching yourself before you get to the Bash.
Now if it's punching yourself because the bubble renders late, I sympathize. A lot of skills have that problem.0 -
Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
"I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo...Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds" is what I read. If you continue with the light attacks and Ransacks you will be punching yourself before you get to the Bash.
Now if it's punching yourself because the bubble renders late, I sympathize. A lot of skills have that problem.
The bubble doesnt render late. I have the buble and i bash, i dont break free. Is it possible that break free is attached to the global CD?Because I can!0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
"I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo...Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds" is what I read. If you continue with the light attacks and Ransacks you will be punching yourself before you get to the Bash.
Now if it's punching yourself because the bubble renders late, I sympathize. A lot of skills have that problem.
The bubble doesnt render late. I have the buble and i bash, i dont break free. Is it possible that break free is attached to the global CD?
I'm pretty sure break free is attached to global CD.Make Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.6 -
The_Brosteen✭✭✭✭✭Oh... I hope they are aware of the cc immunity issue i'm trying to point out.. This sounds not so reasonable to me becasue templars now officially and effectively giving out longer cc immunity to targets. /sigh
The cost of which is the reciever has to decide to break free, stay offensive and kill themselves, or play defensive and let the bubble time out. Fun fact, if you purge the bubble then you get not cc immunity.
Cc immune target that damages themselves if they attack sounds like a pretty good trade off to me tbh.0 -
Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
"I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo...Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds" is what I read. If you continue with the light attacks and Ransacks you will be punching yourself before you get to the Bash.
Now if it's punching yourself because the bubble renders late, I sympathize. A lot of skills have that problem.
The bubble doesnt render late. I have the buble and i bash, i dont break free. Is it possible that break free is attached to the global CD?
I'm pretty sure break free is attached to global CD.
That make sense. Then Total dark should be reworked or even better break free should be removed from global CD.Edited by Bashev on November 21, 2018 7:10PMBecause I can!0 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
✭The_Brosteen wrote: »Oh... I hope they are aware of the cc immunity issue i'm trying to point out.. This sounds not so reasonable to me becasue templars now officially and effectively giving out longer cc immunity to targets. /sigh
The cost of which is the reciever has to decide to break free, stay offensive and kill themselves, or play defensive and let the bubble time out. Fun fact, if you purge the bubble then you get not cc immunity.
Cc immune target that damages themselves if they attack sounds like a pretty good trade off to me tbh.
You do get cc immunity when you purge. At least with cleansing ritual, because i usually cleanse it and get the immunity without spending stamina.
And true, it is up to receiver's decision and there is a trade off. But he also gets normal 4 sec cc immunity when the bubble time out. This breaks the fair deal imo. If it has to stay like this, then ZOS should consider removing cc immunity when the bubble isnt break freed/cleansed.Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
"I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo...Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds" is what I read. If you continue with the light attacks and Ransacks you will be punching yourself before you get to the Bash.
Now if it's punching yourself because the bubble renders late, I sympathize. A lot of skills have that problem.
6? ransack isnt rending slash, that should be 3 tops (LA, ransack, bash). But that's also 3x 10k tooltip with at least 1 critting lol.
Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
The_Brosteen✭✭✭✭✭The_Brosteen wrote: »Oh... I hope they are aware of the cc immunity issue i'm trying to point out.. This sounds not so reasonable to me becasue templars now officially and effectively giving out longer cc immunity to targets. /sigh
The cost of which is the reciever has to decide to break free, stay offensive and kill themselves, or play defensive and let the bubble time out. Fun fact, if you purge the bubble then you get not cc immunity.
Cc immune target that damages themselves if they attack sounds like a pretty good trade off to me tbh.
You do get cc immunity when you purge. At least with cleansing ritual, because i usually cleanse it and get the immunity without spending stamina.
And true, it is up to receiver's decision and there is a trade off. But he also gets normal 4 sec cc immunity when the bubble time out. This breaks the fair deal imo. If it has to stay like this, then ZOS should consider removing cc immunity when the bubble isnt break freed/cleansed.
It might be that cc immunity isnt applied after purge from guards. Which has always been typical, as changes to skills are made the equivalent that cyrodiil guards have is always overlooked.
It sounds like your real issue is that a healbot or tank can just let the bubble sit on them and get extra immunity time. In that case you just need to pick your targets better.
I know that any decent dd is going to try and get rid of it asap unless they are running away because otherwise they'd kill themselves. If they're running away they are either out numbered or cant beat you 1v1. If its the former, seems like a silly thing to complain about a skill you chose to use in a situation that did not allow you to Xv1 someone effectively enough. If it's the later then, well, you won. These are pretty niche scenarios that shouldnt influence a skill to be changed where you would be able to reflect all of the damage they do back on them and knock them down. Bubble is good as a defensive cc, allowing to immediately use an offensive cc seems broken. It would be like getting hit with defensive rune and then knocked back by flame reach right after, which also sounds broken.0 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
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If we apply this example to other skills, then in this case Hardened Ward/Reflective Wings/Spell Wall/resto ult should all remove from the game because they offer strong defence and can also be used offensively vs range/melee builds or in a 1vX fight allowing you to stay defensive when going full offensive. Of course this would be the silliest thing to do.The_Brosteen wrote: »Bubble is good as a defensive cc, allowing to immediately use an offensive cc seems broken
I'm all for balancing things. But what you do is killing the ugly duck and keeping the good ones. I often come into situations where i turn the tides with TD and ulti dump right after. This happens very often and not even a niche scenerio. Now since this combo no longer stuns, the guy im fighting usually goes full defensive or runs away with bubble on(except dks), and is awarded with double cc immunity. He will come back to fight again with full health before even the cc immunity goes off. In what world giving double cc immunity to retreating targets (or anyone) considered as a balanced mechanic where we have unblockable and undodgeable ccs?
I'll tell you what is really niche.
Use total dark only when you decide turtling and it will be broken free immediately.
Use total dark when you want some extra damage on enemy before dumping your ult and you will lose your ability to stun him/her.
Yeah, what a great skill to use.
Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]1 -
dodgehopper_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭This is interesting considering the fact that the last couple days of pvp have shown me that I can get put into a hard cc over and over, despite breaking instantly. The CC mechanics in this game are really blown. I hope the Devs are working on this in their next balance update, and I'm not just talking about this total dark skill which has never worked in any sane sort of way.US/AD - Dodge Hopper - Vet Imperial Templar | US/AD - Goj-ei-Raj - Vet Argonian Nightblade
US/AD - Arondonimo - Vet Altmer Sorcerer | US/AD - Azumarax - Vet Dunmer Dragon Knight
US/AD - Barkan al-Sheharesh - Vet Redguard Dragon Knight | US/AD - Aelus Vortavoriil - Vet Altmer Templar
US/AD - Shirari Qa'Dar - Vet Khajiit Nightblade | US/AD - Ndvari Mzunchvolenthumz - Vet Bosmer Nightblade
US/EP - Yngmar - Vet Nord Dragon Knight | US/EP - Reloth Ur Fyr - Vet Dunmer Sorcerer
US/DC - Muiredeach - Vet Breton Sorcerer | US/DC - Nachtrabe - Vet Orc Nightblade
EU/DC - Dragol gro-Unglak - Vet Orc Dragon Knight | EU/DC - Targan al-Barkan - Vet Redguard Templar
EU/DC - Wuthmir - Vet Nord Sorcerer | EU/DC - Kosh Ragotoro - Vet Khajiit Nightblade
<And plenty more>1 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Does total dark still damage you on volatile armor proc and riposte or did they ever fix that? Just curious. If not, I know how to handle those DK tanks
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TheYKcid✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
"I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo...Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds" is what I read. If you continue with the light attacks and Ransacks you will be punching yourself before you get to the Bash.
Now if it's punching yourself because the bubble renders late, I sympathize. A lot of skills have that problem.
The bubble doesnt render late. I have the buble and i bash, i dont break free. Is it possible that break free is attached to the global CD?
Break-free is attached to the GCD.
The key distinction with bubble is that, unlike traditional hard CCs that disable you, getting bubbled does NOT reset your GCD.
Therefore your ransack spam is consuming all your GCDs, and any bash that is woven immediately after will not count as a break, since you're on cooldown.
If you get bubbled, stop casting any abilities immediately if you intend to break.Edited by TheYKcid on November 22, 2018 1:29PMPC/NA — Daggerfall Covenant — BGs, Kaalgrontiid
Kalazar Chalhoub — Redguard Nord Stamplar
Kalaron Caemor — Altmer Magsorc
Kalahad Cirith — Dunmer Magden4 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Lol , following this logic fear is broken because it gives almost 12 seconds CC immunity since if You'll fear someone and he wont break free Yoiu wont be able to use other stun for next 11,6 seconds...0 -
Soris✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Great reasoning! Because fear lets you block/dodge/heal/vanish!!Lol , following this logic fear is broken because it gives almost 12 seconds CC immunity since if You'll fear someone and he wont break free Yoiu wont be able to use other stun for next 11,6 seconds...
Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]6 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
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Hmm...good to know. Guess I'll have to keep wearing chudan for a few more years in PvP0 -
BNOC✭✭✭✭✭Bring back IC Total Dark and reflectable meteors. The ping pong championships were so fun.
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
578,000 - 36 Minutes 58 Seconds (Top 2 World?)
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox NA
569,000 - 40 minutes (350CP, Non optimised runs)5 -
Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I really dont like that ability. It is so buggy. I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo and I cannot break free. I have enough stamina but i cannot breakfree that skill. It needs 2-3 tries. Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds. I had some ridiculous death recaps. Also it procs on each tick of lighting staff heavy attack.
I think that this skill should have 1 second CD for the damage and the heal.
If you are in an Eclipse, you stop attacking until you purge/break free. Those ridiculous ticks are YOU.
If it had a 1 second cooldown it would finally be completely useless. The only effective CC TD has is to interupt a players' burst and force them to pause. The boobie prize is if they keep going and you get the heal.
Dont you read? I spam bash which is breakfree. I do damage but I do not breakfree.
"I use LA, Ransack, Bash combo...Imagine 6 hits for 2 seconds" is what I read. If you continue with the light attacks and Ransacks you will be punching yourself before you get to the Bash.
Now if it's punching yourself because the bubble renders late, I sympathize. A lot of skills have that problem.
The bubble doesnt render late. I have the buble and i bash, i dont break free. Is it possible that break free is attached to the global CD?
Break-free is attached to the GCD.
The key distinction with bubble is that, unlike traditional hard CCs that disable you, getting bubbled does NOT reset your GCD.
Therefore your ransack spam is consuming all your GCDs, and any bash that is woven immediately after will not count as a break, since you're on cooldown.
If you get bubbled, stop casting any abilities immediately if you intend to break.
Yeah, I learned it the hard way.
I still think if break free is not attached to GCD it will be better. So many issues with all CCs will disappear.Because I can!0