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Ideal max item limit
olda90
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What would be in your opinion the ideal max item limit (for notable houses)?
Making some deep costumizations on the Psijic Villa i already reached 630 and didn’t furnished even half of it. I think that a house is not worth to be furnished if you cant create some deep changes that can make it significantly unique (and enjoyable to attend) from a standard version. Maybe the fact that having something unique in this game must always imply a monetary income makes this house tool (like the rest of the game) and players experience quite limited.
Edited by olda90 on November 12, 2018 12:06PM Making some deep costumizations on the Psijic Villa i already reached 630 and didn’t furnished even half of it. I think that a house is not worth to be furnished if you cant create some deep changes that can make it significantly unique (and enjoyable to attend) from a standard version. Maybe the fact that having something unique in this game must always imply a monetary income makes this house tool (like the rest of the game) and players experience quite limited.
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dcam86b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭I read in another thread about making homes split cells. So inside could be 700 limits and outside would be 700 limits as well. This idea would be awesome.8 -
Ahzek✭✭✭✭✭
✭dcam86b14_ESO wrote: »I read in another thread about making homes split cells. So inside could be 700 limits and outside would be 700 limits as well. This idea would be awesome.
Issue with that idea is that you would then have a loadingscreen everytime you were to go in- or outside.
In a perfect world they would give us an "remove item limit - use at your own risk" option so we could just decide if we want to make a good looking house or cater to some low end PC/consoles hardware.Edited by Ahzek on November 12, 2018 9:49PMJo'Khaljor6 -
kargen27✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭dcam86b14_ESO wrote: »I read in another thread about making homes split cells. So inside could be 700 limits and outside would be 700 limits as well. This idea would be awesome.
Issue with that idea is that you would then have a loadingscreen everytime you were to go in- or outside.
In a perfect world they would give us an "remove item limit - use at your own risk" option so we could just decide if we want to make a good looking house or cater to some low end PC/consoles hardware.
Yeah, that would be a good business decision. Let's treat people with high end gaming computers better than everyone else. Nothing can go wrong there.
And because of the way the game renders things you probably wouldn't get many more slots anyway even with a really nice computer.and then the parrot said, "must be the water mines green too."0 -
Unit117✭✭✭✭✭dcam86b14_ESO wrote: »I read in another thread about making homes split cells. So inside could be 700 limits and outside would be 700 limits as well. This idea would be awesome.
Issue with that idea is that you would then have a loadingscreen everytime you were to go in- or outside.
In a perfect world they would give us an "remove item limit - use at your own risk" option so we could just decide if we want to make a good looking house or cater to some low end PC/consoles hardware.
I would honestly be ok with loading screen if it meant I got to design how I want it too Look. 700 more items? Sign me up please..2 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Unless ZO$ completely revamps their housing system (yes, I heard the laughter) into something better I feel like the "inside/outside" slot additions are our best hope. Any time you have to "zone" into a different part of your house... that part should have its own item slot count. Make is so ZO$, make it so! Longer loading screens to get around your house? Okay. After all, it's not like we're not used to that in literally every other part of the game.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!1 -
R_K✭✭✭✭✭
✭One word: Minecraft.
I realize that ESO isn't Minecraft, but I would like to see the limits at least raised into the area of many thousands. And again, I don't care if they lock it behind the ESO+ Subscription -- in fact, I think that they should.
The limit as it stands is artificial only. The game can handle thousands of 3D elements on screen simultaneously without a problem even on less than ideal hardware.
Doubt me? Open up my Essential Housing Tools add-on and select all 700 items in any one of your large houses that are sitting idle because you can't do anything else with it anymore.
After EHT sets up the 3D models for all of the visuals (a process that, just once, takes a second or two), watch the rotating check marks -- there's one on every single one of the 700 items. I am refreshing each check mark's color gradient and transforming each one to rotate it 33 times per second (I could do 60 fps, but 33 felt smooth enough) and tell me if your game runs tangibly slower. It won't. So you could at least squeeze an additional 700 items out of the limit -- and I am telling, you could add even more than that.1 -
immozz01✭✭✭One word: Minecraft.
I realize that ESO isn't Minecraft, but I would like to see the limits at least raised into the area of many thousands. And again, I don't care if they lock it behind the ESO+ Subscription -- in fact, I think that they should.
The limit as it stands is artificial only. The game can handle thousands of 3D elements on screen simultaneously without a problem even on less than ideal hardware.
Doubt me? Open up my Essential Housing Tools add-on and select all 700 items in any one of your large houses that are sitting idle because you can't do anything else with it anymore.
After EHT sets up the 3D models for all of the visuals (a process that, just once, takes a second or two), watch the rotating check marks -- there's one on every single one of the 700 items. I am refreshing each check mark's color gradient and transforming each one to rotate it 33 times per second (I could do 60 fps, but 33 felt smooth enough) and tell me if your game runs tangibly slower. It won't. So you could at least squeeze an additional 700 items out of the limit -- and I am telling, you could add even more than that.
as much as I would like to have 2500 limit in some houses, I wonder more why zos doesn't seem to put much effort in it.
putting xk hours in making new dlc's to make us active for a week and ignoring existing content and not improving it seems to be a bad company move.
a successful mmo is one where people want to be online as much as they can. high activity levels open up the path for new and more players, high activity provides a psychological excuse to even spend (more) real money, that's what a company should aim for.
I do not have numbers, but I can assure you a huge % of gold being generated directly or indirectly goes into housing. gold is a global currency in the game, there Is no difference if its created in pvp or pve, zos should focus on putting effort In where most gold is going and improve that part in order to have a more than healthy and sustaining mmo
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Anotherone773✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The ideal limit would be to increase small by 50%, medium by 100%( double), large by 200%, and notable by 400%( 2800 items). Or just not have a limit. Let those be your starting limits and you buy space in lots of 25 slots( 50 for sub).
There is no reason why we cannot have more space, except they are going to sell it to us later. You have to ask yourself why dont all homes have a 700 limit if that is the ceiling? Why are they not cashing in on selling up upgrades for the smaller homes?
Cannot use the hardware limitation issues for an instance. The delve in the gold coast with the troll boss, that room alone has at least 500 placed objects. That is for a single room not an entire instance. That is only one of many examples i can think of in this game that have a large amount of objects in a small space. If the instance runs on my hardware then it should only be limited by my hardware. Housing is the one place i dont ever lag. Animations , shadows, and particles are what really tax a graphics card not static objects.
I notice they are trying to sell us bigger and bigger houses with more open space. They are also working on providing a variety of building elements so we can make our own buildings. That tells me that the selling of more slots is probably a year or less away. They will of course have managed after much hard work and dedication to allow increases in furniture limits( when really it was changing a few values in the code) and thus to pay for all the time devs spent on it we will have to pay 1k crowns per 100 slots per house.Edited by Anotherone773 on November 13, 2018 1:31PM0 -
Grind_Zilla✭✭just remove the limitations , so we can enjoy the game without any restrictions , tnx
"Respect your gamers Zenimax"0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If you think the developers are sitting around cackling over some arbitrary limit on housing items and how they enjoy making the population suffer are just wrong. The reason for the limit is purely related to technical limitations of the consoles and low end PCs. Its not just the number of items to be rendered and shadowed, it is also allowing up to 24 other players, and having duels that have to be accounted for. And, housing items that have animations are a big performance hit too.
Splitting the Interior and Exterior is really the only solution they have, other than limiting the hardware the game can be played on. Unless ZOS is going to throw out the idea that all players experience the same game no matter what platform.Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"3 -
R_K✭✭✭✭✭
✭One word: Minecraft.
I realize that ESO isn't Minecraft, but I would like to see the limits at least raised into the area of many thousands. And again, I don't care if they lock it behind the ESO+ Subscription -- in fact, I think that they should.
The limit as it stands is artificial only. The game can handle thousands of 3D elements on screen simultaneously without a problem even on less than ideal hardware.
Doubt me? Open up my Essential Housing Tools add-on and select all 700 items in any one of your large houses that are sitting idle because you can't do anything else with it anymore.
After EHT sets up the 3D models for all of the visuals (a process that, just once, takes a second or two), watch the rotating check marks -- there's one on every single one of the 700 items. I am refreshing each check mark's color gradient and transforming each one to rotate it 33 times per second (I could do 60 fps, but 33 felt smooth enough) and tell me if your game runs tangibly slower. It won't. So you could at least squeeze an additional 700 items out of the limit -- and I am telling, you could add even more than that.
as much as I would like to have 2500 limit in some houses, I wonder more why zos doesn't seem to put much effort in it.
putting xk hours in making new dlc's to make us active for a week and ignoring existing content and not improving it seems to be a bad company move.
a successful mmo is one where people want to be online as much as they can. high activity levels open up the path for new and more players, high activity provides a psychological excuse to even spend (more) real money, that's what a company should aim for.
I do not have numbers, but I can assure you a huge % of gold being generated directly or indirectly goes into housing. gold is a global currency in the game, there Is no difference if its created in pvp or pve, zos should focus on putting effort In where most gold is going and improve that part in order to have a more than healthy and sustaining mmo
Regarding the currency I totally agree; however, I must give credit to the developers as they have acknowledged and delivered on request after request that I have made for various API changes and additions to support Essential Housing Tools' features, so I don't think that they are sitting idle or purposely disregarding Housing from a development perspective.
I do think that the overall product road map could highlight Housing far more than it does today though -- it would make many players happy and it would yield even more revenue for ZeniMax.0 -
dtsharples✭✭✭✭✭I did manage to (almost) fill my Psijic Villa, but with the help of a friend.
We wanted to decorate it for a guild event, so we each put all of our larger / more expensive furniture in the house.
The only rooms we didn't fill were the small rooms that join to the 2 suites, which we closed off with a bookcase.
And actually created 2 new rooms in the main hall using Alinor walls, to add a Kitchen + Library. This helped to break up the huge expanse of space, which to begin with made it look very cold and empty.
Outside was split into 6 designated areas, which were entirely different, and this really helped to make the outer feel full, and fully used.
The issue as always though, is making the place look "Lived-In". The small items like bottles, glasses, knives, jewelry boxes etc, that add interest to each room.
I think given another 100 item slots I could make it work. But ofc 300 more would be lovely
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Anotherone773✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭If you think the developers are sitting around cackling over some arbitrary limit on housing items and how they enjoy making the population suffer are just wrong. The reason for the limit is purely related to technical limitations of the consoles and low end PCs. Its not just the number of items to be rendered and shadowed, it is also allowing up to 24 other players, and having duels that have to be accounted for. And, housing items that have animations are a big performance hit too.
Splitting the Interior and Exterior is really the only solution they have, other than limiting the hardware the game can be played on. Unless ZOS is going to throw out the idea that all players experience the same game no matter what platform.
I run a PC that was built in 2009 with a gtx 650 video card. I can do 700 items in a house easily at 70-80 FPS on medium settings. I have a laptop from 2014 with an i3 processor and 12 gb of shared ram and intel integrated graphics on a laptop. I can do a full 700 items on that pc on medium settings and get 40-50 FPS.
A GTX 650 only performs about 80% as well as the original Xbox One graphics. So no " outdated systems" are not the issue. People could simply learn to play on a potato. ZOS is missing a lot of opportunity because of the way they do things. They could make 3 or 4 times what they make now easily if they would L2MMO and care about a quality desirable product instead of a fast buck.
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Hotdog_23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I will link this thread again as I have before. I think it details the housing limit very well. I personally learned a lot from it. Hope it helps.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/420541/explaining-the-house-slot-problem-and-why-it-is-difficult-to-solve/p10 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@Anotherone773
I said low end PCs, yours is not a low end PC. And did you have 24 friends in the home? Did you do any dueling?Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"0 -
Anotherone773✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@Nestor My PC is low end and about equal to an original xbox one. Anything worse than my pc and you are getting into severely out of date. You cant expect to have good performance on a potato pc. And consoles, as it has been said are what is used as a guide for hardware limitations.
24 people is irrelevant. I stand in the bank with 30 people and 50 pets without much issue. The rendering is the same. regardless of if you are in your house or in an open world.0 -
Nestor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@Anotherone773
A bank is not a home, and since you have not tried to run dueling in a home with 600 or 700 items and 24 players total, you dont know what it will and wont do. Your just guessing.
And, just so you know, I was in the room with the devs last March and asked them to increase the limit and this was the answer given. They all said they wanted to, Crown Store or not, and they cant. As much as you, or I dont like the answer, it is what it is.Enjoy the game, life is what you really want to be worried about.
PakKat "Everything was going well, until I died"
Gary Gravestink "I am glad you died, I needed the help"1 -
Aurie✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Anotherone773
And, just so you know, I was in the room with the devs last March and asked them to increase the limit and this was the answer given. They all said they wanted to, Crown Store or not, and they cant. As much as you, or I dont like the answer, it is what it is.
My cynical side says that 'the devs' gave you the answer they wanted reported back on the forums. Which is not necessarily their real reason.
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WolfStar07✭✭✭dcam86b14_ESO wrote: »I read in another thread about making homes split cells. So inside could be 700 limits and outside would be 700 limits as well. This idea would be awesome.
What about the homes that don't have a separate interior and exterior? How would you propose they solve that problem? Erstwhile Sanctuary, Colossal Aldmeri Grotto, Earthtear Cavern, Pariah's Pinnacle, are all one zone. It would be stupid to put a separate arbitrary cell somewhere in there since you wouldn't have the same visual cue of when you're entering another zone.0 -
Anotherone773✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@Nestor
A bank or a home doesnt make a bloody difference. Your PC does the same amount of work to render the environment. It isnt like it magically takes more resources to render a home than it does any other area. No im not just guessing. I know a good amount about both computers and games since I went to school to work on PCs and ive been modding my own games since the early 2000s.
The devs are telling you what they want you to believe. There are hundreds of instances in this game in which i can point out massive amounts of local objects and dozens of people some in combat and my pc handles it ok. And yest a bunch of people in a bank is accurate. You have a bunch of animations going the only thing your missing is particle effects from abilities.
But you keep drinking that company koolaid.
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gtnorrell✭✭The game would be just fine handling extra effects if they would cut down on some of the excess scenery they show outside of the furnishable area. Take Linchal Grand Manor for instance, the house already allows you 700 slots to do with as you please without any rendering issues. But, if you travel up onto the ramparts, you can quickly see where all of the furnishing slots have gone. I saw a video where someone had traversed the housing wall and ran around outside the walls. The ENTIRE city of Kvatch is fully furnished in the Linchal Grand Manor instance. Every tree, the maze, the arena, every building, ALL OF IT! And the sad part is you cannot even see it from the ramparts, because Kvatch has its own wall that blocks it all from view. If they eliminated that area you have another 700 slots right there. But, I am still a firm believer that the system can handle more slots as it is. The game does not lag out in other, much larger instances. Why would it lag out in a small housing instance with some extra slots? If ZOS would finally start selling us slots (much as they did the storage) on the crown store I know that me, as well as tons of others, would be lining up to throw them our fistfulls of cash. PLEASE ZOS, TAKE OUR MONEY ALREADY! WE ARE DYING HERE!"I was lurking behind a Dark Anchor chain link, preparing to terrify an approaching Soul Shriven by suddenly knocking her down and sneering, "No match at all," when I suddenly felt a strange tingling all over, from my horns down to my toes. I grew dizzy as the plane spun around me, nearly fell into a pool of blue plasm, and then suddenly felt myself hurled into an endless black void." -Excerpt from I was Summoned by a Mortal by Kynval Zzedenkathik of Clan Deathbringer1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't think it needs more slots, just more giant items that are readily available. And more items that already come with clutter, like some of the bookshelves.
There is no reason for example that they can't make a long horizontal bookstack that when clicked has all the text from a collection of stories. This way something that might take 10 spaces now takes 1.
There should be large banquet tables with a ton of food and drinks and other miscellaneous items attached to it. A nice big table can easily take up like 20 slots on its own in a big house.
Most large items are extremely expensive and very showy, like statues, rather than something intended to be a cheap way to make a space look lived in for the bigger homes. And this is a shame because it means item limits get hit too hard for simple things.Edited by spartaxoxo on November 16, 2018 4:24AM3 -
gtnorrell✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I don't think it needs more slots, just more giant items that are readily available. And more items that already come with clutter, like some of the bookshelves.
There is no reason for example that they can't make a long horizontal bookstack that when clicked has all the text from a collection of stories. This way something that might take 10 spaces now takes 1.
There should be large banquet tables with a ton of food and drinks and other miscellaneous items attached to it. A nice big table can easily take up like 20 slots on its own in a big house.
Most large items are extremely expensive and very showy, like statues, rather than something intended to be a cheap way to make a space look lived in for the bigger homes. And this is a shame because it means item limits get hit too hard for simple things.
What if you took that idea a step further, and made it possible to create item setups. Like have a table that is allowed say 7 items to be placed on it, and then locked so that it becomes one item. The bigger the table the bigger the max item limit it has. The same could be done with bookshelves and the like so that you can have a custom collection on each shelve.
"I was lurking behind a Dark Anchor chain link, preparing to terrify an approaching Soul Shriven by suddenly knocking her down and sneering, "No match at all," when I suddenly felt a strange tingling all over, from my horns down to my toes. I grew dizzy as the plane spun around me, nearly fell into a pool of blue plasm, and then suddenly felt myself hurled into an endless black void." -Excerpt from I was Summoned by a Mortal by Kynval Zzedenkathik of Clan Deathbringer2 -
Aurie✭✭✭✭✭
✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I don't think it needs more slots, just more giant items that are readily available. And more items that already come with clutter, like some of the bookshelves.
There is no reason for example that they can't make a long horizontal bookstack that when clicked has all the text from a collection of stories. This way something that might take 10 spaces now takes 1.
There should be large banquet tables with a ton of food and drinks and other miscellaneous items attached to it. A nice big table can easily take up like 20 slots on its own in a big house.
Most large items are extremely expensive and very showy, like statues, rather than something intended to be a cheap way to make a space look lived in for the bigger homes. And this is a shame because it means item limits get hit too hard for simple things.
What if you took that idea a step further, and made it possible to create item setups. Like have a table that is allowed say 7 items to be placed on it, and then locked so that it becomes one item. The bigger the table the bigger the max item limit it has. The same could be done with bookshelves and the like so that you can have a custom collection on each shelve.
That would be amazing if it can be done. So much better to be able to personalise your own laden tables and bookshelves etc, rather than have no choice except for what @ZO$ decide to create.1 -
immozz01✭✭✭tech question, how much % difference would it make if normal setting is 4 visitors (for all houses) and if you want to allow more, you need to manually change setting, therefor at own "risk"?0