Any NB tanks out there or all Wardens/DKs?? (pve)

actosh · November 2018

Littlebluelizard wrote: »

@actosh can help you with insights in terms of build and etc.

For me, DK and Warden are straight out better than NB tanking in PvE. And that doesn't change by any stretch of the imagination. But that doesn't mean you can't tank with NB, and do I mean every content, even HM. Playing DK will be more easy and better utility for sure, but doesn't mean you have to.

@Littlebluelizard Sure, but will need some time to write it down. so it may be posted tommorrow.

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

Psyonico wrote: »

I think only NBs can do this (no Ayleid, no Toughness)

Not sure why I have so much more magic than stamina, running Maw, Skoria, Green Pact, and Plague Doctor

Why? Also you get more HP with Warrior Poet instead of GP. I still dont see why you would run that in PvE (this thread is about PvE). Even in PvP you will be terrible with only 9k stamina to block/breakfree/dodge. Enjoy being a DPS dummy.
I can get 70k in PvP with better magicka/stamina pools and only 30 skill-points into Health and earthgore. Your resistances are not that great as well. You should tweak your build.

dovakiin5574 · November 2018

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

I shelved my NB tank. I would love to see these builds that are still playable.
I use a Warden tank now and it’s a lot of fun.

Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content:

Race: Argonian

Mundus: The Lord or Atronach

Skillpoints: 30 Health. 9 Magicka, 25 Stamina

Gear and Skills for trials:
7 Heavy for better Major Ward/Resolve uptime

Switch Earthgore with Lord Warden or Thurvokun if you like

Switch Ebony with Plague Doc if you want more HP

Switch Backbar S&B with Ice or Lightning Staff infused Crusher Enchant. (Switch Echoing Vigor with Elemental Wall if you do so, you can switch Silver Leash with Crushing Shock in trials as well)

Switch Alkosh with Powerful Assault if you're the Off-Tank.

Wear Swarm Mother if tanking Dungeons.

Big pieces and Shields are Tri-Stat Enchant, small pieces are Health Enchant

Jewelry: 3x Shield-Play Enchants.

Swords are Crusher and Weakening Backbar

Effi. Purge is flex spot. I run either Purge, Ring of Perservation, Balance, Overflowing Altar (or Sap Essence / Time Freeze in Dungeons)

You can use Siphoning Strikes on Frontbar for more Magicka %

CP (Wolfhunter):

RED:
37 Quick Recovery

10 Heavy Armor

48 Thick Skinned

37 Hardy

37 Ele Defender

81 Ironclad

10 Spellshield

BLUE:
23 Physical Weapon Expert

37 Master-at-Arms

100 Elfborn

100 Blessed

GREEN:
81 Shadow Ward

28 Tumbling

32 Arcanist

43 Healthy

21 Bashing Focus

18 Sprinter

37 Warlord

You might want to adjust your CP for each trial individually. This is my "basic" CP.

Strats:
Basically have your Buffs up all the time and use Dark Cloak for sealf heals for survivability (You will get around 4k healing ticks/ 7k healing crit ticks with this setup). Heavy Attacks, Meditate and Tripots for sustain.

These will be you frontbar stats with Earthgore, The Lord Mundus, Ebon and Alkosh (only food buffed):

Buffed:

jypcy wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Oops, apologies— l2r issue on my part In that case, to make the nb’s 2nd scenario comparable to the dk, she shouldn’t need to taunt the small melee adds, meaning a stam cost equal to the dk’s with a lower magicka cost, or the dk should taunt the smaller adds as well, meaning the stam cost equal to the nb’s with a much higher mag cost. I don’t disagree that on demand immobilization is a pain point for tankblades, but I think your example exaggerates it a bit.

DK doesnt need to taunt the smaller ads since talons applies minor maim and roots them at one spot making it easier for the DDs. Meanwhile NBs doesnt have that, leaving the ads to move around freely if not taunted.

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

Wat?

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Also the "elitist" guild leaders want DKs because of their Engulfing Flames skill, not because "they can do it slightly better". Chains and roots arent really needed in trials anyway. But we werent even talking about Engulfing, so whatever...

There is a difference between "Elite" and "Intolerant to new ideas that are outside your safe space"

DoobZ69 · November 2018

There's a bit of a misconception here that I think needs to be cleared up.
When something is better or more capable or less disadvantaged it doesn't mean it only makes a difference when the push comes to shove. It means that at all times. You don't feel it when everything dies in half a second, no. But you do when you're doing the content for the first time and just learning how it works. You do when the difficulty level gets higher and higher. Its not just the 1% of content that is affected if the class performance is 1% better. All the content is affected by a 1% improvement. The players that have the easier time are the most likely to succeed and be less frustrated. These are the ones with the best class/race/skill combinations. Ie. your build.

So, keeping that in mind for this discussion in terms of tanking balance, the DK has all the tanking tools and every single one of those tools is superior in comparison to the tanking tools that are available to the other classes, in my opinion and I am happy to try and argue that if required, including Taunt. Ignoring specific races and gear and assuming same player skill, the one rolling a DK has an advantage at all times over someone who is not a DK.

Therefore, it isn't a matter of "the DK only has an advantage in 1% of the content", which in itself a terrible stance to get behind, its a matter of "they are always 1% less disadvantaged". Well balancing isn't perfect so there will always be someone 1% ahead, you may argue and I would agree with that, but this is not a 1% advantage, its more like a 50% advantage at the worst of times and a constant 25% advantage when not in the easiest of content. Again, I really don't have a way of proving that except to point out that most tanks are DK and I often get surprised comments "I didn't know Sorc class could tank". I also tank on both classes and see the difference. I can point to the numbers on paper when comparing skills and passives and tool design.

Here's my personal rankings for class tanking and the gradient is not flat. I've added effectiveness percentages for comparison:
1. DK 100%
2. Warden 85%
3. Sorcerer 70%
4. NB/Templar 60%

Once more it doesn't mean that rank 6 can't tank. Any one of those can tank even with a staff build. But it does mean that "play how you want" is not the reality in ESO, as they are clearly unbalanced, either because A ) By intentional design or B ) By unintentional design. If the case is B ) then a correction is required and all players should expect this. If the case is A ) then the "play how you want" is a misleading concept because there is no statement available anywhere during the character creation to state this role mis-balance design. And if case A ) is in effect now then there is still nothing like that for the people who are making their first character today and I am here to inform them that whether the case is A ) or B ) they are making a mistake if they are serious about their character.

Once again if you care about your character and you want to tank - right now you should only be rolling an Argonian DK. The skills and passives are designed for tanking in a far superior manner when compared to the other classes. To what gradient is arguable but the fact that it is superior is not. And that's the bottom line. Churr

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

I shelved my NB tank. I would love to see these builds that are still playable.
I use a Warden tank now and it’s a lot of fun.

Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content:

Race: Argonian

Mundus: The Lord or Atronach

Skillpoints: 30 Health. 9 Magicka, 25 Stamina

Gear and Skills for trials:
7 Heavy for better Major Ward/Resolve uptime

Switch Earthgore with Lord Warden or Thurvokun if you like

Switch Ebony with Plague Doc if you want more HP

Switch Backbar S&B with Ice or Lightning Staff infused Crusher Enchant. (Switch Echoing Vigor with Elemental Wall if you do so, you can switch Silver Leash with Crushing Shock in trials as well)

Switch Alkosh with Powerful Assault if you're the Off-Tank.

Wear Swarm Mother if tanking Dungeons.

Big pieces and Shields are Tri-Stat Enchant, small pieces are Health Enchant

Jewelry: 3x Shield-Play Enchants.

Swords are Crusher and Weakening Backbar

Effi. Purge is flex spot. I run either Purge, Ring of Perservation, Balance, Overflowing Altar (or Sap Essence / Time Freeze in Dungeons)

You can use Siphoning Strikes on Frontbar for more Magicka %

CP (Wolfhunter):

RED:
37 Quick Recovery

10 Heavy Armor

48 Thick Skinned

37 Hardy

37 Ele Defender

81 Ironclad

10 Spellshield

BLUE:
23 Physical Weapon Expert

37 Master-at-Arms

100 Elfborn

100 Blessed

GREEN:
81 Shadow Ward

28 Tumbling

32 Arcanist

43 Healthy

21 Bashing Focus

18 Sprinter

37 Warlord

You might want to adjust your CP for each trial individually. This is my "basic" CP.

Strats:
Basically have your Buffs up all the time and use Dark Cloak for sealf heals for survivability (You will get around 4k healing ticks/ 7k healing crit ticks with this setup). Heavy Attacks, Meditate and Tripots for sustain.

These will be you frontbar stats with Earthgore, The Lord Mundus, Ebon and Alkosh (only food buffed):

Buffed:

jypcy wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Oops, apologies— l2r issue on my part In that case, to make the nb’s 2nd scenario comparable to the dk, she shouldn’t need to taunt the small melee adds, meaning a stam cost equal to the dk’s with a lower magicka cost, or the dk should taunt the smaller adds as well, meaning the stam cost equal to the nb’s with a much higher mag cost. I don’t disagree that on demand immobilization is a pain point for tankblades, but I think your example exaggerates it a bit.

DK doesnt need to taunt the smaller ads since talons applies minor maim and roots them at one spot making it easier for the DDs. Meanwhile NBs doesnt have that, leaving the ads to move around freely if not taunted.

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

Wat?

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Also the "elitist" guild leaders want DKs because of their Engulfing Flames skill, not because "they can do it slightly better". Chains and roots arent really needed in trials anyway. But we werent even talking about Engulfing, so whatever...

There is a difference between "Elite" and "Intolerant to new ideas that are outside your safe space"

You do you my dude, if people are actually letting you use caltrops in trials and 100 points into mighty. Sure go ahead. However I will still not listen to anything you say because you clearly dont know how tanking works.

dovakiin5574 · November 2018

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

I shelved my NB tank. I would love to see these builds that are still playable.
I use a Warden tank now and it’s a lot of fun.

Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content:

Race: Argonian

Mundus: The Lord or Atronach

Skillpoints: 30 Health. 9 Magicka, 25 Stamina

Gear and Skills for trials:
7 Heavy for better Major Ward/Resolve uptime

Switch Earthgore with Lord Warden or Thurvokun if you like

Switch Ebony with Plague Doc if you want more HP

Switch Backbar S&B with Ice or Lightning Staff infused Crusher Enchant. (Switch Echoing Vigor with Elemental Wall if you do so, you can switch Silver Leash with Crushing Shock in trials as well)

Switch Alkosh with Powerful Assault if you're the Off-Tank.

Wear Swarm Mother if tanking Dungeons.

Big pieces and Shields are Tri-Stat Enchant, small pieces are Health Enchant

Jewelry: 3x Shield-Play Enchants.

Swords are Crusher and Weakening Backbar

Effi. Purge is flex spot. I run either Purge, Ring of Perservation, Balance, Overflowing Altar (or Sap Essence / Time Freeze in Dungeons)

You can use Siphoning Strikes on Frontbar for more Magicka %

CP (Wolfhunter):

RED:
37 Quick Recovery

10 Heavy Armor

48 Thick Skinned

37 Hardy

37 Ele Defender

81 Ironclad

10 Spellshield

BLUE:
23 Physical Weapon Expert

37 Master-at-Arms

100 Elfborn

100 Blessed

GREEN:
81 Shadow Ward

28 Tumbling

32 Arcanist

43 Healthy

21 Bashing Focus

18 Sprinter

37 Warlord

You might want to adjust your CP for each trial individually. This is my "basic" CP.

Strats:
Basically have your Buffs up all the time and use Dark Cloak for sealf heals for survivability (You will get around 4k healing ticks/ 7k healing crit ticks with this setup). Heavy Attacks, Meditate and Tripots for sustain.

These will be you frontbar stats with Earthgore, The Lord Mundus, Ebon and Alkosh (only food buffed):

Buffed:

jypcy wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Oops, apologies— l2r issue on my part In that case, to make the nb’s 2nd scenario comparable to the dk, she shouldn’t need to taunt the small melee adds, meaning a stam cost equal to the dk’s with a lower magicka cost, or the dk should taunt the smaller adds as well, meaning the stam cost equal to the nb’s with a much higher mag cost. I don’t disagree that on demand immobilization is a pain point for tankblades, but I think your example exaggerates it a bit.

DK doesnt need to taunt the smaller ads since talons applies minor maim and roots them at one spot making it easier for the DDs. Meanwhile NBs doesnt have that, leaving the ads to move around freely if not taunted.

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

Wat?

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Also the "elitist" guild leaders want DKs because of their Engulfing Flames skill, not because "they can do it slightly better". Chains and roots arent really needed in trials anyway. But we werent even talking about Engulfing, so whatever...

There is a difference between "Elite" and "Intolerant to new ideas that are outside your safe space"

You do you my dude, if people are actually letting you use caltrops in trials and 100 points into mighty. Sure go ahead. However I will still not listen to anything you say because you clearly dont know how tanking works.

Ok, I never said I used caltrops OR put 100 into Mighty at all that was another commenter so please get your facts straight. I DID say you can tank with NB or any other class for that matter with only a SLIGHT loss

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

I shelved my NB tank. I would love to see these builds that are still playable.
I use a Warden tank now and it’s a lot of fun.

Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content:

Race: Argonian

Mundus: The Lord or Atronach

Skillpoints: 30 Health. 9 Magicka, 25 Stamina

Gear and Skills for trials:
7 Heavy for better Major Ward/Resolve uptime

Switch Earthgore with Lord Warden or Thurvokun if you like

Switch Ebony with Plague Doc if you want more HP

Switch Backbar S&B with Ice or Lightning Staff infused Crusher Enchant. (Switch Echoing Vigor with Elemental Wall if you do so, you can switch Silver Leash with Crushing Shock in trials as well)

Switch Alkosh with Powerful Assault if you're the Off-Tank.

Wear Swarm Mother if tanking Dungeons.

Big pieces and Shields are Tri-Stat Enchant, small pieces are Health Enchant

Jewelry: 3x Shield-Play Enchants.

Swords are Crusher and Weakening Backbar

Effi. Purge is flex spot. I run either Purge, Ring of Perservation, Balance, Overflowing Altar (or Sap Essence / Time Freeze in Dungeons)

You can use Siphoning Strikes on Frontbar for more Magicka %

CP (Wolfhunter):

RED:
37 Quick Recovery

10 Heavy Armor

48 Thick Skinned

37 Hardy

37 Ele Defender

81 Ironclad

10 Spellshield

BLUE:
23 Physical Weapon Expert

37 Master-at-Arms

100 Elfborn

100 Blessed

GREEN:
81 Shadow Ward

28 Tumbling

32 Arcanist

43 Healthy

21 Bashing Focus

18 Sprinter

37 Warlord

You might want to adjust your CP for each trial individually. This is my "basic" CP.

Strats:
Basically have your Buffs up all the time and use Dark Cloak for sealf heals for survivability (You will get around 4k healing ticks/ 7k healing crit ticks with this setup). Heavy Attacks, Meditate and Tripots for sustain.

These will be you frontbar stats with Earthgore, The Lord Mundus, Ebon and Alkosh (only food buffed):

Buffed:

jypcy wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Oops, apologies— l2r issue on my part In that case, to make the nb’s 2nd scenario comparable to the dk, she shouldn’t need to taunt the small melee adds, meaning a stam cost equal to the dk’s with a lower magicka cost, or the dk should taunt the smaller adds as well, meaning the stam cost equal to the nb’s with a much higher mag cost. I don’t disagree that on demand immobilization is a pain point for tankblades, but I think your example exaggerates it a bit.

DK doesnt need to taunt the smaller ads since talons applies minor maim and roots them at one spot making it easier for the DDs. Meanwhile NBs doesnt have that, leaving the ads to move around freely if not taunted.

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

Wat?

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Also the "elitist" guild leaders want DKs because of their Engulfing Flames skill, not because "they can do it slightly better". Chains and roots arent really needed in trials anyway. But we werent even talking about Engulfing, so whatever...

There is a difference between "Elite" and "Intolerant to new ideas that are outside your safe space"

You do you my dude, if people are actually letting you use caltrops in trials and 100 points into mighty. Sure go ahead. However I will still not listen to anything you say because you clearly dont know how tanking works.

Ok, I never said I used caltrops OR put 100 into Mighty at all that was another commenter so please get your facts straight. I DID say you can tank with NB or any other class for that matter with only a SLIGHT loss

They all mean that for hm mode most viable and comfortable tank for group is argonian dk sitting in permablock and restoring his stam with class passives and all other resources with potions and healer support.
And this is true.
But that content is only done by small% of players (as tanks) and for all others that is all arguable simply because majority of people i know are not permablocking and are not drinking potions every 20 seconds, so difference between dk and others is not so big and they are happy with every vet dlc which was run without wipes.

Joxer61 · November 2018

"Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content"

Would have been better without "meta"...…"Heres a build that will get you through vet content"
See how that instantly is helpful?

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

Joxer61 wrote: »

"Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content"

Would have been better without "meta"...…"Heres a build that will get you through vet content"
See how that instantly is helpful?

The gear used on the build is meta. Alkosh/Ebon/Torugs/Lord Warden/Thurvokun/Earthgore are all meta sets for end game/sets that are wanted in trials to be run by tanks.
You also get the gear from vet DLC dungeons or MoL trial. Vet for gold jewelry. So its not *that easy* to obtain.
If you use these sets though most people wont question you as tank in trials. However if you want to have a non meta approach you can change your gear however you want to. Thats why I used "meta".

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

I shelved my NB tank. I would love to see these builds that are still playable.
I use a Warden tank now and it’s a lot of fun.

Heres a meta build that will get you through vet content:

Race: Argonian

Mundus: The Lord or Atronach

Skillpoints: 30 Health. 9 Magicka, 25 Stamina

Gear and Skills for trials:
7 Heavy for better Major Ward/Resolve uptime

Switch Earthgore with Lord Warden or Thurvokun if you like

Switch Ebony with Plague Doc if you want more HP

Switch Backbar S&B with Ice or Lightning Staff infused Crusher Enchant. (Switch Echoing Vigor with Elemental Wall if you do so, you can switch Silver Leash with Crushing Shock in trials as well)

Switch Alkosh with Powerful Assault if you're the Off-Tank.

Wear Swarm Mother if tanking Dungeons.

Big pieces and Shields are Tri-Stat Enchant, small pieces are Health Enchant

Jewelry: 3x Shield-Play Enchants.

Swords are Crusher and Weakening Backbar

Effi. Purge is flex spot. I run either Purge, Ring of Perservation, Balance, Overflowing Altar (or Sap Essence / Time Freeze in Dungeons)

You can use Siphoning Strikes on Frontbar for more Magicka %

CP (Wolfhunter):

RED:
37 Quick Recovery

10 Heavy Armor

48 Thick Skinned

37 Hardy

37 Ele Defender

81 Ironclad

10 Spellshield

BLUE:
23 Physical Weapon Expert

37 Master-at-Arms

100 Elfborn

100 Blessed

GREEN:
81 Shadow Ward

28 Tumbling

32 Arcanist

43 Healthy

21 Bashing Focus

18 Sprinter

37 Warlord

You might want to adjust your CP for each trial individually. This is my "basic" CP.

Strats:
Basically have your Buffs up all the time and use Dark Cloak for sealf heals for survivability (You will get around 4k healing ticks/ 7k healing crit ticks with this setup). Heavy Attacks, Meditate and Tripots for sustain.

These will be you frontbar stats with Earthgore, The Lord Mundus, Ebon and Alkosh (only food buffed):

Buffed:

jypcy wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Oops, apologies— l2r issue on my part In that case, to make the nb’s 2nd scenario comparable to the dk, she shouldn’t need to taunt the small melee adds, meaning a stam cost equal to the dk’s with a lower magicka cost, or the dk should taunt the smaller adds as well, meaning the stam cost equal to the nb’s with a much higher mag cost. I don’t disagree that on demand immobilization is a pain point for tankblades, but I think your example exaggerates it a bit.

DK doesnt need to taunt the smaller ads since talons applies minor maim and roots them at one spot making it easier for the DDs. Meanwhile NBs doesnt have that, leaving the ads to move around freely if not taunted.

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

jypcy wrote: »

-The strategies used by the DK and by the NB aren’t entirely comparable. Chains and leash apply soft taunts, so often you won’t need to immediately apply an actual taunt after using one of these skills. Yet, the nb does and the dk does not. Factor that in and stamina expenditures are the same, and mag expenditure is twice as high (or more) for the dk, who can get a better stack for it. You can decide whether that’s fair or not.

No? There are 8 ads, 3 ranged 5 melee(2 of which are big guys). NB only taunts the 5 melee ones. Both of the above dont taunt the ranged ads.

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Think about why trial leaders only want DK tanks.
Again your argument with "can do content" we already had that talk. Your argument before was DK should be the tank class because they underperfom as DD but applying your logic they can clear all content and achieve high DPS numbers.
Your logic is flawed.

Inner. Rage. Also in MANY of the end game trial guilds even score pushers with leaders that aren't a[word]-holes (at least the ones I have had the pleasure of running with) allow non-DK tanks provided they pass a "Tank Test". Thank you and goodbye Mr Owl

Wat?

BejaProphet wrote: »

@Joxer61 Dovakn is correct. It’s important to understand what people mean by “viable.” 98% of the time when somebody is screaming that a class isn’t viable they really mean something very specific.

Not viable = the leader of my super elite score run trials guild won’t let me bring the character I want.

You see, they know dang well they can complete any and all content. Several of them complaining actually HAVE done all veteran content (including trials) on these “not viable” characters. What they are really saying is that since the DK can do it slightly better, therefore elite guilds demand DK, therefore NB isn’t viable.

Now I don’t mean to belittle that. I’m sure it’s frustrating. But it’s not the same as saying a NB can’t do the content.

Also the "elitist" guild leaders want DKs because of their Engulfing Flames skill, not because "they can do it slightly better". Chains and roots arent really needed in trials anyway. But we werent even talking about Engulfing, so whatever...

There is a difference between "Elite" and "Intolerant to new ideas that are outside your safe space"

You do you my dude, if people are actually letting you use caltrops in trials and 100 points into mighty. Sure go ahead. However I will still not listen to anything you say because you clearly dont know how tanking works.

Ok, I never said I used caltrops OR put 100 into Mighty at all that was another commenter so please get your facts straight. I DID say you can tank with NB or any other class for that matter with only a SLIGHT loss

It isnt "SLIGHT". Like DoobZ already pointed out the gap becomes bigger when you dive into veteran/harder content.

Also:

CP from my spreadsheets isn't updated (Yes, I use spreadsheets for builds) but here it is
Champion Points
Red 45 heavy armor, 32 hardy, 32 ele defender, 38 thick skinned, 47 spell shield, 31 iron clad, rest in bastion
Green 56 tenacity, 43 mooncalf, 43 arcanist, 28 shadow ward, rest in warlord
Blue 11 elfborn, 10 master at arms, 10 phys expert, 10 shattering, 95 mighty, 10 piercing, 11 precise, 11 thaumaturge, rest
in blessed

Im sorry, you're right 95 into mighty. And 10 into piercing, 10 into shattering and only 31 into ironclad...

I honestly have to say Im not good at min/maxing CP so my CP might not be the best. But your CP clearly shows that you have no idea what you're doing, then you come in this thread say stuff like "people just dont know how to make a good NB tank, NB tanks are OP!". Its enraging honestly.

Edit: To add on that. I assume you were going for the Major Heroism passive from CP but thats not even that useful, NB tanks already get 20 ulti just from drinking a potion (have a great ulti generation) and the CP passive is only active when you drop below 20% which shouldnt happen most of the time on a good tank anyway. Maybe in vHoF/vAS/vNCR but like already said, not worth getting consindering you can have a 100% uptime on Minor Heroism through Heroic Slash.

Joxer61 · November 2018

Is it just me or has this thread lost its direction? Hell, its my thread and I have forgotten what the hell I was actually asking and trying to look for! ;P
Can we bring it back to being constructive input, builds, advice or if not just let it die? I am tickled it went 4 pages but kinda strayed off topic a bit to become a pissing contest and that was not my intention.
So yea, if nothing "good" to say in direct response to the original post just "Let it go"....(oh god I went there....lol)

Sparr0w · November 2018

Ran a NB tank thru basically everything, with being able to run DW back bar and have an absorb stamina enchant too will help the issue of sustain.

Only thing I'm worried about is the dodge chance was basically 15% damage mitigation and 15% block reduction, now that's changed and minor vitality removed from Swallow Soul there's not much reason to pick a NB over a DK or a Warden.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Joxer61 wrote: »

Is it just me or has this thread lost its direction? Hell, its my thread and I have forgotten what the hell I was actually asking and trying to look for! ;P
Can we bring it back to being constructive input, builds, advice or if not just let it die? I am tickled it went 4 pages but kinda strayed off topic a bit to become a pissing contest and that was not my intention.
So yea, if nothing "good" to say in direct response to the original post just "Let it go"....(oh god I went there....lol)

As was discussed, in average dungeons NB tank struggles with lack of class cc and this can be solved with time stop and caltrops.. lack of chains can be solved with silver leash.. all of this will create lack of stamina resource, which can’t be fixed only by class passive especially in hm modes where you are forced to hold block most of the time.
Possible solution is to use ice staff on second bar but it’s less effective in high-end content where each % of mitigation matters.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

All of it makes me think of anti-meta dream team with nb dunmer tanks, sorc nord healers and breton stamdk / khajit magden dps

Liofa · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

As was discussed, in average dungeons NB tank struggles with lack of class cc and this can be solved with time stop and caltrops.. lack of chains can be solved with silver leash.. all of this will create lack of stamina resource, which can’t be fixed only by class passive especially in hm modes where you are forced to hold block most of the time.
Possible solution is to use ice staff on second bar but it’s less effective in high-end content where each % of mitigation matters.

Read my first post in this thread. Stamina is not an issue for any class and can be easily worked around. It's just that some classes need more investing than others, Nightblade being an example.

You are not forced to hold block a lot in most fights as opposed to what majority thinks. We can mitigate so much damage now thanks to huge amount of red CP we have even without blocking.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Liofa wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

As was discussed, in average dungeons NB tank struggles with lack of class cc and this can be solved with time stop and caltrops.. lack of chains can be solved with silver leash.. all of this will create lack of stamina resource, which can’t be fixed only by class passive especially in hm modes where you are forced to hold block most of the time.
Possible solution is to use ice staff on second bar but it’s less effective in high-end content where each % of mitigation matters.

Read my first post in this thread. Stamina is not an issue for any class and can be easily worked around. It's just that some classes need more investing than others, Nightblade being an example.

You are not forced to hold block a lot in most fights as opposed to what majority thinks. We can mitigate so much damage now thanks to huge amount of red CP we have even without blocking.

Dire wolf in MHK one-shots my 40k hp 33k res tank if i’m not blocking and it is not even considered larger mob..
Of course i barely use block other then against knockdown from HA in base dungeons.. but in dlc vets non-block is quite deadly.. and actually that resisrance from CP is more helpful to squishes then a tank, due to mitigation formula.

BejaProphet · November 2018

But that attack is telegraphed by the yellow/white streaks. I would hate to put words in Liofa’s mouth but I doubt he was meaning for anybody to not block the one-shots.

The problem is that some tanks are blocking everything and the they think their stam issues are class issues.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Liofa wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

As was discussed, in average dungeons NB tank struggles with lack of class cc and this can be solved with time stop and caltrops.. lack of chains can be solved with silver leash.. all of this will create lack of stamina resource, which can’t be fixed only by class passive especially in hm modes where you are forced to hold block most of the time.
Possible solution is to use ice staff on second bar but it’s less effective in high-end content where each % of mitigation matters.

Read my first post in this thread. Stamina is not an issue for any class and can be easily worked around. It's just that some classes need more investing than others, Nightblade being an example.

You are not forced to hold block a lot in most fights as opposed to what majority thinks. We can mitigate so much damage now thanks to huge amount of red CP we have even without blocking.

Dire wolf in MHK one-shots my 40k hp 33k res tank if i’m not blocking and it is not even considered larger mob..
Of course i barely use block other then against knockdown from HA in base dungeons.. but in dlc vets non-block is quite deadly.. and actually that resisrance from CP is more helpful to squishes then a tank, due to mitigation formula.

I have nothing to add to the conversation about tanks but I have to say, this mechanic, the one hit kill by a non elite mob on everything but a blocking tank, is so terrible. Playing that dungeon is a chore, this is a big reason for that.

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Liofa wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

As was discussed, in average dungeons NB tank struggles with lack of class cc and this can be solved with time stop and caltrops.. lack of chains can be solved with silver leash.. all of this will create lack of stamina resource, which can’t be fixed only by class passive especially in hm modes where you are forced to hold block most of the time.
Possible solution is to use ice staff on second bar but it’s less effective in high-end content where each % of mitigation matters.

Read my first post in this thread. Stamina is not an issue for any class and can be easily worked around. It's just that some classes need more investing than others, Nightblade being an example.

You are not forced to hold block a lot in most fights as opposed to what majority thinks. We can mitigate so much damage now thanks to huge amount of red CP we have even without blocking.

Dire wolf in MHK one-shots my 40k hp 33k res tank if i’m not blocking and it is not even considered larger mob..
Of course i barely use block other then against knockdown from HA in base dungeons.. but in dlc vets non-block is quite deadly.. and actually that resisrance from CP is more helpful to squishes then a tank, due to mitigation formula.

I have nothing to add to the conversation about tanks but I have to say, this mechanic, the one hit kill by a non elite mob on everything but a blocking tank, is so terrible. Playing that dungeon is a chore, this is a big reason for that.

Its the same with vMoS. One ad was charging his heavy attack and I thought I could easily ignore it, but I was wrong...
50k dmg on a tank...
Fun!

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Yes, it is telegraphed, but if there are 3-4 other mobs near plus spell effects, atronach whatever you may easily miss them, because this wolfes are rather small. Similar things not so deadly but heavy hitting even with LA are common in dlc vets.. so I use the rule - if i don’t see clearly what’s going on, i hold block

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Yes, it is telegraphed, but if there are 3-4 other mobs near plus spell effects, atronach whatever you may easily miss them, because this wolfes are rather small. Similar things not so deadly but heavy hitting even with LA are common in dlc vets.. so I use the rule - if i don’t see clearly what’s going on, i hold block

I pretty much do the same!

BejaProphet · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Yes, it is telegraphed, but if there are 3-4 other mobs near plus spell effects, atronach whatever you may easily miss them, because this wolfes are rather small. Similar things not so deadly but heavy hitting even with LA are common in dlc vets.. so I use the rule - if i don’t see clearly what’s going on, i hold block

I agree with your rule. It’s smart.
I also agree that the dire wolf is surprisingly unassuming for such a big hit.

However, are saying this to say a tank should be perma blocking?

I ask this sincerely. I truly am unsure if your statements were meant that was or not.

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Yes, it is telegraphed, but if there are 3-4 other mobs near plus spell effects, atronach whatever you may easily miss them, because this wolfes are rather small. Similar things not so deadly but heavy hitting even with LA are common in dlc vets.. so I use the rule - if i don’t see clearly what’s going on, i hold block

I agree with your rule. It’s smart.
I also agree that the dire wolf is surprisingly unassuming for such a big hit.

However, are saying this to say a tank should be perma blocking?

I ask this sincerely. I truly am unsure if your statements were meant that was or not.

DKs can perma block + are the better tanks. Thats easier and better to play. Why would anybody want to play any other class than DK?
Sure you *dont have to* perma block. But DK can while others cant. So is there any reason to play any other class?
Also perma blocking is better for learning new content as well.

BejaProphet · November 2018

Owl, this thread is actually in danger of becoming constructive again. Can’t you please stop trying to drag me into another argument with you?

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

Owl, this thread is actually in danger of becoming constructive again. Can’t you please stop trying to drag me into another argument with you?

Lol.

So is there any reason to play any other class as tank?

Can you answer this?

jypcy · November 2018

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Yes, it is telegraphed, but if there are 3-4 other mobs near plus spell effects, atronach whatever you may easily miss them, because this wolfes are rather small. Similar things not so deadly but heavy hitting even with LA are common in dlc vets.. so I use the rule - if i don’t see clearly what’s going on, i hold block

I agree with your rule. It’s smart.
I also agree that the dire wolf is surprisingly unassuming for such a big hit.

However, are saying this to say a tank should be perma blocking?

I ask this sincerely. I truly am unsure if your statements were meant that was or not.

DKs can perma block + are the better tanks. Thats easier and better to play. Why would anybody want to play any other class than DK?
Sure you *dont have to* perma block. But DK can while others cant. So is there any reason to play any other class?
Also perma blocking is better for learning new content as well.

To use different abilities and try out different builds.
To enjoy other aesthetics and playstyles.
To get data and experience so we can even have this type of conversation in the first place.
To challenge oneself.
To show that it can be done.

Those are some of my main reasons for tanking on every class, anyway.

Joxer61 · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

Owl, this thread is actually in danger of becoming constructive again. Can’t you please stop trying to drag me into another argument with you?

I KNEW you guys would come around!! Big hugs!! And thanks for going down the civil road again!!

BejaProphet · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

Owl, this thread is actually in danger of becoming constructive again. Can’t you please stop trying to drag me into another argument with you?

I’ll ask a second time. Please leave me alone.

xI_The_Owl_Ix · November 2018

jypcy wrote: »

xI_The_Owl_Ix wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Yes, it is telegraphed, but if there are 3-4 other mobs near plus spell effects, atronach whatever you may easily miss them, because this wolfes are rather small. Similar things not so deadly but heavy hitting even with LA are common in dlc vets.. so I use the rule - if i don’t see clearly what’s going on, i hold block

I agree with your rule. It’s smart.
I also agree that the dire wolf is surprisingly unassuming for such a big hit.

However, are saying this to say a tank should be perma blocking?

I ask this sincerely. I truly am unsure if your statements were meant that was or not.

DKs can perma block + are the better tanks. Thats easier and better to play. Why would anybody want to play any other class than DK?
Sure you *dont have to* perma block. But DK can while others cant. So is there any reason to play any other class?
Also perma blocking is better for learning new content as well.

To use different abilities and try out different builds.
To enjoy other aesthetics and playstyles.
To get data and experience so we can even have this type of conversation in the first place.
To challenge oneself.
To show that it can be done.

Those are some of my main reasons for tanking on every class, anyway.

So not 1 point because it can do XY better?
And yet here we are trying to argue with DK fanboys that our class is not worth it atm/needs a buff and we get told that we are wrong.
Good stuff.

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

BejaProphet wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Yes, it is telegraphed, but if there are 3-4 other mobs near plus spell effects, atronach whatever you may easily miss them, because this wolfes are rather small. Similar things not so deadly but heavy hitting even with LA are common in dlc vets.. so I use the rule - if i don’t see clearly what’s going on, i hold block

I agree with your rule. It’s smart.
I also agree that the dire wolf is surprisingly unassuming for such a big hit.

However, are saying this to say a tank should be perma blocking?

I ask this sincerely. I truly am unsure if your statements were meant that was or not.

No, I don’t mean pure permablock.. but in many situations game forces you to hold block for long.. maybe all this can be outhealed and this mechanics of new dungeons were created to make healers more necessary.. but in practice, especially in pugs you won’t see such amount of heal or it might a be 3 dd run.. and so burst heal from low hp and indirect stamina restore which is not stopped by blocking make dk most efficient tank, increased block mitigation add to that too. Though other classes may stack more max hp, have vampiric heal or DoT heal or even plainly better heal (sorc) etc.. they can’t survive and sustain, endure like dk in awful conditions.

jypcy · November 2018

I mean, as I believe I stated earlier, I do believe that DKs have easier access to superior tanking utilities. But I’d still be perfectly content if NB tanking is left as is currently. I don’t want to bother with an extensive list rn, but as a few quick items that I like tankblades for:
-Dark cloak is my favorite of the health based heals (though in fairness I should give clannfear another try this patch)
-Malevolent offering is basically a free burst heal for party members
-Soul siphon is my current favorite survival ult behind the overpowered magma armor (this could change if healers start running br resto)
-Excellent for ulti builds
-Natural stat bonuses give me more resources to play around with