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Whirlwind
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Zeromaz✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »This is a nerf, I use it and enjoy it. And to use this it can be simply and much fun but you still need to get someone to execute range. Plus magica users have a delayed execute on the sorc and a very strong ranged execute via the magblade. This execute is somewhat ranged plus aoe and this is very nice to have as a stam character. Keep this skill as is.
Plus 5m is very small. Other executes are single target but this does allows the animation to target your opponent. While this is aoe is more difficult to focus on a target you need to position yourself. 5m will not work in open world pvp.
U mad bro ? Meele build works in meele distance so what does it change for them that steel tornado is meele ? The answer is nothing. Before You're not in meele You wont apply much of the damage anyway as a meele build so... Both sorc and magsorc executes are avoidable (especially magblade one) and single target plus requires certain amount of health on enemy to fire where steel tornado is getting more and more dmg starting from 99% of someones health there is no execute range so it's much easier to brainlesly spam it.
Targeting is the easiest with steel tornado and it's the biggest issue of it since You dont have to face oponent You dont need to have him on Your sight , You can just spam steel tornado at any position You want and if enemy is in range You'll hit him even through cloak , if he's behind You , if he's roll dodging , hiding inside group or even through some obstacles. These are things that users of those "OP" range executes can only dream of.
when did it become "your personal campaign" to teach us how to play and with what style and how we play in eso?
from reading the advertisements about eso play style it is often quoted that you can "play as you want"
yet here we see you directly targetting a type of (as you call it) "mindless" and "spam"
please, dont get me wrong on this, but freedom in this game is one of the biggest reasons for staying in eso.
the freedom to "do what we want to" in eso is what is keeping alot of players here, instead of being Forced into a playstyle.
It is mindless and lazy. ZOS just wants the crown store to be successful. They don’t give a *** about your steel tornado1 -
sly007✭✭✭✭steel tornado's damage can be blocked. The damage is nothing compared to single target executes that critical strike for double that of steel tornado.0 -
BuddyAces✭✭✭✭✭
✭Just wanted to point out that if you're low enough on health where a couple spin2wins finishes you off, so will just about every other skill in the game.
You're just mad because it's the last attack on your death recap. If every last attack on that recap was from a healing staff light attack, you'd be asking for that to be nerfed. If it's not one thing today, it's something else tomorrow.They nerfed magsorcs so hard stamsorcs felt it,lol - Somber97866
I'm blown away by the utter stupidity I see here on the daily. - Wrekkedd3 -
Stigant✭✭✭✭History:
We had Wrecking Blow with CC and empower for any next attack vs. Dizzying Swing with CC and maim... devs realized the 2 were not balanced and took the CC off of WB... good call in my opinion.
Present:
On a weapon line that has a passive giving a small execute bonus to all of its abilities,
We have PBAoE udodeable execute scaling from 99% HP down, with 9m range.
Vs.
PBAoE melee ability with slightly reduced cost, which noone cares about and granting Major Endurance, which every stambuild gets elsewhere (mainly from potions).
Does it seem balanced? Not by a long shot, so I tend to agree with OP that some rework should be done.
His suggestion of moving the execute part to the 5m range morph would make it more interesting while the 9m morph would still be interesting for it's range, while keeping it's undodgeability and small execute functionality from the DW passive.
I personaly would have hard time picking amongst the two, now I just take Steel Tornado without even considering the other morph.Edited by Stigant on November 15, 2018 4:10PM4 -
Stigant✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »Hurricane of sorc does ALOT more damage and alot Larger Area.
first remove Hurricane, is much more realistic.
I'm failing to understand how is this a valid argument against balancing Whrilwind morphs against each other, please explain.5 -
Stigant✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »Colecovision wrote: »Why didn't you put "nerf steel tornado" in the title? Can we leave bait and switch to the marketing team?
the above quote ^
is the answer to your question @Stigant
Yeah someone decided to take the thread off track...
but the Original Post has some value in it and should not be disregarded by trolls. Which brings me back to my previous post. What has Hurricane to do with Whrillwind morphs being severely disbalanced against each other? One outperforming the other to a point that people don't even feel tempted to at least consider it as an option.Edited by Stigant on November 15, 2018 5:22PM2 -
Katahdin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Change whirlwind to make it better but leave steel tornado aloneBeta tester November 20130 -
Rohaus✭✭✭✭✭I would be using reverse slice if it wasn't for NB's. Reverse slice hits so much harder...YouTube channel Rohaus Lives!
Daggerfall Covenant
VR16 DragonKnight0 -
Stigant✭✭✭✭I can't make sense of any of your last 3 posts @dwemer_paleologist , except the feeling that you somehow have a problem with a a Sorc skill, which seems unrelated to this topic that is about a DW skill and it's morphs and disbalance between the two, one severely outperforming the other.
Btw I haven't edited anything, just quoted.
Edit: I don't see the "hidden nerf request" part... seems a little paranoid to me.Edited by Stigant on November 15, 2018 6:32PM2 -
Brutusmax1mus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ash_In_My_Sujamma wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »another thread asking for more nerfs.
i trust the devs, i think they know what their doing without the need for constant spamming nerf threads.
please End the Nerf request threads.
This is simply a rework idea not a nerf. Also I would like to know If you say the same when a 48 meter draining shot that applies a bleed hits you and you can't break free in time cause there is a delay in the stun animation.
It's most certainly a nerf though.. come on...1 -
ku5h✭✭✭✭✭
✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »Hurricane of sorc does ALOT more damage and alot Larger Area.
first remove Hurricane, is much more realistic.
You managed to turn discussion about stamina weapon skill into nerf sorc tread.....gj you get the cake.
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Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »Hurricane of sorc does ALOT more damage and alot Larger Area.
first remove Hurricane, is much more realistic.
And how the area is larger? It starts from 5m and expands to 9m, while steel tornado is 9m fixed.Because I can!1 -
Bashev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »Hurricane of sorc does ALOT more damage and alot Larger Area.
first remove Hurricane, is much more realistic.
And how the area is larger? It starts from 5m and expands to 9m, while steel tornado is 9m fixed.
the area size is a constant red circle that will immediately pull all invisible and all stealthed players out into the open.
this is completely unfair for those of us playing a stealth playstyle.
where as the steel whirlwind is only for a few seconds and has to be repeatedly cast over and over depleteing your stamina Very quickly.
it is unfair to request a nerf to one skill without nerfing the other one as well.
I dont want to nerf the range of steel tornado. So where is the problem?
Also one of the skills is Dot + utility while the other is direct damage. It is not fair to compare themBecause I can!3 -
Conduit0✭✭✭✭✭
✭Switching the bonuses on the two morphs won't fix a thing, Steel Tornado isn't the default choice because of the range, its the execute that matters, without the execute the damage is so low that it isn't even worth bothering with. So if all you do is switch the execute to whirling blades and the stam regen to steel tornado, everyone will just use whirling blades instead, since the extra range is pointless on an ability that does abysmal damage for the cost. If your goal is to balance the two morphs what you need to do is give whirling blades something useful, like maybe something dual wield is currently lacking.
If your goal is to simply nerf steel tornado, then I suggest you ask for other more powerful and equally mindless PBAOEs(like hurricane) be nerfed first before complaining about steel tornado.2 -
Lightspeedflashb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Switching the bonuses on the two morphs won't fix a thing, Steel Tornado isn't the default choice because of the range, its the execute that matters, without the execute the damage is so low that it isn't even worth bothering with. So if all you do is switch the execute to whirling blades and the stam regen to steel tornado, everyone will just use whirling blades instead, since the extra range is pointless on an ability that does abysmal damage for the cost. If your goal is to balance the two morphs what you need to do is give whirling blades something useful, like maybe something dual wield is currently lacking.
If your goal is to simply nerf steel tornado, then I suggest you ask for other more powerful and equally mindless PBAOEs(like hurricane) be nerfed first before complaining about steel tornado.
The execute is part of the base skill and both morphs. The point of this thread is to remove that from the base and steel tornado. Then the only one that would have the in-skill execute (dual wield passives would still apply to both morphs) would be the 78 meter area whirlwind, not the 254 meter area steel tornado, if you don't see how this would make the skill choice more interesting, your eyes need to be checked.
Also, stop comparing ST, a single hit skill to a dot like hurricane. They are completely different in their use.As a PVE stam dps , I would say no .
What Stam dps has steel tornado on their bar thesr days? What does your bar look like?Edited by Lightspeedflashb14_ESO on November 16, 2018 7:46AM2 -
Zeromaz✭✭✭✭Its sad that every single stam sorc runs the same stuff. Its always dawnbreaker, hurricane, steel tornado, w/ axes. Its effective, but it shouldn’t be so powerful that it overshadows other types of play.0
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Ender1310✭✭✭✭Steel Tornado OP with zero skill to use. The execute is too much. Always has been. I like this suggestion and it is in line with other morphs. Reduced area for an execute. Nice.1 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭dwemer_paleologist wrote: »dwemer_paleologist wrote: »Hurricane of sorc does ALOT more damage and alot Larger Area.
first remove Hurricane, is much more realistic.
And how the area is larger? It starts from 5m and expands to 9m, while steel tornado is 9m fixed.
the area size is a constant red circle that will immediately pull all invisible and all stealthed players out into the open.
this is completely unfair for those of us playing a stealth playstyle.
where as the steel whirlwind is only for a few seconds and has to be repeatedly cast over and over depleteing your stamina Very quickly.
it is unfair to request a nerf to one skill without nerfing the other one as well.
What is unfair is how stealth playstyle work in this game. Hurrincane is problematic only last 5 seconds when it reaches 9 meters range for first 10 seconds it's 5-7 meters which is not an issue for any competitive stamblade. If You suck too much to place shade somwhere then dodge away from it bait sorc with hurricane there then telepoert back to shade it's problem on Your side not on the side of the game balance. Even sorcs with hurricane can struggle to deal with dodging and cloaking stamblade. You want every even smallest counter to stealth playstyle to be gone despite that even current counters are weak dont You ?Edited by Juhasow on November 17, 2018 6:22AM1 -
Zekka✭✭✭✭Its sad that every single stam sorc runs the same stuff. Its always dawnbreaker, hurricane, steel tornado, w/ axes. Its effective, but it shouldn’t be so powerful that it overshadows other types of play.
they're running that build because it's either that or a dizzy swing build, that's what happens when a class has a total of one class damage skill...1 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭steel tornado's damage can be blocked. The damage is nothing compared to single target executes that critical strike for double that of steel tornado.
Other executes can be dodged , cloacked , avoided by LoS and requires targeting enemy You want to execute plus many times also requires that enemie to be at certain health percentage. Steel tornado doesnt. It may deal less dmg on execute range then other executes but much more outside of it thus can be brainlesly spammed.1
