Mr_Walker wrote: »

Diminishing returns. Probably because people started demanding harder and harder content, because they and their 2 friends want it, but the rest of the world doesn't want to be stuck in a dungeon for 3 hours trying to do ridiculously diffficult content. Plus anyone who contends with lag, like a lot of us Aussies, might as well not even bother joining the group.

I like moderately challenging content, but don't want frustration. If I want to be frustrated, I go to work, and they pay me for it.




And before it gets said, no, most people can't solo a group dungeon, even FG1, and they can't pull 40K dps.

This. if i wanted to spend 1-3 hours in an instance, i would do maelstrom or a trial or something. I like my dungeon runs( not speed runs either) to be like my pizza, 30 minutes or less. It takes longer to do DLC dungeons but the number of bosses are the same and thus the rewards are generally the same. So dont want to run them unless i need gear in them and that is rarely.

Anotherone773 wrote: »

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Diminishing returns. Probably because people started demanding harder and harder content, because they and their 2 friends want it, but the rest of the world doesn't want to be stuck in a dungeon for 3 hours trying to do ridiculously diffficult content. Plus anyone who contends with lag, like a lot of us Aussies, might as well not even bother joining the group.

I like moderately challenging content, but don't want frustration. If I want to be frustrated, I go to work, and they pay me for it.




And before it gets said, no, most people can't solo a group dungeon, even FG1, and they can't pull 40K dps.

This. if i wanted to spend 1-3 hours in an instance, i would do maelstrom or a trial or something. I like my dungeon runs( not speed runs either) to be like my pizza, 30 minutes or less. It takes longer to do DLC dungeons but the number of bosses are the same and thus the rewards are generally the same. So dont want to run them unless i need gear in them and that is rarely.

Yup. I have a life. It may not seem like it, but I do! That's why I like the original dungeons, most of them you're in and out in 15/20 minutes. If you're with some mates you tend to do a few in a row, muck around, but they're all relatively quick, even if sometimes not so painless. My friends must not be awesome though, because we occasionally have problems with the old "II" dungeons.

lokulin wrote: »

Sad to see I am not alone in seeing this trend. I really like some of the newer dungeons but totally agree that the risk vs reward balance doesn't seem quite right. I had a couple of friends spend eight hours one Sunday a few months back doing the Fang Lair hard mode and no death runs. I'm fairly certain that the burnout from that is what caused them all to one by one quietly drop the game over the subsequent weeks.

That doesn't sound like fun.

New guild, new friends.

You'll tend to find that a guild as a whole clears the new content pretty fast and then returns to it less and less frequently. I think we'd all pretty much done the speed and no death runs for all the new Vet DLC within two weeks of release and, whilst we'll go do it if people specifically ask as they missed the achievements first time around, it's seen as something of a chore that gets in the way of the more interesting trials etc.

Same goes for pledge runs, because it's easy to get the mask you want in the first few vet runs and then transmute it, there's only a finite life for that content. I, and many others like me, have over 1600 unused keys now between my chars, so whilst I still do pledges from time to time, even a group of CP capped people will tend to run them on normal as they can be cleared in a few minutes and people can then go back to something more interesting. I do enjoy dungeon running, and I'll always run vet DLC with guildies who ask, but it's not often asked IMO, maybe the odd new member may want to mop up a few achievements, now and then.

I think to eliminate this issue, ZOS need to release dungeon content that is genuinely mechanically challenging, not just a HP slog with repetitive mechanics. I think vMHK and vMoS are good examples of how to make it more interesting for longer, but in the end of course, it's all learned by rote.

Just my experience here...

Vet dlc drops expensive motif pages, so in day of pledges you may meet experienced guys giving this dungeons a shot. In other days it will be mostly random newbies aiming for a helm.. anyway I don’t have problems finding a group for them, though it is considerably longer then for base dungeons.

SakuraRush wrote: »

Most players want the biggest reward for the least effort in the smallest amount of time. In addition to that many of the DLC dungeons are a nightmare to pug. They have actual mechanics sometimes and that seems to baffle a great many player.

This isn't an issue unique to ESO and is something you will encounter in any MMO. Players want a "gimme loot" button. The moment loot is behind a challenge those players will call for nerfs.

A very simplistic and 1 dimensional way to look at it. An argument usually churned out by those who have little or no desire to discuss the real issues many players encounter within the game. Undoubtedly there are players that fall into that category, but they seem to be in the minority. However, it's akin to saying everyone who runs weekly leader board runs are elitist pricks. Again, nothing could be further from the truth.

In the real world, finding a guild that realistically gives these guys the opportunities to run this content long after the dlc has been released is a task on its own. I mean, you see it regularly on these boards. People stating it's as easy as joining a guild and asking for 3 other folk, who all happen to have the tank/healer/dps on tap. The reality, you can spend days or even weeks asking in guilds before you come across people willing to help. I get there are guilds out there that people on here use without issues, but that isn't the norm. Most people either stick to a small clique or will only run it with very competent players.

It happened with Craglorn. The nay sayers come on here and paint a rosy picture of how easy it was to get others to quest with you. They are either living in the past or play an entirely different game. Next to no one wanted to do Craglorn pre nerf. No one. I remember when i first played this game, I spent weeks/months asking for others to run Craglorn with me and I could count on 1 hand how many people offered help during that time. Most preferred to just stand in Mournhold spamming their AoE's. That was the reality, not the alternative reality that is regularly painted on these very forums. Same happens with dlc dungeons. I see countless people asking for help in guilds, guilds that supposedly pride themselves in helping others with niche content and like Craglorn, they get little or no offers of help.

Not everyone has "mates" in game, many people just play the game for the sake of playing a game and leave the "mates" thing for real life.

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

SakuraRush wrote: »

Most players want the biggest reward for the least effort in the smallest amount of time. In addition to that many of the DLC dungeons are a nightmare to pug. They have actual mechanics sometimes and that seems to baffle a great many player.

This isn't an issue unique to ESO and is something you will encounter in any MMO. Players want a "gimme loot" button. The moment loot is behind a challenge those players will call for nerfs.

A very simplistic and 1 dimensional way to look at it. An argument usually churned out by those who have little or no desire to discuss the real issues many players encounter within the game. Undoubtedly there are players that fall into that category, but they seem to be in the minority. However, it's akin to saying everyone who runs weekly leader board runs are elitist pricks. Again, nothing could be further from the truth.

In the real world, finding a guild that realistically gives these guys the opportunities to run this content long after the dlc has been released is a task on its own. I mean, you see it regularly on these boards. People stating it's as easy as joining a guild and asking for 3 other folk, who all happen to have the tank/healer/dps on tap. The reality, you can spend days or even weeks asking in guilds before you come across people willing to help. I get there are guilds out there that people on here use without issues, but that isn't the norm. Most people either stick to a small clique or will only run it with very competent players.

It happened with Craglorn. The nay sayers come on here and paint a rosy picture of how easy it was to get others to quest with you. They are either living in the past or play an entirely different game. Next to no one wanted to do Craglorn pre nerf. No one. I remember when i first played this game, I spent weeks/months asking for others to run Craglorn with me and I could count on 1 hand how many people offered help during that time. Most preferred to just stand in Mournhold spamming their AoE's. That was the reality, not the alternative reality that is regularly painted on these very forums. Same happens with dlc dungeons. I see countless people asking for help in guilds, guilds that supposedly pride themselves in helping others with niche content and like Craglorn, they get little or no offers of help.

Not everyone has "mates" in game, many people just play the game for the sake of playing a game and leave the "mates" thing for real life.

And if you actually want to use one of the sets that drops there you have to try and get a group together another dozen times if not more. ZOS likes the RNG way too much.